you know what sux... Yeah there is proof for a lot of religions and all.. Wouldnt it be awesome if we can have some rocksolid proof. Lol cuz life would really suck if these athiests were right this whole time. Anyone feel me?
proof
you know what sux... Yeah there is proof for a lot of religions and all.. Wouldnt it be awesome if we can have some rocksolid proof. Lol cuz life would really suck if these athiests were right this whole time. Anyone feel me?
i think the lack of proof is what makes religion interesting...if there was rock solid proof then people who know for sure what to believe in, but without proof they have to base their beliefs on faith alone
i think if there was rock solid proof then that would lead to too many extremists one way or the other...you'd have people saying either "there is no god so why try to do any good" or "god is going to get me so i can't have any fun"....think about how religious parents would raise their children...
How about have faith in god,but still do what u want, I mean live a good life but still ahve a little fun. You have to believe in something. If every one beleived there was no god and no afterlife then life would be so dangerous because EVERYONE would be shady and always looking to kill and do what ever it takes to get ahead. I mean you have ppl like that now but if you didnt beleive wouldnt you do mor ebad stuff?
If religion had proof it would be .... science.
lol yea
there will never be rock solid proof... if there was all of the churches would go out of business and it would kill the natural balance of good/evil.
yeah, that's more or less what i was trying to say...just couldn't put good wording to itOriginally Posted by admin
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business being the key word
the proof is in the pudding..
I got free clear tails with my ride.....
How do you figure?
^ well evil can not exsist w/o good nor good w/o evil... now if there was solid proof the balance between the two would be interupted... everyone would basically stop living and would be preparing for the end.
I'm gonna have to keep challenging your assumptions here, how do you figure? If everyone on the planet is good, then how does it follow that there is a lack of good? If an old woman falls and I help her, it's a good act and evil was not involved.
The end of what?
^ if everyone is good then there would be nothing to fear, if there is nothing to fear then there isn't anything to worship. life would soon be pointless w/o the battle of good/evil.
Oh c'mon. I don't live my life to battle evil and I manage just fine. You know most people don't die from evil and I'm sure plenty of people fear death.
what would there be to fear if the bible was prooven??? com'on think about it... the only thing that keep christians christian is the thought of hell and of what you dont' know... now if you knew for a fact that god exsisted b/c of proof then life would be easy.
Proven or proven wrong? So you are saying if everyone knew there was no hell, they would become hedonists and lose their morals? You know us godless pagans do manage to live normal lives without fear of hell.Just because there are not post life consequences to one's actions, doesn't mean there are no consequences at all. If it was proven God existed, then the whole heaven and hell would still apply.
no i meant proven... and hell wouldn't still apply... if knew the bible word for word was 100% true then the only way you couldn't get into heaven would be b/c of blashphamy... so all you have to do is ask for forgiveness.Proven or proven wrong? So you are saying if everyone knew there was no hell, they would become hedonists and lose their morals? You know us godless pagans do manage to live normal lives without fear of hell.
christianity is based on believing... its like santa claus once you know he isn't real what is point? same thing, there nothing to fear if the bible is proven
now if the bible was proven false then everything wouldn't matter... life would be pointless w/o consequence.
It would still be open to interpretation. Two people who believe the bible is 100% true now can both have wildly varying interpretations. I suppose if your contention is that the only way not to get into heaven would be blasphamy then all the Christians would kill themselves and the world would be a lot calmer.
You are implicitly stating that the only thing to fear in life is evil and damnation, that's simply not true.
Is it now? I don't think the bible is true and my life is not pointless. You are rather bold here man. Just because God does not exist does mean life is pointless.
interpetation wouldn't matter if the bible is prooven... b/c it doesn't matter what you believe; its that you believe. now back to my point... life would seem awful pointless from a christian standpoint if you knew you can do anything and be forgiven for it. what is the point of judgement if you already know what is to happen?It would still be open to interpretation. Two people who believe the bible is 100% true now can both have wildly varying interpretations. I suppose if your contention is that the only way not to get into heaven would be blasphamy then all the Christians would kill themselves and the world would be a lot calmer.
from a christian view it is... what else would there be to fear?
i don't believe in GOD or the bible, so it doesn't phase me either way, but my statements are from what i believe christian views would be enlight of the situation... if you are christian and just found out everything you believed in is now proven false... what is there to live for, if your praising something found out to not be true?
