I was referring to you being set in your ways... I'm not gonna change your mind. Right?Originally Posted by metalman
Thats just the point. The true Christian should never be "set in their ways", they should always be completely willing to accept whatever the Bible teaches as they advance in knowlege of that Word, regardless of what mommy and daddy told them, regardless of what the preacher man said, regardless of the popular opinion, regardless of their former ideas.
And every sunday morning, night and wednesday night I enter worship/ preaching with an open mind and heart so don't think I'm stubborn like that.
I'm truely honestly not.
Wrong. I am bound by the Scripture. If you can show me a rational explanation that is in harmony with ALL Scriptures on the subject of death and hell I am there. We are all subject to the Word. I am no exception. So far you have not, or even attempted to explain some of the plain english from the Bible I have quoted...which is okay, youre not obligated to prove anything to me. Thats my job to study for myself.
You have simply stated what you believe and given a couple Scriptures for it.
Nothing wrong with that, its just not that compelling to me. I respect your right to ANY opinion you wish to hold. For me though the evidence has to be given from a sum total of all Scripture. The "contradictions" between Scriptures must be explained. I really care not whose view is proven. Do you?
I realize that most likely the view of eternal burning hell may be a favorite of your church. Youre not alone. Catholics love it. Baptists love it. In fact the majority of the so called Christian world endorses this teaching. Problem for me is that this teaching fails to explain the countless verses that indicate and clearly state otherwise.
It also serves as a motivation for many to reject a God that is only one small step away from tormenting one forever. I dont blame them.
I realize that most likely the view I have presented is probably completely foreign to you. Maybe youve never even heard it before. I also realize that it took me many hours of studying the words and teachings of the entire Bible, greek & hebrew, words like "forever", "soul" "spirit" "hell" etc etc to arrive at any conclusion.
I certainly DO NOT expect to convince you in a matter of a few minutes to see something that took me a long time. I only appeal to you to study further, dont rely on what your church teaches. Have an open mind. Be open to anything the Scripture teaches. If we BOTH do that we'll end up knowing what is true regarding hell and alot of other things as well.
True... (I'm penecostal by the way- and no, we don't handle snakes, lol)
I will say though, that somethings aren't as clear as we'd like them to be in the bible. For instance if Adam and Eve were the only couple in the world, did Eve have to reproduce with her offspring? The same with Noah's family...
Or the fact that the bible never mentions Dinosaurs, but we know they existed because we have bones to prove it.
But I'll study up some more and maybe ask my preacher tonight at church and get back to ya. Cool?
Last edited by kelly; 03-15-2006 at 11:09 AM.
Plus one for no snakes.
Pentecostals love the eternal hell doctrine even more then Baptists.
If I were you I'd study for myself. My .02
Indeed, the Bible can be confusing on some points. To me the answer is multiple..some things arent nessessary for us the created to know. Other things (answers) are in the Book just not discovered by us as individuals.
As to dinosaurs...to me the Bible infers something. God destroyed the world by flood (Noah) because man "worshiped the creature more then the Creator" and because man was evil continually. The Scripture states the God saved "that which he had made" or pairs and sevens etc of that life. That tells me he DIDNT save what he did not make.
Think about it...mans lifespan before the flood was nearly 1000 years. Humans then were much more "pefect" and closer to what Adam was then are we. They were much more perfect in their knowlege and wisdom. Their worship of the creature obviously included manipulating God's creation...making, breeding, cloning whatever..dinasours. When God destroyed
the earth he destroyed those works of men too.
It says "as it was in the days of Noah, so shall it be in day of the coming of the Son...." What are earthly scientists involved in today??? Hmmm cloning...genetic manipulation etc etc
And contrary to popular opinion man and dinasour have been found in the same layer of earth. There are even tracks that appear to be of a large human leading a dinasour.
All very good points. Cept the thing "man and dinasour have been found in the same layer of earth". I'll have to read up on that too.
So what exactly do you believe? Do you believe the bible in it's entireity, parts of it, any of it at all?
Of course, study for yourself. Perhaps I should state it this way...evidences of man and dinasour have been found in the same layers of earth.
In order to accept any of the Bible one must accept all of it. People attempt to disect out the parts they dont want to comply with or can't understand.
They use lame excuses like "I am a new testament christian" or "I am under the new covenant" etc etc. Problem is the Bible clearly states that His principles do not change. 'I am the Lord thy God, I change not' is one very clear verse. That is why I say it is quite clear to me that in order to claim any teaching is true and in accordance with the Bible one must strive to find what is harmony with all of Scripture, not just a few select verses. There is NO adding to or subtracting from it.
See the princple outlined in Deut. 12:29-32
An illustration of that...Jesus, the author of new testament christianity summarized the ten commandments by saying "Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thine heart....thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself"
The first four commandments are mans duty to God. Love for God.
The last six are mans duty to fellow man. Love for Man.
The commandments were written in stone by the finger of God, upon two tablets of stone.Jesus simply reiterated the law in summary form. He didnt contradict it. He didnt change it. He didnt add to it. He didnt subtract from it.
He didnt do away with it. Which is all in keeping with the Bible description of the law being eternal.
Rev 22:7 Behold, I come quickly: blessed is he that keepeth the sayings of the prophecy of this book.
Rev 22:18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:
Rev 22:19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.
A warning to those who add or subtract from the Word and do so in Gods name....
Mat 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
John 10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me
2 Pet 1:19 We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts:
2 Pet 1:20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
2 Pet 1:21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.
2 Pet 2:1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.
2 Tim 2:15 Study to show thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
2 Tim 2:16 But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.
etc etc....
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote