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Thread: Callout: SRT4s, All your boost are belong to us your pull is none

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  1. #1
    buy me some STP octane booster whatever210's Avatar
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    ill run. me vs op. ill run 22lbs. 40-120....good luck.

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    I think its interesting when people bring up "it's his power to weight ratio that will help him out" as if its the only thing he's got going for him... Ever car has a "power to weight ratio" why can't you just say its the amount of power he makes lol? In a basic sense power to weight is what determines acceleration.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ejohnson88 View Post
    I think its interesting when people bring up "it's his power to weight ratio that will help him out" as if its the only thing he's got going for him... Ever car has a "power to weight ratio" why can't you just say its the amount of power he makes lol? In a basic sense power to weight is what determines acceleration.
    Because I know even with his 125 shot I will still have more power than him with me on pump gas. The light weight is the only thing that will help him and that's the truth of it. If I was to put my engine in a car that weighs what his does it would be no contest. I'm not saying thats the only thing he has going for him, hell I would love to own that hatch myself, that is an awesome setup he has and I have been planing on doing something like it my self when I start back work. I already have a good k20z3 motor and tranny that I am going to drop into a hatch.
    Last edited by oleblue; 10-21-2009 at 11:45 AM.
    (SRT EQUIPPED) It's Just A Neon...
    1/4mile= 11.21 @ 127mph 2.0 60ft
    The Boost Is Strong With This One.

    If You Can't Say Anything Nice,
    "Then Go F**k Yourself"!!!

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    Certified Gearhead chunky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oleblue View Post
    Because I know even with his 125 shot I will still have more power than him with me on pump gas. The light weight is the only thing that will help him and that's the truth of it. If I was to put my engine in a car that weighs what his does it would be no contest. I'm not saying thats the only thing he has going for him, hell I would love to own that hatch myself, that is an awesome setup he has and I have been planing on doing something like it my self when I start back work. I already have a good k20z3 motor and tranny that I am going to drop into a hatch.
    If you put your engine into a car as light as his, you really think you'd get him? I don't think so. It's more than just power to weight. It's how the power gets put down. Honda makes great naturally aspirated engines and great gearboxes that put power to the ground efficiently. If you put your motor into his chassis, your traction/spinning problems would get about 100x worse.

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    Quote Originally Posted by chunky View Post
    If you put your engine into a car as light as his, you really think you'd get him? I don't think so. It's more than just power to weight. It's how the power gets put down. Honda makes great naturally aspirated engines and great gearboxes that put power to the ground efficiently. If you put your motor into his chassis, your traction/spinning problems would get about 100x worse.
    For sure, it would be spinning but when it hooks up it would be on. Maybe it would not be that bad because I would not be pulling as much weight either. Nothing some slicks or dr's would not help. I think it will be a good race as it is even with me being 900lbs more than him.
    Last edited by oleblue; 10-21-2009 at 09:15 PM.
    (SRT EQUIPPED) It's Just A Neon...
    1/4mile= 11.21 @ 127mph 2.0 60ft
    The Boost Is Strong With This One.

    If You Can't Say Anything Nice,
    "Then Go F**k Yourself"!!!

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    530TQ + FWD = FAIL!! Kason23's Avatar
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    Blue is right. If that was a plain ole RSX or SI. It WOULD be slower correct?? and why is that? Because it WEIGHS more.

    Power to weight is what has propelled Hondas into serious cars these days. I know it,you know it and so does everyone else.

    Why else would people drop motors into hatchs?? Its not to take there family out for a fun night thats for damn sure. lol
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kason23 View Post
    Blue is right. If that was a plain ole RSX or SI. It WOULD be slower correct?? and why is that? Because it WEIGHS more.

    Power to weight is what has propelled Hondas into serious cars these days. I know it,you know it and so does everyone else.

    Why else would people drop motors into hatchs?? Its not to take there family out for a fun night thats for damn sure. lol
    The truth don't get any better than that.
    (SRT EQUIPPED) It's Just A Neon...
    1/4mile= 11.21 @ 127mph 2.0 60ft
    The Boost Is Strong With This One.

