Question about Muslims (Keep Civil Or Will Be Deleted)

[Brett]

Jamie I have often wondered this myself. I brought this up when we all discussed this issue when the beheadings started, I dont understand how the Muslin world does not stand up against these few who use the faith as a excuse to do what they do and say its done in the word of Islam..... Maybe if the rest of the Peaceful Muslim/Islamic world would stand up, Protest, etc they wouldnt feel they have the backing and acceptance of the faith and thier god.

[Jaimecbr900]

I know that in certain parts of the world for someone to publicly denounce certain things would certainly mean you'd be damn near stoned to death, so I totally understand the represion aspect and possibility. That may be an answer.

I also know that some people may feel like there's not much their opinion would do against this kind of violence. That too may be an answer.

I just would like to get some more insight as to why this is so one-sided in my mind.

There has to be a reason behind it.

[Brett]

I also know that some people may feel like there's not much their opinion would do against this kind of violence. That too may be an answer.

I just would like to get some more insight as to why this is so one-sided in my mind.

There has to be a reason behind it.

true, But I think if terror cells who do these acts in the name of Islam felt the the faith does not back them, it would make an impact, because in thier eyes, they feel thier god will bring them to heaven for what they are doing and to me if the people of the islamic faith would stand up and make an outcry to how this is not what Islam is and the faith is not a backer of thier actions, they (The terrorists) wouldnt be so confient in what they do and feel its in the name of thier religion.

I do believe if when the First beheading happened, If the Islamic nations stood up and said "That is not acceptable, or even the terror attacks that go on are not acceptabe" they would not be able to attack in the name of what they believe is right, which in thier heads totally changes things.

Anyone who takes the time to understand the Muslim faith knows the teachings of Islam is a peaceful religion and do not back terrorism or any injustice that has been going on, But at the same time the people need to let terrorists know, Its not acceptable and its not what Islam preaches.

[Hulud]

Jamie I have often wondered this myself. I brought this up when we all discussed this issue when the beheadings started, I dont understand how the Muslin world does not stand up against these few who use the faith as a excuse to do what they do and say its done in the word of Islam..... Maybe if the rest of the Peaceful Muslim/Islamic world would stand up, Protest, etc they wouldnt feel they have the backing and acceptance of the faith and thier god.

i have seen some things of people denouncing the violence, its not just on the front page of the paper. my guess is because the news people feel the american people want a group to claim as "the bad guys" rather than say its a bunch of different groups.

also i think people over in the mid east arent going to stand up and say something, because they will be killed. would you stand up and say something like that in the mid east? i dont think most of us would.

[Brett]

i have seen some things of people denouncing the violence, its not just on the front page of the paper. my guess is because the news people feel the american people want a group to claim as "the bad guys" rather than say its a bunch of different groups.

also i think people over in the mid east arent going to stand up and say something, because they will be killed. would you stand up and say something like that in the mid east? i dont think most of us would.

But see, they are getting killed now over in IRAQ anyways, These extremeists are killing muslims now, So why as a group not stand up to not only to stop terrorism against us, but on thier OWN PEOPLE? All it takes is to show that Muslims will not back it, and make clear Islam teaches peace, and thier sins will not be met by god or accepted.

[Hulud]

But see, they are getting killed now over in IRAQ anyways, These extremeists are killing muslims now, So why as a group not stand up to not only to stop terrorism against us, but on thier OWN PEOPLE? All it takes is to show that Muslims will not back it, and make clear Islam teaches peace, and thier sins will not be met by god or accepted.

easier said than done, when you dont know whos good and whos bad in a country with no control you dont know who to trust. so if you dont know who to trust, your not going to speak your mind, cause yuo will get killed.

also you gotta remember they dont have the govt to protect them and if they say something that pisses people off, you will have people wanting to kill you

[SLOWLYbtngU]

easier said than done, when you dont know whos good and whos bad in a country with no control you dont know who to trust. so if you dont know who to trust, your not going to speak your mind, cause yuo will get killed.

also you gotta remember they dont have the govt to protect them and if they say something that pisses people off, you will have people wanting to kill you

Exactly, You do not know who is really on your side...So it is easier to stay out of it and jsut mind ur own business and pray that you are not the target of one of the crimes...

