Ya that would stir up even more trouble and I don't think we should ever disarm anymore nukes. Especially now with all the warm wars we got building up.Originally Posted by redrumracer
Ya that would stir up even more trouble and I don't think we should ever disarm anymore nukes. Especially now with all the warm wars we got building up.
fuck em.
LOL
I think closing Gbay is a good idea. The only purpose it is serving is holding supposed terrorists or war criminals. Our soldiers guard it and all its done is caused us problems. People being tortured, humiliated, molested, etc. I mean if our soldiers were being kept in something like this we would be raising mortal hell. IMO, shut it done, move the prisoners that are actually guilty of something to Alcatraz and send the rest to Australia.
lol..Australia...Alcatraz.
Last edited by RedEj8; 01-21-2009 at 09:16 PM.
no the prisoners from our country are just killed by cutting the head off, no jail for them.
So? I wonder if thats the reason we've ripped taliban members bodies in half with 50 cal's? Im not saying its the same thing. I was saying if the position was reversed we wouldve already shoved a few thousand missles up someones ass. Us holding prisoners and torturing them is against the Geneva Convention, which if im not mistaken, Iraq, Iran, and other middle eastern countries aren't apart of.
if they are members of the taliban then i dont care if they got ripped to pieces or even quartered. the worse the better imo. also i doubt we would have "shoved" a couple missiles up there asses. hell like i said, what they do with POW's from America is far worse than what we do to them.
Your obviously missing my point.
This isnt even a comparison. You are talking about combat and prisoners.
Then what are you saying?
I would hope that we would do everything in our power to avoid the mistakes of Vietnam and actually get our POWs back.
None of them are protected under the rules of the Geneva Accords. They are not wearing a recognizable uniform and they are purposefully dressing as civilians in order to blend into the population before an attack. Under those conditions they have no protections.
More to the point though, waterboarding is not considered torture by the Geneva Accords. It is considered an interrogation tactic in the same manner that sleep deprivation is as there is no chance of death or permanent damage. All it does is give you the feeling of drowning. Someone that is comfortable in water would not be susceptible to this method.
1. I was referring to the retaliation that we apply to middle eastern soldiers. I know that excessive force has been used out of anger.
2. I was implying that us torturing war criminals is not justifiable to the extremes they have used.
3. I was make a generalization in that statement. I was trying to say that we could've done everything in our power to get our POW's back.
4. Im not very familiar with specifics to the geneva accords, but im sure sodomy, beating, and etc. isn't listed in them as interrogation tactics. Before you even say that it hasn't happened, it has.
Is Alcatraz even still in operation? I thought they shut that down a long time ago, or am I thinking of something else?
yes it is shut down.
Yea its shut down, but we could reopen it im sure.
so if we reopen alcatraz, what in gods name would be the point of shutting down g'bay?
They are talking of moving the detainees to another location. Thats why i said alcatraz.
So where are they talking about moving them to?Hopefully not U.S. Soil. That would be a mistake.
As far as what to do with them, the latest word I ahve heard is that Fort Levenworth is at the top of the suggestions.
If they tried to put the terrorists on trial here in the US each one of them would be found not guilty or have a hung trial. The govt cannot be forced into providing info on intel operations or methods and if they dont state those methods n court there will be little to no evidence. On top of that, I seriously doubt our soldiers ook the time to collect forensic evidence when each of them was captured.
As far as the ones that have already been released, about 70% have been recaptured or killed on other battlefields within 6 months of their release. This tells me that we are doing a pretty damn good job and finding the guilty ones. Too bad we didnt just summarily execute them on the battlefield.
