I'm going to have to say it would be FAR easier to kill 20 people with a gun than kill 20 people with a knife. It takes barely any time to go pop pop pop at people versus walking up and stabbing someone one by one without anyone tackling you. There's no argument here.
It depends on the situation and location. Who is able to fight back in an elementary school room? The tool doesn't make a difference there, as first graders can't fight an adult. If someone wants to do evil, they will find a way. We need to address the source, whixh is the person commiting the crime. Removing the tools from law-abiding citizens will not prevent these situations - and Obama stated it during his SOTU address.Originally Posted by simontibbett
"Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting." - Steve McQueen
You cant have freedom without the freedom to do bad things. Freedom is dangerous...... we knew that when we founded this country.
You could kill a building full of people with supplies from home depot. If you take one tool away, the next tool is picked up. You will never prevent evil people from doing evil things by banning inanimate objects. In this case..... the government isnt even seeking to ban the criminals "tool" of choice. Assault rifles are RARELY used in crimes..... AR is just an agreeable mascot used to manipulate the masses.
Not really, it was in direct response to your post. Soldiers don't give a damn about presidential recognition. Politicians use other's sacrifices to gain points in the public eye. We all know they don't actually give a shit about us.
If they cared, they wouldnt seek to remove everything theyve asked you to fight for.
^Exactly.
"The Gestapo was specifically exempted from responsibility to administrative courts, where citizens normally could sue the state to conform to laws. As early as 1935, however, a Prussian administrative court had ruled that the Gestapo's actions were not subject to judicial review."
Now look at our country.
1)Patriot Act
2)National Defense Budget Act of 2012
3)Extrajudicial Assassination of American Citizens
4)Removal of the 2nd Amendment
5)Manhattan Federal Judge Alvin Hellerstein has declined to hold the CIA in contempt for destroying videos that it had been ordered by the courts to preserve.
This country's going to shit.
TEACHERS can stop a knife slinging crazy man though, with a gun, it may be harder. There's absolutely no debate that a gun is the easiest weapon to obtain that can cause the most damage. Does that mean ban them? No, so Sinfix don't get all pissy with this comment, I'm just saying though, guns make it easy to kill quickly in numbers.
A guy with a knife snuck in my mom's school when she was teaching, he was tackled by a few teachers, they got the knife, and held him down while the police arrived. If he had a gun, I think it's safe to assume the outcome would have been much different. Say what you want about security measures or whatever, but a gun vs a knife the gun is the deadlier weapon.
"You brought a knife to a gun fight."
You ALWAYS bring up assault rifles. lol
I'm saying a GUN, I pistol, shotgun, rifle who cares, is a better tool to kill a mass number than a hammer, knife, brick, whatever. Let me guess "a bomb would be better" guns are easy to obtain, cheap, and a moron can handle one.
Like I said, I'm not saying ban guns, I'm just saying.
Assault rifles are a part of our culture. The belief that the 2nd amendment is partially to protect us from tyranny is a part of our culture. These are ideas that politicians have spent decades asking 18 year old men to die for and now they ask you to sit idle while they attempt to remove them.
Freedom is dangerous....... founding fathers recognized that day one. If they could be awakened and asked about their intentions they wouldnt say "omg we didnt realize freedom was so dangerous, take it away" they would probably say "yeah, pretty much what we expected, who is this moron you elected president?"
Yeah the soldiers caring or not caring about presidential recognition is a different subject from the president giving recognition to somebody who I think deserved some type of recognition. I was agreeing that the real heroes do not do it for praise.
How does this response relate to mine? lol
You keep saying "they couldnt have done that with a knife" or "you can kill 100 people with a knife".....
Freedom is dangerous......................................... ............................... you cant remove danger without removing freedom. How can you not relate my response???????????
You also said " you keep bring up _______" that's because it's a part of our culture. Politicians have spent decades asking people to die for the things i "keep bringing up". Theyve spent years telling you these things were worth fighting for.... and now they tell you to stop fighting for them.
No, I said it would be hard to kill 100 people with a knife.
Yes, freedom is dangerous. I never said you could prevent danger, well you could, but we'd all be locked up.
I haven't mentioned assault rifles in this knife debate. The debate I said was that a gun can easily kill a larger number faster and more efficiently than a knife.
So what do you propose?
Chinese teachers were unable to save quite a few children from knife attacks. More than at Sandy Hook. Even if you remove guns completely from society, you haven't solved the real problem. That's a fact.
"Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting." - Steve McQueen
It's not exactly easy to kill 100 people with a gun either. You are trying to make it sound like it is just simple and anyone can easily do it, but if you look at reality, none of these people that tried to do it managed to succeed.
Is it easier with a knife or gun? Why does that question matter at all? The question should be, how do we stop people from wanting to kill in the first place.
"Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting." - Steve McQueen
Plan for the worst, hope for the best, and get sick people off the streets.
I never said getting guns out would solve a problem. I have no idea how teachers couldn't take down someone with a knife though.