[LiL PaKi]

easier said than done, when you dont know whos good and whos bad in a country with no control you dont know who to trust. so if you dont know who to trust, your not going to speak your mind, cause yuo will get killed.

also you gotta remember they dont have the govt to protect them and if they say something that pisses people off, you will have people wanting to kill you

People claim they are Muslim and doing it for Islam.. i'm no one to judge, i'll leave that to God...

However, killing innocent people isn't Islamic nor acceptable in any religion... yes, it's there and how are u to stop people you can't find? (ie. Osama bin Laden and the taliban)

If the people try to fight back they may get shot. We are talking about poor countries and how they may not be ready to lose their families but they are doing it for Islam and to protect the name and God williingly they will be accepted into paradise.

This type of war/fight back would be considered Jihad, Jihad may reflect the war aspects in Islam. Jihad is as presented in war in the name of justice or Islam, to deter an aggressor, for self defense, and/or to establish justice and freedom to practice religion, would the Quran and any of the other scriptures implies the striving of spiritual good. This Jihad particularly involves change in one's self and mentality. It may concern the sacrifice of material property, social class and even emotional comfort solely for the salvation and worship of God Alone.

The day will come when every soul will serve as its own advocate, and every soul will be paid fully for whatever it had done, without the least injustice." (16:111).
" The day will come when each soul will find all the good works it had done brought forth. As for the evil works, it will wish that they were far, far removed. GOD alerts you that you shall reverence Him alone. GOD is Compassionate towards the people. " (3:30).

"You shall strive for the cause of GOD as you should strive for His cause. " (22:78).
In Brief; the meaning the media gives to this word (Jihad) is false. This word does not mean a holy war, for there is nothing holy about a war in Islam. There are times when war is tolerated, permitted and even, in some case, to a point accepted, but never considered holy. Islam is a religion of peace, no matter what certain media or deranged individuals say or claim.

[MongolPup]

There are times when war is tolerated, permitted and even, in some case, to a point accepted, but never considered holy. Islam is a religion of peace, no matter what certain media or deranged individuals say or claim.

Remember, the Christians are the same way. The first "Crusades" were indeed called by the pope, but then later people would just "call" them themselves. If we had had this conversation a couple hundred years ago, we would be saying "damn Christians, seems like every couple of years they go and fuck shit up."

Sadly I need to go to work, so if someone wants to refute this or w/e you may have to wait a bit.

[SLOWLYbtngU]

But see, they are getting killed now over in IRAQ anyways, These extremeists are killing muslims now, So why as a group not stand up to not only to stop terrorism against us, but on thier OWN PEOPLE? All it takes is to show that Muslims will not back it, and make clear Islam teaches peace, and thier sins will not be met by god or accepted.

NOt every group of people in this worls know how to come together...Amongst a community of thousands there are jsut as many personalities...Sure here in America we have the tendancy to unite...But think about it, normally something bad to extreme measures has to happen..

Besides once again, sure they cry and suffer but at the same time who is to say that these are not things that they have to endure in order to get to where they want to be in their religion??? Think about it in Christianity I am supposed to die to myself and therefore let God guide me...How do u know it isnt the same with them?

[4dmin]

But see, they are getting killed now over in IRAQ anyways, These extremeists are killing muslims now, So why as a group not stand up to not only to stop terrorism against us, but on thier OWN PEOPLE? All it takes is to show that Muslims will not back it, and make clear Islam teaches peace, and thier sins will not be met by god or accepted.

lol Brett how come you and the rest of the Bush nazi's sound like tree hugging hippies during discussion such as this... WAR is WAR there are no rules.... we waged war on them we shall reap the reward of such actions. shit we have more gun related deaths in our country then any other. turn on the news you will hear about atleast 1 rape, 1 murder, 1 kidnapping every night. wake up we have the same thing outside our doors being commited by White/Black suburban commandos; just our killers aren't motivated by religion

[Brett]

lol Brett how come you and the rest of the Bush nazi's sound like tree hugging hippies during discussion such as this... WAR is WAR there are no rules.... we waged war on them we shall reap the reward of such actions. shit we have more gun related deaths in our country then any other. turn on the news you will hear about atleast 1 rape, 1 murder, 1 kidnapping every night. wake up we have the same thing outside our doors being commited by White/Black suburban commandos; just our killers aren't motivated by religion

Dude, how does this have to do with Bush or my support of Bush? Im just saying in General I am with Jamie, that I dont understand why a religion does not stand up for what is going on in parts of the world and denounce the violence, etc. How is that tree hugging?

