10,500 is crazy, but with a turbo that big, its neccesary. Hell terry was revving his to 10,500 2 yers ago on his 700whp b16 lol.
Dont worry bee and danny, the Rome boys are too scared to cross the 9000rpm threshold, i have to yell at them to rev it above that.
if my STOCK GSR rods could handle 9700rpms, then i would expect a forged rod to be able to handle 10,000
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lol...
94 Supra= 500rwhp
If you look at peters Dyno chart he could have stopped at 9K and made the same amount of HP.
Anyways look at the dyno charts tough mid range on peters turbo flows so much better, at 6500 hes like 600 and the gt42r is at 450.I would recommend that turbo to everyone. the gt42r is overrated
on a 4 cylinder i agree, i think its VERY overrated.Originally Posted by B18c1Turboed
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nice #'s, and one sexy ass car, good job
-2001 Lexus IS300
-2004 Pontiac GTO - 530hp/625ft lbs - 10.62@130mph - Sold!
i would personally get a t3/t4 57 trim, boost 20-30psi and race peter on the street from stop light to stop light
94 Supra= 500rwhp
Just wandering, i know most people that build motors for that kind of power don't assemble them themselves. I didnt know if he had opted to send it to Jim Justice or something.
Danny, I was just stating the difference in the turbo's from what the NHRA limit is. For the restrictions they have the 42R is the best. Peter is right at 540whp @6500, but i see what you are saying, its making 100 more whp.
Mike, you are not yelling at us to rev it higher, we arent the ones tuning the car..... Most dont rev over 9500rpm, powerband is an opinionated subject, especially since some engine managements allow you to launch at 20+psi.
yeah i think SFWD's limit is 70mm or was it 72mm
94 Supra= 500rwhp
if you hadnt asked I could have told you
The 4294 has the largest compressor wheel that they can use, 72mm.
the 4202 is a 74mm.
Last edited by josh green; 10-31-2006 at 03:59 PM.
Fuck SFWD. TurboStreet is where it's at!!! hahaha j/k
I'm debating whether to go air/water or just regular front mount. I doubt I'll ever race at a NHRA event. They are mostly west coast events except for Moroso or Atco.
It's amazing the powerband of Peter's car and how it fast that big as turbo spools.
I have to rebuild shortblocks every once in a blue moon here at Nissan but when my block gets back we all know that Peter's assembling it!! I trust my work w/ a customer's car but just like many raceshops throughout the world THEY TRUST SOMEOONE ELSE TO BUILD THEIR RACE CARS!!
Now hopefully I'll be building my own streetcar motor sooner or later but NOT the racecar. I don't care what people say about me but I'm a realist as I've always said. Just keepin it real.
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Yeah, there is a thread going on on H-T talking about people building engines that will make 800whp and people that build 800whp engines that will last. I mean it would be badass sending an engine to jim justice and i wouldnt feel ashamed in the slightest is a shop like that built a motor for me. It just a motor needs freshening up after a season and I wouldnt send it back to them to be freshened up. Because you putting new bearings and rings and all that wouldnt be any different than putting it all together yourself. All of their torque and clearance specs are gone once its disassembled, or the bearings are worn. I mean hell I wouldnt doubt it if the sponsored guys have a fully rebuilt engine I.E. all new parts, every season. I just dont see that necessary. But you do pay for knowledge, and if they can build a motor that makes more/same power at less boost and last longer then thats badass.
in regard about the 42R being overplayed, I could say it has been to an extent , BUT the fastest guys are using it. BUT its not not the reason they are the fastest, and I dont think a lot of people understand that.
Yeah I know exactly the thread you're talking about. The best reply on that thread is:
There's a difference between assembling a motor and building a motor.
Anybody can go get a Helms manual and assemble a motor. But builders generally know the ins and out and special "tricks" to doing it better than stock. Not just better than stock internals.
There's a big difference in assembling and actually building such as stretching the rod bolts, filing the rings, gapping the rings, and better torque specs for the type of motor you're building.
Generally builders have years of experience and many trial and error moments that no one knows about.
I respect and appreciate Peter b/c of the longevity of all his last race motors on his old hatch. Which only totalled 2(one stock) and one built. Both lasted full seasons of racing and way too many Fast Fridays, Import Showdowns, Import Face-offs, and TunerFest shootouts w/o a hiccup.