whats your point? that we signed a piece of paper saying we'll feed, house, cloth, and shit to your army while you slaughter ours? GBay has its goods and its bads, but im sorry there are to many soft bodied pussys running this country. they wanna spend billions of dollars on chance info instead of takeing one prisoner that WANTS TO KILL ALL AMERICANS and getting the info we need in order to settle this whole ordeal. yeah some people may be there for no reason, but lemme ask you this, would you rather take the chance that that person is trying to commit war crimes against this country, or remove all doubt because hes stuck in a damn cage? i mean come on your worried about people that wanna see us dead, what about your sympathy for the guys that put there lives on the line for you while you sit beating your dick in a comfy bed, while they havent slept in days, there wives and girlfriends dont know if there alive or dead, and there worried about the possible sucide bomber thats waiting in the building ready to die for a twisted religion? we didnt ask for this war, but you better believe i plan to see this to the end, and if it causes the enemy some discomfort for us to find an ending and keep our men alive with good intel, you better believe i'd be the one maken sure that towel head doesnt sleep for 60 hrs straight. end rant
No one ever said they didnt have sympathy for our soldiers. No one ever said we should just release them. But something needs to be done about it.
i heard that some presidents even refuse the oath. or maybe its vice presidents. i dont even know...
here is a question for u geniouses. who was the only president to take the oath over the bible.
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All I know is that every dollar wasted by the gov't over the past couple days on lunch's and shit bugs the fawk out of me.
Yeah free the terrorists!
Fucking asswipe. Good job Hussein Obama.
They should put all the detainees on another island. AND BLOW IT THE FUCK UP!
Alcatraz will never be re-opened its too expensive to run and our maximum facilities are more than equipped to hold todays criminals
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Well, I must say that I didn't get my bag lunch tonight. I am in the Navy, and I have a night class from 1500-2300. Every night we get a bag lunch since we miss breakfast (Bottle Water, Sandwich, 2 Slices of bread, Jelly, Peanut Butter, Apple, Fruit Juice, and some Cookies). Know let me say that it probably ain't his falt, but his first day in office and we don't get our bag lunch. I don't like him already. lol
<---Click it.
F the president.
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I want to know his plan to help the economy. Besides rebuilding roads, and bridges. That's just redistributing money already in the country (money from taxpayers AKA: the ones that are suffering). We need to develop something to sell to other countries.
I can take money out of my wallet, and give it to my wife. That doesn't make our household any richer....
You are DEFINITELY in the Navy, talkin/typin' like that!
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we are fucked... doesn't matter, the greatest dynasties only lasted a few hundred years anyways.
You know better; next time will be a ban.
Your point about jurisdiction is well taken. It would seem that a military tribunal is indeed the proper venue for such cases. It is, however, inexcusable that such tribunals have not been convened within a reasonable time frame.
And, while I agree about the lack of precedent for rules of engagement for the current circumstances, that is where I begin to think that we need to set the standard for proper treatment of these individuals. Is it not incumbent on us to rise above the tactics of Al-Qaida? To not display the barbarism that we did at Abu Graib? I'm still embarrased about those events...whether the perpetrators have been addressed or not.
I agree, but we cannot hold anyone but the people that committed the crimes responsible for those crimes.
I agree completely. Those at the top were not doing their jobs, but the military has already addressed this issue. The commander and XO were both relieved with letters in their jacket that will prevent them from ever getting another command. The top enlisted was basicly retired. Those that physically committed the offenses have been tried and found guilty.
How much further should they go up the chain?
Agreed. My point in mentioning those events was to illustrate the damage to world perception of our ideals and integrity with respect to our 'holiest document'.
I'm like the Israelis. I couldnt possibly care less what a country that doesnt like us anyways think about us.
There is a slight difference in that analogy, in that Israel doesn't hold itself up to the rest of the world as the 'shining light of democracy'. That said, I unconditionally support Israel in their struggles, and hope that the US continues to do so as well.
Also, it damaged the opinion of our Allies as well as the "countries that don't like us anyway".
The only unconditional ally we have is England and they have been there with us the entire way, even though they have a PM that campaigned agaisnt the war.
Germany, France and all the others are fair weather fans of ours. We could do no wrong in WWII when we were saving their ass, but they have continually harassed us since then. We even had to deal with France, Germany, and Russia supplying Iraq with military equipment during the embargo. These were the same countries that benefitted mostly with the oil for food scandal.
I think you missed the point.
my point is they dont have rights, they arent innocent until proven guilty. imo they are guilty until proven innocent
So you believe that the Constitution should be a matter of convenience, rather than a matter of principle and conscience. Ok.......
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