Islam is not a new religion or the newest religion..

[AtifSajid]

Recently since Ramadan is going on I have heard non-muslims mention that Islam is the newest of the 3 main religions in the world(Christianity, Jewish, Islam). This is not true from Islamic belief.

Islam started when God(the Almighty unknown being) decended Adam to the Earth. He was Muslim according to all the religious books that were sent down in there pure form(Bible, Torah, Quran). From there when different Prophets were born to this earth, they were all Muslims. Moses, Noah, Jesus, Abraham, etc..

The only problem that happened is that either they were not able to complete the spread of Islam completely, or there words were changed and there practices were changed after they passed away.

Prophet Mohammad was the last prophet in Islam. He spread the most Islam throughout the world, and that is why he is classified as the best Muslim. This is the reason why most non-muslims believe that Islam is the newest religion when it is the oldest religion that has been around.

I am stating this just to clarify this saying of Islam being the newest religion.

Please be mature in your replies

[XLR8NMR2]

I'm thinking about changing my religion to Islamic...it's an all around better religion to Christianity, ive learned alot about the religions in the passed year.....

[civic95]

ive learned alot about the religions in the passed year.....

Did you learn that they were just early forms of government? To keep order, and prevent the chaos of human instinct? Books of stories to teach "moral" lessons?

I'm not saying this earth is all a coincedence either. I believe there is a greater being, but I don't believe the stories in religious books. There is too many ways to interpret them. Today people are changing their views of whats acceptable (one ex: gays). You can't say gays are going to hell, and 20 yrs later you reinterpret it to welcome them in your church. I believe it was an early form of government, and that it evolved into a business. If your a pastor, priest, whatever you should be one of the biggest followers of your religon. You should have an incredible fear in god, and you would never (kill your wife, molest young kids, etc) BUT IT HAPPENS ALL THE TIME.

Checkout this book called "God is not great, why religion poisons everything".

[gtikid]

When it comes to religion, there's no concrete proof of anything. It's all just faith. You were raised believing this, and others were raised believing other things. It's hard to change someone's mind, especially when they've been brought up being told one thing all their life. It's just a matter of which one you were raised on...

[wantboost]

When it comes to religion, there's no concrete proof of anything. It's all just faith. You were raised believing this, and others were raised believing other things. It's hard to change someone's mind, especially when they've been brought up being told one thing all their life. It's just a matter of which one you were raised on...

, reps

[XLR8NMR2]

actually there is more "proof" in islam then any other religon.....

they read the quran(sp) and trutfully i can't read it just yet but one of my girlfriends read me a couple pages and it puts everything in a much better perspective

why do you think ultimately all the great powerful men turn islamic...

[gtikid]

actually there is more "proof" in islam then any other religon.....

they read the quran(sp) and trutfully i can't read it just yet but one of my girlfriends read me a couple pages and it puts everything in a much better perspective

why do you think ultimately all the great powerful men turn islamic...

Everything is just belief man. A christian can easily come in here and argue that there's a lot of proof of Christianity b/c it's written in the Bible that Jesus resurrected.... That's not proof at all. Those are just basis for belief in something. Not to be racist here Mark, but just because a few black men/leaders in the black community turned to Islam, doesn't mean ALL the great powerful men converted....

[AtifSajid]

No man you are wrong. Faith is just one part of the entire concept. You can read history books, they have exactly what was written in them that happened years ago. The only difference is that history books dont say these people were Muslims and these people were Jews and these people were christians, they just say there was this war or that war and this person was this great or that great person was great. History books dont look at religion. Your religion is what states who was who in actuality.

Make sense? Its deeper than this..I just tried to broaden it.

[gtikid]

No man you are wrong. Faith is just one part of the entire concept. You can read history books, they have exactly what was written in them that happened years ago. The only difference is that history books dont say these people were Muslims and these people were Jews and these people were christians, they just say there was this war or that war and this person was this great or that great person was great. History books dont look at religion. Your religion is what states who was who in actuality.

Make sense? Its deeper than this..I just tried to broaden it.

Why am I wrong? Because you were raised believing this? It's a BELIEF man, that's all it is. Just b/c we don't believe the samething does not make me wrong. History books don't show Moses splitting the sea, they don't show Noah building an arc. They talk about TALES of these people doing these things. We, as adults, should know that not all tales are true. And even then, it's up to decide if we BELIEVE they were muslim/christian/jew/whatever...

[AtifSajid]

Why am I wrong? Because you were raised believing this? It's a BELIEF man, that's all it is. Just b/c we don't believe the samething does not make me wrong. History books don't show Moses splitting the sea, they don't show Noah building an arc. They talk about TALES of these people doing these things. We, as adults, should know that not all tales are true. And even then, it's up to decide if we BELIEVE they were muslim/christian/jew/whatever...

sorry didnt mean to say you were wrong..but you have a point.

