^^ EDIT
^^ EDIT
"I'm not a gynecologist... but I'll take a look."
Bunch of ignorant mofos in here (both sides of the argument)
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^ yep.
buncha google thumpers.
holy shit you guys are going off...and about darwin converting to christianity on his death bed...
What person right before they are about to be in some serious shit doesn't say..."oh god!"
or, "god?....if there is a god....please help me"
LOL
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Well Baby J and I are having a discussion, and what do you expect when 2 people stand on 2 different sides of the Fence. Personally I really Enjoying discussing Religion with someone who does not get offended and can offer some perspective from the other side.Originally Posted by SPOOLIN
About Darwin: Why would someone like Darwin, who was dedicated to disproving God say Oh God, or if there is a God help me. He didnt just say that according to the information we have. This excerpt is from the book that claims he did become a Christian before he died:It was one of those glorious autumn afternoons, that we sometimes enjoy in England, when I was asked to go in and sit with the well known professor, Charles Darwin. He was almost bedridden for some months before he died. I used to feel when I saw him that his fine presence would make a grand picture for our Royal Academy; but never did I think so more strongly than on this particular occasion.Another example is Dr. James Kennedy is another person who spent the better part of his life trying to disprove the Bible and became a Christian.
He was sitting up in bed, wearing a soft embroidered dressing gown, of rather a rich purple shade.
Propped up by pillows, he was gazing out on a far-stretching scene of woods and cornfields, which glowed in the light of one of those marvelous sunsets which are the beauty of Kent and Surrey. His noble forehead and fine features seem to be lit up with pleasure as I entered the room.
He waved his hand toward the window as he pointed out the scene beyond, while in the other hand he held an open Bible, which he was always studying.
"What are you reading now?" I asked as I seated myself beside his bedside. "Hebrews!" he answered - "still Hebrews. 'The Royal Book' I call it. Isn't it grand?"Then, placing his finger on certain passages, he commented on them.I made some allusions to the strong opinions expressed by many persons on the history of the Creation, its grandeur, and then their treatment of the earlier chapters of the Book of Genesis.
He seemed greatly distressed, his fingers twitched nervously, and a look of agony came over his face as he said: "I was a young man with unformed ideas. I threw out queries, suggestions, wondering all the time over everything, and to my astonishment, the ideas took like wildfire. People made a religion of them."
Then he paused, and after a few more sentences on "the holiness of God" and the "grandeur of this book," looking at the Bible which he was holding tenderly all the time, he suddenly said: "I have a summer house in the garden which holds about thirty people. It is over there," pointing through the open window. "I want you very much to speak there. I know you read the Bible in the villages. To-morrow afternoon I should like the servants on the place, some tenants and a few of the neighbours; to gather there. Will you speak to them?""What shall I speak about?" I asked."Christ Jesus!" he replied in a clear, emphatic voice, adding in a lower tone, "and his salvation. Is not that the best theme? And then I want you to sing some hymns with them. You lead on your small instrument, do you not?" The wonderful look of brightness and animation on his face as he said this I shall never forget, for he added: "If you take the meeting at three o'clock this window will be open, and you will know that I am joining in with the singing."
How I wished I could have made a picture of the fine old man and his beautiful surroundings on that memorable day!
In his book Why I Believe, Dr. James Kennedy relays the story of Sir William Ramsey who devoted his whole life to disproving the Bible. He was a respected, wealthy atheist with a Ph.D. from Oxford. In attempting to disprove the Bible, he unearthed hundreds of findings that confirmed its accuracy. After 25 years of digging, he shocked the whole critical world by declaring himself to be a Christian.
the key word was "claims" he converted... this is a nice way for Christians to get the last word of a dying man
don't drink the juice!
