you lose me when you storm a burger king and vandalize it and when you write STRIKE on the outside of a building (IIRC it was mens warehouse) , when you storm a rally in DC that has nothing to do with you and try to kick down the doors, use your children as human shields, vandalize a chase bank, set trash cans on fire, etc.
IE negatively impact businesses and dont protest peacefully.
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A rash of reports of sexual assaults at Occupy Wall Street protests across the country has both police and activists raising red flags.
Nearly a half-dozen assaults have been reported at Occupy camps, including three at the New York City protests, which have prompted protesters to set up a “women only” tent in Manhattan's Zuccotti Park to provide a safe haven.
“The concern would be the rapes and attacks that aren’t reported,” said Sgt. Ed Mullins, president of the Sergeants Benevolent Association, a police union in New York City. “We have no way of really knowing. If you have three or five crimes reported, you really don’t know if it’s eight or 10 that happened.”
He also noted how young many of the protesters are.
"They are in the lion’s den, so it’s not surprising that they are more susceptible to crimes,” he said.
The first reported incident occurred on Oct. 8, when a man was accused of sexually abusing a woman who was in a sleeping bag at Zuccotti Park. The victim did not report the incident until a few days later, when she saw the suspect, David Park, 27, at the protest site again.
Park, a Connecticut resident, had been arrested for disorderly conduct at a previous march, and he had numerous warrants out for him in both New York and his home state before the protests began.
Another incident was reported last week when a Brooklyn man, Tonye Iketubosin, 26, was arrested for allegedly sexually assaulting a woman in her tent at Zuccotti Park on Oct. 25.
Iketubosin, a volunteer at the Occupy Wall Street “kitchen,” was questioned about the alleged rape of a second woman on Oct. 29.
Reports of sexual abuse also surfaced in Dallas, where a 23-year-old man was accused of having sex with a 14-year-old runaway girl, and in Cleveland, where cops opened an investigation of a sexual assault that allegedly occurred on Oct. 15.
Organizers for Occupy Wall Street did not return messages seeking comment, but they released a lengthy statement addressed to the participants.
“As individuals and as a community, we have the responsibility and the opportunity to create an alternative to this culture of violence,” the statement reads. “We are working for an OWS and a world in which survivors are respected and supported unconditionally… We are redoubling our efforts to raise awareness about sexual violence. This includes taking preventative measures such as encouraging healthy relationship dynamics and consent practices that can help to limit harm.”
The incidents of sex crimes, reports of petty theft, assaults and general outbursts of violence have sprung up not only around Wall Street, but in Occupy camps across the country.
And many of the protesters have become more aggressive overall in recent days.
The most serious incident was reported in downtown Portland last night -- cops responded to calls of a Molotov cocktail being set off near the city's World Trade Center. Authorities had received unconfirmed information a week earlier that people within the Occupy Portland encampment were constructing the crudely made bomb, which is normally fashioned from a glass bottle filled with gas and a soaked rag or cloth sticking out of the opening as a wick.
At the site of the Occupy San Diego camp, street cart vendors were forced to close up shop Monday when protesters, angry that they stopped receiving free food, ransacked and vandalized the carts.
The angry mob not only scrawled graffiti on the carts, they reportedly splattered them with blood and urine as well.
In addition, the vendors received death threats, according to local radio station KNX 1070.
Last weekend, a man was walking through Zuccotti Park taking pictures of the Occupiers' camp when an unidentified man approached him and struck him in the face, leaving his victim with a laceration to the face, according to law enforcement reports.
Also in lower Manhattan, a business owner made claims that she has been terrorized and her well-being threatened by Occupiers after she prohibited them from using her store's restroom to bathe.
Stacey Tzortzatos, owner of Panini and Co., located across from Zuccotti Park, got fed up two weeks ago when demonstrators broke a bathroom sink causing flooding in the shop and leaving her with a bill of $3,000 in damages, according to the New York Post.
In Boston, homeless protesters were removed from Dewey Square after they were discovered to have knives and stashes of illegal drugs.
“Paralysis is occurring across law enforcement. It’s becoming a Catch 22,” Mullins said. Referring to the protests in New York, he said, “To go in there to clear the park is going to cause confrontation. To not do so is detrimental.”