[gtikid]

sorry didnt mean to say you were wrong..but you have a point.

No problem. I don't really like arguing about religion because to some people, it hits home a lot harder than others. It's hard to alter someone's beliefs, and some people are just a lot more shallow and narrow-minded than other people. My parents tried to bestow Christianity on me, because that's what they were raised with. And b/c of that, I know a lot of Christian people that are very narrow minded, like my grandma .

[SpecV_Scott]

Why am I wrong? Because you were raised believing this? It's a BELIEF man, that's all it is. Just b/c we don't believe the samething does not make me wrong. History books don't show Moses splitting the sea, they don't show Noah building an arc. They talk about TALES of these people doing these things. We, as adults, should know that not all tales are true. And even then, it's up to decide if we BELIEVE they were muslim/christian/jew/whatever...

Well put. That's exactly why I'm an atheist.

[rizzler]

i'm Muslim, believe in all of the three monotheistic religions as legitimate religions because from what i've learned we are all one in the same, just different parts of the world spread the religions party and fully, i agree with Atif when he said that words were changed as time went on but in the end i still say humanity is the best religion.

[gtikid]

i'm Muslim, believe in all of the three monotheistic religions as legitimate religions because from what i've learned we are all one in the same, just different parts of the world spread the religions party and fully, i agree with Atif when he said that words were changed as time went on but in the end i still say humanity is the best religion.

I believe that words were changed as well, in ALL religions, not just some. And because of that, how are we to believe that the religion we chose, if any, is the "correct" one?

[AtifSajid]

Julian you know one thing. There is an original Quran in Saudi Arabia in Mecca where that Kaaba resides. It is the first Quran ever created and it has been preserved for centuries.

If you take that one and get a Quran from 2007 of this month that was made today. Not one word will be different in it.

[gtikid]

Julian you know one thing. There is an original Quran in Saudi Arabia in Mecca where that Kaaba resides. It is the first Quran ever created and it has been preserved for centuries.

If you take that one and get a Quran from 2007 of this month that was made today. Not one word will be different in it.

That's what a lot of my Muslim friends have told me. I can see taking Islam a little bit more serious than Christianity b/c of that. Who knows how many times the Bible has been changed. Everyone and their mother has their own, different, version of the bible. I remember learning about back in the medieval times when if a king didn't agree with the Bible, he would just come up with his own and alter it to what he wanted , like the King James Bible or something like that

[TheProfiteer]

Actually Hindu is the oldest practiced religion.

from a historical perspective the oldest records to be found about a religion still being practiced today is Hindu.

[The Ninja]

Theres your religion.

[The12lber]

Theres your religion.

Ohnoez, I'm threatened by the notion of morality without some horribly contradictary book spoon feeding ignorance to me so I'm going to make Atheism seem ridiculous because I can't wrap my head around even the basic, laymen scientific origins of life and the universe you can hear about on the Discovery Channel.

Also, Atheism is not a belief. A belief is a thing that you hold to be true despite the fact that it is directly contradicted or disproven by empirical evidence.

If you're an Atheist you don't "believe" in anything, you know things to be true because they've been scientifically proven.

zzzzzz

[gtikid]

Ohnoez, I'm threatened by the notion of morality without some horribly contradictary book spoon feeding ignorance to me so I'm going to make Atheism seem ridiculous because I can't wrap my head around even the basic, laymen scientific origins of life and the universe you can hear about on the Discovery Channel.

Also, Atheism is not a belief. A belief is a thing that you hold to be true despite the fact that it is directly contradicted or disproven by empirical evidence.

If you're an Atheist you don't "believe" in anything, you know things to be true because they've been scientifically proven.

zzzzzz

Atheism is more of a "choice". As in, "I CHOOSE to not believe in anything."

[The12lber]

Atheism is more of a "choice". As in, "I CHOOSE to not believe in anything."

You're not choosing anything, you're just thinking rationally.

[gtikid]

You're not choosing anything, you're just thinking rationally.

You're choosing to not believe in any religion. You're choosing to think "rationally".

[Ran]

Ohnoez, I'm threatened by the notion of morality without some horribly contradictary book spoon feeding ignorance to me so I'm going to make Atheism seem ridiculous because I can't wrap my head around even the basic, laymen scientific origins of life and the universe you can hear about on the Discovery Channel.

Also, Atheism is not a belief. A belief is a thing that you hold to be true despite the fact that it is directly contradicted or disproven by empirical evidence.

