Figured you guys would find this funny- DHS checkpoint refusals

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Again, one person walks into the welfare office by choice, and applys for benefits by choice, and chooses to give a sample. All choices.

The other person was stopped, and intimidated by a government official who is specifically looking to find something to use against the person in criminal court. Not by choice.

The first situation is not currently happening, and the second situation is happening daily. You don't see a difference or an issue?

So we should change the laws so we can intimidate welfare applicants into giving up a urine sample without probable cause?

"Just pee in this cup and let us search your piss, or you can't feed your family. Do you have something to hide?"

Your only suspicion would be that you think all welfare applicants use drugs, and that's classism.

If we let that happen, what's stops the officers in this video from searching these cars without probable cause or a warrant?

I understand the sentiment, but we know that the population of drug users on welfare is very low and inline with the general population, so welfare users arent more likely to be on drugs than anyone else. Giving up 4th amendment rights is a pretty draconian solution to a problem we don't have. Private employers are taking care of this issue just fine.

[David88vert]

So we should change the laws so we can intimidate welfare applicants into giving up a urine sample without probable cause?

"Just pee in this cup and let us search your piss, or you can't feed your family. Do you have something to hide?"

Your only suspicion would be that you think all welfare applicants use drugs, and that's classism.

If we let that happen, what's stops the officers in this video from searching these cars without probable cause or a warrant?

I understand the sentiment, but we know that the population of drug users on welfare is very low and inline with the general population, so welfare users arent more likely to be on drugs than anyone else. Giving up 4th amendment rights is a pretty draconian solution to a problem we don't have. Private employers are taking care of this issue just fine.

You either don't have the mental capacity to understand the difference in the two situations, or you are choosing to ignore it. My intuition tells me it is the second, which means that continuing this discussion will go nowhere, as you simply want to argue for the sake of argument.

As I previously stated, no one is forced to apply for welfare, and no one is being approached by a government official stating that they have to take any test or fill out any application. Anyone needing financial assistance has multiple options where they do not have to give any fluid samples, including assisitance from religious and secular charity organizations, and plenty of jobs that do not require any testing. I though that you wanted all types of issues discussed in the open? Or is it just when it suits your beliefs?

When you are being stopped a DHS checkpoint, the government is detaining you, and they sought you out.

On top of all that, you do realize that welfare is a state issue, not a federal one.
DHS is a federal agency. They are not the same, nor do they have the same regulations.