Point is it IS easier to kill more people with a gun, that's a fact, simple as that. I'm just saying, not saying we should ban guns, but I don't see why some people don't see why people consider the gun the top of the weapon chart for killers.
Easier, faster, less hand to hand.
100 people may be a little intense yes, but if I ran into a room and wanted 5 people dead, I could probably kill those 5 people much easier with a gun than a knife.
The point I'm making? None. Simply a gun is a better tool than a knife. lol
this IS the plan for the worst.
So little kids carrying rifles is the plan for the worst?this IS the plan for the worst.
Quit your gun slinging comments, they don't even make sense with most conversations.
The never ending quarrel between the peace lover and the peace maker.
Any real proposal outside of generic hippy rhetoric like "hope for the best" ?
btw, ever find your shotgun?
At the next Athens meet I am totally stabbing you in the chest with the Kershaw pocket knife I have on me every waking minute of the day.
Afterwards, you can ask yourself... "Self, do I really care about the other 99 people he's gonna kill with that knife besides me?" And you're gonna respond to yourself by saying to yourself "Self... I'm dead. Who cares? AIN'T NOBODY GOT NO TIME FOR DAT!!!!!"
If only you had a gun to stop me from the dastardly deed that I am planning. But alas... You do not. Oh well.
Call me from the afterlife and tell me how it is. I'm curious.
It'd be easier if you had a gun.
As I mentioned earlier, location and situation determines which tool is best of the job. In your situation of 5 people above, the size of the room and placement of the individuals, along with their skills levels, as welll as your own skill level, would determine which is a better tool for that task.
A 10x10 room, with them spread out evenly all around, and you charging into the middle, does not mean you want a gun. Actually, if you have any combat skill, you would be more inclinded to choose a good long blade instead.
A gynasium or large lunch room (more in line with the Columbine situation), would call for a gun more.
Guns have a longer reach, but in tight quarters, then the knife has the advantage, due to its flexibility in use.
You have to use the right tool for the right situation. And to be clear, guns do have more situations where they are the better tool to use, but a blanket statement is not correct.
Your note of getting sick people off the streets is the part of a real approach to the problem. Planning for the worst involves placing armed individuals at schools to protect the students. The issue with that is it costs a LOT of money, and there is not a lot of extra money these days.
Let me make this clear to everyone. There is no problem with gun-free zones IF you address them correctly. Our courts are gun-free zones, yet we have armed baliffs to protect innocent people. Our planes are gun-free zones, yet we have sky marshalls. If you want to have a gun-free zone, then you have to provide adequate security for that venue. It's that simple. If you do not provide armed security on-site, then it should not be a gun-free zone.
"Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting." - Steve McQueen
Fixed.
A knife is better for a surprise murder in close proximity.
A gun is better to reach out and touch someone from a distance, but it is noisy and attracts more attention.
Out of curiosity, have you shot targets over 100 yards? How did you do? For most, it's not as easy as they think it is.
The longer the distance, the more practice it takes.
"Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting." - Steve McQueen
You're thinking about this with too much thought. I walk in a classroom full of kids, a gun will work far better. If I walked in a room with one guy, talk all the sneak attack stuff you want, I'd rather shoot and not get my hands dirty. But we're not James Bond and we're not sneaking up behind people for "silent kills" either. lol
Gun free zones can work, sure, some schools DO have armed security, others simply have security in the form of cameras, locking doors, etc. Sadly those can't protect people ALL the time.
We need to focus on the problem at hand, which is simply violent crimes in general and not mass shootings at schools, if we only focus on that we lead to the political issues and crying citizens we have right now making irrational decisions because something horrible happened. It's rare though, we shouldn't change laws on a worst fear scenario but make laws/changes that help everything as a whole.
I'm not overthinking it at all. Just making a point that different tool can be just as deadly. In a school room full of kids, it doesn't matter if it is a knife or gun, both are equally easy to use. China's knife attacks show that there is no difference in ability to resist either. That's a fact.
Cameras and secuity doors are passive resistance, and provide no active suppression to an attacker. If you take away someone's ability to actively defend himself, then you need to do the responsible thing, which is provide active security, which can respond to an active attack. Do not mistake passive security systems to be a replacement for personal defense - they just aren't the same.
I agree that we need to look at the factors involved and come to rational decisions. There is no "silver bullet" to solving the problems.
"Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting." - Steve McQueen
Not necessarily. it's probably easier to slash your neck artery with a good swing of a knife, than it is to take out a gun, aim for your neck and get a perfect hit. Just saying.......
I got free clear tails with my ride.....
Not if Obama finds it first.
Oh I wasn't aware he banned shotguns.
He should..... a shotgun would do a number on a classroom. right?
Speaking of shotguns..... spent the day shooting clay.......... hell of a way to spend a sunday while all of those other people are wasting their day at church.
Are you saying he wouldn't?
I think it's highly unlikely.
If he does, oh well!
A dog.
sit boy
you'll get a treat
Oh yippee.sit boy
you'll get a treat
Sit boy, I'm taking your guns.
Oh yippee.
Sit boy, I'm taking your guns.
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