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/11/09...#ixzz1dDw432vR
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Molotov cocktail set off in downtown Portland, police suspect Occupy Portland protesters involved
Police said a Molotov cocktail was set off in an exterior stairwell at the World Trade Center in downtown Portland last night, and they believe protesters at Occupy Portland might be responsible. Someone called 9-1-1 to report the incident about 9:10 p.m., said Lt. Robert King, a spokesman for the Portland Police Bureau. No one was hurt, but a fire caused some damage to the stairs, which are between two escalators. "We're very fortunate that a larger fire didn't occur. These devices are completely unpredictable and destructive — we're very fortunate that no one was injured," King said. Police have been investigating reports since Oct. 31 that a person or group of people at the downtown Occupy Portland encampment has been making or storing Molotov cocktails, King said. Detectives didn't release the information to protect their investigation. But preliminary information received tonight suggested there was a link between the camp and the makeshift bomb thrown at the World Trade Center, King said. (The Oregonian)
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Sigh.
A few weeks ago, an Oakland police officer used his tear gas launcher of in a method against department policy and hit a US Marine in the side of the head, then lobbed a flash bang next to his head to break up a group of people trying to assist him, also against department policy. The marine required brain surgery.
Aside from that, countless journalists and other non violent protesters have been shot point blank with less lethal ammunition. Zero charges have been filed.
The ONLY incidents of human on human violence is the police shooting citizens.
It's that easy to find the bad parts of the movement. Especially when we're talking about Fox news. The news conglomerate that has been documented saying they're extremely biased.
so i guess the sexual assaults arent human on human violence?
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Fox news is the reporting source but feel free to investigate further as i have read tons of LOCAL reports from police and local magazines that are reporting the exact same thing. The Occupy people that are left are EXTREMELY volatile and hostile
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Does anyone here condone violence? If not, lets all agree that it's bad and get back to discussing the issues.
Really?Originally Posted by .blank cd
http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headline...-philadelphia/
http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/m...IwDGt2I1rM33vL
Yep, just the police creating "human on human" violence, nothing to see here.
I can play that game too...
kinda makes me wonder who's really inciting the violence....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=I0pX9LeE-g8
Police cracked a students rib, then told him he had no rights. LOL
http://www.dailycal.org/2011/11/12/p...-condemnation/
Then theres this. Cop says he got assaulted by a protester, video shows otherwise.
http://www.pixiq.com/article/youtube...p-to-be-a-liar
Do I need to post again about the marine who needed brain surgery because he got shot in the face with a tear gas grenade deployed illegaly, and then grenaded with a flashbang? I think they're saying he still has speech problems.
Wonder how long its gonna be until the protesters realize they outnumber the police, usually 10:1....
Faux News says #Occupy protests are anti-democratic and un-american.
Who lets these people become major network commentators??? I think some of them need to go back to 9th grade US history class and learn what democracy means. LOL
http://thinkprogress.org/special/201...l-ows-bashing/
when your pursuit of happiness is interfering with others pursuit of happiness than that's not right.Also, it's quite a leap to get from "pursuit of happiness" to "don't do anything that negatively impacts a business or causes people commute to work to be longer". Aren't the protestors also pursuing their own happiness by trying to positively impact the country? Even if you disagree with what they want, you should see they are doing what THEY feel is right.
Vteckidd has said it all. These protest are retarded. So if they get what they wanted. everyone makes 20 bucks a hour and has a job, would that fix all the problems? Fuck no! it'll cause inflation and making that 20 bucks a hr pointless. Its call survival of the fittest, if your lazy and has no mind of competition than sorry, you're not going to survive.
The protests are anti american and not indicitive of a democracy.
A deomcracy majority rules, these people ARENT the majority
Anti-american = anarchists, communists, socialists pushing an radical agenda for social justice.
All the major news organizations are now reporting that massive crime has started at these "camps". Theres sexual assault/rape charges at almost every Occupy city, Atlanta had a break out of TB, a man was shot and KILLED in Oakland Occupy and when paramedics arrived on scene to assisdt the Occupy people made it impossible for the paramedics to perform their duties.
Democrats and republicans across the state are vowing to remove all Occupy people, look for this to ramp up here soon as they try to restore law and order to a group thats become a bunch of thugs and criminals. Any rational people that were there that had a decent message have long vacated, only the thugs remain.
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sorry they are right. I doubt anyone will agree with you. The Occupy Protestors are no longer protestors, they want violence and intimidation. the "cause" has long been adbondoned, we have said that for pages.
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Over 80% of americans agree with the protests. That is the majority. But, yes I was correct on the other point to, that protesting against something you dont like is democracy at its roots. Plain and simple. There's not really an anarchy, there is no communists or communism (you really need to do some more research on the definition of communism. LOL)
This is why you have to go to the source! Not Fox News! The outbreak was proven false by the health department, and they're saying the shooting may be unrelated.
