Do you believe in God? Simple question

[Buttons]

so you say i have no proof of evolution, then I say you have no proof to God. You must be wrong. Your point is invalid.

[geoff]

a well known australian molecular biologist and evolutionist Dr. Michael Denton wrote a book in 1985 entitled "evolution: a theory in crisis" in the book he admits that no one has ever documented any evidence for the supposed evolutionary "chain of life" leading from one type of creature to another. He wrote, " the concept of the continuity of nature has existed in the mind of man, never in the facts of nature." (p.353) then 13 years later in 1998 he stated, " Whether one accepts or rejects the design hypothesis...there is no avoiding the conclusion that the world looks as if it had been tailored for life; it appears to have been designed. All reality appears to be a vast, coherent, teleological whole with life and mankind as its purpose and goal."

the new accepted theory now that evolution is fading out is " intelligent design". they say that everything was designed but they dont know by who. science is getting closer and closer every decade to proving God. as it sits now. there is no physical evidence of God because how do you prove a superior being that is timeless and infinite? its gonna come down to what the bible says:

"God has given him a name which is above every name – that at the name of Jesus
every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord…" Philippians 2:9-11

"I watched as He opened the sixth seal. There was a great earthquake. The sun turned black like sackcloth made of goat hair, the whole moon turned blood red, and the stars in the sky fell to earth, as late figs drop from a fig tree when shaken by a strong wind. The sky receded like a scroll rolling up, and every mountain and island was removed from its place. Then the kings of the earth, the princes, the generals, the rich, the mighty, and every slave and every free man hid in caves and among the rocks of the mountains. They called to the mountains and the rocks, "Fall on us and hide us from the face of Him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb! For the great day of their wrath has come, and who can stand?" rev.6:12-17

God Bless

[sport_122]

evolution is base all on assumption, hypothesis, and theory, all of which are NOT facts. in order for the THEORY of evolution to work the universe started out with hydrogen molecules and perhaps a few helium atoms(how did these get here? ) in 1960 George Kerkut did a study and wrote a book entitled "the implications of evolution". in it he said the first two assumptions of evolution were: 1-spontanius generation must have occured. 2-spontanius generation must have occured only once. (spontanius generation: the idea that something non-living can produce something living. the entire basis of evolution) not once in the history of evolution no matter how many experiments were conducted could this be done. all attempts failed misserably. therefore evolutionist "assume" that it happened. so there goes assumption 1. assumption 2...evolution cannot happen without spontaneous generation only happening once because all life is composed of a singular genetic code that has only minor variations between all life and because the code is so extremely complicated evolutionists are forced to concede that it could only happen once. so this is called a "one time event". which cannot be studied using the scientific method because science uses the 5 senses to study things that are universal, dependable, and reproductible. but one time events are neither dependable nor universal and by definition cant be reproduced. and so this once time event of spontaneous generation are not capable of expiramental verification.

Abiogenesis is the theory that life could come from non life. It has not been done. They got as far as amino acids. But in context this is one of the ONLY specifics that is given in the Bible about creation. Mankind originated from the dust of the earth. Proving Abiogenesis will not change the discussion, it would only give those who deny certain things something else to have to deny.

Its easy to argue evolution because the bible doesn't speak about this. It is easy to make claims and suggestions against something when that something has nothing to say about it. But if they prove abiogenesis, then science would have bridged a gap between the scientific processes of our world and one of the first direct claims about God in the Bible. While the fossil record still remains broken. I for one have no problem with that as it adds further demonstration for scriptural validity.

But it will be interesting because many people in the church have their view of how things happened and its just not written. So we have to be able to remove our media based mindset on these things and replace them with an open mind because our culture has started to determine Biblical fact off of fictional script.

The bible does not say the world is 6,000 years old. It does not say that there was no evolution. So believers should not be trying to argue these things as if they harm God. They don't. If God used that process to develop us then more power to him. If you made jello, you really only mixed water and the gelatin powder, it is not jello until you put it in the fridge and come back later. But when someone says, who made the Jello, you take the credit because you put the process into motion.

