BALANCE DUE 30th September **CoolingMist Water/Methanol/Alcohol Injection**

[GGPIS3]

All kits will include the following:


CoolingMist 150psi Black Pump
Custom designed and manufactured by ShurFlo for Coolingmist to be used in injection systems. The common agricultural shurflo pumps you see are NOT safe for methanol, these are. If you've already got a meth system but you're using one of the Agricultural pumps for it, you may be in for some trouble. Hopefully you're not going down the track when this happens. Maybe I'll make an upgraded pump an option for you guys who already have systems.


Quick disconnect fittings with quick sealant
No hassle, no barbs, no compression fittings, no leaks. Just push it in and you're done. Sealant is already brushed onto the thread... no need to fuxx with wrapping teflon tape, etc. Screw it in, push in the hose, and you're done. Hell, Supa could do it.


2 Quart Tank
Safe for water/methanol. Small form factor allows for easy mounting and installation. Size upgrades will be available if you think you need more.


CoolingMist 22psi Check Valve
Custom manufactured for CoolingMist, these check valves require 22psi to open, ensuring that the vacuum from your motor will not suck water in from the tank (a problem when you're running larger nozzles). Also eliminates siphon effect, and keeps you from blowing the water back up your meth line when you're running high boost with the injection turned off.


CoolingMist Custom Outside Thread Injector
Not your typical injection nozzle. These are custom machined for Coolingmist to be installed from the outside of your boost pipe. Drill a hole, tap with 1/8NPT, and screw the injector in. Easy. 1 included with kit, sized to your needs.

Injector Nozzle Sized to your HP needs
Have 350 whp? Have 600 whp? You'll get a nozzle that flows the right amount for your vehicle. Anywhere from 1 gallon per hour all the way up to 18 GPH

All Brass Fittings
No cheap plastic or nylon. All brass, won't crack or fade with engine bay heat.

Everything you need for installation.
Fuse, fuse holder, relay, 10 ft of wire, 15 ft of heat resistant tubing, all fittings. The only thing you'll need is a vacuum Tee to connect to your vacuum source, since I don't know what ID your vacuum tube is. And maybe a screw or two to install the tank.


Without further Adieu, here are the 2 kits. The main difference is how they are triggered and how tunable they are:



CoolingMist Stage 1 Water/Methanol Injection kit
Retail: $299.95
Group buy as low as $255

Quick and painless intro level kit for water/meth injection. Controlled by a Hobbes Style adjustable boost switch. Tee this into your vacuum line, wire it up, and adjust it. Controls when your injection comes on, anywhere between 1 and 25 psi of boost..

This kit is on/off only... if you're above the boost you set, it's spraying full bore, if you're below, it's off. Best when using with water only... as it's not very tunable... but if you need tunable...


CoolingMist Stage 2 Water/Methanol Injection Kit with Vari-Cool Controller
Retail $499.95
Group buy as low as $425

Instead of on/off boost switch, you get the CoolingMist VariCool controller. Digital programmable controller, allows you to adjust your water spray based on Boost, MAF, AIT, EGT, or any 0-5v signal (AIT/EGT may require additional sensors, not included). The Vari-Cool has a built-in pressure sensor, good for boost pressures up to 60 psi... again, just tee into your vacuum source and away you go.

The Vari-Cool adjusts your water spray by directly controlling the duty cycle of the pump. Less duty cycle = less pressure = less flow. More duty cycle, you get the picture.

You don't need special software or a computer to tune it, just turn the 3 knobs on the front of the unit to control min/max and flow %.






Hrmm... there is also a stage 3, which comes with the Vari-Cool Commander software preinstalled on a PocketPC... the Commander software can display your control parameters, boost pressure, duty cycle, AIT, EGT. Datalogging, fine tuning, lockout features... blah too much to type. Also makes Julian Fries! Includes dash mount kit to run the Commander anytime in the car. This kit starts @ $850 though... if anyone is seriously interested in it, look me up.




Here's how I'll do the pricing:
0-4 ppl = No group buy
5 ppl = 5% discount off retail
Then for every person after that, I'll add another 1% to the discount, up to 15%

That way, we don't have to worry about getting one more person to get the next tier... if we get 9 instead of 10... it'll still be a 9% discount.



lets get the ball rolling.... we could ALL benefit from water injection.

[GGPIS3]

can i get a sticky mike?

[Nemesis]

damn Dan 850 I could get a turbo upgrade and STI injectors lol

[GGPIS3]

its a good bang for the buck. but i hear you.. its not for everyone.

