Sad article... even sadder is Fox News' attempt to turn it into propoganda

[David88vert]

Again, I think you are just comparing the number of viewers though and not the impact and level of bias. I do not think the level of bias from NBC or ABC is anywhere near that of Fox news, so even if the total number of viewers of "liberal media" is larger, the impact of the bias isn't necessarily larger. From my personal experience, people who watch Fox are much more fervent and entrenched right wing advocates than people who watch the "liberal" outlets are strong left wing advocates. I think most people who watch CNN for example are simply waiting to catch a plane and thus, less beholden to that network to be the purveyors of truth. While of course this is a difficult issue to measure subjectively as we discussed, the presence of Fox (with it's high viewer ratings and high level of bias) alone seems enough to me to debunk the narrative that the mainstream media has an overwhelming liberal bias.

When you say that you "do not think the level of bias from NBC or ABC is anywhere near that of Fox news", you are stating that from your opinion that you are centric. If you do not remove yourself from the equation, and view from the point of a centrist, then your understanding of the impact will be skewed. The better argument is that you do not know the native political leanings of the individual viewers, so the amount of impact would vary per viewer, and make calculations difficult.
If you take the overall media, it is recognized as having a left of center bias, and journalists are overwhelming liberals/Democrats. In advertising, one of the main methods to establishing a narrative is repetition, which we see broadcast in mass from the liberal media. FNC stands alone on the conservative side. You will have extreme believers on both sides of the political aisle watching their favorite stations for certain, but to discount the overall amount of bias broadcast on a daily basis is disingenuous.

[bu villain]

When you say that you "do not think the level of bias from NBC or ABC is anywhere near that of Fox news", you are stating that from your opinion that you are centric. If you do not remove yourself from the equation, and view from the point of a centrist, then your understanding of the impact will be skewed. The better argument is that you do not know the native political leanings of the individual viewers, so the amount of impact would vary per viewer, and make calculations difficult.

We have already agreed that calculation of the impact is difficult. So until some evidence is presented, I have no choice but to rely on my personal experiences. The only evidence you have presented so far shows that Fox and MSNBC are both pretty extreme. I don't see how that equates to media having a huge left wing bias. Although no one is perfectly centrist, I do regularly vote for people of both parties and even third parties.

If you take the overall media, it is recognized as having a left of center bias, and journalists are overwhelming liberals/Democrats. In advertising, one of the main methods to establishing a narrative is repetition, which we see broadcast in mass from the liberal media. FNC stands alone on the conservative side. You will have extreme believers on both sides of the political aisle watching their favorite stations for certain, but to discount the overall amount of bias broadcast on a daily basis is disingenuous.

Recognized by who? Not me. I don't disagree that journalists are more often liberals but I also believe you can be an objective journalist and a liberal. Perhaps the reason I have such a hard time recognizing this supposed bias is that I rarely watch television news and see a much stronger bias from Fox than other stations. Of course I don't think I have ever watched MSNBC in my life. I'm still waiting for evidence stronger than "it is recognized". I'm sorry if you think I am being disingenuous but I assure you I am not.

[David88vert]

We have already agreed that calculation of the impact is difficult. So until some evidence is presented, I have no choice but to rely on my personal experiences. The only evidence you have presented so far shows that Fox and MSNBC are both pretty extreme. I don't see how that equates to media having a huge left wing bias. Although no one is perfectly centrist, I do regularly vote for people of both parties and even third parties.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, and I am not saying that the entire media has a "huge" left bias, only that it does have a left bias, according to those who have actually studied it, and are in the industry.

In case you haven't noticed, I have been presenting the only "evidence" in this thread. No one else is backing up their own opinions with anything else by their own opinions.

20 major media outlets rank on Groseclose and Milyo’s slant scale, with 100 representing the most liberal and zero the most conservative:

ABC Good Morning America
56.1

ABC World News Tonight
61.0

CBS Early Show
66.6

CBS Evening News
73.7

CNN NewsNight
56.0

Drudge Report
60.4

Fox News Spec. Rept. w/ Brit Hume
39.7

Los Angeles Times
70.0

NBC Nightly News
61.6

NBC Today Show
64.0

New York Times
73.7

Newshour with Jim Lehrer
55.8

Newsweek
66.3

NPR Morning Edition
66.3

Time Magazine
65.4

U.S. News and World Report
65.8

USA Today
63.4

Wall Street Journal
85.1

Washington Post
66.6

Washington Times
35.4

Recognized by who? Not me. I don't disagree that journalists are more often liberals but I also believe you can be an objective journalist and a liberal. Perhaps the reason I have such a hard time recognizing this supposed bias is that I rarely watch television news and see a much stronger bias from Fox than other stations. Of course I don't think I have ever watched MSNBC in my life. I'm still waiting for evidence stronger than "it is recognized". I'm sorry if you think I am being disingenuous but I assure you I am not.

The bias in the media is recognized by professors, industry experts, think tanks, etc.
I gave you many links that give you the "evidence". I cannot force you to read them or believe them.