Wanted you guys to see this.

[MachNU]

Let's see, he walked into their dojo of his own accord, was calm and collected enough to take time to make his claims, and fought on his own. No one forced him into that situation. Looks like he expected to walk into their dojo, pick a target, show off, and beat up one of the students. I'm not surprised by the outcome at all.
He didn't seem too mentally challenged, just plain ignorant.

It not a criminal act if someone comes inside your place with the purpose of attacking. He just picked the wrong place. As long as you don't stop and restart, it is legally self-defense.

Wrong. What was on that video was in every way criminal. There have been many cases over the years where people went to jail over fights for use of Exsessive Force. Someone who is a trained Marine AND a black belt in Karate, is a highly trained weapon. That video shows someone who was either handicap, or under the influence. THey should have never had him in a fight in the first place. Even more so when right before he put him on the ground the guy yeilded to him, and admitted defeat. Past there it was pure murder, IF the guy did live!

[David88vert]

Wrong. What was on that video was in every way criminal. There have been many cases over the years where people went to jail over fights for use of Exsessive Force. Someone who is a trained Marine AND a black belt in Karate, is a highly trained weapon. That video shows someone who was either handicap, or under the influence. THey should have never had him in a fight in the first place. Even more so when right before he put him on the ground the guy yeilded to him, and admitted defeat. Past there it was pure murder, IF the guy did live!

Incorrect. KFG entered their place of business - legally, they are in the defensive position. Secondly, BJB specifically asked him if he was a master and what degree belt he had. This was calculated to make certain that he was legally covered by 1984 VA law regarding excessive force. Basically, BJB had KFG establish that he was trained. WD then was only exercising self defense at that point legally.
In this case, a jury would have a hard time pinpointing a spot where WD stopped prior to being pushed back by his fellow students. Just because the other person stops fighting back does not mean that your right to self defense has been terminated. If a person uses a weapon at you, and then lowers it and says I don't want to fight anymore, you have no legal obligation to stop.

The simple facts are this:
If KFG lived, then the statue of limitations are already up, and this video cannot be used to prosecute the individuals involved.
If KFG died as a result of the injuries in this video, the prosecution will have to:
1) Identify the real identify of KFG.
2) Discover the actual body of KFG.
3) Identify the actual time and cause of death through forensic analysis.
4) Discover if KFG had any prior martial arts training and mental health history.
5) Establish that BJB and the others in the dojo had training in recognizing mental health issues.
6) Etc. (too many more things to write)

Get the point? Whether or not they should have done it is a moot point. The fact is that it is likely that they will get away with it. People can be upset, but this country has laws that we are governed by. Unfortunatley, someone MAY have died, but he walked into that dojo with the intention of showing off, and then did not walk away when the situation started to escalate.

[MachNU]

Incorrect. KFG entered their place of business - legally, they are in the defensive position. Secondly, BJB specifically asked him if he was a master and what degree belt he had. This was calculated to make certain that he was legally covered by 1984 VA law regarding excessive force. Basically, BJB had KFG establish that he was trained. WD then was only exercising self defense at that point legally.
In this case, a jury would have a hard time pinpointing a spot where WD stopped prior to being pushed back by his fellow students. Just because the other person stops fighting back does not mean that your right to self defense has been terminated. If a person uses a weapon at you, and then lowers it and says I don't want to fight anymore, you have no legal obligation to stop.

The simple facts are this:
If KFG lived, then the statue of limitations are already up, and this video cannot be used to prosecute the individuals involved.
If KFG died as a result of the injuries in this video, the prosecution will have to:
1) Identify the real identify of KFG.
2) Discover the actual body of KFG.
3) Identify the actual time and cause of death through forensic analysis.
4) Discover if KFG had any prior martial arts training and mental health history.
5) Establish that BJB and the others in the dojo had training in recognizing mental health issues.
6) Etc. (too many more things to write)

Get the point? Whether or not they should have done it is a moot point. The fact is that it is likely that they will get away with it. People can be upset, but this country has laws that we are governed by. Unfortunatley, someone MAY have died, but he walked into that dojo with the intention of showing off, and then did not walk away when the situation started to escalate.

Again very very wrong. This guy had ZERO argument to self-defense...and why is that you ask? Because his life was not in any immediate danger! That black belt was not in fear for his life. Watching that video, shows from the whole time that he had the upper hand. He also had 10 people there on his side! Therefore that fight consisted of 11v1. So grounds for self defense is already out the window. The one guy was obviously crazy or under the influence. So the black belt had the upper hand from the beginning. Was a trained Marine and Karate Expert. Also the video shows the guy saying and motioning to stop. You can clearly hear him saying "Stop, you are good!" Past there it was Aggravated Assault, with possible Malice and Intent to Kill. If the guy killed him when he stomped on his head thats purely Manslaughter in the Second Degree.

