First Motorex, now Kaizo. More GTRs seized by police forces from Cali owners.

[Vteckidd]

you can quote FED REGs all you want it still comes down to a simple facts:

1) YOU CANNOT LEGALLY DRIVE A SKYLINE ON US SOIL *unless its a motorex car which was grandfathered in*
2) YOU CANNOT LEGALLY TITLE A SKYLINE IN THE UNITED STATES *unless it has a motorex title that was grandfathered in*
3) ANY PERSON IMPORTING A SKYLINE IN THE USA IS DOING SO TO DRIVE THE CAR, WHICH AS IVE STATED IS ILLEGAL

there is no way around it. your "skyline owners meet" all of them that arent motorex cars are ILLEGAL. If they are being driven on the street i would say 99% of them are FED ILLEGAL

[Vteckidd]

No, they've been legal to bring in for several years now. But there's more to that then what's mentioned..... there's no OBDII.

yeah all 1996 R33s are "legal" to import, but they dont possess OBD2 capability so they will NEVER be made legal in the eyes of the FED.

They knew what they were doing

[Type-R]

yeah all 1996 R33s are "legal" to import, but they dont possess OBD2 capability so they will NEVER be made legal in the eyes of the FED.

They knew what they were doing

NHTSA doesn't have a hand in the OBDII world, that is the EPA's cup of tea. RB's will pass emissions with alittle bit of care, the issue isn't that it's not possible to do OBDII on a R33, it's that no one has a system up and running for the compliance process.

Now if a RI has access to a system and can get a ICI to install it then all is well, but again, it's not that it can't be done it's that no one has one yet. However, JK Tech claims they are able to do this and I'm sure if that is accurate that they obtained the rights and privacy to the designs so no other RI could use it, just as they did with the air bag system that's required for the complaince process as per the Addendum A.

[Vteckidd]

NHTSA doesn't have a hand in the OBDII world, that is the EPA's cup of tea. RB's will pass emissions with alittle bit of care, the issue isn't that it's not possible to do OBDII on a R33, it's that no one has a system up and running for the compliance process.

Now if a RI has access to a system and can get a ICI to install it then all is well, but again, it's not that it can't be done it's that no one has one yet. However, JK Tech claims they are able to do this and I'm sure if that is accurate that they obtained the rights and privacy to the designs so no other RI could use it, just as they did with the air bag system that's required for the complaince process as per the Addendum A.

so youre talking about a backward engineered OBD2 electronics system that will pass EPA standards?

awesome im sure its a $200,000 skyline now

[Type-R]

your "skyline owners meet" all of them that arent motorex cars are ILLEGAL. If they are being driven on the street i would say 99% of them are FED ILLEGAL

I never once vouched for someone else's car, I know many Motorex owners accross the country attending the meets. Pointing the "illegal" finger at Skylines is silly when JDM tyte motor swaps are just as illegal as a grey market car (Euro, Jap, whatever) driving around.

[Type-R]

so youre talking about a backward engineered OBD2 electronics system that will pass EPA standards?

awesome im sure its a $200,000 skyline now

I'm not a systems engineer so I cannot number crunch for you but I do have a proposed OBDII system document and I can tell you that the numbers are more in the #### digit range.

[Vteckidd]

I'm not a systems engineer so I cannot number crunch for you but I do have a proposed OBDII system document and I can tell you that the numbers are more in the #### digit range.

Then whoever owns it, and can implement it is selling it too cheap.

If i possessed the only tech that would make a LEGAL R33 in the country, there is almost no price tag for that.

The motors ARE LEGAL though thats the point. All EPA says is SAME YEAR OR NEWER. Now in CALI its much more strict. But until that spreads across the nation, it is what it is.

just like skylines, state titled ones in NC, FL, SC, GA whatever, dont get a second look from the local authorities, but if the FEDs find you your in trouble.

Ive owned SIlvias, i knew perfectly well than they were ILLEGAL an drove them anyway. But if for some reason the FEDs pulled me over i was prepared to lose the car on the off chance that happened.