[geoff]

i am not argueing evolution. i believe natural selection and what not. i just believe the bible is true when it says that God(superior being) spoke everything into existence. the way things happend now are in our own hands and thats where evolution or some form of it and natural selection come in.

[sport_122]

so you say i have no proof of evolution, then I say you have no proof to God. You must be wrong. Your point is invalid.

what...I do say you have no proof of evolution, but you are too close minded to understand this statement in its entirety. I believe in some of the evolutionary process (there are numerous versions) but its not because its all proven. its because its logical even with its broken fossil record. Its when evolutionists try to turn their thoughts into fundamental religion that they have a problem. Much like you are doing.

If I said "do you have a red car", and you said "yes" that doesn't mean that every car on the planet was red at one time, and that you can never have a blue car or that all black cars are slow, and all white cars are bad for the environment. It simply means...You have a red car. Stop trying to read religious principles into evolution. If it is to remain a pure theory you should not do this.

You are like arguing with an infant. You assume that because I believe one way about God and you believe the other, that we could not agree on evolution. And like a kid you close your mind to the arguments presented to you (as I knew you would) not because they are bad arguments but because you think i have to be wrong in order for you to be right. Your world view is not about science, its about atheism or agnosticism. That is where your arguments flow from and you prove it with your general nonsensical statements.

I presented very valid reasons for you as to why it is very logical to say that one believes in God and I can almost imagine you reading them going "how can I prove this wrong?". Its like the UFO theorists and the scientists who say...oh its all explained. There are thousands upon thousands of people, and many with very good credentials saying there is an actual extra terrestrial UFO phenomenon going on. Former astronauts, pilots, military and government officials, other major world governments, but some scientists say...I don't believe it until we have testable solution to prove it. Its fine to be skeptical, but skepticism can make some people look outright ridiculous. I sure hope you don't continue down that path.

[btstone]

there is proof, but i don't feel like searching google for many different sites just for the people to say that their belief is right and i'm wrong.

i'm just saying why don't y'all give me proof that y'all are right? i've yet to see CREDIBLE proof.

you getting frustrated in your post is proof enough you cant prove evolution. i just told you that i can not prove a Supreme being, he is everywhere you look. if your mind doesnt understand that then its cool. im not trying to say you are wrong, but i would like you to show yourself the holes in your "evolution". the more research you do on it, the more it becomes impossible to believe it

[Buttons]

what...I do say you have no proof of evolution, but you are too close minded to understand this statement in its entirety.

i'm not close minded. i'm just saying that just quoting things from the bibles is not proof. anybody can put a book together. He had a following so many people believed what he said. Same things happen in cults. I'm not saying Christianity is a cult, but it is easy to get people to believe what you say.

you can believe what you want, i honestly don't care. i'm glad you have something to believe in, but in my opinion, i just didn't like it. I tried to understand and like it, but it just wasn't for me. Not one religion is going to be right for everyone.

i'm sorry, but quoting from the bible is just not that credible of a source in my opinion. that's like saying anything I write in my journal is credible. no offense to anyone, but that's just how I see it.

I can come up with proof and show you links, but I don't want to waste my time.

this is just my honest opinion. take it how you want, but it's whatever. no need to bash at me for not believe what you believe in.

[Buttons]

you getting frustrated in your post is proof enough you cant prove evolution. i just told you that i can not prove a Supreme being, he is everywhere you look. if your mind doesnt understand that then its cool. im not trying to say you are wrong, but i would like you to show yourself the holes in your "evolution". the more research you do on it, the more it becomes impossible to believe it

LOL, i can prove, but rather not waste my time. I'm still waiting for your proof for God. I believe there might be a superior being(s), but does that necessarily make him God? No.

The more I read the bible and the things you people say, makes Christianity more unbelievable to me. That's how I see it.

