Could Jesus have been an alien?

[d993s]

Lolol. I left the thread because there will never be scientific, actual, materialistic evidence of the existence of God. Later, QD.

I came back to the thread cause it's still funny.
Of course there is no scientific, actual, or materialistic evidence.
It's impossible to extract all that from BELIEF OR FAITH, NO MATTER HOW STRONGLY YOU BELIEVE OR HOW MUCH FAITH YOU HAVE!
THE END!

Anything after this will be in PS: format.

[Maniacc]

I am not even going to bother with that huge wall of text.

Geo can you cut down all the evidence that proves God really existed and post it in a quote format.

[geoff]

for someone that wanted scientific evidence and wanted us to provide you with everything we had your gonna sit there and not even take the time to read it? that shows me you have no genuine desire to know the truth or to hear evidence of it. you just believe whatever you WANT not what is proven so in that case it really doesnt matter how much proof we provide. it will never be enough for you cuz you truly dont desire or care to know

[Maniacc]

for someone that wanted scientific evidence and wanted us to provide you with everything we had your gonna sit there and not even take the time to read it? that shows me you have no genuine desire to know the truth or to hear evidence of it. you just believe whatever you WANT not what is proven so in that case it really doesnt matter how much proof we provide. it will never be enough for you cuz you truly dont desire or care to know

I do care.

I just have to be at work at 3pm and don't have time. Just do it, Geo. In the name of God.

[TheProfiteer]

for someone that wanted scientific evidence and wanted us to provide you with everything we had your gonna sit there and not even take the time to read it? that shows me you have no genuine desire to know the truth or to hear evidence of it. you just believe whatever you WANT not what is proven so in that case it really doesnt matter how much proof we provide. it will never be enough for you cuz you truly dont desire or care to know

I havent seen a single piece of "proof" all ive heard is you blabbering like an idiot.


lol see sig for "proof"

[geoff]

for the two above me. obviously you two have not learned to read. there is the proof. put your eyes to the posts and try to use your brain to comprehend it. i promise its not that difficult. and im sorry profiteer but that is how you spell conscience. and maniac to quote all the evidence would be to just repost what i had said, sport had said, and the other guy. take the time to read it after work if you trully do care. its really good stuff. and +1 to you for actually having interest instead of just writing it off cuz you just dont care

[quickdodge®]

and +1 to you for actually having interest instead of just writing it off cuz you just dont care

Yeah because I'm just writing it off. Later, QD.

[d993s]

for the two above me. obviously you two have not learned to read. there is the proof. put your eyes to the posts and try to use your brain to comprehend it. i promise its not that difficult. and im sorry profiteer but that is how you spell conscience. and maniac to quote all the evidence would be to just repost what i had said, sport had said, and the other guy. take the time to read it after work if you trully do care. its really good stuff. and +1 to you for actually having interest instead of just writing it off cuz you just dont care

Yes, you're absolutely right. Somebody WROTE that.
That's the proof, isn't it?...that somebody wrote it.
Well fuck, in that case I'm not doubting it one bit!

[geoff]

i know its long to read maniac but if your trully seeking all the evidence in both sides of the arguement to be able to come to your own logical conclusion then please do read from pages 12-14 of this thread. God bless

[geoff]

QD i respect you man, mostly cuz your car is nasty, but if you trully want to seek knowlegde you have to take ALL of it into consideration. what part do you want me to explain exactly as it is all there in these posts?

[quickdodge®]

QD i respect you man, mostly cuz your car is nasty, but if you trully want to seek knowlegde you have to take ALL of it into consideration. what part do you want me to explain exactly as it is all there in these posts?

I'll be honest dude. You don't have to explain anything to me. I will guarantee that it won't change my mind. Like I said, I believe God may be out there. We came from somewhere. But I'm just the type that likes to have claims backed up with real evidence. All I see are interpretation of what people get from stuff written hundreds of years ago. To me it's just like sitting in English Lit. class and having my assignment be to write down my interpretation of a Shakespeare play. I believe some of your beliefs about things are way off base, but it's all good. Later, QD.

[geoff]

well i respect you for that man. we are each entitled to believe what we want with the evidence provided. i have alot of claims to back me up. studies from all kinds of scientists, natural laws, ect...if your looking to use your 5 senses to believe in God then your in for dissapointment. you cant touch, feel, taste, smell, or hear the laws of causation or thermodynamcs yet you know that they are real cuz of the natural world around you.

and just curious QD, you dont have to go into detail if you dont want, but you said that you believe some of my beliefs are way off base...what would those be?

[quickdodge®]

well i respect you for that man. we are each entitled to believe what we want with the evidence provided. i have alot of claims to back me up. studies from all kinds of scientists, natural laws, ect...if your looking to use your 5 senses to believe in God then your in for dissapointment. you cant touch, feel, taste, smell, or hear the laws of causation or thermodynamcs yet you know that they are real cuz of the natural world around you.

All the scientific studies conducted show there is something around us alright. But it doesn't point to anything in particular.

and just curious QD, you dont have to go into detail if you dont want, but you said that you believe some of my beliefs are way off base...what would those be?