If you're an Atheist you don't "believe" in anything, you know things to be true because they've been scientifically proven.

zzzzzz

Your rebutle could have used some refining. Leave the sh*t-tossing to the monkeys and try to hold an intelligent conversation. This isn't the Whoreslounge.

Also, science has just as many theories and flaws as any religion on most comparable subjects. The creation of the world for example. Both science and religion have their stances of subjects and sometimes one will outweigh the other. When it comes to these things, it helps to have an open mind.

Oh, and just for the record, I'm agnostic. I do think that there's some sort of afterlife, reincarnation, or high power out there. I just don't know what and I don't pretend to know.

[The12lber]

Your rebutle could have used some refining. Leave the sh*t-tossing to the monkeys and try to hold an intelligent conversation. This isn't the Whoreslounge.

The irony of this statement reached right through my TV and killed me.

My statement was actually prompted by someone else posting something lacking in substance, instead laden with vitriol and non-facts.

Also, science has just as many theories and flaws as any religion on most comparable subjects. The creation of the world for example. Both science and religion have their stances of subjects and sometimes one will outweigh the other. When it comes to these things, it helps to have an open mind.

Science has flaws such as... I'm waiting... really...
I suppose the most popular one is natural selection and evolution and the contention by zany idiots that there's debate within the scientific community about whether or not this actually takes place.

Unless you count the people who got their education at diploma mills arguing that the great biblical flood was caused by the Earth's crust cracking and that dinosaurs are actually 700 year old iguanas, there is not.

If you're insinuating science doesn't have an explanation to all the "big questions" religion wants to answer you're sadly mistaken.

I'm sure plenty of charity goes through religion.

People also get stoned in the streets for holding hands with someone of another religious demomination for religion.

One could argue that this is an extreme example. However, events like this are all too common and less egregious violations of rights are state sanctioned right here in this country.

Religion is nothing but ignorance.

[Ran]

The irony of this statement reached right through my TV and killed me.

My statement was actually prompted by someone else posting something lacking in substance, instead laden with vitriol and non-facts.

Irony? There was no irony. I consider his post just as worthless as yours was due to the content. However, there's no reason why you should of had to lower your standards and respond in kind. Judging from the statements in your more recent posts, you seem to be capable of more than that. That's a compliment.

Science has flaws such as... I'm waiting... really...
I suppose the most popular one is natural selection and evolution and the contention by zany idiots that there's debate within the scientific community about whether or not this actually takes place.

Unless you count the people who got their education at diploma mills arguing that the great biblical flood was caused by the Earth's crust cracking and that dinosaurs are actually 700 year old iguanas, there is not.

If you're insinuating science doesn't have an explanation to all the "big questions" religion wants to answer you're sadly mistaken.

Okay, maybe I misworded. I do know, and respect, that science gives us answers to most things in our physical world. No question there. Also, I'm not much into the Evolution vs. Creation debate. I do, however, wonder about the origin of this world and of life itself. For one reason of another, I find it a bit easier to accept a divine creator over a random explosion in the cosmos. That and the simple complexity of physical life itself. I don't see how single cell organisms could simply come together and form something as complex as even an eye. Save your evolution over time response because I've heard it before and I still find it hard to accept the fact that there wasn't some sort of greater essence at work.

Religion is nothing but ignorance.

Kind of a bold statement. I'll accept the fact that religion is based primarily on faith and belief. However, I think to ignore it all together is just as ignorant as those that would ignore science.

[bu villain]

Also, science has just as many theories and flaws as any religion on most comparable subjects. The creation of the world for example. Both science and religion have their stances of subjects and sometimes one will outweigh the other. When it comes to these things, it helps to have an open mind.

I disagree with this statement. Science says "We don't know how the universe was created but we have some theories that are not fully proven but have large amounts of evidence for them." Religion says "We know how the universe was created and we believe that no matter what evidence is contrary to it."

Oh, and just for the record, I'm agnostic. I do think that there's some sort of afterlife, reincarnation, or high power out there. I just don't know what and I don't pretend to know.

I used to be agnostic as well but the more I studied and the more I learned to not give in to what I wanted to be true, the harder time I had believing there could be a god (in the traditional sense). That being said, I do not look down on anyone for their beliefs as long as they are not harmful to others.

[bu villain]

Also, Islam, Christianity, and Judiasm are all very new religions in the timeline of human history.

[Tasuki_Civic]

Theres your religion.

[{X}Echo419]

I'm with ya here.
btw:
I can't imagine being a muslim woman. talk about sexual discrimination(although the term erks me). women in the middle east got it 10x any free woman in the west.

1 more thing(this really happened). I was @ 6 Flags and I saw the kids and 1 of the was wearing a shirt that I swear said, "Islam. As Seen On TV". what ****ing tv has he been watching?!