[HypnoToad]

Again very very wrong. This guy had ZERO argument to self-defense...and why is that you ask? Because his life was not in any immediate danger! That black belt was not in fear for his life. Watching that video, shows from the whole time that he had the upper hand. He also had 10 people there on his side! Therefore that fight consisted of 11v1. So grounds for self defense is already out the window. The one guy was obviously crazy or under the influence. So the black belt had the upper hand from the beginning. Was a trained Marine and Karate Expert. Also the video shows the guy saying and motioning to stop. You can clearly hear him saying "Stop, you are good!" Past there it was Aggravated Assault, with possible Malice and Intent to Kill. If the guy killed him when he stomped on his head thats purely Manslaughter in the Second Degree.

yea,i think if these people were trained and so forth,they should have no problem stopping the man with a hold or something and calling the cops.

not curb stomping the guy.

[David88vert]

Again very very wrong. This guy had ZERO argument to self-defense...and why is that you ask? Because his life was not in any immediate danger! That black belt was not in fear for his life. Watching that video, shows from the whole time that he had the upper hand. He also had 10 people there on his side! Therefore that fight consisted of 11v1. So grounds for self defense is already out the window. The one guy was obviously crazy or under the influence. So the black belt had the upper hand from the beginning. Was a trained Marine and Karate Expert. Also the video shows the guy saying and motioning to stop. You can clearly hear him saying "Stop, you are good!" Past there it was Aggravated Assault, with possible Malice and Intent to Kill. If the guy killed him when he stomped on his head thats purely Manslaughter in the Second Degree.

You do not seem to understand the legal system. They would have to follow the laws of VA from 1984 back then to charge him, and WD and BJB would have not been convicted under the law. Doesn't make it right, just technically legal.

[MachNU]

You do not seem to understand the legal system. They would have to follow the laws of VA from 1984 back then to charge him, and WD and BJB would have not been convicted under the law. Doesn't make it right, just technically legal.

I take it your referring to by VA from 1984 to actual 1983 Civil Rights: Excessive Force & Quailified Immunity? If so that only pretains to Police Officers and the use of excessive force when arresting, subdoeing, and protecting ones self in the face of life threatening danger. No matter which way you argue it, each person in that video would be able to be prosecuted!

[David88vert]

I take it your referring to by VA from 1984 to actual 1983 Civil Rights: Excessive Force & Quailified Immunity? If so that only pretains to Police Officers and the use of excessive force when arresting, subdoeing, and protecting ones self in the face of life threatening danger. No matter which way you argue it, each person in that video would be able to be prosecuted!

No, not referring to EFQI - just VA state code.

For a prosecution of murder to take place, they will have to know who KFG's real identity is/was, then show PROOF he actually died from that particular head trauma. Without that, they could only try to charge them with felony assault.

BTW - I have found that Virginia's state laws WILL let them choose to charge them, as long as they can get enough evidence to prove the incident happened in VA. VA's current statue of limitations is retroactive. NVCV has all of that data listed.


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Here is a video of BJB that you will like.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nRVBi4w-8kY
Who in their right mind would have ever gone to this place to train?

[MachNU]

No, not referring to EFQI - just VA state code.

For a prosecution of murder to take place, they will have to know who KFG's real identity is/was, then show PROOF he actually died from that particular head trauma. Without that, they could only try to charge them with felony assault.

BTW - I have found that Virginia's state laws WILL let them choose to charge them, as long as they can get enough evidence to prove the incident happened in VA. VA's current statue of limitations is retroactive. NVCV has all of that data listed.


-----------------------------------------------------------

Here is a video of BJB that you will like.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nRVBi4w-8kY
Who in their right mind would have ever gone to this place to train?

Which is funny because the 1983 Civil Rights act I listed came out of Virginia! Thats why I was saying these guys would go to jail for Assault with Malice Intent to Kill, if he did not die, or Manslaughter in the Second Degree if he did die!

[Turbodude06]

Wrong. What was on that video was in every way criminal. There have been many cases over the years where people went to jail over fights for use of Exsessive Force. Someone who is a trained Marine AND a black belt in Karate, is a highly trained weapon. That video shows someone who was either handicap, or under the influence. THey should have never had him in a fight in the first place. Even more so when right before he put him on the ground the guy yeilded to him, and admitted defeat. Past there it was pure murder, IF the guy did live!

^ yea that guys not a fighter, he's a murderer.... I could have went without seeing that, makes me pissed off.....