Question Regarding Brakes, Primarily Pads

**StraightSix** · 01-31-2008, 04:22 PM

There are a lot of people that use Hawks, and they have become increasingly popular. I'm not ever convinced that the most popular product is always the best.

As an example, I heard good things in the past about ATE Super Blue brake fluid. My brake system is currently filled with the stuff, but I'm not that happy with it. I didn't care much for how it performed on track at Road Atlanta, Roebling, or Barber. Before the Civic sees any track time, I'm switching to Motul 600. Hopefully, though, I won't be tracking the Civic much longer.

**JessAlba452** · 02-01-2008, 01:12 AM

This is all you need if you don't decide on going BBK

If you need part numbers or whatever let me know. I got everything for a pretty good deal. Just check out the vendors on .org

If you do decide to go BBK...Best are Brembo, Wilwood/AP Racing, K-Sport, 300ZX 30mm aluminum with caliper bracket and do some cobra 13" rotors. Even the 6th Gen brake upgrade. Lots of choices.

Brembo Blanks
Racing Blue DOT Brake Fluid
HAWK HPS Brake Pads

**Sammich** · 02-01-2008, 06:01 AM

well i installed my ceramics last night...and o man are these soooooooooooo nice..the grab really good. but i am sure that i will need to replace my rear calipers soon..so i'm thinking of changing them in a month when i replace all my rotors with brembo blanks...jess you were talking about upgrading to 6th parts...how hard is it to upgrade to 6th gen calipers and retain all other maxima parts? or am i suppose to upgrade pads also or can i keep my just installed ceramics?

**StraightSix** · 02-01-2008, 09:25 AM

^^ What indicates that the rear calipers need to be replaced?

**Sammich** · 02-01-2008, 09:31 AM

Originally Posted by StraightSix

^^ What indicates that the rear calipers need to be replaced?

they were hard as hell to turn...almost like they were frozen. they are about toast homie..believe me..they arent suppose to be THAT hard to turn

**JessAlba452** · 02-01-2008, 12:38 PM

Originally Posted by phatboislim

well i installed my ceramics last night...and o man are these soooooooooooo nice..the grab really good. but i am sure that i will need to replace my rear calipers soon..so i'm thinking of changing them in a month when i replace all my rotors with brembo blanks...jess you were talking about upgrading to 6th parts...how hard is it to upgrade to 6th gen calipers and retain all other maxima parts? or am i suppose to upgrade pads also or can i keep my just installed ceramics?

You just need a matt blem bracket. The rotors will be a little larger than the stock. I'm not 100% sure if the brake pads are the same or not. It's cheaper than the 300zx upgrade though.

Hmm did you mean the rear caliper or rear rotor?

**matthewAPM** · 02-01-2008, 12:48 PM

Originally Posted by phatboislim

right now i'm in a crisis sort to speak in needing to change my pads on my maxima, the rear is squealing, so its time for change/upgrade.

a friend and i were chatting and there was a discrepancy of ceramic pads. i know they have a longer life and dont create the brake dust, but is it true that they dont grab right, i mean even after a correct 'break-in' period?

also will slotted rotors reduce the life of your brake pads? i've been thinking either getting blanks or slotted..but kinda want to go slotted incase i decide to do a lil auto-x in the future.

hawk HP+

**Sammich** · 02-01-2008, 02:02 PM

Originally Posted by JessAlba452

You just need a matt blem bracket. The rotors will be a little larger than the stock. I'm not 100% sure if the brake pads are the same or not. It's cheaper than the 300zx upgrade though.

Hmm did you mean the rear caliper or rear rotor?

i mean the caliper..because i need to replace my rear calipers soon..i'm hoping that i can turn em when i install all of my rotors(brembo blanks)..but i'm not counting on it

.

i guess if i use the 6th gen caliper then i will have to upgrade rotors and pads anyway huh?

**StraightSix** · 02-01-2008, 02:33 PM

Originally Posted by phatboislim

they were hard as hell to turn...almost like they were frozen. they are about toast homie..believe me..they arent suppose to be THAT hard to turn

That's much more an indication that the threads for the parking brake actuator are rusty. It certainly won't hurt anything to replace them.

**Sammich** · 02-01-2008, 02:37 PM

guess ill look into replacing that too...