Christians already believe that to an extent.
We KNOW God exists. Easy or not easy comes later. Just the mere fact of knowing God exists doesn't mean you won't have "trials and tribulations" which may or may not make your life easy.
I understand where you're going, but it's over simplifying the situation a little too much Paul.
What? That last sentence doesn't make any sense.
I was more trying to get at what Jamie posted above me.
Plenty, losing your job, breaking up with your significant other, prison, killer bees, heights, small spaces, dragons, you name it.
I'm sure a lot of people would feel like idiots but for one thing not everyone is Christian and frankly proof would still not sway most people from their beliefs.
i'm not simplifying the situation.. i'm answering the guys topic... if from day one we all grew up knowing that GOD for FACT is real and christianity(bible) was real then no other religion or belief system would matter... you would be in slaved to truth. Live or Die it wouldn't phase you b/c you know for a fact where you will be going.
See look at the situation now.. you being christian you BELIEVE GOD is real, but you have no physical proof. We live in a society made of up anything... but if there was only one way of thinking then everything would be simplified all the way down to life.
how does that not make sense... there are different interpetations of the bible and all think theres is right... you can interpet it the way you want it doesn't matter, its the point that you believe in GOD. its not words on a page that make you who you are its whats inside of you that does.
ummm... seriously this is an adult conversation... I'M AFRIAD OF THE BIG BAD WOLF? com'on you know what i meant. if the bible is proven and you are christian then you have nothing to fear b/c you life has just began here on earth. now if you aren't christian than you obviously have something to fear if the bible is proven... HELL.
proof obviously wouldn't change people right now, but we are nothing more than specs of dust in time compared to life... people will always live and life will go on far past us...
its like if you asked someone about GOD before BC could they tell you about him? no but if you asked someone now they could... why the bible? it is used as proof.. now as someone 1000+ years after the bible is proven and you will get a more highly evolved answer in a society that knows only one thing.
if the bible is proven it discredits all other religions... so you have only one choice.
Yes but the interpretation of those words is what determines a persons actions. So I don't see how it doesn't matter.
Haha some of it might have been thrown in for effect but the point is valid. Even for Christians there are human constraints that prevent them from doing things. Things like laws and the fear of their consequences would not disappear.
I see your point but I think it's a bit naive. I suppose it depends on what this proof is but there will always be people who don't believe it. If it's simplistic like God comes down and tells everyone then sure maybe. However realistically it would be complicated and beyond the understanding of the common man. When people don't understand something there is always doubt regardless of it's truth. Who knows where society would be in a 1000+ years, probably all dead realistically.
good example... like if GOD himself appeared in form to prove christianity... yes there will be some doubts but there will always be non believers... but the point is it will change the balance of life... it kinda kills FREE thought if you know the end of the story.
1000+ years... if we make it that long, I don't see it either at this pace... shit Mayans think we have about another 7 years before another major change to our world happens (their calendar ends)
Yes, but you are still over-simplifying because you are assuming that there are no other "trials and tribulations" besides knowing where you are going or not going after you die.
Life itself is a trial. Everything about it is. Not just weather you believe in God or not. How you do everything is a trial. So, merely knowing where you are going AFTER is not the only solice you need TODAY.
I'm sorry how is life a trial if you know the end? Your thinking of now not if the bible was proven... yes life now is a trial b/c you make them b/c you have to think of the what if's... but the what if's don't matter if you know the end... we have established in previous threads that the only unforgivable sin is Blasphemy... so w/ that said, if i know for a FACT that heaven/hell is real then nothing will matter if i believe in God and praise him he will accept me no matter what i do or what happens as long as i ask for forgivness...
with that said... if the bible was proven and i was a believer than nothing will phase me even death b/c i know i'm going to heaven.