FEDs arent looking for illegal motors right now, they are looking for skylines. That may change soon enough though

[Type-R]

Then whoever owns it, and can implement it is selling it too cheap.

If i possessed the only tech that would make a LEGAL R33 in the country, there is almost no price tag for that.

I wouldn't because to expensive means no one will buy it. Since the Addendum A was released any RI/ICI could team up and develope a working OBDII system if they wanted to. It'd be stupid for a company to develope one and try to corner the market when Joe Smuckatelly down the street can make his own "cost effective" version that would knock the competition out of business.

Motorex went wrong with many things, one of them was overcharging for compliance work. Taking a $10,000 car and turning it into a $70,000 car causing them to have very little sales and no profit to repay expenses already dished out.

[Vteckidd]

yeah but like you said, no one has done it. The amount of R&D involved to have a working OBD2 systems has to be in the hundreds of thousands if not millions.

You have to have sensor feedback, and ECU that will talk to the OBD2 scanner, etc.

you are talking about totally engineering a computer system and packaging it into a car that 1) has an engine we never had here in the USA 2) never had OBD2 ports/scans to hook up to

Kaizo was selling their cars for upwards of $100,000 for an R34 right (figures i heard) because they were "legal". I could only imagine the person that had some sort of OBD system that was EPA compliant would charge whatever he wanted and people would pay.

[Glides]

I never once vouched for someone else's car, I know many Motorex owners accross the country attending the meets. Pointing the "illegal" finger at Skylines is silly when JDM tyte motor swaps are just as illegal as a grey market car (Euro, Jap, whatever) driving around.

Actually. You are incorrect to a certain point.

A Skyline as a whole, is illegal.

The entire car, not just the engine. You can walk down to the DMV and register swapped 240s all day long. Won't be able to do that with your Skyline. Sure you can fudge it, because yes....this is Georgia and get titles. The Southeast is the Wild West of automobiles. You will never get away with that in Cali. Used to be you called a Sheriff, had him come out, check the blinkers and lights and bam, you got a vin and then a title. Those days are coming to a close as the Feds are educating Jethro.

Now, if it's more than 25 years old, no problem. But your R32 or R34...nope, Evo 5...nope, Pulsar GTiR...nope.

Sad really, but thats the way it is.

[FAM0U5]

and that's how the cookie crumbles...

[Glides]

you can quote FED REGs all you want it still comes down to a simple facts:

1) YOU CANNOT LEGALLY DRIVE A SKYLINE ON US SOIL *unless its a motorex car which was grandfathered in*
2) YOU CANNOT LEGALLY TITLE A SKYLINE IN THE UNITED STATES *unless it has a motorex title that was grandfathered in*
3) ANY PERSON IMPORTING A SKYLINE IN THE USA IS DOING SO TO DRIVE THE CAR, WHICH AS IVE STATED IS ILLEGAL

there is no way around it. your "skyline owners meet" all of them that arent motorex cars are ILLEGAL. If they are being driven on the street i would say 99% of them are FED ILLEGAL

Kidd, you yell alot. Revmaynard needs to get in touch with you si his buddy can buy a Steering wheel.

[Ziptied]

Same things i've been saying for a while and even warned Daryl about, the govt just does NOT want them here and simply will always find a way to stop you. If you want a skyline, buy a g35/g37 or save your penny's for a new GTR.

[Type-R]

Actually. You are incorrect to a certain point.

A Skyline as a whole, is illegal.

A vehicle with no motor/tranny is not considered a motor vehicle and therefore is not to be treated as such when being declaired through Customs and is not subject to FMVSS. So no I'm not incorrect and a chassis is not illegal in any way at all. There is nothing illegal about having a chassis on a dolly claimed as "used automotive parts". That is not circumvention, it's facts.


A lot of what's being debated here in regards to legal/not legal with Kaizo and related matters needs to be reminded that no charges have been filed against Daryl or Kaizo in general, therefore these issues have yet to stand in court which the suspected case is to be regarding what the intended purpose of the vehicles was upon importation. Shipping used auto parts or a chassis for the sole purpose of using it as a coffee table is perfectly legal.

[HachiDori]

Wow that truely blows...