Now I'm not saying he didn't have other accessory problems such as axles, turbos, and the occasional main relay but the longblock held together like a champ.
Oh and I know many people are gonna say you really don't know what happens after hours or how many times he tore it down and found a problem-but my reply is I DO!! And many of his friends and family(Bee) also know that he didn't have any problems and wasn't doing overnight rebuilds so people wouldn't find out.
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i had to quote that for the next time you say something about me not building my 2.0l motor LOL
but i do agree with you
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Anyoen can build a motor with a helms manual, but getting the right bearing clearances on the rods an mains for the type of motor you are building is an industry secret.
The big guys like Jim, Don, Skunk, IPS, Inline pRo, Abacus, RLZ , etc have blown up enough motors or built enough to know that 3 though tighter on the mains gains 7whp on an NA motor, but decreases longevity or life of the motor. oops , i said too much
but yes, there is no shame in having a PROFESIONAL build your race motor, whether its peter, dfe, justice race engines, mspi, rlz, benson, GE, etc.
some shops SPECIALIZE in race motors, we usually build any motor under 600whp, anything over that we leave to others that can handle those kind of motors and have tons of experience with that kind of motor. we build mostly street cars.
thats why i laugh everytime i hear someone bitch about ACL bearings. about how they are only greens an you need to color code them to have the right "built motor". that person knows nothing about BUILDING a motor.
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Sorry buddy we've had plenty of spats but never got on you for not building your motor. If I remember correctly you and silviadriftr got on me about my last hatch when it was built allmotor then the guy that bought it wanted it turbo and I didn't tell yall(didn't know I had to) that I rebuilt the motor before he took the car back to Chi town.
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its all good man, i was just poking fun at you. you know we are cool now
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yeah I was just about to come edit my post and add that I'm not trying to start anything else just stating the facts.
Yeah I'm glad we're all cool now. It takes a lot out of you when you hate someone. No hate here. Just glad I can post on IA now and that I finally have another honda that'll be done sooner than later(hopefully).
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DO you two need one now?
I knew you were gonna say something Danny! I just knew as soon as I posted that I figured I'd see a reply or get a phone call!!!
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LOL @DANNY
group HUG! SIKE
glad to hear your back in the honda game jerel, youve been gone for awhile
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What a bunch of pansies....
damn thats all I can say good job with that kind of power...
----KENNYBOI----
Joe Simpson threw on that turbo and tuned it for the last few races of this season. He didnt spend the RIGHT amount of time on tuning it. He couldve gotten way more out of it! He made that power on a SHOT gt4294r. It was Cortney Greens turbo...and from what I heard Joe messed it up and thats why it wasnt making the power it shouldve been making.
As far as the 42r...I wouldnt go off saying its over rated yet. I have seen a chart (will have one posted up of a non dual-ball bearing gt4294 soon) of a 4294r and it was hitting full boost (38psi) at 5500rpms. Now you can do the math...32psi=860whp...38psi=???.
ANYWAYS, Im not getting into a pissing match here...all I wanted to know was if the t76 was dual ball bearing...thats all.
P.S. Ill have a dyno posted up for you all soon...non dual BB 4294. Spools 300rpm later and 1k cheaper.
Last edited by v8killr; 10-31-2006 at 07:19 PM.
And to the dude stating that ALL the fast guys that are racing are runing the 42r...I understand COPLETELY that its not the turbo thats making them fast...its because theyve been racing for years and have sooo much seat time! PLUS the horsepower...but you have to get the power to the GROUND or else its just wasted power...lol!
Guys like these:
Tony Palo: 9.46 @ 158
Mat Keller: 9.47 @ 157
Cortney Green: 9.66 @ 152 (lot left in that car...he was at 32psi on that run!!!)