**JessAlba452** · 02-02-2008, 05:36 PM

Rotor, Caliper, maybe brake pads too and you'd need the bracket. So around $400 if you can get a deal on it all.

If it was for me and I wanted a brake upgrade I would do the 300zx 30mm aluminum bbk. But I don't need to especially since I just got the brakes done yesterday.

Has some bite to it!

**StraightSix** · 02-02-2008, 06:35 PM

Originally Posted by phatboislim

guess ill look into replacing that too...

The parking brake actuator stuff is internal to the caliper. I'd have to see a cut away drawing or exploded diagram to really describe it acurately, but when you replace the rear calipers, all the parking stuff will be renewed, too.

**JessAlba452** · 02-02-2008, 07:10 PM

Ask and you shall receive

**StraightSix** · 02-03-2008, 01:56 AM

Okay, it looks like the lever that the parking brake is connected to rotates a worm gear that is in mesh with P/N 44200E. That gear train rotates and extends the piston. The reason that you have to rotate the piston to reset the caliper comes from the fact that a worm gear system can not be forced to rotate by applying force, ie. compressing the piston, to the output gear.

PBS, there could be a couple of things that would cause your calipers' pistons to be hard to reset. One would be binding in the threads of the worm gears. Another cause could be a really tight seal where the piston and the caliper o-ring interface. That's a couple of theories, fwiw.

**Tech5** · 02-03-2008, 09:32 PM

On a Maxima, I done them about over 100 all years, i say go with bendix ceremics, with Stock rotors, rear dont do but 10-15% stopping anyways

Originally Posted by phatboislim

right now i'm in a crisis sort to speak in needing to change my pads on my maxima, the rear is squealing, so its time for change/upgrade.

a friend and i were chatting and there was a discrepancy of ceramic pads. i know they have a longer life and dont create the brake dust, but is it true that they dont grab right, i mean even after a correct 'break-in' period?

also will slotted rotors reduce the life of your brake pads? i've been thinking either getting blanks or slotted..but kinda want to go slotted incase i decide to do a lil auto-x in the future.

**green91** · 02-03-2008, 09:38 PM

Ive got the hawk hp+ pads and brembo blanks on all 4 corners, they are noisy as **** and dust alot but they are very heat resistant and don't fade easily. much better than the cobalt friction pads i ran before. if you want a quiet combo get ceramic pads, and MAKE SURE TO RUN BRAKE PAD SHIMS WITH ANTI SQUEAL COMPOUND. shims + anti-squeal are key, even with OEM pads.

**speedminded** · 02-04-2008, 06:53 AM

Originally Posted by green91

MAKE SURE TO RUN BRAKE PAD SHIMS WITH ANTI SQUEAL COMPOUND. shims + anti-squeal are key, even with OEM pads.

**Sammich** · 02-04-2008, 07:44 AM

Originally Posted by StraightSix

Okay, it looks like the lever that the parking brake is connected to rotates a worm gear that is in mesh with P/N 44200E. That gear train rotates and extends the piston. The reason that you have to rotate the piston to reset the caliper comes from the fact that a worm gear system can not be forced to rotate by applying force, ie. compressing the piston, to the output gear.

PBS, there could be a couple of things that would cause your calipers' pistons to be hard to reset. One would be binding in the threads of the worm gears. Another cause could be a really tight seal where the piston and the caliper o-ring interface. That's a couple of theories, fwiw.

well i'm going to just replace the calipers with advance/napa calipers anyway instead of worrying about whats wrong with the inside of the calipers. i mean if their toast, their toast right.

On a Maxima, I done them about over 100 all years, i say go with bendix ceremics, with Stock rotors, rear dont do but 10-15% stopping anyways

ceramics are already done, brembo blanks will be installed soon

**StraightSix** · 02-04-2008, 10:55 AM

Originally Posted by phatboislim

well i'm going to just replace the calipers with advance/napa calipers anyway instead of worrying about whats wrong with the inside of the calipers. i mean if their toast, their toast right.

Yup, pretty much.

Someone else pointed out something that I took as understood. Definitely make sure you use the proper anti-squeal shims.