Paul "your bullshit makes the flowers grow"
I stated that, as I am completely aware of the Facts. Like i said there are many others, but show me where he didnt?the key word was "claims" he converted... this is a nice way for Christians to get the last word of a dying man
don't drink the juice!
well considering no one is alive that was then how can anyone have proof of such? i guess you just have to have "faith"
men w/ conviction don't change their belief system even in the face of death furthermore he was intelligent enough to understand that blasphemy is unforgivable so he could never be saved.
Paul "your bullshit makes the flowers grow"
the key word was "claims" he converted... this is a nice way for Christians to get the last word of a dying man
don't drink the juice!
i was just meaning that he didn't convert. it was a fluke of typical speech lol.
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^^ Man --- are you from some planet where they have like "common sense" or something? Amazing.
"I'm not a gynecologist... but I'll take a look."
it doesnt matter what anyone believes because no one will never know for sure. so if someone tries to tell you a certain number tell them to fuck off cuz they dont know what there talking about.
Truth. And who cares about Darwin? Why don't we let a real genius handle this...
Albert Einstein
"Then there are the fanatical atheists whose intolerance is the same as that of the religious fanatics, and it springs from the same source . . . They are creatures who can't hear the music of the spheres."
"In the view of such harmony in the cosmos which I, with my limited human mind, am able to recognise, there are yet people who say there is no God. But what makes me really angry is that they quote me for support for such views."
"We know nothing about [God, the world] at all. All our knowledge is but the knowledge of schoolchildren. Possibly we shall know a little more than we do now. but the real nature of things, that we shall never know, never."
"I see a pattern, but my imagination cannot picture the maker of that pattern. I see a clock, but I cannot envision the clockmaker. The human mind is unable to conceive of the four dimensions, so how can it conceive of a God, before whom a thousand years and a thousand dimensions are as one?"
"What separates me from most so-called atheists is a feeling of utter humility toward the unattainable secrets of the harmony of the cosmos."
You idiots, once again on both sides of the argument, are so sure of your views (read: CLOSED-minded) yet one of the greatest mind of all time disagrees with both sides...
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"Unattainable secrets," "we will never know, never"... etc are statements that go against the scientific method and the aesthetic of science. The goal of science is to search for answers to every question. To simply dismiss something as an "unattainable secret" is a crock.
so basically saying that if they find any life on any other planet will totally make sense, and apparently be able to be wrung out of some scripture. The bible was written by people hundreds of years past the original events. The events themselves were carried on by stories. THE BIBLE IS NOT TRUTH!!! It was never intended to be. It was supposed to be a book of stories to get people to embrace morals. Religion and most of its followers are freaking retarded.
Besides all of the google searches...
There is no god. Took me 19 years to figure it out, after being fed a whole bunch of bull shit. Show me a god, and I will bow down to you. Show me what he can do for me...
"God" is just there to provide you comfort, something for you to look forward to, and be given hope. God cant help you.. And he never will. Why would he help you?
Your belief is illogical, and you fail if you believe in any higher being.
Its funny, if "God" loves us and wants to look out for us, why does he make us all different in every aspect and expect us to shape outselves for him to get somewhere we do not know exists. Why do we have to change ourselves to make us good for him?
Gods/Jesus/Whothefuckcares... Does not exist... We just have to wait to see how long it will take most ignorant believers to understand the troof. Night.
Oh man, a whole 19 years... wow with all that life experience how could anyone doubt you. Ladies and gentlemen, it's time for a press conference.
The debate is over.
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"During the youthful period of mankind's spiritual evolution, human fantasy created gods in man's own image who, by the operations of their will were supposed to determine, or at any rate influence, the phenomenal world."
- Albert Einstein, quoted in: 2000 Years of Disbelief, James Haught
"I have repeatedly said that in my opinion the idea of a personal God is a childlike one. You may call me an agnostic, but I do not share the crusading spirit of the professional atheist whose fervor is mostly due to a painful act of liberation from the fetters of religious indoctrination received in youth. I prefer an attitude of humility corresponding to the weakness of our intellectual understanding of nature and of our own being."