[umairejaz]

I'm with ya here.

I can't imagine being a muslim woman. talk about sexual discrimination(although the term erks me). women in the middle east got it 10x any free woman in the west.

If you look back in history, America doesn't have a strong back bone in sexual equality either. Even in our country just a few years back, women weren't allowed the right to vote nor own property or land. Sexual discrimination is nothing new and still exists even in America today. It may not be to as vivid as in other parts of the world but we are all still fighting this same problem. Wouldn't you agree?

[{X}Echo419]

If you look back in history, America doesn't have a strong back bone in sexual equality either. Even in our country just a few years back, women weren't allowed the right to vote nor own property or land. Sexual discrimination is nothing new and still exists even in America today. It may not be to as vivid as in other parts of the world but we are all still fighting this same problem. Wouldn't you agree?

10 to 1. vails and just basicly 2 class citizens. they really don't compare.

[RandomGuy]

Yeah

In addition, In Islam it is a sin to change any of the scripture a single bit. You can ask any historian, the Quran is one of the most well preserved literary peices in history. Verses appear verbatim in a present book and a book centuries old....

A reason for this is the fact that you can't really "translate" the Quran (which is why many people learn Arabic to read it in its true form).... You lose a little bit of meaning through translation and not every word can be converted EXACTLY. Which is why all of the "translation books" say something like "Translation of the Interpretation or meaning of the Quran" or something along those lines, bc its a grave sin to alter God's words.


my 2 cents for the day


Anyone else in favor of bringing the religion forum back, so we can have clean, civil, discussions.

[{X}Echo419]

so if I convert does that mean I get to sue people and get 3 months off a year? Right now I'm a Buddist.... azn girls. and that beats the hell out of being enslaved, taxed or killed any day.

[LiL PaKi]

so if I convert does that mean I get to sue people and get 3 months off a year? Right now I'm a Buddist.... azn girls. and that beats the hell out of being enslaved, taxed or killed any day.

huh?

[THX712517]

Considering Muhammad lived from 570 to 632 AD, I would have a hard time believing that Islam is the oldest, as he is considered the primary founder of said religion. Christians do not claim to be the oldest. The currently accepted timeline for monotheistic religion starts with the Jews, branches off with Christianity which was validated by Rome as the official religion of that civilization, and then you have Islam and Muhammad who was born quite some time after Jesus.

Claiming that all prophets of all religions were Muslims who got it wrong is egotistical and frankly, embarrassing. But as it has been said before, religion is a deeply personal belief and no matter what is said to you or pointed out you will continue to believe what you believe, defending it any way you can and twisting truths if necessary, so I'd rather not argue.

[umairejaz]

Claiming that all prophets of all religions were Muslims who got it wrong is egotistical and frankly, embarrassing.

They never made a mistake, they were pure in form. People's perception and interpretation of their word did however misconstrued over time.

[SpecV_Scott]

Recently since Ramadan is going on I have heard non-muslims mention that Islam is the newest of the 3 main religions in the world(Christianity, Jewish, Islam). This is not true from Islamic belief.

The name of the religion is Judaism.

[The12lber]

Recently since Ramadan is going on I have heard non-muslims mention that Islam is the newest of the 3 main religions in the world(Christianity, Jewish, Islam). This is not true from Islamic belief.

Islam started when God(the Almighty unknown being) decended Adam to the Earth. He was Muslim according to all the religious books that were sent down in there pure form(Bible, Torah, Quran). From there when different Prophets were born to this earth, they were all Muslims. Moses, Noah, Jesus, Abraham, etc..

The only problem that happened is that either they were not able to complete the spread of Islam completely, or there words were changed and there practices were changed after they passed away.

Prophet Mohammad was the last prophet in Islam. He spread the most Islam throughout the world, and that is why he is classified as the best Muslim. This is the reason why most non-muslims believe that Islam is the newest religion when it is the oldest religion that has been around.

I am stating this just to clarify this saying of Islam being the newest religion.

Please be mature in your replies

Well, they can believe whatever they want in terms of their religious beliefs, but in a historical context Islam had its beginning in the 7th century.

[OneSlow5pt0]

without religion their would be less wars....im a casual christan...imm so-so,havent been to church since i was 7 or 8...and dont plan on starting anytime soon,its just one more thing for people to argue bout

[The12lber]

without religion their would be less wars....im a casual christan...imm so-so,havent been to church since i was 7 or 8...and dont plan on starting anytime soon,its just one more thing for people to argue bout

Its really not an argument considering there is no evidence to support the existence of anything supernatural. If you want to be religious, great, more power to you, but to attempt to argue your correctness is logically futile.