**Sammich** · 02-04-2008, 11:00 AM

dont know wtf that is...lol that must be sad..but i dont. i know there were(for the front pads) some kind of 'adhesive' i had to apply to the back of the pad when i installed them. either way..no squealing...as of yet

**speedminded** · 02-04-2008, 01:03 PM

Originally Posted by phatboislim

dont know wtf that is...lol that must be sad..but i dont. i know there were(for the front pads) some kind of 'adhesive' i had to apply to the back of the pad when i installed them. either way..no squealing...as of yet

The shims provide a contast pressure/tension against the back of the pad so the pad surface doesn't vibrate against the rotor and the grease is to prevent any noise being created from the metal shim resting against the metal backing of the pad.

The person above complaining about noise from their recently changed pads most likely didn't use either...

**Sammich** · 02-04-2008, 02:07 PM

ok...well shims were used on the front pads...shims werent provided with the rear set of ceramics, but they were bendix ceramics, so i imagine that they should be fine, as they dont do a bulk of the braking work anyway.

**JessAlba452** · 02-04-2008, 02:56 PM

Originally Posted by green91

Ive got the hawk hp+ pads and brembo blanks on all 4 corners, they are noisy as **** and dust alot but they are very heat resistant and don't fade easily. much better than the cobalt friction pads i ran before. if you want a quiet combo get ceramic pads, and MAKE SURE TO RUN BRAKE PAD SHIMS WITH ANTI SQUEAL COMPOUND. shims + anti-squeal are key, even with OEM pads.

The HP+ are more for track use so most have reported that they are noisy. Also AXXIS pads, they are known to be noisy. Hawk HPS is for street, I just had them installed and there is no noise at all from them.

**StraightSix** · 02-04-2008, 03:47 PM

Bendix quite often manufactures their pads with the anti-rattle shims as a part of the pad backing plate.

**Sammich** · 02-05-2008, 08:11 AM

is it like a lil 'nub' that comes from the back of the pad? i believe i have it..i'm good. just waiting to get extra money for my rear calipers and rotors

**speedminded** · 02-05-2008, 08:19 AM

Originally Posted by phatboislim

is it like a lil 'nub' that comes from the back of the pad? i believe i have it..i'm good. just waiting to get extra money for my rear calipers and rotors

nope, it should be made of "spring steel" or similiar. It a tab that applies constant pressure to the back of the pad so it does not rattle.

**Sammich** · 02-05-2008, 08:20 AM

i'd have to see visually what you are talking about...

**speedminded** · 02-05-2008, 08:24 AM

Originally Posted by phatboislim

i'd have to see visually what you are talking about...

It's different for every pad shape/size/model, it's just a thin piece of metal that slides behind the pad....

**speedminded** · 02-05-2008, 08:29 AM

The shim is the thin piece about the thickness of a playing card. If there is any play because the retainer does not hold the pad tight the shim will put space it so there is constant tension on the back of the pad preventing it from moving/rattling...

**Sammich** · 02-05-2008, 08:31 AM

well the front ones i had to attach...it had some adhesive on it that i removed to put the shim on..i duno about the rears..they may have already been on there cuz i didnt have anything else in the box but the pads

**speedminded** · 02-05-2008, 08:35 AM

Originally Posted by phatboislim

well the front ones i had to attach...it had some adhesive on it that i removed to put the shim on..i duno about the rears..they may have already been on there cuz i didnt have anything else in the box but the pads

The metal piece in those pics is the retainer, i assumed thats what you said yours had...the shim is just the thin piece of metal and doesn't always come with new pads, simply reuse the old ones if they are there. It acts as a spacer to increase the thickness of the pad.

**Sammich** · 02-05-2008, 08:38 AM

i trashed the ones from the rear...i used the new ones with the front pads that came with it...no squealing as of yet...

**mushroom_toy** · 02-07-2008, 04:02 PM

You go with ceramic pads? Sorry didnt read whole thread.

**Johnny Chimpo** · 02-07-2008, 11:01 PM

I've had Hawk HPS pads on 3 cars, always loved them.

**Sammich** · 02-08-2008, 07:21 AM

Originally Posted by mushroom_toy

You go with ceramic pads? Sorry didnt read whole thread.

yea i went with ceramics....no complaints at all here..best pads i've felt before..although i always opted the cheap pad route when i replaced them on my truck...no brake dust...more responsive braking...cant wait until i have enough money to replace my rotors and rear calipers and possibly to SS brake lines

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