- Albert Einstein to Guy H. Raner Jr., Sept. 28, 1949, quoted by Michael R. Gilmore in Skeptic magazine, Vol. 5, No. 2
"It seems to me that the idea of a personal God is an anthropological concept which I cannot take seriously. I also cannot imagine some will or goal outside the human sphere.... Science has been charged with undermining morality, but the charge is unjust. A man's ethical behavior should be based effectually on sympathy, education, and social ties and needs; no religious basis is necessary. Man would indeed be in a poor way if he had to be restrained by fear of punishment and hope of reward after death."
- Albert Einstein, "Religion and Science," New York Times Magazine, November 9, 1930
(Note that several of us were lambasted for just the position voiced above earlier in this thread.)
"I cannot conceive of a personal God who would directly influence the actions of individuals, or would directly sit in judgment on creatures of his own creation. I cannot do this in spite of the fact that mechanistic causality has, to a certain extent, been placed in doubt by modern science. My religiosity consists in a humble admiration of the infinitely superior spirit that reveals itself in the little that we, with our weak and transitory understanding, can comprehend of reality. Morality is of the highest importance -- but for us, not for God. "
- Albert Einstein, from Albert Einstein: The Human Side, edited by Helen Dukas & Banesh Hoffman
"Nobody, certainly, will deny that the idea of the existence of an omnipotent, just, and omnibeneficent personal God is able to accord man solace, help, and guidance; also, by virtue of its simplicity it is accessible to the most undeveloped mind. But, on the other hand, there are decisive weaknesses attached to this idea in itself, which have been painfully felt since the beginning of history. ..."
- Albert Einstein, Science and Religion (1941)
put that on your plate
"I'm not a gynecologist... but I'll take a look."
Ummm... I don't see any ideas different than what I posted.
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^^ I didn't quote you. I just added his quotes (AND CITED THEM) that I think are more understandable.
"I'm not a gynecologist... but I'll take a look."
I didn't read the whole thread so I don't know if anyone mentioned this, but carbon dating only works up to 50-60K years in the past. Any more than that and the carbon has already decayed.
To determine the millions of years thing, you must use radioisotope dating.
I got an A in both of my geology lab science classes at GSU so I'm kind of a big deal.
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The bible thumpers would want to hold onto the idea that the earth is only a couple thousand years old because if it were actually billions of years old, and humans only here a couple tens of thousands of years, then it makes the argument that god mad man in his own image a little less believable (that was not a run-on sentence!).
Atheism rocks.
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aight... so is it good to say that neither side is completely right... and neither side is completely wrong ?
RIP Kaleb Mashburn
This shit keeps getting more interesting.. .LOL. Good find Paul.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/20...l-missing-link
"I'm not a gynecologist... but I'll take a look."
I believe that there is no missing link. WE have always been here. They found fossilized human footprints 18 inches away from fossilized dinosaur footprints. They also found man made objects in layers of the Earth that are MILLIONS of years old.
jigga-what? do you have proof of this or can you link to anything?I believe that there is no missing link. WE have always been here. They found fossilized human footprints 18 inches away from fossilized dinosaur footprints. They also found man made objects in layers of the Earth that are MILLIONS of years old.
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Mysterious Origins of Man
^^ No way. Dirt-Age-Analysis V 2.0 isn't perfected yet -- that dirt could be only 6000 years old.
"I'm not a gynecologist... but I'll take a look."
I think its ridiculous when people try to take the creation of the universe as a proving point in god.
I believe humans in general cant stand not being able to figure something out so they turn to God for everything.
We cant figure out how the Earth was made or the Universe so that HAS to mean that a God had to put it here. A god had to create humans and all other forms of life.
Why cant it be possible that the Earth is just that "lucky" planet that was formed in the right part of the solar system that would allow life to grow.
The truth is that we will NEVER know how Humans or the Universe came to be. Not in my lifetime anyway and probably not in my childs lifetime either.
