i wouldnt call 4.0L V8 huge....lol
but i like the E30 and E36,then i think they just became ugly pigs.........this coming from someone that drives a old camaro(which im sure weighs less then the E92,lol)
but ill deff take the C63 AMG over the E92
i wouldnt call 4.0L V8 huge....lol
but i like the E30 and E36,then i think they just became ugly pigs.........this coming from someone that drives a old camaro(which im sure weighs less then the E92,lol)
but ill deff take the C63 AMG over the E92
Don't worry about his post. Guy said the same thing to me cuz i said the 944 was ugly as hell. Guy went on and on about it being a great track car and blah bah blah and i should be ashamed of myself for owning a Porsche. Just retarded shit cuz I called a car ugly.Originally Posted by Frög
^
Know nada about driving? Why such provocative post? You don't like the fact that I criticized the M3? I am not the only one who has, and pro drivers have.. Me not liking the car has NOTHING to do with my driving experience or skill level..
There are many reasons why I feel this car did not meet my expectations..
Yes the E92 outperforms the E46.. But at what cost? Just for example (im sure you know), comparing the manual (for fair comparison) the E46 was 4.8 seconds compared to the 4.7 seconds for the E92.. I am sorry, but they easily could of kept their awesome in-line six and improved it to gain that.. Instead, they threw a huge, gas guzzling v8..
For comparison, E90 is the 4 door.. I said "E90, no comment" because all this rant against the E92 does not apply to the E90 since it's a luxury sport saloon.. I hate Mercedes, I would take the rs4
And I don't hate Mercedes blindly.. In every category, I would take either a BMW or Audi before a Mercedes.. My family has owned many, and they all drove like shit.. Including AMG's.. They build great cars, I would just never own one..
Last edited by Frög; 05-22-2009 at 12:44 AM.
EVO did a test of all the M cars in a comparison against one another.
The E30 won.As a matter of fact NONE of the new M cars were in teh top 5. The only reason the new M3 was 5th was b/c they said "its new and we give it a pass".
Frog has a point, the new "M" stands for "MASS". They are heavier and more complex then ever. BMW has sold some of its soul to sell MORE cars. They expect to sell over 100,000 M3s this go round.
DOesn't make it a bad car at all. However its not as involved as the older cars. Period.
Vossen CV3 20x9 & 20x10.5
Please show me were pro drivers hating on an E92... You should know, it sounds like you read lots of magazine stats, yet you argue so ignorantly with someone who actually goes out and drives these cars on the track, and has been for 5 years now. Keep jerkin' off to that magazine racing....^
Wow, lots of responses.. Oh and I can't read gtrmonkey's
Know nada about driving? Why such provocative post? You don't like the fact that I criticized the M3? I am not the only one who has, and pro drivers have.. Me not liking the car has NOTHING to do with my driving experience or skill level..
There are many reasons why I feel this car did not meet my expectations..
Yes the E92 outperforms the E46.. But at what cost? Just for example (im sure you know), comparing the manual (for fair comparison) the E46 was 4.8 seconds compared to the 4.7 seconds for the E92.. I am sorry, but they easily could of kept their awesome in-line six and improved it to gain that.. Instead, they threw a huge, gas guzzling v8..
I was with about 3 professional drivers 2 weeks ago at a private track rental, we brought my family/instructor friends personal E92's out there, with much nicer/more hardcore cars owned by rich guys/club racers and pro drivers . It was the underdog, considering we were running it with the Scruderia, ACR Viper, GT3, 997 Turbo and others. The turn in and overall balance is of the best of its kind, like always and better than it's ever been. It was nothing short of holding its own against the best, the chassis/improved suspension geometry/overall grip and flat out 114mph traps impressed everyone even though it was the cheapest car...
Matter of fact, we ran damn scary close times to his personal E46 M3 race cars.
Nah dude, you said the car felt terrible, when it's one of the most successful club racing cars of all time, not to mention one of the best beginner track cars of all time, along with Miata's and such and best of all, not because of it's price but because of its chassis and balance.Don't worry about his post. Guy said the same thing to me cuz i said the 944 was ugly as hell. Guy went on and on about it being a great track car and blah bah blah and i should be ashamed of myself for owning a Porsche. Just retarded shit cuz I called a car ugly.
I hated because you own a Porsche and you don't know that. It's people I love to make fun of, so much money GIVEN to you and no brain cells to be found.
Last edited by OnURleft; 05-22-2009 at 01:25 AM.
I really can't believe the attitude you have and how rude you are..Please show me were pro drivers hating on an E92... You should know, it sounds like you read lots of magazine stats, yet you argue so ignorantly with someone who actually goes out and drives these cars on the track, and has been for 5 years now. Keep jerkin' off to that magazine racing....
