Obama to tear apart the country

[Gorilla Eg!]

first of all *I AM NOT RACIST*.... now thats out of the way....yes the fact that obama might become president startles me....not that I believe Hillary or Mcain could do any better.... I tell you what really made me start thinking is with talks of him being muslim and I saw an email the other day that said it has been predicted that arabic/ middle eastern people will be the ones who will set forth the economic changes in the near future... Im guessing its bec they own so much damn oil for 1.....and 2 they own the majority of business around many countries!....though im not parital to (some of) their ways of fighting and killing not only themselves but everyone else in the world....it just freaks me out to think of what might happen if he gets into office and finally comes out as a muslim and "rallys the troops" so to speak.....but who knows maybe im a little on the matter....but maybe im not....guess only time will tell........

[Spektrewing386]

obama isnt even arab or middle eastern, so.... yeah. and hes not muslim, hes christian, even though his father is muslim.... but who cares?

[The12lber]

I agree with most of what you said, and I basicly agree with it. Face it, oil is the lifeblood of our country, and anyone that put that supply in jepordy is threatening our national security.

The bolded part is funny though as I dont remember the US ever removing a democratic govt and placing a puppet govt there.

That's probably because you don't know anything about history, which is quite shocking considering that you knew the relatively obscure fact that Israel secretely borders the Persian Gulf. Iran's democratically elected Government was replaced by the United States with the Shah. Saudi Arabia, Egypt and Pakistan all have oppressive governments supported by our own. If you don't believe me, you should take a look at the hardware their armed forces are sporting.

[BanginJimmy]

and now the US is comprimising Iraq's sovereignty with new US-Iraq pacts which will establish many permanet US military bases, even the iraqi's dont like it.

I heard something about that vaguely, got a link to more info on it?

[Spektrewing386]

http://www.time.com/time/world/artic...810897,00.html

http://www.time.com/time/world/artic...812446,00.html

[BanginJimmy]

http://www.time.com/time/world/artic...810897,00.html

http://www.time.com/time/world/artic...812446,00.html

thanks.


I agree with the general purpose of the agreement, but the timing is horrible. If the US wants bases in Iraq, thats fine, but wait until the country is pacified and a STABLE govt is in place.

[Spektrewing386]

I think permanet bases in iraq will cause much anger to their people. It is a slap in the face to their independant sovereighty. Really, pernament US bases in Iraqi will bring a world of trouble and unrest to the area.

Next up for pernament US military bases? Poland and Czech Republic with the missile bases and radar stations, after that? Iran maybe?

[BanginJimmy]

The US has actual bases in Germany, England, Iceland, Japan, and Korea. All these other installations are nothing more than maybe an outdated listening post for the NSA, or not even used.

There are no permanent US bases in Australia, Saudi, Afghanistan, or Columbia as your map would suggest.

[Spektrewing386]

Yes there are. There is a MAJOR air force base in Germany, its a frequent stop for planes heading to Iraq.

The ones in Japan and Korea are also quite extensive, as they are used to to monitor the North Koreans. And if anything broke out with North Korea, they are the first responders.

The United States pulled out of Saudi Arabia in mid 2003. The major one was our presence at Prince Sultan air base. Which to us, was used for the past 15 years in Operation Southern Watch to moniter the Iraqi no-fly zones and was also used as the command and control center for the invasion of iraq. We used the base as a launching pad for our aircraft. We moved it to Qatar.

We have bases in Australia, theres a new military communications one coming in Geraldton on the west coast. Also dont forget the military satellite intel base in Pine Gap (i think central australia).


And of course there are bases in Afghanistan. And of course those bases can pretty much be described as pernament. Hell, we still have important bases in Japan, and ww2 was over 60 years ago, so you think any base in afghanistan is temporary? rubbish.

We have a proposed base in Columbia in the La Guajira region, and im pretty sure we already have troops there. We also have troops stationed in Manta, Ecuador.




Every source, every map is pretty much the same as the one I posted above.

[BanginJimmy]

most of these installations you are talking of, have like 10-12 personell there and are nothing more than listening posts of some sort or another.

Also, if you want to get technical, the US has a military presence in something like 150 countries.

[Spektrewing386]

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...world_2007.PNG

theres a map with numbers for reference

[The12lber]

thanks.


I agree with the general purpose of the agreement, but the timing is horrible. If the US wants bases in Iraq, thats fine, but wait until the country is pacified and a STABLE govt is in place.

The agreement gives us complete control of their airspace and total immunity from Iraqi as well as complete authority within the nation. The Iraqi government still exists, but the United States could override their authority at any time in any way it sees fit.

The agreement basically establishes the United States Empire permanently in Iraq.

[ARH1192]

I'm not racist, but with a black man as the President I have the feeling there will be an assassination.

[The12lber]

I'm not racist, but with a black man as the President I have the feeling there will be an assassination.