[DasGalloway]

damn Dan 850 I could get a turbo upgrade and STI injectors lol

You're looking at the full on Stage3 Commander kit, which includes a PocketPC setup with Coolingmist software preconfigured to fine tune the included Vari-cool controller. If you're looking at water/meth injection, that's the Cadillac on 26's with 80 screens in it.

The stg1 kit will be less than $300 group buy price, and stg2 with controller will be under $500.

[Maniaç]

Well I should be looking into that in a couple of months.

*EviL Grin*

[St0lenR]

Hahahaha....u dumbass you should of posted this Monday...I go pick my up tomorrow

[Vteckidd]

up an stickied

[Tank]

ok got some questions

1. can aem ems control this "because if so that would eliminate the palm pilot"

2. can the palm pilot be setup to display aem ems tuning features or do youknow of such a device or program

3.whats julian fries

lastly when does this group buy end cause im definitly all about meth

[TIGERJC]

I dont know too much about water/methane injection, but can u just run water injection with this kit?? I think so and I just want to make sure. I still need to do a whole lot more research on this. does the kit come with a light or a gauge telling you when the injection is running? are there any safety measures on this kit???

[Tank]

I dont know too much about water/methane injection, but can u just run water injection with this kit?? I think so and I just want to make sure. I still need to do a whole lot more research on this. does the kit come with a light or a gauge telling you when the injection is running? are there any safety measures on this kit???

read teh stage 3 JC

[TIGERJC]

Thinking of getting this - http://water.lovehorsepower.com/Main.html. what is difference between this kit and yours?? I still need to do a lot more research, so that I really know everything about water/meth injection.
I heard meth is bad for gaskets and the engine

[drmcivicsi]

umm if u ARE NOT going to run nitrous yes u can. just hook it up to the AEM nitrous tables just fine but if u are going to have nitrous then NO u cant.

ok got some questions

1. can aem ems control this "because if so that would eliminate the palm pilot"

2. can the palm pilot be setup to display aem ems tuning features or do youknow of such a device or program

3.whats julian fries

lastly when does this group buy end cause im definitly all about meth

[Tank]

hmmm that complicates things then, i wanted to run both i guess ill call D and see what he says

[Reaper]

depending on how long this "group buy" is lasting...Im in..But if its too soon oh well. Cuz im getting it regaurdless

[iloveboost]

I know with the Snow Performance kits they have a safety kill where if the pump stops pumping or a bubble gets caught in the line, it will turn off the boost controller and run off wastegate pressure. I believe this feature might also be through a standalone engine management system like AEM, Hydra, etc.

I wouldn't run methanol without a safety switch/kill/bright LED due to the simple fact that if the pump does stop working, or a bubble is caught in the line, or you're not getting the full pressure necessary... your engine is as good as gone.

Methanol also tends to eventually corrode Iron over a long period of time with heavy useage which someone with an Iron Ductile sleeve may want to take into consideration when using methanol.

Don't get me wrong, there's tons of cheap power to be made using methanol and water injection... just make sure you do your research before throwing something on your car. At the very least, rewire the kit with a bright LED to go off if the pump fails or there's a hiccup with the unit.

[Vteckidd]

^^^ exactly, i read up on the snow performance kit, VERY nice

[Reaper]

Thanx for the info man, its definitly been noted!

[DasGalloway]

ok got some questions

1. can aem ems control this "because if so that would eliminate the palm pilot"

2. can the palm pilot be setup to display aem ems tuning features or do youknow of such a device or program

3.whats julian fries

lastly when does this group buy end cause im definitly all about meth

Ok, GGP needs to edit the post, because the palm pilot kit is the stage 3... the stage 2 and stage 1's are also in the GB.

An EMS such as an AEM can control a simple on/off kit (the stage 1), but to my knowledge it doesn't have the capability to drive a the pump via duty cycle. You could, however, use the AEM and a relay to give power to the vari-cool, and let it do it's varying from there.

I've looked into running the pump dutycycle with the AEM wastegate map or something, but the channel drivers in the AEM won't support 10 amps, which is what the pump draws... and since it's a duty cycle you can't use a relay to pass the signal on.

Julian fries, joke from an old movie.

[DasGalloway]

I dont know too much about water/methane injection, but can u just run water injection with this kit?? I think so and I just want to make sure. I still need to do a whole lot more research on this. does the kit come with a light or a gauge telling you when the injection is running? are there any safety measures on this kit???

Yes, you can run any of the following with these kits:


water (recommend distilled from the grocery store, has all the impurities and minerals removed)

denatured alcohol (pick it up @ home depot for 15/5 gallons), mix with water

Isopropal alcohol (yes, rubbing alcohol, convenient because it's cheap, already a 30/70 water/alch mix, and you can buy it just about anywhere

Methanol (buy it from your local speed shop for a few bucks a gallon)



Anything you run, it's "officially" recommended that you keep it at least 50% water (70% in isopropal's case)... that way it stays non-flamable.