    If You Can't Say Anything Nice,
    "Then Go F**k Yourself"!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by KIZDAWAY View Post
    Ill run any srt4 on pump gas

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sCuyKihhMWM&hd=1
    come get K'd
    Not 100% sure yet but I am doing some work for a friend today to get the gas to come out tonight and if I do you want to get to it tonight? You on Street tire's and 60shot v/s Me on street tire's and pump gas just like the first race? It will be fun.
    (SRT EQUIPPED) It's Just A Neon...
    1/4mile= 11.21 @ 127mph 2.0 60ft
    The Boost Is Strong With This One.

    If You Can't Say Anything Nice,
    "Then Go F**k Yourself"!!!

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    I still don't think you are understanding what I am trying to say. I think it's kinda of arrogant of a person to patronize another person for how they make their car go fast...
    "He's only fast because he is so light." Always seems to be the excuse when people get beat by hatches or any other form of light car with a small amount of power. I mean the argument can go the opposite way and I could say "Your only fast because you have to boost your motor to unnatural pressures." It's almost as if people have to belittle the other cars just so they can feel better about what they've got. Anyways I have enough of the condescending efforts of people on this forum.

    But I guess thats what happens when you are in a hobby that is full of big headed people that always have to be better than others... And like Chunky said... its not just about being light, its about everything else involved to make the car fast overall. Anyways I am done with my rant. Back to racing.
    K-What?!?!

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    Quote Originally Posted by ejohnson88 View Post
    I still don't think you are understanding what I am trying to say. I think it's kinda of arrogant of a person to patronize another person for how they make their car go fast...
    "He's only fast because he is so light." Always seems to be the excuse when people get beat by hatches or any other form of light car with a small amount of power. I mean the argument can go the opposite way and I could say "Your only fast because you have to boost your motor to unnatural pressures." It's almost as if people have to belittle the other cars just so they can feel better about what they've got. Anyways I have enough of the condescending efforts of people on this forum.

    But I guess thats what happens when you are in a hobby that is full of big headed people that always have to be better than others... And like Chunky said... its not just about being light, its about everything else involved to make the car fast overall. Anyways I am done with my rant. Back to racing.
    I'm not saying nothing bad about him or his car and i'm not trying to be better than anyone, i'm just saying TRUE facts. I'm not making any excuses either because I have not been beat by him or no hatch, I ALREADY BEAT HIM. You can say what you want but you know the truth as well as everyone else does.
    (SRT EQUIPPED) It's Just A Neon...
    1/4mile= 11.21 @ 127mph 2.0 60ft
    The Boost Is Strong With This One.

    If You Can't Say Anything Nice,
    "Then Go F**k Yourself"!!!

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    530TQ + FWD = FAIL!! Kason23's Avatar
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    Im not saying ANYTHING bad about his car. Its just normal Honda building to me. If thats how he wants to go fast more power to him. I would not mind having a built ls/vtec big turbo setup myself in a hatch.

    IMO a good set of tires will about make anything hook. My car on just slicks (no motor mounts,traction bars or anything of the sort) can cut VERY low 1.6 60fts no problem. I have did it mulitple times. Maybe im a good driver I dont know.

    Im just not down with him thinking hes at the top of the world and can beat all of us SRT's. I could prob trap 100+ in the 1/8, 126+ in the 1/4 IF I pushed my car. But its still stock motor so I would rather not go to the edge.

    Like I said I can respect his car all day as long as he does not act like GOD of the Hatchbacks.

    /rant
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    Ejohnson, why do you think people lighten their car? Lighter car = faster car

    It's facts, it's not belittling the car. If you take that same motor and put it in a 3,200-3,500lbs car, guess what. It's slow as balls.

    Lighter car also means less strain on the drivetrain and EASIER to put the power down. You need the proper suspension setup and tires for everything to work in harmony though, but lighter will always mean faster.

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    Certified Gearhead chunky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lurker View Post
    Ejohnson, why do you think people lighten their car? Lighter car = faster car

    It's facts, it's not belittling the car. If you take that same motor and put it in a 3,200-3,500lbs car, guess what. It's slow as balls.

    Lighter car also means less strain on the drivetrain and EASIER to put the power down. You need the proper suspension setup and tires for everything to work in harmony though, but lighter will always mean faster.
    The point is, there's more to his car than power to weight. You can't identify one thing that makes his car fast. It's the whole build. To suggest that negating the weight disadvantage of an srt-4 would guarantee that the srt-4 would be faster is short sighted. What's the redline? Gearing? How stiff is the chassis? How is the throttle response?