Protesting is anti-american? Protesting against the government was how the US was founded! LMAO
Maybe fox news is funnier than I initially expected. LOL
I dont know what polls you are looking at but youre way off. The polls show that most americans arent in favor of the Occupy Movement anymore
http://www.rasmussenreports.com/publ...41_unfavorable
Most of the polls show growing disapprovement for Occupy from respectable sources like Gallup or Rasmussen.
But regardless if 80% of the people were in favor of it like you say, then Occupy would be positioning themselves to be in congress, but they arent. wonder why? dont say its unfair media coverage lol
I just read that on WSBTV friday night, if its false then so be it, doenst matter usually that happens iwth clustering of vagabonds stuff happens. but, the other stuff is true and i can post the videos if you wwant.This is why you have to go to the source! Not Fox News! The outbreak was proven false by the health department, and they're saying the shooting may be unrelated.
The "legitimate message" about being angry at CEOs is lost. Most normal thinking people are gone.
when youre storming businesses, setting trash cans on fire, inciting violence , i classify you as anarchists. Democracy is changing and working within the system , they arent.
Thats plain and simple.
You can try to justify it all you want, but like i always said, one movement actually got stuff done and got people elected to congress, i doubt youll see anyone running on an OCCUPY platform next year, and its because its a lunatic fringe movement that is full of anarchists now.
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protesting doesnt mean =destroying public/private property, infringing on the rights of others, vandalizing, raping, sexual assaulting, etc.
So yes, MY definition of protesting is different than yours. And what they are doing is unamerican. They arent exercising their "free speech", they are going far beyond that
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And that whole pesky pursuit of happiness thing, which ISN'T in the constitution or the first amendment by the way, it's in the declaration of independence, and it has nothing to do with owning a business
Butchering the constitution, thats not right
wrong.
It was used inthe declaration of independence, but appears several times in the US Constitution:
5th Amendment
14th Amendment"No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation"
Life, liberty, property was a pseudonym for pursuit of happiness because they Franklin IIRC wanted to mention property specifically.Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
Section 2. Representatives shall be apportioned among the several States according to their respective numbers, counting the whole number of persons in each State, excluding Indians not taxed. But when the right to vote at any election for the choice of electors for President and Vice President of the United States, Representatives in Congress, the Executive and Judicial officers of a State, or the members of the Legislature thereof, is denied to any of the male inhabitants of such State, being twenty-one years of age, and citizens of the United States, or in any way abridged, except for participation in rebellion, or other crime, the basis of representation therein shall be reduced in the proportion which the number of such male citizens shall bear to the whole number of male citizens twenty-one years of age in such State.
Section 3. No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may, by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.
Section 4. The validity of the public debt of the United States, authorized by law, including debts incurred for payment of pensions and bounties for services in suppressing insurrection or rebellion, shall not be questioned. But neither the United States nor any State shall assume or pay any debt or obligation incurred in aid of insurrection or rebellion against the United States, or any claim for the loss or emancipation of any slave; but all such debts, obligations and claims shall be held illegal and void.
Section 5. The Congress shall have power to enforce, by appropriate legislation, the provisions of this article.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.
Also if you know history there were great discussions about Human Rights and what those were. Anytime RIGHTS were used in the constitution it was made to reflect the previous documents they worked on, including the declaration of independence.
Everyone has the right to life liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Protesting, as i have always said, is anyones right. ANd i would never tell someone they cannot do that.
But they are breaking many laws under the protection of this fallacy that they are "protesting" or "exercising free speech".
Rapes occuring in Occupy Tent cities? Free speech
Thefts occuring in Occupy Tent cities? Freedom of assembly
Retaliating against police? Freedom of Speech
i mean again, most of the civilized country (regardless of political party) sees it for what its worth. Its people that want to burn the system down, not fight to change it, or do anything meaningful. I mean BUSINESS owners are on the record saying how they have been threatened, told to give out free food, looted, vandalized, etc.
Occupy is demonstrating how to NOT get anything done, because they are too stupid to figure out how to change something. Any politician that runs on the OCCUPY platform it will be political suicide.
For as crazy racists as the media portrayed the TP, no one can figure out how they protested and actually got people elected and have a caucus in congress now with little to no civil disobediance, yet Occupy, no matter how much you want to sequester the bad press, its blatantly obvious these guys that are left are thugs and anarchists.