If you're running 100% meth and you pop a hose in the engine bay, you'll have a nice little fire on hand. The CM kits can be upgraded to full Stainless steel braided hose if you really want to go the extra mile.

[DasGalloway]

Thinking of getting this - http://water.lovehorsepower.com/Main.html. what is difference between this kit and yours?? I still need to do a lot more research, so that I really know everything about water/meth injection.
I heard meth is bad for gaskets and the engine

Wow, that right there is a home depot special. Every single thing I see there, save the solenoids, can be picked up @ Home depot or Northern Tool... yet's its more expensive than the CM product, which contains parts custom designed and manufactured specifically for water/meth/alch injection.

See the big red sticker on the pump? WARNING: DO NOT PUMP FLAMMABLE LIQUIDS. lol Thats also a straight agriculture pump, not recommended for methanol... it's meant to spray herbicides on sunflowers and pump water to the pig trough.

The accumulator isn't neccessary, it's only there because they didn't properly size nozzles and calculate flow. With the stg 2 controller or a properly sized stg 1 NZ setup, it's absolutely unneccesary. Accumulators were used before people figured out better ways to smooth their water/meth flow.

If they got that hose from Home depot (like all those compression fittings) it won't last long... icemaker hose isnot rated for the heat of an engine bay, andit will become brittle and crack after a few heat cycles.

The compression fittings are a pain, thats exactly what I did before I upgraded to the CM setup, with real quick disconnect fittings.

If you need dual nozzle (NZ) (most people don't, unless they have a v8 or dual throttle bodies) that can be arranged.

If you think you need a dual stage (2 NZ's that come on at different times, as pictured in the link) what you really need is a controller. The volumetric efficiency of your motor does not work in cliffs and plateaus... it's a generally smooth line, which you can't recreate with 2 stages. The digital controller is the way to go in that case.

The wiring is also more complex... need two boost switches that both cut the pump on and open the appropriate solenoid.

Tuning will also be more complex, a lot of guess test and revise to install the right size NZ, and play with the boost switches til you find the right psi to turn them on. The CM digital controller comes pre-calibrated, you select 10 on the dial, and that's 10psi.


Finally, the single NZ setup you linked to is almost $150 more expensive that the comparable CM stg1... and the stg2 is almost the same price as the CM stg II... but the CM kit includes the digital controller.

Hope this helps.

[Tank]

good as info got me thinking now man thanks

[DasGalloway]

The Snow performance Safe Injection system works just fine with the CM kits... people do it all the time. You get the benefits of the more capable CM controller and components, along with the peace of mind of the Safe Injection.

CM does directly offer a Status Monitor/clogged nozzle detector... which will alert you if your NZ is clogged, and shows when the system is spraying or not spraying. Its usually a $50 add on, I'll have to see what we could GB it for. It includes an LED to show you the system status.

Float switches + LED are also an option to alert you when your tank is running low.


For people running straight water... the safety systems are less critical, since you usually don't tune to the edge if you're just pumping water. If you're running meth and using it to bump up the boost or adv the timing, it's recommended you build in some safegaurds.

I know with the Snow Performance kits they have a safety kill where if the pump stops pumping or a bubble gets caught in the line, it will turn off the boost controller and run off wastegate pressure. I believe this feature might also be through a standalone engine management system like AEM, Hydra, etc.

I wouldn't run methanol without a safety switch/kill/bright LED due to the simple fact that if the pump does stop working, or a bubble is caught in the line, or you're not getting the full pressure necessary... your engine is as good as gone.

Methanol also tends to eventually corrode Iron over a long period of time with heavy useage which someone with an Iron Ductile sleeve may want to take into consideration when using methanol.

Don't get me wrong, there's tons of cheap power to be made using methanol and water injection... just make sure you do your research before throwing something on your car. At the very least, rewire the kit with a bright LED to go off if the pump fails or there's a hiccup with the unit.