It could be possible that Aliens created us and put us on this planet as an experiment. Why? Who knows, but its possible. Nobody can discredit that with something like "Aliens dont exist thats bullshit haha moron" because I could just counter with there is no real life proof that God exists why is that theory so much more believable than the alien experiment.
I believe people just need something to believe in, something to keep them going I guess you could say. Nothing better than an almighty God that created everything and watches us from the stars.
how about the things they have been finding that point to PREVIOUS nuclear wars before our time. Like ancient buildings found in india that have melted on one side and fused...and skeletons that have 50 times the normal radiation levels.
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ALRIGHT. i didn't read page 3 just FYI.
anyway.
why does science have to take precedence over faith? God is ageless. He created the heavens AND THE EARTH. so basically there is no science that disproves God. anything you try to explain can still be interpreted as being put there by God. don't get me wrong... i'm no bible thumper and certainly haven't been to church in quite some time and really just don't have the faith. but that doesn't mean that i can't believe that there is someone (or being) that has put all this together. i don't understand why all the super christians want to try and discredit all the science that is coming out. while his human son is debatable, there is still no need to completely discredit a God.
and the earth is like 4.3 billion years old i think it was. they found the oldest pieces of rock from a crater. using a dating process on a certain type of rock. you can't fucking debate solid science.
very true i watched a show on tv a few weeks ago about earth good show might i add. very intertaining aswell i beleave in god i go to chruch once n a while but like Mr.Clean said science is fact not fiction. or how ever the fuck you spell it. lolALRIGHT. i didn't read page 3 just FYI.
anyway.
why does science have to take precedence over faith? God is ageless. He created the heavens AND THE EARTH. so basically there is no science that disproves God. anything you try to explain can still be interpreted as being put there by God. don't get me wrong... i'm no bible thumper and certainly haven't been to church in quite some time and really just don't have the faith
and the earth is like 4.3 billion years old i think it was. they found the oldest pieces of rock from a crater. using a dating process on a certain type of rock. you can't fucking debate solid science.
havn't you guys seen men in black? We're being played with in a marble by some alien.
maybe we are a second life program, i mean hell we did create our own second life program LOL, kinda like "the 13th floor" movie.
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i don't now man, i just find it so hard to able to to say how old something is without really knowing. carbon dating can only give a general time frame. and honestly, i think some of that shit the media puts out, not all of it, is straight bullshit. i mean, entertainment sells. its a good way to get people to pick up the mag or whatever and get things going just so they will come back for more.
I dont know if its been said already cause im not reading all this but i have heard people say that in the bible what we think of as a calendar year is not what they believed in.
Like God didnt really make the earth and heavens in 7 days, to us it would have been millions of years.
I have heard that argument.
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the Bible creation story (it's actually 2 stories combined if you read carefully) actually borrows from other, older creation stories, and is meant to be taken allegorically. it's really a parable describing mankind's fall from "grace". I've also heard arguments that the Adam/Eve story is really not about a couple, but more about man finding the balance between his yin/yang masculine/feminine energy, etc.
anyways to stay on topic...i agree it's pretty stupid for anyone to think in this day and age that the earth is 6000 years old or evolution isn't real. i mean...honestly speaking...if you graduated from HS you should know better. remember when mainstream christianity swore that the earth was the center of the universe??? LOL
Sort of. To God there is no such thing as time. Think about it, we on Earth base time on 1 full rotation of the earth, then 1 year is a full rotation around the sun. Well God doesnt live on earth, so there is no such thing as time to him. Therefore its not like 1 day to God is 24 hours. To God there is no time, he has already seen the past, present and Future.
^^ Did he tell you that?
"I'm not a gynecologist... but I'll take a look."
lol yeah it was told to him through a huge game of "secret message" ...you know that game you play in middle school where the message starts on one side of the room and ends up insanely different when it gets to the other
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HAHAH - thumpers are SOOO funny.
"I'm not a gynecologist... but I'll take a look."
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