One of them being the other discussion...about animals. Later, QD.

[geoff]

d993s...if you look at all scientific evidence the way your interpreting it then that means we cant trully believe in anything. How do you know that gravity is real if you cant feel it or touch it or hear or smell or taste it? because in some point in time a man did a study and WROTE down his findings to explain it and you believe that man yes? i have said it once and i will say it again, for you there is no such thing as enough evidence. when you die, as we all do, and stand before your maker then you will believe.

[d993s]

d993s...if you look at all scientific evidence the way your interpreting it then that means we cant trully believe in anything. How do you know that gravity is real if you cant feel it or touch it or hear or smell or taste it? because in some point in time a man did a study and WROTE down his findings to explain it and you believe that man yes? i have said it once and i will say it again, for you there is no such thing as enough evidence. when you die, as we all do, and stand before your maker then you will believe.

Simple: THERE IS UNDENIABLE EVIDENCE TO BACK IT UP

My makers were my mother and father. Again, EVIDENCE.

[TheProfiteer]

d993s...if you look at all scientific evidence the way your interpreting it then that means we cant trully believe in anything. How do you know that gravity is real if you cant feel it or touch it or hear or smell or taste it? because in some point in time a man did a study and WROTE down his findings to explain it and you believe that man yes? i have said it once and i will say it again, for you there is no such thing as enough evidence. when you die, as we all do, and stand before your maker then you will believe.

the 5 sense are what culminate to what we call perception. In order for humanity to even come up with laws of thermodynamics and causation the effects of such laws need to be perceived. So your argument right there is thrown out the window.

God, Heaven, Hell, The Holy Spirit, cannot be perceived at all, not even indirectly, so the only proof that god exists, exists in faith.

Tell me thats not true, that faith is really the only driving force behind all theological movements.

[sport_122]

the 5 sense are what culminate to what we call perception. In order for humanity to even come up with laws of thermodynamics and causation the effects of such laws need to be perceived. So your argument right there is thrown out the window.

God, Heaven, Hell, The Holy Spirit, cannot be perceived at all, not even indirectly, so the only proof that god exists, exists in faith.

Tell me thats not true, that faith is really the only driving force behind all theological movements.

That is NOT true.

You are trying to walk the middle while playing for one side. But you still are ignoring that there is reason for faith. Based on your logic, faith is the driving force behind ALL things as all things in and of themselves require us to have faith in. But if people of faith are able to see reason and logic as demonstrated in their very universe then we can draw a reasonable conclusion that the universe itself is giving off evidence to drive the theological debate.

Just like in science. there are reasons to believe in some theories that have not been tested or demonstrated, and there are reasons to not believe in some. And usually when science finds evidence that something is going on, a process is discovered, or better understood. So based on your definition science is just as much about faith as anything else.

So if the 5 senses lead to perception then when does perception ever become reality. Because beyond those senses we have nothing left to understand our universe with. Are you suggesting that our entire universe is all perception. If that is the case then you have no reason to ever ask for proof because ALL things are interpreted by men using the same five senses which (according to you) only give us perception but never any truth.

What is real, because now we are hitting on the philosophical arguments that tell us that we can only have faith in our senses to define reality, if we understand our universe to be submissive to an external laws and forces, which logically have to have existed before our universe started (as demonstrated by the expansion of our universe). This law tells us that it is safe to say that we know something is going to happen because our universe behaves with a specific set of guidelines and does not act outside of those rules. So our observations can logically be turned into knowledge. If you reduce human understanding down to the five senses then you close the door to understanding the part where those senses have to come together and generate some sort of response.

[TheProfiteer]

That is NOT true.

You are trying to walk the middle while playing for one side. But you still are ignoring that there is reason for faith. Based on your logic, faith is the driving force behind ALL things as all things in and of themselves require us to have faith in. But if people of faith are able to see reason and logic as demonstrated in their very universe then we can draw a reasonable conclusion that the universe itself is giving off evidence to drive the theological debate.

Just like in science. there are reasons to believe in some theories that have not been tested or demonstrated, and there are reasons to not believe in some. And usually when science finds evidence that something is going on, a process is discovered, or better understood. So based on your definition science is just as much about faith as anything else.

So if the 5 senses lead to perception then when does perception ever become reality. Because beyond those senses we have nothing left to understand our universe with. Are you suggesting that our entire universe is all perception. If that is the case then you have no reason to ever ask for proof because ALL things are interpreted by men using the same five senses which (according to you) only give us perception but never any truth.

What is real, because now we are hitting on the philosophical arguments that tell us that we can only have faith in our senses to define reality, if we understand our universe to be submissive to an external laws and forces, which logically have to have existed before our universe started (as demonstrated by the expansion of our universe). This law tells us that it is safe to say that we know something is going to happen because our universe behaves with a specific set of guidelines and does not act outside of those rules. So our observations can logically be turned into knowledge. If you reduce human understanding down to the five senses then you close the door to understanding the part where those senses have to come together and generate some sort of response.