That silver one is epicly nice. Best of luck to all the people involved..

[Type-R]

It is and it's a absolute shame but we all hope that some light will be shed on the matter soon following the court case. A very good lawyer was obtained to defend the owners.

[bdydrpdmazda]

I would fucking cry and possibly do some crazy shit if a cop knocked on my door and told me he was their to take my R34 and I wasnt gonna get it or any money back.

[Glides]

A vehicle with no motor/tranny is not considered a motor vehicle and therefore is not to be treated as such when being declaired through Customs and is not subject to FMVSS. So no I'm not incorrect and a chassis is not illegal in any way at all. There is nothing illegal about having a chassis on a dolly claimed as "used automotive parts". That is not circumvention, it's facts.


A lot of what's being debated here in regards to legal/not legal with Kaizo and related matters needs to be reminded that no charges have been filed against Daryl or Kaizo in general, therefore these issues have yet to stand in court which the suspected case is to be regarding what the intended purpose of the vehicles was upon importation. Shipping used auto parts or a chassis for the sole purpose of using it as a coffee table is perfectly legal.

Here let me give you the final fact in this debate. If the government WANTS to take your Skyline. They WILL!. End of discussion, end of story. There will be absolutely NOTHING that you can do about it. You can quote this, quote that, say this, say that....be an armchair lawyer all the live long day, but if they want it. They will get it. Done.

[Glides]

Let me add a little edit here. I hope to god they never do decide to take a liking to your questionably legal automobile, I really do. I would hate to see someone stripped of their car. Skylines are not cheap. Nobody deserves that. I watched my brother piss away $60,000 dollars on lost imported automobiles. It's not a pretty sight.

In context though, it seems that everytime someone debates legality issues with a Skyline owner, they always quote this and that and 15 rules and sub sections to this code and whatnot to try and convince the other person that they are legal....and then their car gets snatched. I'll bet you doughnuts that every person whose car got snatched in Cali was saying the same things you are on message boards far and wide, assured that their car was safe. And look what happened there. If you are 100% sure about your vehicle.....go to the DMV and ask them. Call the EPA or ICE and make sure. If you still have it after those phone calls....you win the debate

[Type-R]

If you are 100% sure about your vehicle.....go to the DMV and ask them. Call the EPA or ICE and make sure. If you still have it after those phone calls....you win the debate

I have motorex papers, I don't have to worry about anything.

Furthermore, I have had ICE agents here inspect multiple vehicles of mine over the years at the port. I don't preach B.S. or talk nonsense, I speak from experience and facts. Whatever the your brother pulled and got in trouble over it is your business, obviously from the vehicles you mentioned was a instant flag because it sounded like they were complete cars... so no kidding they got snatched.

I don't need to call anyone or varify any information that I have because to put it simple, I know it's right because I do this for a living and have been for many years.

There's neat little things in this industry called lawyers who specialize in customs and importing matters. That's their job and they are good at it, petty B.S. that people post on here means titty to them. I'm not trying to win a debate, I'm trying to keep the misinformation to a minimum so the average Joe doesn't get steered in the wrong direction.

This isn't my first go around the block nor is it my first imported car, I have many and have had many. I've probably had the only driveway in my state with 5 Skylines at once parked in it.

[TIGERJC]

Other than a Lotus Super 7 name a kit car that is a reproduction of a car that has ever been federally illegal in the US. Once the Super 7 hit 25 years old it was legal to import, until then it was brought in from England in pieces and re-assembled here, typically by pilots that had the means of getting them past, or over, customs. That is basically what Kaizo was doing with the skyline except it's still illegal no matter what.

Also, 9/10 kit cars use the chassis' of a car that is LEGAL in the US. You put Diablo or 355 bodywork on a Fiero you still have a legal Fiero. You put a Cobra or GT40 body on a mustang 5.0 you still have a mustang 5.0. Then you have the companies that build ground up reproductions, but still none of the cars they are reproducing are federally illegal. Other than the R33, the Skyline is.