[DasGalloway]

depending on how long this "group buy" is lasting...Im in..But if its too soon oh well. Cuz im getting it regaurdless

GB will probably last through the month of Sept, so start saving your change and selling the junk sitting in your garage. =D



You have an IS... that I haven't tuned? I thought my laptop and I have been in every boosted IS within 100 miles of the ATL

[Reaper]

well funds are tight and ive spoken alot to dan. BUT i have a chance to pick up a PLP powerdyne S/C and everything it needs for 2800. And also a clutch/fly. No2 set up for 1k(i think). How do u like ur s/c? what kinda power u puttin down? I have toyomoto headers/testpipe(no cat) hks hiper exhaust..the guy laid down 292/272 with just exhaust and hp header.. so I figure id be atleast in the low 300's.. Btw, would it be safe to run a 50shot of spray with a water/meth. injection? Thanx man

[DasGalloway]

well funds are tight and ive spoken alot to dan. BUT i have a chance to pick up a PLP powerdyne S/C and everything it needs for 2800. And also a clutch/fly. No2 set up for 1k(i think). How do u like ur s/c? what kinda power u puttin down? I have toyomoto headers/testpipe(no cat) hks hiper exhaust..the guy laid down 292/272 with just exhaust and hp header.. so I figure id be atleast in the low 300's.. Btw, would it be safe to run a 50shot of spray with a water/meth. injection? Thanx man

Shit, if you're getting a powerdyne, better get 2. It won't be blowing for long. Youc an pick them up on the cheap for a reason.

You can simulatenously run juice with WMI... between air/fuel/meth/water/n20 just realize you're mixing a serious cocktail. If you don't get the mix right, it might not taste too good. Definitely recommend the digital controller for more complex applications (meth as a fuel source/octane enhancer, parallel with N2O, etc)

I dynoed 400 to the wheels a while back boost only, probably less than that now. No time to work on my own car anymore.

[Reaper]

how the hell are you runnin 18psi on a s/c? what kind of s/c is it?

[David88vert]

The Mustang and Rotary guys have been running methanol injection for years on S/C and turbo setups - and none of the kits cost a lot. Snow is an excellent system. I have Anderson's Mr. Freeze kit on my 5.0. If you look on Ebay, you can find Mr. Freeze kits around $100 at times. Mine was less than that. If you want really cheap injection, you can go to Ace hardware for windshield washer fluid. The stuff they sell at auto parts stores is different here in the south, so it doesn't have the same methanol content. Ace only sells 1 type across the nation.
The AEM can control the injection, but with the Mr. Freeze kit, it only pumps the amount your jet is set for, and only under boost, so it's not necessary. There are no pumps to have break on you, so your engine is safer. You use the output from the AEM to control your nitrous. This way you can have the best of all worlds.

[DasGalloway]

how the hell are you runnin 18psi on a s/c? what kind of s/c is it?

The only one of it's kind on an IS. It's a big ass Rotrex blower, the C38.

It'll pop 21 psi if I push the revs... and I have a 5mm smaller pulley sitting in the garage waiting for it's turn.

Of course, I'll have to run the meth in high RPMs if I install the smaller pulley... it will push almost 25 psi according to the calculations. I can get away with it since it's an s/c... not a turbo. 20+ psi on pump gas with a turbo is a big no no.

[Reaper]

man u suck! haha! so whats wrong with teh powerdyne s/c? In my case what would u suggest? The turbo set up is lookin to get REAL expensive considering its not gonna be near as reliable and ill have to do a whole new tranny swap..etc. Thanx man

[DasGalloway]

The Mustang and Rotary guys have been running methanol injection for years on S/C and turbo setups - and none of the kits cost a lot. Snow is an excellent system. I have Anderson's Mr. Freeze kit on my 5.0. If you look on Ebay, you can find Mr. Freeze kits around $100 at times. Mine was less than that. If you want really cheap injection, you can go to Ace hardware for windshield washer fluid. The stuff they sell at auto parts stores is different here in the south, so it doesn't have the same methanol content. Ace only sells 1 type across the nation.
The AEM can control the injection, but with the Mr. Freeze kit, it only pumps the amount your jet is set for, and only under boost, so it's not necessary. There are no pumps to have break on you, so your engine is safer. You use the output from the AEM to control your nitrous. This way you can have the best of all worlds.

That's interesting... I wonder what kind of atomization they get with 10-25 psi behind the water. I imagine it's limited to rather low flow rate... it's very hard to flow 10-18 GPH @ good atomization with only 10-20 psi of pressure.

A novel idea though, and definitely very cheap if you're really strapped for cash and don't need the additional functionality of safety features.

[DasGalloway]

Figured I would throw this into another post, since it's kinda bured in the first one.

With the CM controller.. you can actually use more than one input to trigger the water meth. You can do Intake air temps, EGT, TPS, a MAF signal, or any other 0-5v signal you have.

You can multiplex any of those with the boost signal, one as the rate and one as the trigger.

For example, you could say "Spray water based on my IAT's, but only when boost is above 5psi".