Ball bearing turbo's are nice but are not worth the money for drag racing IMO. Hell borg warner's extended tip turbos are supposed to be better than ball bearing ones on all aspects. I personally would rather wait 300rpm later for a $1k difference. Ball bearing turbos have a lot of hype, daniels 630whp ls build actually spooled the same or around 100rpms later than spoolins last setup. Granted that it made a little more mid range, but the rpm at which it just took off was around the same or a little later. Just as Chris Rado has stated, ball bearing turbos are for slow shifting diesel trucks.
hmmmmmmmP.S. Ill have a dyno posted up for you all soon...non dual BB 4294. Spools 300rpm later and 1k cheaper.
i'd like to see that cause if thats the case....maybe i'll get one LOL...
94 Supra= 500rwhp
Well, from what Charles has told me, there's still some room in the tune because the timing wasn't advanced much at all. I'd have to compare the same car with different turbos to really see the difference.
I'll probably get it retuned here in a few days or so and we'll see if anything changes.
They were talking about adding timing in the top end. As I believe charles said scotty added timing up top and nothing changed. It doesnt really matter though. I think scotty is starting to learn how push a car and give the engine what it wants rather than "safe mode" lol.
Ok compare it too this gt42r dyno chart car was fully tuned!
thats about 70hp throught the powerband
I've been looking into those BorgWarner extended tip turbos. Chris Anderson and whole AAP crew(3 race cars and 2 customer cars) have switched and all have seen dramatic decrease in there spool up times and some increase in top end hp and torque.
Everytime I go buy there Chris and Yamil tell me I should try it out. Louis Curujos(Paradise Racing Celica) was at AAP for a week switching from AEM to Motec on his race car and he swears up and down that the BorgWarner extended tip turbos are the new age of turbo performance w/o ball bearing center sections. I've been on the bulleyepower.com website and looked at graphs and all that but I really haven't seen any graphs of how that turbo will do on a 4 cylinder honda. They have graphs of other 4 cylinders(srt-4 neon, DSMs, and I think a celica).
If I had money to trial and error stuff then I'd love to be the 1st to try out a BorgWarner turbo on a TurboStreet Honda but for now w/ me being poor I'll let other people w/ deeper pockets figure out what works and what doesn't.
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jerel there will be a comaprison of the Warner turbo vs a 40R VERY SOON
i have the inside info , ill share it with you when it goes down
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Well they are pretty pricey, but what larger turbo isnt at this time? I meant he 42R's have gone up in price $200 in the last few months. The BW turbo's have a stainless steel turbine housing which is pretty nice and also much safer than the traditional housings. The only reason that their turbos wont take off in the sfwd series and some others is b/c they use a t6 flange and most series only allow up to a t4 flange. I believe the s366 is supposed to out perform the 4067 in all aspects and i think the s471 is supposed to be in the same class as the 42R. Now there is a 4094R out and its priced pretty damn good($1550-1600) . I mean its $400 less than a 42R and its supports up to 850hp. Thats plenty enough power for any sportsman class.
Damn I am so ready to get the bugs worked out of spoolins car and get it on the track. Nothing more exciting than gross amounts of hp and trying to get the car down the track.
I think Jarel and I feel about the same. I havent been happy with a car since i sold the turbo motor that came in my green car, and you are now building up a car. So you are already 1 step ahead.
AAP Motorsports and Paradise Racing(Luis Curujos) are both dealers and are sponsored by BorgWarner. When I was doing my research I noticed that the larger turbos only came w/ the T6 flange vs. the T4 that most Hondas run. So I talked to Chris Anderson about getting them in a T4 flange and he wasn't sure. So then I called Paradise Racing and talked to Luis and he wasn't sure. Both called me back later and told me they can get whatever turbo I need w/ T4 flange.
Yamil's been on my ass to "take his word that I won't be disapointed w/ the results of their turbo." One of his customer's had the GT42R on a street supra and switched to the BorgWarner and it made more power but you have to look at what else was done to the vehicle. Generally people upgrade other aspects when switching turbos. You never really know the truth until you're the one under the knife.
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Yeah, seriously let me know about that one. I smell a new turbo on a blue EK in the near future!!
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Nah, that wont be happening, maybe a new map sensor more towards next season.
It sounds to me like your buddy just wants to sell you a turbo. I dont see how the "extended tip technology" would work on a "smaller" t4 flanged housing. There has to be some reason people arent using them, its not like they are "new and the next big craze"
the reviews on the warner turbos have been outstanding, but ive yet to see it on a honda, YET
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