[sport_122]

i'm not close minded. i'm just saying that just quoting things from the bibles is not proof. anybody can put a book together. He had a following so many people believed what he said. Same things happen in cults. I'm not saying Christianity is a cult, but it is easy to get people to believe what you say.

you can believe what you want, i honestly don't care. i'm glad you have something to believe in, but in my opinion, i just didn't like it. I tried to understand and like it, but it just wasn't for me. Not one religion is going to be right for everyone.

i'm sorry, but quoting from the bible is just not that credible of a source in my opinion. that's like saying anything I write in my journal is credible. no offense to anyone, but that's just how I see it.

I can come up with proof and show you links, but I don't want to waste my time.

this is just my honest opinion. take it how you want, but it's whatever. no need to bash at me for not believe what you believe in.

I didn't quote the Bible.

and I would agree...the convenience for the skeptic is that in formation of logical discussion you are not supposed to use anything which is a part of that which is to be proved to prove the existence of it. Because anything that flows from a source is "not neutral" and will prove that source. Like the Bible as God's breathed word therefore it can not be used to prove him because it presupposes that he is real.

So for a person who is a skeptic NOTHING is suitable evidence, because (at least for the judao-christian) ALL things are created by God and speak to his existence. So why don't you give us all example of suitable evidence?

[Buttons]

I didn't quote the Bible.

and I would agree...the convenience for the skeptic is that in formation of logical discussion you are not supposed to use anything which is a part of that which is to be proved to prove the existence of it. Because anything that flows from a source is "not neutral" and will prove that source. Like the Bible as God's breathed word therefore it can not be used to prove him because it presupposes that he is real.

So for a person who is a skeptic NOTHING is suitable evidence, because (at least for the judao-christian) ALL things are created by God and speak to his existence. So why don't you give us all example of suitable evidence?

other people are.

i'm pretty skeptic, so that's why none of reading the bible makes any sense to me.

[sport_122]

other people are.

i'm pretty skeptic, so that's why none of reading the bible makes any sense to me.

IMO most people who have said that to me say it for one of three reasons...

1. They do not understand HOW to read the Bible and HOW it is put together.

2. They do not have a realistic (based on the Bible) view of God. They believe one thing about him and it is usually not what is written in the Bible. And even if you don't want to read it as a book of faith. You can still pick it up to read through it much like you would a piece of fiction and learn about it.

3. As i was leading into. The majority of people who read the Bible are compelled to make a decision on it. You don't have to read it with the idea of I have to prove or disprove this. Even if you pic it up and read it as fiction, it does not mean that you are forced to believe it. I have learned a ton about religion, science, sociology etc, and I don't believe it all. Understanding and knowledge of something does NOT denote belief or that you have a religious face.

Once you pull those misconceptions out, then you can start to look at what is written and then you can have a good foundation to make arguments based off of what is written. But it seems like you may have some serious misconceptions on what the Bible says and who and how God functions. Most people who don't believe in God are like this. But its no different than me deciding that everything about you can be determined off of what you have said here in this thread. That is completely wrong, and we know that, but so many people do that very thing when arguing the character and existence of God.

[btstone]

LOL, i can prove, but rather not waste my time. I'm still waiting for your proof for God. I believe there might be a superior being(s), but does that necessarily make him God? No.

The more I read the bible and the things you people say, makes Christianity more unbelievable to me. That's how I see it.

you can not prove it autum. you know me better than that. i would not say some dumb stuff that makes no sense. look in the mirror. tell me that came from a primate. if you honestly believe that. i will stop with htis post

[Buttons]

i've read the bible and understood it. not all of it, but i've been to church. i've been to sunday classes. i still read a lot. i just didn't like the religion. that's all. i'm still searching for what i want to believe in. it's just a personal choice.