I was with about 3 professional drivers 2 weeks ago at a private track rental, we brought my family/instructor friends personal E92's out there, with much nicer/more hardcore cars owned by rich guys/club racers and pro drivers . It was the underdog, considering we were running it with the Scruderia, ACR Viper, GT3, 997 Turbo and others. The turn in and overall balance is of the best of its kind, like always and better than it's ever been. It was nothing short of holding its own against the best, the chassis/improved suspension geometry/overall grip and flat out 114mph traps impressed everyone even though it was the cheapest car...
Matter of fact, we ran damn scary close times to his personal E46 M3 race cars.
Nah dude, you said the car felt terrible, when it's one of the most successful club racing cars of all time, not to mention one of the best beginner track cars of all time, along with Miata's and such, not because of it's price but because of it's chassis and balance.
I hated because you own a Porsche and you don't know that. It's people I love to make fun of, so much money and no brain cells to be found.
But genius, did I not already acknowledge that the E92 outperformed the E46?
What I am saying is that the car does not feel the same and I prefer the previous models.. I've spoken to pro drivers that feel this way.. Not necessarily from a performance standpoint..
Fuck, you even say it in your profile "BMW M3. The good year"
Go fuck yourself with that attitude, I always thought you seemed like a nice guy.. But you being a dick like you are over me criticizing the M3 is fucking gay..
lol ian, quit being arrogant, youngn and frog are just stating their opinions and you tear them apart
I'm not, you're just taking it personally because you don't want to admit you are completely wrong, or you were either on some illicit drug. I am stating the fact, and here is another this thread was POINTLESS. Take it or leave it, I don't care. Your opinion is like a Youtube video post, it is wtf?
The old M3's were great but in todays standard they are what they are, old, outdated, unsafe, overrated.. E30's with Evo conversions are even piss slow stock. If we had a stock E46 M3 out there we would've been absolutely trashed and probably would've had to do solo sessions or stay away from the pack.
My car may be the good M3 in my opinion, and for a track car/occasional street car (what I use it for) it is one of the best in the world for the drieer, but they've been racing it/developing aftermarket for it since 1992, it's won countless autocross/SCCA championships/NASA and even an I.P E36 M3 race car will have to be pushed to run away with an E92 M3, despite it's stock fatass and 900lb weight advantage.
Lol maybe I am, oh well, but where I came from kids/friends knew what it meant to be a good car before they were in high school, not after they were in college. I had higher expectations from a Porsche owner, who's apparently been around the world x deux, speaks fifty eleven languages and tracks his car.
You keep looking at it from a performance standpoint.. I hate the fact that BMW went with a bulky v8.. They can make that power/weight ratio easily out of a 6 cylinder..
Im not a fan of the new m3 either...ive always liked the c63 much better..this go round.
The only M motor that is lighter then the 4.0 V8 is the S14, which is a 4 cylinder. The cars have carbon roofs now as an option, no spares, as well as more technology to reduce un-sprung weight and you can still spec it with cloth seats which puts it at an almost identical weight to a loaded 46 with a full tank of gas.
You keep looking at it from a performance standpoint......
Not going to lie, Mercedes did the C63 right. You could even argue it's night and day better than any AMG to date, although most of their new products are such an improvement.
I am fortunate enough to have a buddy who has a C300 Sport and that is a damn good/beautiful car.
I have not taken the E92 around the track, so I obviously cannot comment on its performance there.. But from driving it around town, I liked the E46 and E36 better..
This is what I have been saying since the beginning..
Also, comparing the stats, BMW could of done better without compromising fuel consumption especially in these times.. What a bad move for BMW, which is why it is IMO FAIL..
They should be striving for more efficient engines and cars, rather than going along similar path to that of American cars.
If you like simplicity/ old cars...
As stated by BMW, the M3 will always be two cylinders less then the M5, but the days of 30mpg possibilities and 20+ in the city are gone, which is a huge shame, but it will return.This is what I have been saying since the beginning..
Also, comparing the stats, BMW could of done better without compromising fuel consumption especially in these times.. What a bad move for BMW, which is why it is IMO FAIL..
They should be striving for more efficient engines and cars, rather than going along similar path to that of American cars.
No, I like new.. But I like nimble cars, as I remember (obviously I couldn't compare them one right after the other), the previous models were.
And this is a HUGE factor why I feel this way about this car.. I just can't understand the logic behind the v8!
Honestly the last M3 that was somewhat nimble was out of production by mid 1999. Only the E30 was the true nimble one. The E46 was essentially the same basic platform as an E36, except with +250lbs and and entirely new/luxury/coupe GT feel, which is why it is my least favorite. The E92 is just an improvement on that, and a good one at that as the E46 SMG ran an identical time to the Evo E36 on the ring, and about 20+ seconds off the E92.No, I like new.. But I like nimble cars, as I remember (obviously I couldn't compare them one right after the other), the previous models were.
And this is a HUGE factor why I feel this way about this car.. I just can't understand the logic behind the v8!