    Anyhow, looking at the HP numbers that some of you srt-4 guys put down, power to weight is in you favor. :p

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    Quote Originally Posted by chunky View Post
    Anyhow, looking at the HP numbers that some of you srt-4 guys put down, power to weight is in you favor. :p
    How do you figure that? A 2,100lbs hatch or lower with say 330whp or a little more with the 125shot, against a 380/400whp srt-4 that is 900lbs heavier. I don't see 50hp to 70hp covering that.
    (SRT EQUIPPED) It's Just A Neon...
    1/4mile= 11.21 @ 127mph 2.0 60ft
    The Boost Is Strong With This One.

    If You Can't Say Anything Nice,
    "Then Go F**k Yourself"!!!

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    Certified Gearhead chunky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oleblue View Post
    How do you figure that? A 2,100lbs hatch or lower with say 330whp or a little more with the 125shot, against a 380/400whp srt-4 that is 900lbs heavier. I don't see 50hp to 70hp covering that.
    Who said anything about a 125 shot?

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    sup yaw, shits going down soon. Bring some popcorn :boobies:

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    Quote Originally Posted by chunky View Post
    Who said anything about a 125 shot?
    I was told he run's a 60 shot setup and a 125 shot setup. So it just depends on which he uses. I guess he should be right around 280/290whp if he uses the 60 shot if it is a wet kit. I think with me on pump and him on the 60 shot it would be a good run but if he uses the 125 shot with me on pump I don't think I could get him but who know's. I have seen those hatches with around 330whp run low 11's with slicks.
    (SRT EQUIPPED) It's Just A Neon...
    1/4mile= 11.21 @ 127mph 2.0 60ft
    The Boost Is Strong With This One.

    If You Can't Say Anything Nice,
    "Then Go F**k Yourself"!!!

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    LOL I love how you take my statement as if I don't think I know that a lighter car will equate to "faster"... I probably know the physics behind why that statement is true better than you do.

    Here is the how my mind process works: A Lighter car is only one of the MANY factors that come into play when it comes to how fast a car can accelerate.

    Here is how people on this forum seem to think: "It's ONLY faster because it's lighter." Almo

    WHAT I AM SAYING HERE is that the power to weight argument always appears to come as an "EXCUSE" in places like this. The car is fast and most of you have stated "Because it's such a light car." It's almost like you discount that fact that ALL THE OTHER factors that make a car "fast" don't even matter. It's basically a defensive attack.

    Kinda like when a civic beats a Corvette or porsche or mustang or any other car out there, alot of times this retort comes out: "It may be fast but its still a civic." They race, they get beat and so they have to downplay the other car because their butt hurt. When I race the point of the race is to see who is faster, if I lose I say "Nice car, its fast."

    I have always been a car enthusiast and love cars and love the engineering behind it, I am just frustrated and tired of all the ego's that "Racer's" are constantly trying to protect by talking down other cars.

    /rant lol
    Last edited by ejohnson88; 10-21-2009 at 10:10 PM.
    K-What?!?!

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    Quote Originally Posted by ejohnson88 View Post
    LOL I love how you take my statement that I don't think I know that a lighter car = faster... I probably know the physics behind why that statement is true better than you do.

    Here is the how my mind process works: A Lighter car is only one of the MANY factors that come into play when it comes to how fast a car can accelerate.

    Here is how people like lurker think: POWER/WEIGHT conquers all! -.-


    WHAT I AM SAYING HERE is that the power to weight argument always comes as an "EXCUSE" in places like this it seems. The car is fast and most of you have stated that "Because it's such a light car." It's almost like you discount that fact that ALL THE OTHER factors that make a car "fast" don't even matter. It's basically a defensive attack.

    Kinda like when a civic beats a Corvette or porsche or mustang or any other car out there, alot of times this retort comes out "It may be fast but its still a civic."

    I have always been a car enthusiast and love cars and love the engineering behind it, I am just frustrated and tired of all the ego's that Racer's are constantly trying to protect by talking down other cars.