[btstone]

i've read the bible and understood it. not all of it, but i've been to church. i've been to sunday classes. i still read a lot. i just didn't like the religion. that's all. i'm still searching for what i want to believe in. it's just a personal choice.

you didnt answer my question. im not hear to tell you about church. i havent been to church in a long time. a building (church) does not define a religion. The "church" is the people and views that make up the religion

[Buttons]

you didnt answer my question. im not hear to tell you about church. i havent been to church in a long time. a building (church) does not define a religion. The "church" is the people and views that make up the religion

i was just pointing out church, meaning i've read the bible (most of it) and understood it.

[geoff]

reading the bible alone doesnt mean anything. its not a search for God. to search for God takes prayer aswell. and i didnt only quote the bible. i also used athiestic writings and research done by credible scientific evolutionists. everyone makes their own path buttons. some people take longer than others. you say you believe in a higher superior being? well why cant that being be God? im happy you have read the bible and understood most of it cuz i read and understand less than half. but its a constant thing...the more i read and pray the more i understand. you can believe we came from ants pissing on frogs...it doesnt matter. there are alot of theories and hypothesis out there in the world and there that constantly change. that doesnt mean they are all right. there is one absolute truth to everything what you believe that is, is up to you. i know that my God is the same past present and future and has shown me He is real. i hope one day with your reading and what not that you come to your own absolute truth. God bless

[zimabog]

We are not special.

[geoff]

? what is that supposed to be?

[zimabog]

? what is that supposed to be?

Our planet taken on the edge of the solar system. In the original photo the planet was only .12 of a pixel. Considering our entire solar system is a similar sized dot in a photo of our galaxy. One could see smallness and insignificance of Earth in reference to everything else. You as an individual are the size of an atom in that photo. You are less than a dot in comparison everything else. Do you really think that if you pray a god will hear your voice? Do you think that every birth is a gift from a god and that a god made you in your precise form? Do you think a god will actually cause a plane to have a safe crash landing? There are celestial bodies out there that are so huge it would take a hundred years or more traveling at the speed of light just to cross it. And these celestial bodies may not even have intelligent life in them. Why would a god create something so massive and awesome in spectacle and then create something so insignificant such as Earth and call it it's super special creation, so special I'll send down a son to die for them?

In the scope of everything, you are nothing.

You are not special.

So its ridiculous to claim that a god, if such a thing exists, created you specifically in your homo sapien form to inhabit the specifically super specially created Earth and that it wants you to praise it. And that if you pray really hard (got to bow your head and clasp your hands or it wont work correctly!) that it just might do a miracle, such as angling a crashing aircraft a few degrees (compared to a 3,000 light year wide celestial object) so it can not break up on impact.

The notion that a god looks upon this planet is ridiculous.

[geoff]

how is it ridiculous? the bible says God created the stars above to testify to His awesome power. the size of something does not signify its importance...an oxygen molecule is naked to the human eye yet we cannot survive without it. i know my God hears me because i am His child and He is my Father. and your above statements are oppinion.

[zimabog]

We are probably someone else's stars. And they look at their sky, which our star or galaxy is just a faint twinkle.

geoff:
Do you believe that there is other intelligent life out there?
Do you think that they think that our solar system is just a "testament of power"?


Do you think our planet has oxygen because there was a plan to put oxygen breathing animals on it or is it that there are oxygen breathing animals because there is oxygen on it?

If an "intelligent designer" was so smart why don't we breathe nitrogen? the atmosphere is 80% nitrogen.

[geoff]

i dont know if there is any other intelligent life out there. the bible doesnt say anything about it so yes there very well could be. i think our planet has oxygen cuz thats how God made it. i dont know why we breath oxygen instead of nitrogen. maybe we would of had a different make up in that case. not sure. are you telling me that its impossible for a superior being ( God ) to have created us and everything and done so else where and just not put it in the bible so we could concentrate on Him instead of trying to find other life? is the possibility of God really more farfetched than the universe, plants, humans to have just spontaneously come out of no where for no reason and " evolved" to what we are today?