So would it be legal to do the kaizo method on a r33 skyline? So bring the chassis of the r33 fully stripped and then reassemble it in the us so it would be consider a kit car

[Ziptied]

simply, no.

Unless its motorex, its not legal.

[Tracy]

Customs made Dan throw out his mango once! They were not letting him bring that shit here from Jamaica.

[Type-R]

So would it be legal to do the kaizo method on a r33 skyline? So bring the chassis of the r33 fully stripped and then reassemble it in the us so it would be consider a kit car

If the original drivetrain wasn't used then yes. A fine example is the Kaizo R34 buggy with a VW engine (used in F&F) which was not seized by ICE agents during the raid. A reconstructed vehicle using a different motor/tranny not offered for that vehicle, again... that's what Kaizo offered but what landed Daryl in trouble was putting the same motors back in the cars and hooking up the customers.

[Glides]

If the original drivetrain wasn't used then yes. A fine example is the Kaizo R34 buggy with a VW engine (used in F&F) which was not seized by ICE agents during the raid. A reconstructed vehicle using a different motor/tranny not offered for that vehicle, again... that's what Kaizo offered but what landed Daryl in trouble was putting the same motors back in the cars and hooking up the customers.

Actually, i'm pretty sure you are wrong again.

You cannot have an R34. The R34 that was used in F&F is a studio pictures vehicle, not driven on roads, not raced, not nothing. That's why it was not seized. It is not, will never be registered. It is also so heavily modifed that it is basically a purpose built car, like the Batmobile. Much different than a fresh off the boat R34.

You cannot take an R34 and put a different engine combination in it and get it legalized. If that was the case, people would take R34's and put 2Jz's in them. A Kit Car is a Kit Car, it is not a production car with a different motor. You WILL have to get a Kit Car inspected before it is ever isued a VIN plate or registration.

No matter if you are given a plate, a title, a registration.....if the feds get you, ALL state stuff goes out the window. The Feds have final say over state and local regulations when it comes to things of this nature. As I said, if they want your car, they are going to get it.

Unless some movie star petitions the SKyline and gets the laws changed, your car is always going to be in danger.

[Ziptied]

Unless some movie star petitions the SKyline and gets the laws changed, your car is always going to be in danger.

Paul Walker is trying, seriously. Cause he has 2 R34's.

[Type-R]

Actually, i'm pretty sure you are wrong again.

No you are wrong, you are assuming ICE agents only seize titled vehicles here for street use. Please stop trying to correct people when you clearly have not even read a shred of black and white information.

I can bring in any vehicle in the world so long as it's no motor/tranny and is claimed as parts., again if you actually took the time to read the rules you'd notice in bold letters where it says NOT CONSIDERED MOTOR VEHICLE.

Stop trying to toss up a front because your brother pulled some illegal shit and got caught. Whatever backwoods shop you people are running doesn't impress anyone.

[Glides]

No you are wrong, you are assuming ICE agents only seize titled vehicles here for street use. Please stop trying to correct people when you clearly have not even read a shred of black and white information.

I can bring in any vehicle in the world so long as it's no motor/tranny and is claimed as parts., again if you actually took the time to read the rules you'd notice in bold letters where it says NOT CONSIDERED MOTOR VEHICLE.

Stop trying to toss up a front because your brother pulled some illegal shit and got caught. Whatever backwoods shop you people are running doesn't impress anyone.

First off, my brother owned Tophat Performance. Secondly, I don't toss up fronts, I tell what I know because i've SEEN it. Unlike you, i'm not so fucking stupid to believe all the shit that is printed in areas by the government that is changed time and time again. You think that was the first time they brought in cars? He's brought them in EVERY single way you described and knows ALL the ins and outs of the importing process. Maybe you need to actually IMPORT something in instead of dick humping on someone elses efforts and running your mouth like you know something. The only way they were seized is because the exporter shipped em open deck. Learn boy, before you speak.

Finally, like I said jackass. Call the EPA. Tell em you got a Skyline, see what they say. Call up ICE, tell em you have a Skyline, see what they say. Tell em that it's legal and they can't do shit about it. If you still have it after those phone calls, you won. If you don't, LOL at you.