I have a feeling its going to be a disaster. Does anyone remember the first Palmer administration?

[BanginJimmy]

and Jack Bauer isnt around to bail him out either.

[ShooterMcGavin]

lulz

[The12lber]

I have a feeling its going to be a disaster. Does anyone remember the first Palmer administration?

I forgot as well the disaster that took place under the black president in Deep Impact.

Vote McCain or be vaporized by a comet.

[BanginJimmy]

I forgot as well the disaster that took place under the black president in Deep Impact.

Vote McCain or be vaporized by a comet.

Morgan Freeman is God though, didnt you see Bruce Almighty?

[Apollo]

The Democrates are turning American into a Socialistic society, Meaning there goes Democracy out the door. Its sounds like a good idea but its not. Taking away our freedoms more than the republicans could ever do.

[The12lber]

The Democrates are turning American into a Socialistic society, Meaning there goes Democracy out the door. Its sounds like a good idea but its not. Taking away our freedoms more than the republicans could ever do.

Actually, Neo-conservative ideology/political philosophy championed by Republicans have been responsible for stripping you of most of your rights.

The Democrats just kind of went along with it because they're also politicians, and as such are mostly self serving douchebags.

More over, all legislative trends skew towards creating laws/tax codes/etc favorable to wealthy, so the Socialism thing is bull****.

[wantboost]

More over, all legislative trends skew towards creating laws/tax codes/etc favorable to wealthy, so the Socialism thing is bull****.

lol

[IMPORTchic]

Maybe this is just my 2 cents and is not worth anything, but I feel like Obama is going to cause a big race thing if he wins and mccain is going to get us in deeper economically. Maybe im too young and inexperienced to have an opinion but thats just what I get out of it. I am not sure of my political side. Dem/rep? I just go by what I read and hear in the media(which is ****ty) and go with it. I am not going to vote this year, BUT if I was......I would have to say mccain. With living in the south I dont feel like dealing with all the racial stuff! Economoy is already shot anyways. This is 2008.....people need to get over theirselves. There are just as many "nigs" as white trash. Same thing! THere are good and bad in every race! Just ignorance in between!

And as for the war deal. I know a TON of people over there fighting. One person being very dear to my heart, he has already been blown up and recieved a purple heart once and is going back for another tour in the first of '09. I do not want him to have to go back or anyone for that matter, but we all know that if we just pull out its going to be HELLATIOUS! There is no telling what will happen here! It will have to be a gradual thing. I feel that they could possibly decrease the number of troops in Iraq, but need to increase in Afghanistan. Does anyone hear the report of the amounts of OUR people being killed over there? They obviously need backup or something.....


Like I said....just my 2cents.....

Just please keep all of the miliary in prayers!

[tony]

Maybe this is just my 2 cents and is not worth anything, but I feel like Obama is going to cause a big race thing if he wins and mccain is going to get us in deeper economically. Maybe im too young and inexperienced to have an opinion but thats just what I get out of it. I am not sure of my political side. Dem/rep? I just go by what I read and hear in the media(which is ****ty) and go with it. I am not going to vote this year, BUT if I was......I would have to say mccain. With living in the south I dont feel like dealing with all the racial stuff! Economoy is already shot anyways. This is 2008.....people need to get over theirselves. There are just as many "nigs" as white trash. Same thing! THere are good and bad in every race! Just ignorance in between!

And as for the war deal. I know a TON of people over there fighting. One person being very dear to my heart, he has already been blown up and recieved a purple heart once and is going back for another tour in the first of '09. I do not want him to have to go back or anyone for that matter, but we all know that if we just pull out its going to be HELLATIOUS! There is no telling what will happen here! It will have to be a gradual thing. I feel that they could possibly decrease the number of troops in Iraq, but need to increase in Afghanistan. Does anyone hear the report of the amounts of OUR people being killed over there? They obviously need backup or something.....


Like I said....just my 2cents.....

Just please keep all of the miliary in prayers!

You're never too young to have an opinion or get engaged in what is going on because it effects your future.. don't feel like you should be quiet simply because of your age of how someone may respond to what you think.

[Tasuki_Civic]

Tony is right.

its America who will judge the big picture, "economy wise", rather than the little things that people will naturally hate on. There is always a portion who will disagree on the littlest things and make them bigger than what they are.


you mite have to pray alot more pretty soon. Bush has been talkin about another war by the end of his term. lol things are going to be pretty interesting in the fall.

[Tasuki_Civic]

I tell you like this.....No one ever knows what those 2 ( Mccain or Obama) will do untill they get into office. No one ever knew what any of the past presidents would have done. Shyt look at Bush! lol alot of people are appalled by his perfomance in the past 2 terms.

If you like Bush performance in the past 2 terms then doggonit vote for Mccain if not Obama is your best choice wither you like or not. atleast you made the safest bet on your own opinion.