Hey there man, dont go drawing conclusions on my behalf. You turned a simple comment into something unnecessarily deeper. We can have a discussion on reality, but this is not the thread for it.

I simply stated, that scientific discoveries, theorems, hypotheses, ect ect are initially derived from the perception of an occurrence. IE: Rain, a shooting star, an earthquake, a flood, birth, ect ect. So in order to logically draw a conclusion said occurrence must be observed and studied. Nothing in religion can be observed and studied, other than its detrimental effect on society and the world.

Religion, and I say this with emphasis, MODERN ORGANIZED RELIGION. Serves you a cold plate of "their truth." This is whats right, you will believe this, if not well then you burn in hell."

I say this now, and I will say it again. Christianity, Islam, and Judiasim, to a lesser extent because they are not as evangelical as the other two, are a blight to the world and are inhibiting the progress of humanity. The very nature of man, the most significant thing that separates us from animals is our thirst for knowledge, the drive to question is put in jeopardy because of religion. When we ignore the fact that we do not have the answer to where we came from, why we are here, and where we are going. We stop looking, because the teachings of philosophers of the past were bastardized and manipulated into a societal tool to maintain social cohesion, that is what we know as religion. Its a processes thousands of years old, and humanity has reached an age where the slow yet sure demise of religion is at hand. It will not happen in our life time but centuries from now religion will see its darkest days.


"Faith: not wanting to know what is true." Friedrich Nietzsche

[trini_gsr]

Hey there man, dont go drawing conclusions on my behalf. You turned a simple comment into something unnecessarily deeper. We can have a discussion on reality, but this is not the thread for it.

I simply stated, that scientific discoveries, theorems, hypotheses, ect ect are initially derived from the perception of an occurrence. IE: Rain, a shooting star, an earthquake, a flood, birth, ect ect. So in order to logically draw a conclusion said occurrence must be observed and studied. Nothing in religion can be observed and studied, other than its detrimental effect on society and the world.

Religion, and I say this with emphasis, MODERN ORGANIZED RELIGION. Serves you a cold plate of "their truth." This is whats right, you will believe this, if not well then you burn in hell."

I say this now, and I will say it again. Christianity, Islam, and Judiasim, to a lesser extent because they are not as evangelical as the other two, are a blight to the world and are inhibiting the progress of humanity. The very nature of man, the most significant thing that separates us from animals is our thirst for knowledge, the drive to question is put in jeopardy because of religion. When we ignore the fact that we do not have the answer to where we came from, why we are here, and where we are going. We stop looking, because the teachings of philosophers of the past were bastardized and manipulated into a societal tool to maintain social cohesion, that is what we know as religion. Its a processes thousands of years old, and humanity has reached an age where the slow yet sure demise of religion is at hand. It will not happen in our life time but centuries from now religion will see its darkest days.

the man has a point

sport122 is taking the discussion on a deeper level - it does boil down to the philosophical debate between materialism and idealism as far as describing our reality. i'm an idealist, by the way. but profiteer is right, that's a discussion for a different thread.

the problem i have with 'religions' is that they are too static. as we gain a better understanding of the universe around us, it's natural that our views on the supernatural/spiritual are going to change too. I believe that God is dynamic and rational, and we have the drive to discover the secrets of our universe because we were created as rational beings. But while science will give us the "how", it will never answer the question of "why". this is what spirituality is for.

i see what you're getting at, profiteer, but to say that religions are a blight to the world and inhibit progress is taking it a bit too far. religion plays a key role in stressing the importance of morality in a society - i would argue that this too is needed to create the right environment for intellectual progress, although the merits of it might not be as tangible. remember too that religion is a social construct created by the same humans who you say are thirsting for knowledge and striving for progress . it may be flawed (which one of our social constructs aren't?) but it serves its purpose.

[geoff]

to your first comment: yes all evidence points to there being something else...in the end its your faith to believe that that something/someone else is God. just the same as you have faith to believe that the law of thermodynamics or gravity is real.

second comment: about the animals. i could be wrong...i honestly dont know.

[quickdodge®]

to your first comment: yes all evidence points to there being something else...in the end its your faith to believe that that something/someone else is God. just the same as you have faith to believe that the law of thermodynamics or gravity is real.

second comment: about the animals. i could be wrong...i honestly dont know.

Kudos to your entire post, man.

I do hope everything you believe is what it is. And in a way, I believe the same. Just too many questions make me seem to be a total non-believer. Later, QD.

[geoff]

i have plenty of questions too man. i wonder alot of things and it seems that no one or nothing can answer them. we just all have to have some faith in something at one point or another in our lives. my faith is in the bible and in God. for others its in themselves. the point is that to every question there is but one absolute answer.

[d993s]

i have plenty of questions too man. i wonder alot of things and it seems that no one or nothing can answer them. we just all have to have some faith in something at one point or another in our lives. my faith is in the bible and in God. for others its in themselves. the point is that to every question there is but one absolute answer.

Do you ever wonder if you would ride a horsecock if god asked you to???
I asked you this earlier. (are you considering it???)