turbo civic putting in work

[Vteckidd]

what we basically find out is 90% of all the shops have dynojets because they are FAR Cheaper than the dyno like Forged has. Dynojets are $30,000-40,000 for 2-4wd. The Forged Load Bearing dyno is $80,000-100,000 but you can do so much more with the Load bearing. Tuning on a dynojet is an educated guess in reality, where with a load based dyno you can calculate brake specific fuel consumption, injector duty cycle, etc PER RPM which you cant do with a dynojet

[David88vert]

what we basically find out is 90% of all the shops have dynojets because they are FAR Cheaper than the dyno like Forged has. Dynojets are $30,000-40,000 for 2-4wd. The Forged Load Bearing dyno is $80,000-100,000 but you can do so much more with the Load bearing. Tuning on a dynojet is an educated guess in reality, where with a load based dyno you can calculate brake specific fuel consumption, injector duty cycle, etc PER RPM which you cant do with a dynojet

Forged has a Dyno Dynamics model and it is my favorite, as it is the easiest dyno that I have used. It is much more expensive, but worth it in my opinion.
Tuning with either a DynoJet or a Dyno Dynamics is the same - you cannot hold a car in high rpm on the Dyno Dynamics anymore than on a DynoJet. When it comes to tuning at the high end of the scale, you will always be taking reading and extrapolating the data to make your map.
BTW - if you took the class 4 years ago, you probably went to Forged for the class and it was probably taught by Chris Macellaro - who know owns EFI Tuning Technologies.

[Vteckidd]

Forged has a Dyno Dynamics model and it is my favorite, as it is the easiest dyno that I have used. It is much more expensive, but worth it in my opinion.
Tuning with either a DynoJet or a Dyno Dynamics is the same - you cannot hold a car in high rpm on the Dyno Dynamics anymore than on a DynoJet. When it comes to tuning at the high end of the scale, you will always be taking reading and extrapolating the data to make your map.

correct but the way i interpreted it (and i am NOT a tuner) is that on a dyno dynamics or load bearing it is MUCH easier to tune and predict the rest of the map, than it is on a Dynojet. Obviously you cant hold a car at redline and tune it (i mean you can but BOOM). But the dyno jet its much harder to keep things consistent vs the dyno dynamics.

But obviously people like Scotty, Morris , Dan Willie etc can figure out how to tune safely on a dynojet so im sure theres pros and cons

BTW - if you took the class 4 years ago, you probably went to Forged for the class and it was probably taught by Chris Macellaro - who know owns EFI Tuning Technologies.

That was my instructor, and he was a great guy. Very knowledgable

[David88vert]

correct but the way i interpreted it (and i am NOT a tuner) is that on a dyno dynamics or load bearing it is MUCH easier to tune and predict the rest of the map, than it is on a Dynojet. Obviously you cant hold a car at redline and tune it (i mean you can but BOOM). But the dyno jet its much harder to keep things consistent vs the dyno dynamics.

Yes, that is the trick - the Dyno Dynamics makes it much easier to tune the lower rpms - and then with a couple of pulls, you can get a fairly close base map quickly, then all you have to do is look to tweak it a little.
With the DynoJet, my method is to work up in 500 rpm intervals, and build the bottom first. I learned it from Matt, and it keeps the risk of popping a motor down. I also keep a buffer to maximum cylinder pressure, so while it gives up a few hp, it keeps motors a little safer.
Right now, I am paying to have Bob Kurgan retune my car, just to get hold of one of his maps, to compare to my own tunes. He is the top AEM tuner in my opinion, so its always good to look for new methods and practices.

[Moseley]

I remember Ed (Senf) saying he likes dynojets for tuning anything other than WOT. The roller does a good job of simulating loads and decel etc. that the car would see on the street. But I could imagine if you were building a road race engine or drag engine you'd want to maximize torque under WOT in a certain rpm range, and a dynapack is probably best for that?

[112480]

Yes, that is the trick - the Dyno Dynamics makes it much easier to tune the lower rpms - and then with a couple of pulls, you can get a fairly close base map quickly, then all you have to do is look to tweak it a little.
With the DynoJet, my method is to work up in 500 rpm intervals, and build the bottom first. I learned it from Matt, and it keeps the risk of popping a motor down. I also keep a buffer to maximum cylinder pressure, so while it gives up a few hp, it keeps motors a little safer.
Right now, I am paying to have Bob Kurgan retune my car, just to get hold of one of his maps, to compare to my own tunes. He is the top AEM tuner in my opinion, so its always good to look for new methods and practices.

So david88vert i have a question. why is it the dyno dynamics usually reads what 5-7% lower than a dyno jet given at some point the have the same properties for measuring hp and tq???

[Vteckidd]

So david88vert i have a question. why is it the dyno dynamics usually reads what 5-7% lower than a dyno jet given at some point the have the same properties for measuring hp and tq???

actually usually the Dynapacs read HIGHER. Churchs Automotive out in cali routinely puts out retarded high cars. Like a stock K20 RSX type-S making 260whp, i mean go read what they turn out. But dynapacs IMO usually read more between flywheel hp, and whp. Somwhere in the middle.

Case in point Knowledge Performance had a dynapac and someone had a b16 with I/h/e and it put down 172whp. I was like "no way, no B16 has ever made over 160whp with just i/h/e" at mainstream. I invited the guy to come to mainstream, he did, it put down 153whp. Almost a 20whp difference.

As for dyno dynamics, i do not know why they read lower, david has more experience so ill let him chime in before i assume and look like a dumbass lol

[David88vert]

actually usually the Dynapacs read HIGHER.

x2

[David88vert]

So david88vert i have a question. why is it the dyno dynamics usually reads what 5-7% lower than a dyno jet given at some point the have the same properties for measuring hp and tq???

Each dyno manufactuer has different ways of doing calculations - don't get caught up on that though. It doesn't matter if your number is higher or lower on different dynos - what matters is that you get maximum cylinder pressure across the entire rpm spread. A dyno is just a tuning device, and the best dyno is the one that helps you find the VE number that you make.
For that reason, I suggest that you chose one dyno for comparisons, and stick with it. For me, I like to use the DynoJet at Dynolab to make comparisons, as it has been around the longest, and has not changed in all these years. I can tune any car on any dyno, and then if I want to compare to a previous car or setting - I have it already logged at Dynolab as well.
BTW - Even different versions of DynoJets can give different numbers - the dyno operator can easily change the setup factors.

Now, in answer to your original question - here is where you can learn about the differences in the dynos:
http://www.efi101.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=29