That's all true, but like I said before....Death and the life after is NOT the only trial a person has to go thru. If it were, then Heaven would not be a very special place because it would be so easy to get there.
You have it ingrained in your mind that Religion is only one thing; Do what you want, ask for forgiveness, go straight to Heaven.
It doesn't work that easily Paul. Yes, if you microdisect the Bible you could oversimplify and make it anything you want. But life is not about Cliff notes. It's a little more involved than that.
Just like in school....if you only read the Cliff notes and not the book itself.....you won't ace the test. You may pass it, but you won't ace it. Religion is much more black and white. There are no B's and C's, only A's and F's. Like I said, you can't ace by reading the Cliff notes. So you can't merely "wing it" in life and expect to get a great reward. Doesn't work that way.
Here is the best example i can come up w/... you know the read along books where you pick the story... IF YOU WANT TO BATTLE DEMONS GO TO PAGE 666, IF YOU WANT TO HAVE SEX W/ YOUR TEACHER TO PAGE 69. Life is like one of those books... you don't know what waits for you on the other side, you have a blief but don't know exactly... the pick your story represents trials of life.
now lets take this a step further to say you know the ending, god exsist heaven is awesome, and hell is awful hot place to live.... well you've just skipped to the ending of the book. what is the point of reading through it?
I have no clue as to what you are talking about there with the books and the pages. Never heard of that. :confused:
Now now Mr. Paul....how "open" minded is that kind of thinking????now lets take this a step further to say you know the ending, god exsist heaven is awesome, and hell is awful hot place to live.... well you've just skipped to the ending of the book. what is the point of reading through it?
Seriously, you say you are ultra open minded, yet have a very closed minded way of looking at religion as a whole. Like I said before, just because you know the ending to a story doesn't mean you don't want to have a part in it. By your logic, Christians would jump off buildings to their deaths rather live their lives right merely because they know they are going to heaven. This is exactly why I've been telling you that you are over simplifying things.
Life is not about Cliff notes.
com'on jamie you didn't go to school w/ D&D nerds... you know the books that became popular in the 80's where kids could choose the story.. you read a chapter and it give you choices which lead to a new adventure in the book on different pages.
if you never had one of these books i feel sorry for you, they kick arse
i'm not close minded by giving my OPINION of events that don't exsist... i guess when you can prove the bible we'll test it till then... (as the commercial goesNow now Mr. Paul....how "open" minded is that kind of thinking????
Seriously, you say you are ultra open minded, yet have a very closed minded way of looking at religion as a whole. Like I said before, just because you know the ending to a story doesn't mean you don't want to have a part in it. By your logic, Christians would jump off buildings to their deaths rather live their lives right merely because they know they are going to heaven. This is exactly why I've been telling you that you are over simplifying things.
Life is not about Cliff notes.
com'on jamie you didn't go to school w/ D&D nerds... you know the books that became popular in the 80's where kids could choose the story.. you read a chapter and it give you choices which lead to a new adventure in the book on different pages.
if you never had one of these books i feel sorry for you, they kick arse
You're such a geek monster sometimes Paul....
Dude, remember, I'm old. I know about D&D but never played it.
Remember that there are plenty of people that honestly and wholeheartedly believe those events did exist, so they don't need any further "proof".i'm not close minded by giving my OPINION of events that don't exsist... i guess when you can prove the bible we'll test it till then... (as the commercial goes
You're still a geek monster though.....
^ ya i'm a geek for sure
Its been scientifically proven that the sun will one day cease to burn and provide heat to the earth. Its also been scientifically proven that the moon is increasing distance from the earth, and that once it gets far enough away, the earth's orbit will change and wont be inhabitable by humans any more. It is scientifically proven, that no matter how long from now, humans will cease to exist. Where is heaven? Is it within the solar system? In the end, we go through trials daily in life.. and while it may seem important now, in the end its insignificant. Each person should live their lives how they see fit within what they believe. If the purpose of life is to be happy and reproduce, and the earth WILL be gone one day, if not by human destruction then nature, what is the purpose?
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