[Jaimecbr900]

lol Brett how come you and the rest of the Bush nazi's sound like tree hugging hippies during discussion such as this... WAR is WAR there are no rules.... we waged war on them we shall reap the reward of such actions. shit we have more gun related deaths in our country then any other. turn on the news you will hear about atleast 1 rape, 1 murder, 1 kidnapping every night. wake up we have the same thing outside our doors being commited by White/Black suburban commandos; just our killers aren't motivated by religion

Death may indeed be Death, but when you MURDER someone while shouting out that you are doing so for your FAITH, there is a difference.

How many of those "urban commandos" kill in the name of their God?

That's the difference.

[Brett]

Death may indeed be Death, but when you MURDER someone while shouting out that you are doing so for your FAITH, there is a difference.

How many of those "urban commandos" kill in the name of their God?

That's the difference.

THANK YOU!!! Thats what I am saying, We all know Paul that in war thier are no rules, But when killing people in terror attacks here or abroad in the name of Allah is bullshit, Im sorry if you dont agree, and I truley believe if a religion stood up and said "NO MORE" it might (MIGHT) make a difference, but when no one says anything, they feel they have the backing of the muslim world and that its okay to MURDER in the name if Islam.

[RandomGuy]

but when no one says anything, they feel they have the backing of the muslim world and that its okay to MURDER in the name if Islam.

hrm... so no one says anything... no one ever says "islam is a religion of peace"

Hrm, so its safe to conclude that we're terrorists since we're not fulfilling our "assigned religious duty" to speak out against negative media representation towards Islam? Kind of reminds me of Bush's: "If you're not with us, you're one of them" shit. If only we were like christians, with no sinful interpreters, no people who do immoral things in the name of god...

come to my mosque on friday .... listen to 1 speech.
thats all.

Anyways the ignorance in this thread is offensive. Especially from someone like Jamiecbr. [/serious RG]

[4dmin]

Death may indeed be Death, but when you MURDER someone while shouting out that you are doing so for your FAITH, there is a difference.

How many of those "urban commandos" kill in the name of their God?

That's the difference.

movtives of the insane/misunderstood do not matter... if i killed you in the name of the devil would it make it any different if i just killed you. your still dead just b/c i put a iconic motive to it doesn't say anything.

the problem w/ this country is we have shot ourself in the foot... we put our selves in this situation now are are back pedaling out of it... countries like US, UK, have pushed for WAR and when WAR is brought to us we whine about it. just like the pope opening his mouth about muslims... that has to be the dumbest thing in the world to discuss... hey let me discuss politics in the middle of a religious war... why don't you just give them a nuke and key to your house.

[Jaimecbr900]

movtives of the insane/misunderstood do not matter... if i killed you in the name of the devil would it make it any different if i just killed you. your still dead just b/c i put a iconic motive to it doesn't say anything.

It would say a lot about devil worshipers if they stood by and said "hmmm, Ok this guy is killing and making us look bad.....nah, it's alright, let him keep doing it...." Yes sir, it does say a lot about someone.

the problem w/ this country is we have shot ourself in the foot... we put our selves in this situation now are are back pedaling out of it... countries like US, UK, have pushed for WAR and when WAR is brought to us we whine about it. just like the pope opening his mouth about muslims... that has to be the dumbest thing in the world to discuss... hey let me discuss politics in the middle of a religious war... why don't you just give them a nuke and key to your house.

Is that like the Elephant in the room thing?

So, let me get this straight: You are proposing that people stand perfectly still and hope that the wasp flying around doesn't sting you? What do you do when it gets ON you? Do you stand there and let it sting you or do you swat it?

So "speaking out" against crazy self proclaimed Muslims (because I don't think they're true Muslims) is a big NO NO because what? They're gonna get mad and kill people........hmmmm, anyone see the irony here?