    /rant lol
    So who are you aimimg this at? All I have said is that he does not make the kind of power that I do, so the lighter weight is what will help him out against me. And the gearing a lot too. You are right though, the lighter weight is only one factor of making a car fast and I have not said it is not.
    Last edited by oleblue; 10-21-2009 at 11:14 PM.
    (SRT EQUIPPED) It's Just A Neon...
    1/4mile= 11.21 @ 127mph 2.0 60ft
    The Boost Is Strong With This One.

    If You Can't Say Anything Nice,
    "Then Go F**k Yourself"!!!

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    If you say so buddy. That's a long ass worthless post that is directed at "most people" as you put it. I never said anything about downplaying a car. Did I mention that's a long ass post.

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    Lol its directed at anyone who feels its directed at them. Its a long ass post because I am stuck in the library with a project group that's doing nothing and just felt like ranting. But apparently in my effort to explain myself you still fail to see the argument I am posing. All I am saying is that the way in which you are framing your statements is making them so they appear to be such as what I have said. Anyways, lol this is obviously not going anywhere.

    Good Racing and Good Luck.
    K-What?!?!

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    I am not going to argue about this shit no more either because some folks don't understand no one's point of view but there own. I'm going to let my car do the talking.
    (SRT EQUIPPED) It's Just A Neon...
    1/4mile= 11.21 @ 127mph 2.0 60ft
    The Boost Is Strong With This One.

    If You Can't Say Anything Nice,
    "Then Go F**k Yourself"!!!

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    Lil' ol SmackedInATL's Avatar
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    I will just say this thread is funny going back and forth will all this power to weight talk. I know that I pulled a 4 door 93 civic with a k20 and a 75 shot ON a badly slipping clutch. It will definitely be much uglier than that now.

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    Certified Gearhead chunky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SmackedInATL View Post
    I will just say this thread is funny going back and forth will all this power to weight talk. I know that I pulled a 4 door 93 civic with a k20 and a 75 shot ON a badly slipping clutch. It will definitely be much uglier than that now.
    if you mean the red one you ran the night I rode with you, it was a coupe + k24 + 75 shot. And yeah, you did pull him although he put up a solid fight. Pretty sure that power to weight checked off in his favor on those pulls considering you had a 200+lb passenger riding along.

    He's made some changes to his setup since then. I'd love to see you two get at it again next time he's in town.

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    I also would like to get some slow rolls in with you smacked. I think me and you would be a pretty good run. There needs to be another KF meet!
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    Kason I live in Douglasville and with you in Rockmart we could meet half way. There has to be somewhere to make some pulls in between Dallas and Rockmart. Just need to find a camera too.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SmackedInATL View Post
    Kason I live in Douglasville and with you in Rockmart we could meet half way. There has to be somewhere to make some pulls in between Dallas and Rockmart. Just need to find a camera too.
    We all should just try and meet and we all can get some runs in all in the same night, that way we can have a hell of a video to show of.
    (SRT EQUIPPED) It's Just A Neon...
    1/4mile= 11.21 @ 127mph 2.0 60ft
    The Boost Is Strong With This One.

    If You Can't Say Anything Nice,
    "Then Go F**k Yourself"!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by oleblue View Post
    We all should just try and meet and we all can get some runs in all in the same night, that way we can have a hell of a video to show of.
    I'm down for this.
    Would be good to have some faces with some of these s/ns

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    Also I have no clue what my car is making right now with this new tune I downloaded last night. I need to put it on a dyno.

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    Haven't read the thread, but I make between 480 - 500rwhp, and weigh just over 3100lbs.

    One night I raced a Civic Hatch making about 360 - 370rwhp, and only weighed around 2000lbs.....couldn't pull him at all.

    I also raced a GT 500 Mustang that was making just over 680rwhp, but also weighing right at 4000lbs, and was pretty much even with him until 120 - 130mph or so, where I started creeping away from him.

    Power:Weight is probably the biggest factor that comes into play when going from a roll, but it's not the gospel. But you're typically going to need about 12rwhp ON AVERAGE to make up for every 100lbs of weight.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lankhoss View Post
    Haven't read the thread, but I make between 480 - 500rwhp, and weigh just over 3100lbs.