[yojimbo]

like i said before...
although evolution can't be psychically seen there is a strong argument about what it is and the study of it. we humans can't even observe a caterpillar mutate, evolve, or whatever you want to call it into a butterfly, but we know that they are the same.


saying that there is NO PROOF of evolution is pretty... well... retarded.
just look at these fossil records.





pretty interesting, yes? I have looked into many different types of research on this topic and read many different scientists' theories. before i continue let me finish smoking this bowl before I try to wrap my mind around this whole topic lol.


.... okay... to all the Christians out there -- take a look at this video. Brain Washing ( Jesus Camp ''Highlights'' )
now, the funny thing is that modern Christianity and its teachings are entirely incongruous with what the bible actually says, or what christ taught.
you cannot justify the fucking wacky bullshit people do like at the jesus camp by using the bible.

They either misinterpret the bible or ignore it entirely.

watching that video just makes me feel gross inside. if hypothetically there was a devil... he's involved in that shit. Those children look like they're possessed, they just have a crazy look in their eyes.
the fat preacher bitch just looks scary too. It reminds me of when i went to a youth group with a bitch I wanted to bang and everyone waved their hands in the air, and one kid got on the mic and spoke in tongues.

I wanted to get the fuck out of there immediately cause I felt like there was some evil shit going on.
there are tons of animals to point out a sign of evolution or adaptation --- one that i enjoy suggesting are dog breeds.... (from chihuahua to bull mastiff) that is an easy way to "see" evolution in action.

[yojimbo]

im not close minded. you are more close minded than most ppl i have met. you just assume your boat is further up the river. it is not. you have no proof other than your theories. thhere are not enough or even close to enough fossil records to prove anything.

and yes, i was a planned birth. it took 4 months for my old man to shoot a good nut.

no i am not close minded... I have gone to church to observe and do research.

i'm opened to what they say --- i just don't believe in it.
though they give good advice in how to maintain a normal, evil-free life they fill believers' minds with a false hope in one day reaching a place where one feels no pain or sorrow.

this is just what i think... like i said, i've come to realize that you can't sway people's opinions so i just do this for fun now.
people shouldn't take a subject like this so seriously.

[btstone]

no i am not close minded... I have gone to church to observe and do research.

i'm opened to what they say --- i just don't believe in it.
though they give good advice in how to maintain a normal, evil-free life they fill believers' minds with a false hope in one day reaching a place where one feels no pain or sorrow.

this is just what i think... like i said, i've come to realize that you can't sway people's opinions so i just do this for fun now.
people shouldn't take a subject like this so seriously.

if your were so open minded you would not just take some reacher's word and look for truth in the religion yourself, im sure you will find it easier to believe then a gap filled evolution THEORY

[sport_122]

no i am not close minded... I have gone to church to observe and do research.

i'm opened to what they say --- i just don't believe in it.
though they give good advice in how to maintain a normal, evil-free life they fill believers' minds with a false hope in one day reaching a place where one feels no pain or sorrow.

this is just what i think... like i said, i've come to realize that you can't sway people's opinions so i just do this for fun now.
people shouldn't take a subject like this so seriously.

...I don't buy it. You say that you wen to church to observe and do research...The Bible cannot be thoroughly researched in two days a week listening to a few people give 15-20 minute discussions. You need to get something that will tell you about the Jewish culture and the roman culture. You need to know how to get the Hebrew and greek in order to properly translate the words on the pages. You would have to become a student of history, philosophy, anthropology and sociology to be able to grasp what the real meanings are on the page.

If you are calling church activity "study" then there is no reason why you have a hard time with it. BTW, no church I have ever been to has said that I could maintain and evil free life. That is contrary to the very Gospel that establishes the Christian church under Christ.

I will suggest two things to you that may spur some interest in the hopes that one day you will think that this is pretty important to our existence you know where to go to get a good idea.

First. Read :Mere Christianity, by C.S. Lewis, to find out what Christians believe at the core of their faith. basically it has nothing to do with denominations and its a pretty easy two or three day read.