You are just pissed that nobody in this thread believed you simply because you have a Skyline and think you are King Ding-a-ling. I got news for you, nobody cares that you have a Skyline. Right hand drive cars are a pain in the ass to drive daily, I had one. Mine was a Fairlady and it WAS legal. What you have is basically a waste of money. A car that is cool cause it's JDM and you are attempting to impress the people you most likely snub your nose at when you take your overpriced borderline illegal car to shows and think your shit doesn't stink.

Good luck with those phone calls. Until you make em an prove yourself right, go out in your garage and rub your penis on the side of your Skyline while you tell yourself how cool you are. You won't listen to anything anyone is saying anyway cause you KNOW everything. Typical.

[Ziptied]

First off, my brother owned Tophat Performance. Secondly, I don't toss up fronts, I tell what I know because i've SEEN it. Unlike you, i'm not so fucking stupid to believe all the shit that is printed in areas by the government that is changed time and time again. You think that was the first time they brought in cars? He's brought them in EVERY single way you described and knows ALL the ins and outs of the importing process. Maybe you need to actually IMPORT something in instead of dick humping on someone elses efforts and running your mouth like you know something. The only way they were seized is because the exporter shipped em open deck. Learn boy, before you speak.

Finally, like I said jackass. Call the EPA. Tell em you got a Skyline, see what they say. Call up ICE, tell em you have a Skyline, see what they say. Tell em that it's legal and they can't do shit about it. If you still have it after those phone calls, you won. If you don't, LOL at you.

You are just pissed that nobody in this thread believed you simply because you have a Skyline and think you are King Ding-a-ling. I got news for you, nobody cares that you have a Skyline. Right hand drive cars are a pain in the ass to drive daily, I had one. Mine was a Fairlady and it WAS legal. What you have is basically a waste of money. A car that is cool cause it's JDM and you are attempting to impress the people you most likely snub your nose at when you take your overpriced borderline illegal car to shows and think your shit doesn't stink.

Good luck with those phone calls. Until you make em an prove yourself right, go out in your garage and rub your penis on the side of your Skyline while you tell yourself how cool you are. You won't listen to anything anyone is saying anyway cause you KNOW everything. Typical.

/thread. Best thing i've read in a loooooooooooooong time. I know this process too and worked/talked with tophat about all of it and have done it myself. Bottom line, skylines are overhyped, overpriced turbocharged camry's, and are illegal as fuck in the US, unless you've got the motorex plates. These kids run their mouths and THINK they know what they are doing/talking about. I'd bet he didnt even import his OWN car.

[Type-R]

Learn boy, before you speak.

Obviously your backwoods operation knew the ins and outs by getting cars seized. I have nothing to prove to you and I will call the EPA all I want because you obviously missed the several times I noted having Motorex documents. Infact how about I call ICE to investigate the circumventing your bunch does.

Let me say it again,

MOTOREX


Need to read that again?


And I'd like to readdress the fact that I've been doing this for years and have never had issues unlike your backwoods shop, Top Gun or whatever it's called. Never heard of it and don't care. I've never seen said name on the RI/ICI list so that means it's clearly a non-factor circumventing gagglefuck.


Come to think of it, there isn't even a RI within the state of GA, therefore whoever claims to be bringing in cars is clearly doing something wrong unless they are trying to run a 2nd hand shop by being the 3rd party middle man and reselling other people's cars to make a profit off of them.

[Ziptied]

Obviously your backwoods operation knew the ins and outs by getting cars seized. I have nothing to prove to you and I will call the EPA all I want because you obviously missed the several times I noted having Motorex documents. Infact how about I call ICE to investigate the circumventing your bunch does.

Let me say it again,

MOTOREX


Need to read that again?


And I'd like to readdress the fact that I've been doing this for years and have never had issues unlike your backwoods shop, Top Gun or whatever it's called. Never heard of it and don't care. I've never seen said name on the RI/ICI list so that means it's clearly a non-factor circumventing gagglefuck.

MotoRex papers, and a MotoRex car are two totally different things..... If you never heard of Top Hat, you must be a n00b to the skyline game.