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"Property" is not a pseudonym for "pursuit of happiness". In both the 5th and 14th amendment, it refers to your possessions. Franklin and Jefferson mentioned property in those amendments because they feared the protection of property wasn't brought up initially.
The Supreme Court, Bill of Rights, Constitution, would all disagree with you.
The Inalieanble rights that were so often discussed preceeded all this.
Anyone has the right to life , liberty, and pursuit of happiness as well as life liberty and rights to property. There is very vague definitions of what property is. Like your business is techincally your property, you have a right to operate it in pursuit of happiness.
It doesnt matter how you spin it, youre trying to change the argument. the Person OPERATING A BUSINESS has a right to do so, when so called "protestors" infiltrate his business and vandalise it and destroy it, they are infringing on another person rights.
When they occupy a public park and refuse to let other people enjoy the same park, they are infringing on someone elses rights.
its very easy to understand this. In your world though people can do whateveer they want and have no rule of law to follow and dont care about their fellow man (as long as they arent in the same socio-economical class as them). I dont want to live in that world
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The reality is, a business doesn't have the right to say people can not assemble at someone else's property that's near their business. If the park owner (not the nearby business owner) wants to kick protestors out, that is up to him. You don't get to decide who's rights are more important just because you disagree with their message. And by the way, I agree that a $20/hr minimum wage is a retarded idea but that is irrelevant to the rights being discussed here.
and no one ever said that was violating their rights. We were talking about the group that wrote STRIKE on mens warehouse, stormed Burger King and vandalised it and chanted inside the business, the group that stormed into Chase bank, or stormed into a rally at Washington DC and disrupted it.
We are talking about the report from the Occupy Plaza people that were saying their businesses were being intimidated into giving OCCUPY squatters free food or let them use the restroom. When they refused they were "protested" or intimidated. One store owner reported finding a Occupy person bathing in his retaurants sink and washing his clothes.
The point YOU are trying to make is they are protesting EVIL CEOs and not having a job, while forcing the local businesses out of work. Im sure if they were spending money at the small businesses the SB owners wouldnt be upset. But they arent.
the 99% is forcing other 99% people out of their jobs by protesting the 1%. Which is OUR point, they are too stupid to even know that the very actions they are protesting are hurting people that would be sympathtic to their movement, but they are alienating them.
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If the protestors are vandalising his business or refusing to leave his property they can rightfully be arrested but simply congregating in a park nearby is not an infringement on any right.
I wasn't aware they were preventing anyone from coming into the park. No person's right to use the park is any more valuable than another persons. A dog walker and a protestor have the same rights.
The police don't seem to be shy about arresting the protestors who are breaking the law. Breaking park rules are not law. I'm not going to deny that some people are acting like assholes, but don't generalize everyone protesting based on those who can't act responsibly.
Funny, the same documents, history, and an english language dictionary would agree with me.
Hmm....
Fox News doesn't see it that way
Ah well that's not the situation you and I were originally discussing which was a business man who said business was down because people didn't want to come by the protestors to get to his business. That is just bad luck and not an infringement of any right. In the scenarios you are talking about above, I completely agree. Such vandalism and intimidation are deplorable. I have no problem with those people being arrested.
they have been arrested, i posted videos and arresting reports. they were shot down by "police are not allowing free speech".
Congregating in a park is fine, i dont have a problem with that. But if that park has a open and close time (which most do) they have to abide by those laws or face the consequences.
when you occupy a tent and barricade yourself into the area, and basically take it over , you are keeping other citizens from using it. Come on dont patronize me go look at the videos and pictures.I wasn't aware they were preventing anyone from coming into the park. No person's right to use the park is any more valuable than another persons. A dog walker and a protestor have the same rights.
An they shouldnt be shy. Park Rules USUALLY are city ordinances which ARE LAWS. These arent like "pick up after your dog" laws. These are city maintained and operated parks which have opening an closing times mainly for public safety.The police don't seem to be shy about arresting the protestors who are breaking the law. Breaking park rules are not law. I'm not going to deny that some people are acting like assholes, but don't generalize everyone protesting based on those who can't act responsibly.
Im not generalizing, im merely reporting on what i see on all the media outlets across the nation , not just fox. There were some people with legitimate biefs, but those are long gone
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Wikipedia is your source for most knowledge. its blatantly obvious. You regurgitate info great, but you really dont UNDERSTAND it.