Second. try to find a debate called "Has science killed God?" It is John Lennox and Richard Dawkins talking about science and God and the human existence. Basically John Lennox puts Richard Dawkins in the hot seat and uses logic to show where his POV on Darwinian Evolution superseding everything is less logical than that of a creator and a personal God. You can get the discussion here for free in MP3 audio. I have the DVD and its worth it because you get to see their body language especially Dawkins who gets stumped several times during the debate.

http://apologetics315.blogspot.com/2...ennox-has.html

I hope you check it out.

[Ocelot]

what church do you go to that only lasts 15-20 minutes? I have been and have seen people go to church and disappear for hours at a time. seriously though, all this talk of how God made this and that... meh. God must be larger than the sun, or even the Galaxy to have "created" them. Or do you believe that God is "invisible"?

[sport_122]

what church do you go to that only lasts 15-20 minutes? I have been and have seen people go to church and disappear for hours at a time. seriously though, all this talk of how God made this and that... meh. God must be larger than the sun, or even the Galaxy to have "created" them. Or do you believe that God is "invisible"?

During a church service that lasts about 1.5ish hours you have about 35 minutes of singing, 10 of prayer, 15 of communion, 10 of Tithing. That leaves about 20 minutes give or take a few to actually have teaching. My church starts at 10:30 and we are usually out by 12:15.

And my comments to him were specifically related to "the studying of the Bible". You are not going through the Bible for an entire church service. Some people may spend extra time on sunday morning in a sunday school class where you may add on another 30 -45 minutes, but we don't.

I believe in a transcendent God, who is beyond our ability to fully understand as he can exists inside and outside of our understanding. I do not believe he has to be physically big to have created the Universe. Thats an extremely elementary way of thinking.

[btstone]

what church do you go to that only lasts 15-20 minutes? I have been and have seen people go to church and disappear for hours at a time. seriously though, all this talk of how God made this and that... meh. God must be larger than the sun, or even the Galaxy to have "created" them. Or do you believe that God is "invisible"?

how big was the person that created sky scrapers, the aiplanes, or the any large object. prob regular size like me and you

[greasemunkey]

as of now 47 people are going to hell...go to a good church people, its not all about what you think. I want to see tuners in heaven! not just the mustang boys

[BABY J]

There is no hell.

[Ocelot]

1.5 hours still seems very short.

also, yes, man created sky scrapers, but man created them with teams, groups, and tools. God created everything solo, with no tools. so he is either very large and powerful, or... the universe just is, Shi* happens is a great motto for it. meh

[btstone]

God created everything solo, with no tools.

your 100% certain about this?

[_Christian_]

Can omniscient God, who
Knows the future, find
The omnipotence to
Change His future mind?

[Incontt]

lol..god....babykiller.....real great guy. he hates those amputees too,

http://godisimaginary.com/

[Buttons]

LOL, some of these responses have me rolling on the ground.

[yojimbo]

You would have to become a student of history, philosophy, anthropology and sociology to be able to grasp what the real meanings are on the page.

To grasp the real meaning?? cmon, guy...
from what i have gathered the bible contains nothing more than morals and guidance to a 'better' way of life.





with messages like this it's kinda hard to take it serious... so are jesus' followers the only ones to get saved from evil? seems kinda selfish and immature of him. what kind of god leaves his children all alone in the back ally to die alone and suffer in a world of crime, murder, rape, ect ect...

I'll tell you... an asshole-god or a god who enjoys seeing human-kind suffer.
either way it's hard to really imagine a being of such greatness. his 'image' requires the admiration of others in order to keep existing because without faith and a believe in christ eventually the thoughts of memories will vanish... same with everything else ---


but people aren't dumb... the know that they have to keep updating and increasing their church sizes in order to bring in the crowd - which is working, but not as good as they expected. many people -- atheists, agnostics, and people who just don't give a damn are now coming out and expressing how they feel about the subject.
they are no longer keeping their mouths shut -- because i'm sure you know... that well, people like me(who doesn't believe in the lord jesus christ) aren't really accepted in society - atleast here in the united states.

kinda fucked up but this country is pretty big into religion...