[leobond001]

i was also under the impression that you could send over bodies or shells of japanese cars and claim them as parts. doesnt have to be a skyline. any car. and get it shipped to a florida port, claim it as parts, and have a U.S counter car that you own that you can " swap" the parts to and just junk what ever is left.
the get the rest of the parts shipped from japan.

[Type-R]

MotoRex papers, and a MotoRex car are two totally different things..... If you never heard of Top Hat, you must be a n00b to the skyline game.

Yeah you caught me kid, I typed up my own bond paper and EPA documents. Sorry I never heard of Top Hat, I guess we didn't have that where I lived in Japan, oh that's right.... we didn't.

[Type-R]

i was also under the impression that you could send over bodies or shells of japanese cars and claim them as parts. doesnt have to be a skyline. any car. and get it shipped to a florida port, claim it as parts, and have a U.S counter car that you own that you can " swap" the parts to and just junk what ever is left.
the get the rest of the parts shipped from japan.

You can ship any car you want as parts, but that's just it, as parts. Any port works, doesn't have to be CA or FL, any place that has container shipments.

I don't advise VIN swapping as that carries feloney charges.


-------


You kids continue to waste your e-lives by trying to impress people with your inaccurate misinformation and lack of ability to read the rules and reference documents. The only fool is you. I'm done with this useless thread, facts are posted.

[leobond001]

You can ship any car you want as parts, but that's just it, as parts. Any port works, doesn't have to be CA or FL, any place that has container shipments.

I don't advise VIN swapping as that carries feloney charges.

yeah that was the only problem with that. i've been looking at the 3000gt or a mirage evo for years, bu ti'm not trying to get caught up.

oh and the accord sir for 97 is on the list

[Glides]

Yeah you caught me kid, I typed up my own bond paper and EPA documents. Sorry I never heard of Top Hat, I guess we didn't have that where I lived in Japan, oh that's right.... we didn't.

Maybe I can help you out on this. Give me your info and i'll call them for you. That way you don't have to make an effort on this. Then both you and I can be sure that you are legal and compliant and in no future danger of losing your car.

[Glides]

You can ship any car you want as parts, but that's just it, as parts. Any port works, doesn't have to be CA or FL, any place that has container shipments.

I don't advise VIN swapping as that carries feloney charges.


-------


You kids continue to waste your e-lives by trying to impress people with your inaccurate misinformation and lack of ability to read the rules and reference documents. The only fool is you. I'm done with this useless thread, facts are posted.

Yeap, then you have a very expensive coffee table that soon as you put a motor in...is illegal. So that brings us back to the whole reason of this thread. Tell me Genius Joe....why would you import in a car with no motor, that you knew was illegal soon as you put a motor in? Simply because it's legal? That's a hell of a business decision.

I honestly think that you just talk out of your ass half the time. Do you even read what you write?

It might be better for you to leave this thread. Good call. Oh yea, go look at the letter posted on the other thread. Could be real, could not be real...but it's for an R33 and there are numbers on there that go to the corresponding people, you might start your phone calls there.

While you are at this, if you decide to not leave, like most people who say they are done with a thread do. Inform us where you got your car? The importer out of Florida, Sean whatever? Or Bergstrom from Canada? Or the fella out of Tennessee? I'd love to know. You see whiz kid, I know importers, if I don't know em, I know people who do. If you think i'm some dumb kid you are sadly mistaken. I've been in the scene a long time. I'll let you know what I find out.

[Type-R]

You see whiz kid, I know importers.

I'm sure you do, please do name one that's on the list right now that you know? Those backwoods people that are under the radar and sell grey market shit through container shipments are not importers. They get panda-express JUNK and sell it for markup prices.

[Ziptied]

lmao glides, this guy is a tool.

[Glides]

Here I will help you out so you can nutswing some more


UNDERCOVER VIN INFORMATIONS "PEW PEW"

Excellent. I'll check that vin number out for you. If all is good, you win. If it's not.....then they can meet you at your next Skyline meet.

I hope you are right. I'd hate for you to lose your bloated, RWD Turbo Camry.