Are my turbo seals blown?
My car will sometimes smoke at idle. It only seems like it smokes at idle when I get in boost. If I drive around in vac. it dont seem to smoke. I dont ever see any smoke driving. The angle of my feed and return is maybe a little less than 45 degrees. So could oil be pooling in the turbo and burning? Will the pooling of oil cause my seals to go bad? I did some research but didnt find enough to answer my problem. I need your help guys, I need to know if I need to get a new one or not. Thanks.
It only seems like it smokes at idle when I get in boost <~ huh? and what kind of car/motor?
I mean when I get in boost while driving, and I come to stop (idling). My car will smoke a little. I drive an ej1 with a D16Z6.
My seal blew a while back, I wouldn't worry too much if it is only very little smoke sometimes.
Mine blew a lot of smoke and it was instantly. Turned out I needed a reducer on my feed line. It was pumping too much oil
into the turbo. What engine?
Last edited by williz6588; 11-04-2010 at 03:39 PM. Reason: mispelled
Ok thanks, and I got a D16Z6.
What kind of turbo and center section? If its an ebay brand, im sure its material quality related.
I had a seal blow in my Master Power T-70. They are known for this problem but the cause is from too much oil pressure in combination with a weak/thin outer seal. If too much pressure is in the center section, and the drain is insufficient, there will be pressurized oil in the center chamber causing it to push the seals out, allowing oil into the hot side of the turbo. A rebuild or new center section will fix your problem. Then contact the manufacturer and see if an oil restriction plate on the feed side is necessary.
Thanks guys, but yall still hav'nt answered my question about the angle of my feed and return. Its a little less than 45 degrees, could oil be pooling in the turbo and burning?
Sure your motor does not have excessive blowby that is burning off when you come back to idle? In response to the oil return, personally I like to have as close to a straight down return as possible.
---Mike
Yea, when I get a chance Im gonna get it straight. Its just a pain cause I have the a/c and p/s friendly manifold, and its a close fit in there by the oil feed. lol How can I tell if I have blow-by?
what we do in the mazdaspeed world is a new oil restriction bolt, a thicker oil, and an oil catch can..... our seals burn all the time... ask any speed owner
To test blowby, the easiest thing to do is to hoob a boost gauge up to a crank case vent and see if you are developing positive pressure under boosted situations. The crank case in this (and my subaru for that matter) was not designed for the levels of cylinder pressure that they see when you turn up the boost (or add any boost to a NA car). Often times that PVC valve is leaking boost into the crank case or your crank case ventilation system is not up to the task of dealing with the additional flow that is now going past your rings. There are a number of ways of dealing with this. But if you are seeing positive pressure in the crank case, the turbo is also seeing this positive pressure on the oil return which can lead to smoking and oil getting pushed past the seals.
---Mike
So how would I be able to stop positive pressure in the crankcase? Couldn't I just remove the PCV?
There are many options. There was a honda specific article on one of the forums.
---Mike
With regard to your feed/return angle question. I have heard that as long as the center cartridge is with in 15deg of being upright then you should be fine. Just as an example, I have a 67mm Precision billet wheel journal bearing turbo with a -3AN feed line and a -10AN return with a 90deg elbow out of the turbo. The ls1 makes about 56psi of oil pressure at higher rpms and I have had no problems. Alot of it depends on the quality of your seals. On the same motor, I had a 70mm Master Power (made in brazil). Even with a 1.5mm feed line restrictor, it blew the outer oil seal out. Hopefully you will figure it out and be on your way to some worry free driving!
EDIT: you say it smokes at idle after a hard pull....Its most likely your turbo. Are you running a catchcan or just routing the pcv back into the intake somewhere? Also check your spark plugs for oil. If they are clean, its your turbo (assuming your car is tuned correctly). If they are slimy black, then you have a pcv problem.
Yes, my car has been properly tuned. I seriously think its the turbo and the angle of the feed and return. Im thinking that oil is pooling inside the turbo and just sitting there causing it to burn. I do have the stock PCV running back to the intake (I know I need a catch can). I have not checked the plugs to see how they look, but I will soon. On a different subject though, today I was fixing my oil feed and return when I broke the restrictor in this link: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/36-In...Q5fAccessories Im going to get another restrictor but one that screws into the turbo. So my question is, what size is the feed line in that link? Also if I have a .50 a/r and .63 exhaust turbo, what size restrictor would I need? Ive been seeing that .065 is real popular, but Im not sure. I need to find out by tomorrow. Thanks a lot guys for all the help.
what turbo is it? brand? Size? t3?
Turbo's don't have a seal, they have a control ring designed exactly like a piston ring. You should not need a restrictor unless its ball bearing.
www.MSSRACING.com - 99 Civic CX - Best ET: 9.53 / Best MPH: 160 - Competition Clutch - Arias Pistons - Coatings M.D. - Mahle-Clevite - ebtec - AHobbs Racing - JKOBD - TDC Performance
Daily D: 2007 Dodge 2500 MEGA CAB, Cummins Turbo Diesel
Most people refer to the control ring/s as the "seal" because of its purpose. From what ive heard anyways.Originally Posted by SPOOLIN
Ehhhhh, some do. It depends on the size of the feed line. The Airwerks Borg Warner turbos, for instance, will get a bit upset with a -4 AN feed line. A slight restrictor is recommended for them if running -4 AN feed lines. But chances are this is not one of those turbos
---Mike
my bullseye s372 states that a -4 is required, its the same thing as a borg warner turbo, just with their different turbine wheel. If you run the PROPER feed line size, then a journal bearing turbo should never need a restrictor unless your drain is shit. ...which shitty drains are pretty common.
www.MSSRACING.com - 99 Civic CX - Best ET: 9.53 / Best MPH: 160 - Competition Clutch - Arias Pistons - Coatings M.D. - Mahle-Clevite - ebtec - AHobbs Racing - JKOBD - TDC Performance
Daily D: 2007 Dodge 2500 MEGA CAB, Cummins Turbo Diesel
Don't know what to tell ya, but -3 or a minor restrictor is what is recommended per Borg Warner. It is listed on in the Borg Warner catalog. You can see the catalog on the Full Race site.
---Mike
A few things you can do to reduce the turbo smoking: Thicker oil in hotter temps.. 15w50 in summer time, 10w40 in winter.. Run full synthetic.. Vent the pcv valve to the atmosphere or a catch can... Run an oil restrictor.. Try atpturbos.com... You really shouldn't run one unless its a bb turbo.. You could starve the turbo of oil... Good luck...
There are different types of restrictors also...the ones for the Garrett or other ball bearing turbos would NOT work on a journal bearing car.
---Mike
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