If you are calling church activity "study" then there is no reason why you have a hard time with it. BTW, no church I have ever been to has said that I could maintain and evil free life. That is contrary to the very Gospel that establishes the Christian church under Christ.

so you spend time going to church that promises things and purifies you but you can never live an evil free life??!!! really?! never ever?!!
damn... seems like a huge waste of time to me then lol
oh, and i don't have a hard time with it -- it's just mind-boggling to me... i mean the stories and all the gibberish talk.

I will suggest two things to you that may spur some interest in the hopes that one day you will think that this is pretty important to our existence you know where to go to get a good idea.

First. Read :Mere Christianity, by C.S. Lewis, to find out what Christians believe at the core of their faith. basically it has nothing to do with denominations and its a pretty easy two or three day read.

Second. try to find a debate called "Has science killed God?" It is John Lennox and Richard Dawkins talking about science and God and the human existence. Basically John Lennox puts Richard Dawkins in the hot seat and uses logic to show where his POV on Darwinian Evolution superseding everything is less logical than that of a creator and a personal God. You can get the discussion here for free in MP3 audio. I have the DVD and its worth it because you get to see their body language especially Dawkins who gets stumped several times during the debate.

http://apologetics315.blogspot.com/2...ennox-has.html

I hope you check it out.

sorry, sport, but I have had a few near-death experiences the recent one being last wednesday, july 8th, and i still don't believe -- what makes you think reading up on an argument that lennox and dawkins had will change my mind? I am lucky and thankful that i am alive.

if some higer being was the reason that i am still here then i thank it, but I know that a lot of factors is the reason that i am still living.
funny that after that day i looked at things totally different. why was i lucky when i'm sure someone else that same exact day died. doesn't seem logical to think that God's choosing who lives and who dies. that's waaaayyy too much responsibility FOR ONE BEING TO HANDLE.

if your were so open minded you would not just take some reacher's word and look for truth in the religion yourself, im sure you will find it easier to believe then a gap filled evolution THEORY

... haha i think i'll stick beside the evolution theory instead of putting my life in an imaginary being's hand.

[yojimbo]

why hasn't anyone attacked post #223?

[BABY J]

^^ Man -- you're like ME, but you're you. Kinda like a mini-me. LOL. Good stuff.

[AnthonyF]

Evolution should not be looked at as a belief. It is a scientific theory that gives a suggestion as to HOW. Faith in the existence of a transcendent God (all powerful, and not fully known or understood) does not necessarily give a HOW.

For instance: you believe that birds exist, but it doesn't tell you how they fly. Or you believe that cars are real but that doesn't tell you how they work or what they do.

I agree with Geoff and as a believer I do not doubt evolution in most cases (there are several different versions of evolution) I think there are HUGE holes in the theory, but I believe there are some valid points. But until a complete fossil record is found then nobody can even say that evolution is 100%, we can just say there is evidence.

Also, my world view does not lead me to believe we have a free will. I believe we have the ability to make choices, but not a free will. For instance, in a multiple choice question, you have the option to select A, B, C, or D. You cannot select F unless it is given as a possible answer. So even in your ability to make choices, your options are limited as well. And what gets even crazier is that choices made apart from us dictate how we will establish our choices. Pointing back to some causal event that began the process of responses and decisions which will echo and place us where we are to be. But i digress free will cannot logically exist in the finite and only in the infinite can 1 free will logically exists. I believe that 1 will governs and establishes all universal laws which is why our universe is seen as consistent and predictable when we observe it.

Did you seriously type ALL that to my PERSONAL opinion about MY beliefs? Get a fucking life loser. I don't care what YOU believe. I did not type anything to get involved into a religion debate. I stated what I feel like is going to happen.

-Ant.