Now we know why he is such a fan of a single payer. He stands to gain from it.Originally Posted by AirMax95
Now we know why he is such a fan of a single payer. He stands to gain from it.
This is a very interesting debate and I hope some others will jump in so we have more than 3 opinions. I think Jimmy and David have many very valid points but we have differing morals that can not be reconciled. Just to summarize my opinion:
1. I am not advocating single payer for ALL healthcare expenses (only basic and preventative that can be shown to save money)
2. I am not advocating the "Obama" health care law
3. We should strive to provide catastrophic insurance that EVERY american can afford
PS. David, how did you get a hold of my financial information? Seriously, I want to know.
We already have emergency care. No one can be refused at the hospital. That point is already taken care of without Obamacare.
Basic, limited coverage is a negotiable item, which I do not have a problem with it being discussed and a potential plan for all US citizens; however, that has never been the intent of Obamacare. From day one, it has been planned for it to become a single-payer government-controlled system.
If you are not advocating Obamacare, perhaps you should develop and document your own plan, and share it with you Congressman. See how far that gets you.
You have posted some basic financial information on yourself in the threads in this forum. Perhaps I have some of yours confused with blaknoize. You are paying too much for insurance, regardless though if you are paying $500 per month for 2 adults with no previous issues.
"Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting." - Steve McQueen
I don't think that would be a good use of my time. I am no expert in health care and do not want to engage in such a crusade. However I do have the time and will for a little debating so that I can at least open myself up to new ideas and perspectives and hopefully do the same for others who are willing.
Maybe you mixed us up. I could try to impress you with how much I make (or taxes I pay) but that has no relevance to this topic anyways. Ideas should be judged on their merits, not the individual expressing them.
Sounds like it. My company offers several plans. I used to be on the one that only costs around 40 bucks a month but I switched to the highest one because my wife and I plan on having a child soon. I had two coworkers recently who compared the cost of their first year with a kid on the highest and lowest plans. It turned out to be pretty much a wash in the end. If there were complications, I don't want to lose my house so I was willing to make the high payment to ensure I will be covered under the worst of circumstances. I will shop around more though to see if I can get a better rate. Thanks for the advice.
Actually, it might be a good use of your time, as our Congress can't seem to get the job done right. As much time as we discuss it on here, you could probably already be done. :-)
I probably did, as one of the two of you was commenting on how little he made, but hopefully will make more in the future.
A good plan should not be too expensive. When my son was born 18 months ago, it cost me a total of $250, and everything else was fully covered - about $14K. As I mentioned earlier, I do not pay anywhere nearly as much as you do. Check to see if you can get a good deal on BCBS through a private insurer. You can also check them direct: http://www.bcbsga.com/health-insuran...ts/pb-overview
"Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting." - Steve McQueen
Are you advocating for preventive care, or for catastrophic care? As I made an example of earlier, major medical care can be had for the cost of a cell phone bill for an individual. For a family it would be more expensive, but if you choose to have a family, you should think of this beforehand.
Both. Preventative care when it is determined to save costs in the long run (e.g., keeping people out of the emergency room) and catastrophic for unforseen issues that require large amounts of care (e.g., child born with faulty heart valve). Your example is an interesting point but it doesn't tell the whole story. It's difficult to compare apples to apples with insurance because there are so many factors (previous histories, deductables, out of pocket maximums, etc). For some the costs may be as low as you state while for others it can be quite a bit higher.
So you want your typical employer provided health care plan at the typical employer health care price, but without the employer to pay the 50-80% of the premium.
Buying your own health care plan is NOT considerably more expensive than your average employer provided plan. You just dont have the employer to pick up the lion's share of the price.
I believe many typical plans require copays for visits and often a percentage of tests and treatment even for basic services. Also I didn't say I expected it to cost the same price as a corporate plan.
I agree but I'm not sure what your point is.
We have spent a lot of time discussing my ideas, so let's give yours some attention. Give me your views on the following:
1. Do you think it's a problem that medical bills are one of the top causes of bankruptcy? If so, how can we change that? If not, why not?
2. How do we keep people from using the emergency room as an alternative to traditional care?
3. Would our society be better off if everyone had health insurance? If so, how can we convince those without it to attain it? If not, how do you feel about people defaulting on their medical bills?
So, you think that we need to provide more care to more people, but it won't cost as much? Do you really believe that? If so, then there is no possible way that you will ever understand enough about health cost for your opinion to be relavent.
1. Why does it need to change? If someone does not choose to have enough medical coverage, and ends up in bankruptcy, then so be it. Bankruptcy is not the end of the world. They can rebuild their credit quickly if it was due to medical costs.
Canada still has bankruptcys due to medical costs: http://www.american.com/archive/2009...ankruptcy-myth
http://www.gabar.org/communications/...es/bankruptcy/
2. The answer is personal responsibility. Until people change their own habits, and get insurance, they will continue to exploit the system to get something for nothing. A lot of illegals abuse the system this way. http://online.wsj.com/article/SB125027261061432585.html
3. No, it would be best if everyone that might need insurance to be able to pay their medical bills would get it - illegal and legal. The rich can afford their bills, so they will not need insurance.
How do you convince people to get it - teach them to be responsible for themselves and their family, rather than tell them to let the government take care of them.
If they default and declare bankruptcy, they can rebuild from there. It is not the end of their lives. they won't lose their house, as it is considered an unsecured debt by law.
"Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting." - Steve McQueen
Then how much should it cost? The answer to that question, alone with what factors are allowed to impact that price, is the answer to this whole debate if you ask me.
No I dont think that is a problem when you take it as a whole. Specific examples may be an issue with me, but as a general statement, no. It comes down to personal responsibility. If you are responsible in your life, you will have the support system, such as family and work, to get back on your feet even if a major illness causes you to go into bankruptcy.
There is no way to do this without allowing hospitals to turn people away. I dont agree with this approach though as there are times that major medical issue can seem final at first glance.
No, our society will not be any better off if everyone had health insurance. Individuals would be, but society as a whole would not be. First off, if people dont want something, then they should not be required to buy it. It really is that simple. If you choose not to buy insurance, then you should be liable for the entire cost of your bills.
As I have pointed out, the cost of your average cell phone will pay for your major medical coverage. If you choose a cell phone over medical coverage, then you take that risk and should reap the consequences of that poor decision.
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