[chameleon30038]

Who the hell wants to be proud of a country who is having an endless war for profit and sending its loved one to be killed. It doesn't really matter who is president this country is f**ked and will stay that way the president doesn't have that much power as all the corrupted politicians and business men that practically run the country now. The Bush family is making a killing off their oil business but no one pays that any attention.

[Tasuki_Civic]

Who the hell wants to be proud of a country who is having an endless war for profit and sending its loved one to be killed. It doesn't really matter who is president this country is f**ked and will stay that way the president doesn't have that much power as all the corrupted politicians and business men that practically run the country now. The Bush family is making a killing off their oil business but no one pays that any attention.

him and his family wont be struggling after his term is over lol

[Lucky DAWG]

Who the hell wants to be proud of a country who is having an endless war for profit and sending its loved one to be killed. It doesn't really matter who is president this country is f**ked and will stay that way the president doesn't have that much power as all the corrupted politicians and business men that practically run the country now. The Bush family is making a killing off their oil business but no one pays that any attention.

All i got from your rant is that you are anti-business. This is the nature of how organizations and nations throughout history rise and fall in power. If you think they are corrupted then you honestly must not know much history.



Move if you hate this country, i'm sure you will find much less "corrupted and greedy" politicians elsewhere, thats a joke

[BanginJimmy]

lets have some fun

Who the hell wants to be proud of a country who is having an endless war for profit

I am quite proud of my country. We are the only remaining superpower and the best country in the world to live in.

Name a single war that someone didnt profit from. I know Douglas did pretty damn well for itself in WWII. As did GM and Harley.

and sending its loved one to be killed.

This might be a halfway valid arguement if every one of them did not volunteer for it.

It doesn't really matter who is president this country is f**ked and will stay that way

I'm willing to bet people were saying the same things during the great depression. As it turns out the US didnt do half bad for itself.

the president doesn't have that much power as all the corrupted politicians

At least you know a little bit about how the country works,

and business men that practically run the country now.

This is a stretch, I would say lobbiests and special intrests and not really businessmen. Either way though, how can you blame them from trying to make a buck? So long as they arent doing anything illegal then more power to them.

The Bush family is making a killing off their oil business but no one pays that any attention.

Where have you been? People have been mentioning that Bush is an oil man for the last 5 years. I have sour news for you though. Oil companies dont set oil/gas prices. They are simply benefitting from the speculation on wall street.

[BB6dohcvtec]

lets have some fun



I am quite proud of my country. We are the only remaining superpower and the best country in the world to live in.

Name a single war that someone didnt profit from. I know Douglas did pretty damn well for itself in WWII. As did GM and Harley.



This might be a halfway valid arguement if every one of them did not volunteer for it.


I'm willing to bet people were saying the same things during the great depression. As it turns out the US didnt do half bad for itself.



At least you know a little bit about how the country works,



This is a stretch, I would say lobbiests and special intrests and not really businessmen. Either way though, how can you blame them from trying to make a buck? So long as they arent doing anything illegal then more power to them.




Where have you been? People have been mentioning that Bush is an oil man for the last 5 years. I have sour news for you though. Oil companies dont set oil/gas prices. They are simply benefitting from the speculation on wall street.

and who are the ones that create that speculation. put one little word out there that freaks ppl out at wall street goes crazy.

[BanginJimmy]

and who are the ones that create that speculation. put one little word out there that freaks ppl out at wall street goes crazy.

US news media, foreign news media, US and foreign oil companies and just about any other source of info you can think about.

[Lucky DAWG]

US news media, foreign news media, US and foreign oil companies and just about any other source of info you can think about.

honestly...


was he expecting a different answer then that? as if it was Bush or something causing they hysteria?

[BanginJimmy]

honestly...


was he expecting a different answer then that? as if it was Bush or something causing they hysteria?

Thats probably what he was implying, but as with everyone else that says that, he has nothing to back it up.

[Spektrewing386]

I am quite proud of my country. We are the only remaining superpower

we wont be for long, but the neocons are doing all they can to prevent it

Name a single war that someone didnt profit from. I know Douglas did pretty damn well for itself in WWII. As did GM and Harley.

but its the way some of the current companies profit. In which they give our soldiers the crappiest services and charge 300x the price for it. They profit the more they spend, but they dont spend on the services they are sopossed to provide. called "cost-plus".

[BanginJimmy]

we wont be for long, but the neocons are doing all they can to prevent it

I think we will come out of this better than when we came in, until we forget what got us into this mess in the first place. Its much the same as it was during the great depression. Artifically inflated markets, in this case oil. Huge public debt and out of control spending just like we do today with CC debt. Then to make it worse, govt interference just like FDR and Hoover did extended the depression a number of years.

but its the way some of the current companies profit. In which they give our soldiers the crappiest services and charge 300x the price for it. They profit the more they spend, but they dont spend on the services they are sopossed to provide. called "cost-plus".