Or "spray water based on boost, but only if my EGT's are above 1000"

If you're NA, you can get an NA controller, and say "Spray based on vacuum, but only when TPS is over 40%"

Etc etc.

You can also change the "ramp up rate" of the spray... the default is a straight line between your start and max boost... but you can change it to be an exponential or logarithmic curve (non-math types, more or less aggressive... more water sooner, or more water, later )

[GGPIS3]

john... thanks for coming in and answering all these questions... it would've taken me a week just to correspond everything to you and then back to them...




if you would like to join the group buy, fill your name in and list what stage you want w/ whatever accessories you want as well....


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[DasGalloway]

w/ whatever accessories you want as well....

Kits:
Stg1 boost switch
Stg2 VariCool Controller

Tanks:
2qt
1 gal
1.5 gal Trunk Mount tank
2.5 gal

Accessories:
Status Monitor/Clog detector
Tank Float Switch
Master arm switch

[iloveboost]

I'm really interested, but I'm working on building my drivetrain.

DasGalloway, I ended up going with the T3 GT35R as opposed to the ball bearing PT61 you suggested. Makes enough power to make me feel important, heh. This is Mark's friend (met you at Ted's in Buckhead with your mom and wife).

Good luck on the group buy.

Edit: And to stay on topic... if the kit is compatible with the safety features Snow Performance offers, then it's definitely a great buy and an awesome price.

While Methanol is about $3.50 a gallon, you probably will only use 1-2 gallons every 2-3 weeks. It doesn't burn as fast as gas unless you're always beating on the car. Make sure you check your meth tank regularly!

It yeilds the same result as running race gas all the time but keeps your intake temps waaaaaaaaaaay down. You even see condensation on your charge pipes after using it, heh.

From my experience with meth kits, it generally yeilds about a 15-20% power increase after installing and tuning.

IE. You're making 400whp, you'll be anywhere in the 480-500whp range after tuning assuming all supporting mods (turbo, motor) can support the power.

[AnclyT]

i might be interested in a kit like this

[ct9a gsr]

I would upgrade to steel-braided lines with any methanol kit for safety reasons... especially if you run pure meth.

Does anyone have a conversion table of M-sized nozzles to GPH?

Do you CoolingMist folks have a warranty? If so... how long and what all does it cover?

Interesting stuff.

[DasGalloway]

I would upgrade to steel-braided lines with any methanol kit for safety reasons... especially if you run pure meth.

Does anyone have a conversion table of M-sized nozzles to GPH?

Do you CoolingMist folks have a warranty? If so... how long and what all does it cover?

Interesting stuff.

SS lines and fittings aren't a bad idea, esp with 100% meth. 50/50 mix of water/meth, however, is non-flammable, so it's not as important in that situation.

M sized nozzles are cake:

M1 = 1 GPH @ 100 psi
M5 = 5 GPH @ 100 psi

Here's a full table:

M0.5 =.50 @ 100 = .75 @ 150
M1 = 1.0 @ 100 = 1.3 @ 150
M2 = 2.3 @ 100 = 2.8 @ 150
M3 = 3.0 @ 100 = 3.9 @ 150
M5 = 4.9 @ 100 = 6.0 @ 150
M10 = 10 @ 100 = 12 @ 150
M14 = 14 @ 100 = 16.5 @ 150
M15 = 15 @ 100= 18 @ 150

And of course, pressure is related to flow through the nozzle, so as you change pressure, you change flow rate. This is the basic principle behind the vari-cool controller... by altering pump duty cycle, it creates varying line pressures, which allows you to control the flow into your motor for a given size NZ.


Warranty, Yes, 90 days. http://www.coolingmist.com/info.aspx?key=warranty

[ct9a gsr]

Didn't know converting M-sized nozzles was so easy, hehe...

Just curious, why only a 90 day warranty? I'm sure your products are awesome... but I've had 5 methanol kits fail on me sometime in the past couple of years... all covered under warranty though. Meth eats through seals used on pumps eventually causing leaks and failurs sometimes....

[DasGalloway]

Didn't know converting M-sized nozzles was so easy, hehe...

Just curious, why only a 90 day warranty? I'm sure your products are awesome... but I've had 5 methanol kits fail on me sometime in the past couple of years... all covered under warranty though. Meth eats through seals used on pumps eventually causing leaks and failurs sometimes....

That's why we had our pumps custom engineered and manufactured by ShurFlo... as I posted above, the agricultural pumps that a lot of "meth" kits use aren't safe for methanol. We've shipped thousands of pumps/kits and the ones that come back are generally due to install error (most commonly people thinking they need to tighten the fittings in the pump like crank bolts and cracking the pump housing. )

What failed on your previous methanol kits?