if you believe that faith and fact cannot coexist on the same subject matter then do you do not believe in the orbit of the earth as it was calculated thousands of years ago, the moon, the sun, the galaxy which were all identified millenia ago, etc. Do you believe evolution is real? Do you believe that going to college will yield you a higher paying job, or adding a certain part will make your car faster than someone elses. These are all actions that people take first based off of observational experience, then based off of faith, and then can easily become fact.Originally Posted by d993s
but who told you that I would call this a miracle. I wouldn't. I would call it provision. Provision is a result of all the factors of your life coming together at one time. And where need (not greed or desire) meet at supply or sustenance, I would call that provision. Provision can be explained away easily by some and there is room for interpretation, however as the two random things flow together, I believe it is God who determines those moments. But those aren't miracles by definition.Come on, let's move onto "miracles" done by god....
I once gave $500 to a poor christian family who was in need. I never told them it was from me. Back then I went to church and they actually announced it as a "MIRACLE" from god!!!!!
WELL FOCKEN AYE, I guess that makes me GOD! LMFAO! It's been over 10 years, and they still talk about it as a "miracle from god". I bet if I told them that it was ME who gave them the $, they would say something like "god instructed you to do it" to which I would reply "no, actually I was fucking your daughter at the time and felt the need to do a regular-ass good deed because it's satifying knowing that you helped someone.
By definition miracles are what happens OUTSIDE the regular laws of the universe/ our world. an example that you point to is the resurrection. I have mentioned it several times because it is THAT important, as even YOU said
This is where the miracle really rears it ugly head for the non believer. And this is what I would call a miracle. If people were being raised from the dead all the time this would go un noticed because it would be natural. this event has left a HUGE mark on our world history. There have been hordes of historians who have tried to disprove it, but cannot. Because of several reasons.When you learn to accept mortality as a fact of life on this planet, you will realize that there is no salvation. Stop dreaming, live your life, leave your mark in history (hopefully in a positive way), and do what you can to improve and allow intelligence to expand as rapidly as possible (religious beliefs have always hindered or denied human advancement)
First, the explosion of the Christian church immediately after the death and resurrection of Christ. Had he not risen, the messages that he spoke and the deeds that he did would have been immediately dismissed as he openly claimed that he would rise again.
Second, There are plenty of first Century Roman historians who have written about the man of Christ and about his death and his followers and the miracles that they were known to have worked.
Third, did you know that after his resurrection he is said to have been on this earth for no less than 40 days. At that time there were hundreds of witnesses who saw him, and his physical body and his ascension.
The list goes on an on. Modern day secular historians have said that they cannot dismiss this miracle as it is accounted for through many records that are NOT of biblical foundation.
I could point you in the direction of plenty of authors, secular and religious, who will tell you that the story of the resurrection cannot be easily dismissed to a hoax and should be looked at with intent to understand it because its place and meaning are so profound to who we are.
And if almost 2000 years of history and knowledge have not discredited the resurrection, and the story is still powerful in our world then there obviously is something to it.
I say all this knowing that what I said before still holds true. You have decided to close your mind to this possibility for what it is and replace it with that which you know to be a part of the laws of existence when in the resurrection, and the miracles performed by Christ, He established his authority to us by defining what we knew to be the laws of our universe and then showing that His power alone could break those laws. That power was later given to the disciples. And what is even more ironic is that you believe in the laws of our world and not a lawlessness, yet just as in the commandments the law was established so that the opposite of the law could be given light.
This is what defines miracles, this is how God demonstrated himself to men all over the world, but we get so used to the "norm" that we ignore the existence of the abnormal. We are currently in a period where we are trying to ignore morality and its origins and next we will try to dismiss the laws of nature and surely enough we will be put in our place again. How? I don't know but history shows that we have a habit of forgetting our problems in favor of embracing and living by sight, when it is very obvious that our world is made up of much more than what we can see.
Reply With Quote