So you mean to tell me a govt contract is poorly run and poorly supervised? Wow, what a concept. This wont happen with socialized healthcare though right?

[Spektrewing386]

I think we will come out of this better than when we came in, until we forget what got us into this mess in the first place. Its much the same as it was during the great depression. Artifically inflated markets, in this case oil. Huge public debt and out of control spending just like we do today with CC debt. Then to make it worse, govt interference just like FDR and Hoover did extended the depression a number of years.

im talking about the power hungry people who are preventing other nations from challenging the current status quo. Also FDR HELPED recover us from the depresison, not make it worse. it was government interference for the better.

So you mean to tell me a govt contract is poorly run and poorly supervised? Wow, what a concept. This wont happen with socialized healthcare though right?

Im sorry to break your heart, jimmy. but government contracts arnt socialized. the government is a client of the company... not the other way around.

But whats weird is when a top member of the government is associated with the contracted company (yeah you know what i mean)

But its all about the people at the top. Anyone can make anything bad and poorly run, doesnt matter if its socialized or not.

[Lucky DAWG]

im talking about the power hungry people who are preventing other nations from challenging the current status quo. Also FDR HELPED recover us from the depresison, not make it worse. it was government interference for the better.





Im sorry to break your heart, jimmy. but government contracts arnt socialized. the government is a client of the company... not the other way around.

But whats weird is when a top member of the government is associated with the contracted company (yeah you know what i mean)

But its all about the people at the top. Anyone can make anything bad and poorly run, doesnt matter if its socialized or not.

you are sorely mistaken. Look at the early years of FDR, it got worse when he got into office before it got better.




And no companies will not give our soldiers the BEST equipment possible because it is simply not financially reasonable, i'm sure out there they have some new protective devices / clothing for soldiers but are not releasing it yet because it is not cost efficient, a company is not going to bankrupt themselves for humanitarian purposes, you wouldn't either if you owned it.


And to argue that we poorly arm our soldiers is ridiculous, you have been watching too much news media of certain instances, our budget is higher then the rest of the world's combined. You would be astonished to see the training they go through and how much money is spent preparing them, its quite the opposite actually. Most other countries in the world are more concerned with the outcome then the means at which they put their own soldiers at risk, look at the people we are war with in the middle east, perfect example.

I don't think you appreciate how good it is here, this scare of a recession which is far from a depression, unless you make it one, is the only reason why you are freaking out.

[Lucky DAWG]

im talking about the power hungry people who are preventing other nations from challenging the current status quo. Also FDR HELPED recover us from the depresison, not make it worse. it was government interference for the better.





Im sorry to break your heart, jimmy. but government contracts arnt socialized. the government is a client of the company... not the other way around.

But whats weird is when a top member of the government is associated with the contracted company (yeah you know what i mean)

But its all about the people at the top. Anyone can make anything bad and poorly run, doesnt matter if its socialized or not.

you're correct there. In a socialized one the people at the top and the people at the bottom both have the power to do that. Its called laziness when there is no incentives.

[Spektrewing386]

Did you read someone else's post and accidently respond to mine?

And no companies will not give our soldiers the BEST equipment possible because it is simply not financially reasonable.

You cant be farther than what i was talking about.

for example. it costs the government $100 to have the company do 1 load of laundry. When the soldiers claim they can do it better themselves, they are forbidden to and must hand their laundry over to the contracted company.

And to argue that we poorly arm our soldiers is ridiculous, you have been watching too much news media of certain instances, our budget is higher then the rest of the world's combined. You would be astonished to see the training they go through and how much money is spent preparing them, its quite the opposite actually. Most other countries in the world are more concerned with the outcome then the means at which they put their own soldiers at risk, look at the people we are war with in the middle east, perfect example.

???? I wasnt talking out the soldiers weapons or combat equipment. I dont know how you came to that conclusion.

I don't think you appreciate how good it is here, this scare of a recession which is far from a depression, unless you make it one, is the only reason why you are freaking out.

You really didnt get the jist of my post did you?




Anyway, I see how some people are freaking out over socialized healthcare saying its going to suck. Have you forgotten that our education system is socialized? Just about every education system in the world is socialized.
If you say that we cant afford it, then take comfort that we wont be spending $12 billion a month for the next 4 years for something that should have never happened.


When I talk about the war I sometimes forget im in a die hard red state.

[BanginJimmy]

You cant be farther than what i was talking about.

for example. it costs the government $100 to have the company do 1 load of laundry. When the soldiers claim they can do it better themselves, they are forbidden to and must hand their laundry over to the contracted company.

If this isnt just a random example you are wrong. The entire time I was in afghanistan I did my own laundry. All it cost me was the price of soap and drier sheets.