[Vteckidd]

the problem w/ this country is we have shot ourself in the foot... we put our selves in this situation now are are back pedaling out of it

No i think the Muslim Extremists bombing our embassys, and the WTC once, and the flying 3 planes into our building killing 3000 people put us in this situation.

Fact of the matter is that we are at WAR, we have always been at war . The only problem with this WAR is that we dont know who the enemy is, or, where they live. We know they are Muslim, we know they are EXtremists, we know they reside in the middle east and in the USA, but we dont know who is who and who is on our side. IMHO.

We had a chance to end all this 8 years ago with Clinton. He had the intel and the means to bomb bin laden, and he chose not to. He chose to watch football instead cause he had NO BALLS. Clinton was great at what he did, make people think everything was ok. He was a great politician, he was a horrible leader.

Now the left will say we went to war because Bush lied about WMDs. Yeah, so what. We had semi decent intelligience that said that Iraq had SOMETHING or they were TRYING to get something SOON. So maybe he POLITICIZED it a little to get approval. I think whats even more funny about that is the fact that even so fresh after 9/11 , some of the country still needed a reason to go after another potential threat.

Had we NOT gone to war, and removed Saddam, what if he wuld have gotten a nuke, or funded ANOTHER terroist attack against the US? then people would have said "oh bush didnt do ENOUGH to stop this". so you guys cant have your cake an eat it too.

Now the democraps say we need to pull out of IRaq. Oh yeah, thats smart. Leave a massive power vacuum to be filled by someone WORSE than saddam and all our soldiers that have died have died in vein. Why dont you guys come up with a plan, oh wait, they dont have one. Their platform is "bush is the devil, we need to change the policy in IRAQ, but we have no idea what that should be".

... countries like US, UK, have pushed for WAR and when WAR is brought to us we whine about it. .

again, its the democrats that have no balls that are whining.

Now people will say that bush caused the 9/11 attacks with no credible proof, conspiracy theories, etc. Believe whatever you want. But freedom isnt free. I just think our generation is so lazy we dont want to fight for it. We just all want to work 10 hours a week an make 100,000 a year. We want so much from this country, but dont want to give anything back. 16 year olds can have $80,000 cars , but ask to fight for your country an its "fuck that".

I lvoe you paulina

to Jaime, your on to something. Ill say something thats gonna piss alot of people off, but i have had ALOT of muslim friends. Its a weird religion. Lots of people are very mellow. but, they dont want to stand up against the bad guys. They are very complacent. Most come to the US an milk it for all its worth, bad mouth us, but still lvie here . I dont get it. The religion as a whole has no balls IMO. They dont care for the most part. Many of my muslim friends, WHO ARE REALLY GOOD FRIENDS OF MINE, still think that Israel needs to perish. ANd since we support israel, we are targets. thats the heart of the whole matter, they cant let shit go. they are arguing over fucking rubble and will kill for the next 4000 years over it cause they are too stupid to wake up an say "this is a war that will never end".


/Corveys sermon

[HvyArms]

I wish I could respond to this, but Im working.

[Jaimecbr900]

i have seen some things of people denouncing the violence, its not just on the front page of the paper. my guess is because the news people feel the american people want a group to claim as "the bad guys" rather than say its a bunch of different groups.

Very true. Certain news sells more papers. Again, that is one of the options that I've thought about, but I've just always thought it had to be deeper than that.

also i think people over in the mid east arent going to stand up and say something, because they will be killed. would you stand up and say something like that in the mid east? i dont think most of us would.

Again, as I previously mentioned, I know persecution is no joking matter in certain parts of the world BUT........

IF you are truly a "peaceful" religion, why would you kill someone for merely not going along with your agenda?

Also, there are Muslims all over the world, not just the Middle East or third world countries. There are Muslims right here in Atlanta. Is not like those people would be in direct jeopardy of being tortured for standing up and denouncing terrorism, right?

[Hulud]

IF you are truly a "peaceful" religion, why would you kill someone for merely not going along with your agenda?

Also, there are Muslims all over the world, not just the Middle East or third world countries. There are Muslims right here in Atlanta. Is not like those people would be in direct jeopardy of being tortured for standing up and denouncing terrorism, right?

i dont know man, maybe your just not looking for them speaking out