However, the CSL is where it's at, but they messed that up with SMG.
I'm a fan a fuel mileage, I love to see what I can get because the track is where I can get 3mpg and I am always commuting between La. and Ga. If it were my 65k, i'd wait for the Direct Injection Carrera S prices came down, rock out in a faster, better car that gets 30 on the highway. Although it will be hard to turn down a 30k 3 yr old M3 when a 3yr old Carrera is 2x the price. Although if that were me, I see myself daily driving 335D in the future, and not wasting 65k on a Carrera when I could bite my tongue for another year and get that GT3 for fun
Noted.. Not knowing the exact specs of the car, I also thought it was going to be noticeably faster than mine but I was disappointed.. Anyway, I didn't like the E92 M3.. Might be a great car, I know it outperforms the previous M's but I will never own one..
Good choices! Although I want a turbo, Carrera c2s is next on my list.. (or GT3 of course) Much better platform IMO..
What you don't realize is that people have opinions that vary from your's. Not sure whether you noticed or not yet either but I drive a Cayman and when i jumped into my friend's 944T that i drove, it didn't really compared to what I'm used to driving. My car is much more balanced and a lot more nimble. You're going to argue that I haven't driven a real race built one since you're supposed to be all hardcore track driver and shit but I don't give a fuck. My car's not built at all and feels much better than the 944.
Just because I own a Porsche doesn't mean I research every detail about every car they ever made. I don't like the 944, pretty evident. If I don't like the car, why would I waste my time and research the hell out of it like you do? You're also making yourself out to be very ignorant with your whole "money GIVEN" argument. For a person to bring that up only means they're jealous so go forth with that one. I do and have owned other businesses in which make money for myself, just in case you want to assume that a person my age HAS to have rich parents. Look who's always bragging about racing M3s all over the place. I'm pretty sure you're not funding that car and all the parts that go into it for racing through your valet job you spoke of before. So lets put that together and can only positively assume that you're GIVEN some of these things to race with.
I bet this guy has an automatic
New car:
95 S14 with RB25DET (stock boost)
Old car:
Turbo S2000 400hp/285tq on 9:1 comp & 11psi
1. The next M3 will likely be a tt I-6 as luxury carmakers move to smaller engines.
2. We are fogetting about a car we didn't get the M3 CSL. it was lighter, with 360hp but you did lose a lot of comforts that makes the M3 such a great near super car daily driver (A/C, power seats/radio).
BMW went with a V-8 b/c for one its lighter than the V-8 in the E39 M5 and I believe the I-6 in the E46 M3. Also the RS4 and C63 and IS-F and CTS-V have V-8 power.
M has been very confused as of late. The M3 is still magnificent but now they make a 4400 lbs M6 that is more hairstylist than true GT. The M6 has done average in reviews. Instead of investing in a M3 CSL again and a M7, we now get the RIDICULOUS X6 M and X5 M, not one but TWO "M" SUVs. This is the SAME BRAND that said they will never make a SUV "M" just 8 years ago.
That said, the new M3 has grown on me tons. I would love one as the V-8 aspect does appeal to me though I prefer the looks of the E46. Make mine a white coupe with BBS LMs please.
Vossen CV3 20x9 & 20x10.5
1) How hard did you drive it? Just like the S2000 and RX8 you have to run the piss out of the engine to get the car to go otherwise they do feel slow.
2) Explain nimble. Give me a 22' to 24' International turbo diesel rental truck and I'll sling it sideways through turns in the rain making anyone think it's "nimble". I worked at Honda with a retired DTM driver, now motorcycle racer, and he could sell the Civic SI hatchback as a high performance driving machine...
At one time I preferred the e36 over the e46, looks and feel. That soon changed.
1SICKLX- I like the way it looks! That was not one of the reasons why I felt this way about this car..
1) I drove it pretty hard, but not as hard as I wish, and probably not hard enough.. I guess I would need to take it on a track to tell, but again, this distrot about the E92 isn't performance based.. Also, traction control and stability were on at all times..
2) Though it was very responsive, it felt heavier than the previous models.. I love small and light sport cars..
When Audi replaced the S4's 2.7t to the 4.2, I didn't really like it either.. But I it was understandable, the 2.7t had many reliability problems and the cost of maintenance was astronomical.. Also, it was during different times, when gas wasn't at the verge of skyrocketing prices..
I just want it to be an inline 6 turbo!
^^^^ The M3 looks grew on me. At first I didn't like it but now, I like it a lot. I think you make very solid points here. Its sad people are so blind to their brand they don't see how sometimes they stray from the course.
For instance I am a loyal Lexus owner but they still refuse to build high powered manuals and I think the new styling direction on their SUVs is pretty bad. They can improve.
Vossen CV3 20x9 & 20x10.5
But again, I couldn't compare them one right after the other..
Oh and BTW, I am a HUGE BMW fan.. As some of you know, my project car is a factory boosted one..
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