    One night I raced a Civic Hatch making about 360 - 370rwhp, and only weighed around 2000lbs.....couldn't pull him at all.

    I also raced a GT 500 Mustang that was making just over 680rwhp, but also weighing right at 4000lbs, and was pretty much even with him until 120 - 130mph or so, where I started creeping away from him.

    Power:Weight is probably the biggest factor that comes into play when going from a roll, but it's not the gospel. But you're typically going to need about 12rwhp ON AVERAGE to make up for every 100lbs of weight.

    Oh snap Rear wheel civic FTW!!! lol

    And im down smacked. Just let me know when and where. On my latest tune Im prob on the 430whp/500+wtq mark. But like you I need another dyno session to know for sure.

    And im waiting for my clutch to say F*ck you. Since its only rated to 500 TQ to the FLYWHEEL lol
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    [quote=Lankhoss;38430729]Haven't read the thread, but I make between 480 - 500rwhp, and weigh just over 3100lbs.

    One night I raced a Civic Hatch making about 360 - 370rwhp, and only weighed around 2000lbs.....couldn't pull him at all.

    Lank if that was the green hatch u were talking about it weighed alot more than u would think
    I check sluts off my list like a maintnence man
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    12? or 120 lank?
    K-What?!?!

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    Quote Originally Posted by ejohnson88 View Post
    12? or 120 lank?
    Really?

    You think 200 pounds would have to be matched with an extra 240 whp?
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    Yes power to weight can be a big factor... but its not a determining factor all the time. For example in your races... both cars have a better power to weight ratio than you... yet you pull on one and not the other. When you start going above 100 mph aerodynamics and gearing are going to become much more of limiting factors in a race.
    K-What?!?!

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    Quote Originally Posted by ejohnson88 View Post
    Yes power to weight can be a big factor... but its not a determining factor all the time. For example in your races... both cars have a better power to weight ratio than you... yet you pull on one and not the other. When you start going above 100 mph aerodynamics and gearing are going to become much more of limiting factors in a race.
    Yeah, that was the point of my post. I actually ran that GT 500 again, and he said all he'd done was take it back to the shop and had them retune it, and he pulled me by a car length consistantly....even though he had a passenger and slipping clutch. Maybe it just wasn't running at 100% for the longest time or something.

    And yes, it's 12whp not 120....I think you may have been thinking what it'd take to overcome 1000lb disadvantage?

    2006 Corvette Z06
    2" Stainless Works LT Headers
    Random Technologies 3" X-pipe, with high flow polished cats
    Callaway "Honker" cold air intake
    Ported throttle body and intake
    Custom dyno tune by MTI Racing Atlanta
    496rwhp/478tq

  37. #37
    Lil' ol SmackedInATL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lankhoss View Post
    Yeah, that was the point of my post. I actually ran that GT 500 again, and he said all he'd done was take it back to the shop and had them retune it, and he pulled me by a car length consistantly....even though he had a passenger and slipping clutch. Maybe it just wasn't running at 100% for the longest time or something.

    And yes, it's 12whp not 120....I think you may have been thinking what it'd take to overcome 1000lb disadvantage?
    I love how you make one estimation and everyone just runs with it. LOL. You guys may not like Lank's posts but he knows what he's talking about when it comes to roll racing.

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    SUPERMAN
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    ^This might be good depending on how far you two go.
    (SRT EQUIPPED) It's Just A Neon...
    1/4mile= 11.21 @ 127mph 2.0 60ft
    The Boost Is Strong With This One.

    If You Can't Say Anything Nice,
    "Then Go F**k Yourself"!!!

  39. #39
    530TQ + FWD = FAIL!! Kason23's Avatar
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    There used to be killsforum meets. But I think the spots got hot and they kinda wiltered away. And with work the way it is now I can only meet up on a weekend.
    Neon PoWa
    Now Delta 46 equipped
    432whp/425wtq on lower boost

  40. #40
    Similac Fed [Reckless]'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kason23 View Post
    There used to be killsforum meets. But I think the spots got hot and they kinda wiltered away. And with work the way it is now I can only meet up on a weekend.
    I am in the same boat or have to leave where ever by 11am.
    I guess I would have been around for the old meets but I took a 3yr hiatus out of the car scene and just got back into it.

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