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yeah a business cant bitch for people assembling and protesting, that is their right, and thats just bad luck if its driving people away or whatever. but the protestors shouldnt be interfering with him either.
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If by "understand" you really mean twist information to suit my own political beliefs, then no, I don't "understand" it.
So if people are being arrested (ie. facing the consequences) when they are breaking the laws, what is the problem? However, I was under the impression that since the park was privately owned, such rules did not have the force of law. I may be wrong on that and would be open to seeing documentation that you are correct on that issue. If that is the case though, the police could just drive them out the way it was done in Atlanta right?
I thought it was the police doing the barricading. I'm not sure why you took my comments as patronizing.
You are generalizing if you are basing it off what you see in media outlets because media outlets are going to focus on the most extreme acts. A dozen people sitting peacefully aren't going to attract media attention like one guy shitting on a cop car.
A quick question for you though. The tea party (the original, not the new anti-tax one) was an illegal act destroying a private business's property. What is your take on the morality of such action? Was that action laudible because you agree with the motivations and goal or is it deplorable simply because it was illegal and violated property rights?
Citizen! It has recently come to our attention that you wish to exercise your first amendment freedoms. In order to ensure compliance with Free Speech Safety standards please obey the following rules to ensure that your protest in conducted properly:
-You can exercise your rights in a designated Free Speech Zone. Anyone who is caught outside specified zones participating in a free speech action will be beaten and jailed.
- You must apply for a permit to designate a Free Speech Zone. To apply for a permit please contact the Board of Permitting and Public Safety. It is expected that you will have your sanitation, safety, education, environmental impact and concessions permits before applying. Anyone found participating in a free speech action without a permit will be beaten and jailed.
-Free Speech Zones operate between the hours of 9am - 5pm, anyone caught participating in a free speech action outside of those times will be beaten and jailed.
-All citizens participating in free speech actions must be properly dressed to identify themselves to authorities, corporate representatives and interested third parties. These uniforms can be purchased at several Free Speech Distribution Authorities located throughout your community. Anyone caught participating in a free speech action without proper attire will be beaten and jailed.
- No items will be allowed to be carried into the Free Speech Zone. Anything that is not attached directly to your person or is out of compliance with the standard Free Speech Zone attire protocol will confiscated before entering the Free Speech Zone. Those caught with foreign items are subject to beatings and possible incarceration at the officers discretion. Any property confiscated will be promptly destroyed.
The first amendment is important to us, and we hope by obeying these simple rules you can make our community a safer and happier place.
Good luck with your free speech action!
LOL spare us please, thats not what is happeneing even though its impossible to convince you otherwise.
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If this is true why is EVERY citiy official even from the MOST LIBERAL in Oakland, now Mayor Bloomberg done with the Occupy crowd? its because they arent protesting they are squatting , destroying, raping, and endagering the lives of others and themselves. PERIOD.
facts speak for themselves, when the LEft is starting to get tired of their own funded protests, then you know its bad
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This is amusing. NYC Mayor Bloomberg tried to evict the protesters last night for "health and fire safety reasons"
http://i.imgur.com/TMxmg.jpg
http://www.nyc.gov/portal/site/nycgo...&rc=1194&ndi=1
Judge trumps mayor, upholds 1st amendment. says LEO cant enforce new rules of the park established after occupation began. It is now (well, its kinda always been) unlawful to evict protesters from the park
https://www.documentcloud.org/docume...-liberty-park/
This whole thing is just laughable at this point. "Damn the health and safety of the general public, the First Amendment says I can do whatever the hell I want and you can't stop me." Give me a break, it doesn't give you free reign to go out and incite violence and destroy property.
Nope, you're right, and if everyone was destroying property and if ANYONE was inciting violence, then it would be an issue.
Someone should also tell the NYPD that "no inciting violence and destroying property thing" works both ways
thought hippies has become instant?
You are wrong! they are back from the dead! Mindless and taking over the streets! Taking over small businesses during the days and raping each others during the nights!
Boobs slagging the streets!
stay toned, The Walking Hippies.
rated R, for mindless, jobless, hopeless hippies only.
And bloomberg is gonna fight it because the judge the offered the injunction is a moron. There are signs that clearly state the privately owned property allows NO CAMPING.
The Private business that owns Zucotti park cannot police the people inside, so they went to the city for help. The injunction wont stand, itll be struck down, and the people will be rightfully arrested if they violate the property they are being allowed to use. The more they continue to squat the worse the movement will be regarded.
They are orchestrating their own demise and ill just sit back and laugh as it all unravels
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