do i need a valve cover ground wire?

[Humphrizzle]

do i?

i want to shave the thing off.. and delete the ugly ground wire but i dont know if it's really necessary or not.

[silverDA]

i took mine off,havent had any problems yet/

[BoxOn20s]

If you are really concerned about it, make a new ground somewhere else that isnt noticeable.

[BABY J]

That's not the purpose of that particular ground... otherwise Honda would have moved it somewhere else as well. Reps to the person on the board (other than me) that knows why that ground exists.

[Grimm Reeper]

reps bwhahahahahaha

[Humphrizzle]

tell me why it's there..

i asked.

[BABY J]

^^ You don't know either Puto.

[C-loS109]

im so intriged right now lol

[blacknightteg]

That's not the purpose of that particular ground... otherwise Honda would have moved it somewhere else as well. Reps to the person on the board (other than me) that knows why that ground exists.

only thing that i can think of is that it has to do with the spark plugs. the fact that if they get to the point where over heat they can short out the block and the ground wire is supposed to allow that not to happen or something? maybe?

[Humphrizzle]

i figured it was a static ground..

[BABY J]

Fine... when the Civic came out in 1972, there was this metal thing called the cam spinning inside of this metal cover called a valve cover. At certain RPMs, this created a real weird "electronic drone" (electrical noise) sound that could he heard through the cheap ass wiring of the speakers, sometimes even when the radio wasn't on. (I forget the technical name of the phenomena when you spin a metal core at high rpms inside of a metal surround --- but it has its own special name) - it produces current (possibly... under certain circumstances) and electrical noise (definitely).

Fast forward to today... we have solid state electronics and shielded wiring, so you think that you could remove it right? Wrong.

Your valve cover "technically" isn't grounded to the block/chassis due to the rubber grometts/seals, and also the paper head gasket between the head and the block... it's isolated (this is arguable, but I won't get into that).

In short --- w/ todays HiPo shielding and super cool solid state electronics you can remove it --- but Honda seems to still think that the VC is isolated (or somewhat isolated) and you need it.

Some run it - some do not.

[Black4DrEK]

IDK i just put that ground from the front to the back of the VC

[Humphrizzle]

so what damage could possibly occur?

[BABY J]

The earth will explode. Don't remove it.

[Humphrizzle]

yessir!

[aaronfelipe]

I took mine off and the car just stayed in VTEC the whole time...

[b17a1db2]

I always run it. I did a B18C swap to my CR-X, was bummed out cause it wouldn't start... hmmmmm. what could it be.... So I took a last look at my engine bay to make sure everything was hooked up... Seemed all fine, then I noticed I didn't have that valve cover ground to the chassis..... figured I might as well put it on.. I did, and gave the motor one last try to crank up... IT DID!!!! And yes, I had all my other engine/transmission grounds hooked up.

[BABY J]

I took mine off and the car just stayed in VTEC the whole time...

LMAO

[Humphrizzle]

well i just got done with paint.. and it is back on.. but it's old and rusty.. what should i use to replace it?

[Elbow]

Speaker ground wire and a new ring.

[BABY J]

Go to autozone and look in the battery section... they have some grounding straps there for lawn mowers that look and work great.

[BABY J]

It will have an end like this on both sides:

http://www.autozone.com/autozone/cat...questid=295900

Looks great... they come in black and work great.

[Humphrizzle]

sweet thanks..

looks cool.

[speedminded]

I always run it. I did a B18C swap to my CR-X, was bummed out cause it wouldn't start... hmmmmm. what could it be.... So I took a last look at my engine bay to make sure everything was hooked up... Seemed all fine, then I noticed I didn't have that valve cover ground to the chassis..... figured I might as well put it on.. I did, and gave the motor one last try to crank up... IT DID!!!! And yes, I had all my other engine/transmission grounds hooked up.

Exactly, if the engine is not properly grounded there may not be enough current to turn the starter over.

Technically the valve cover should be insulated and grounded to help prevent radio interference aka High-frequency electromagnetic interference (EMI).

As for engine grounds, if it's not properly grounded the coolant will become charged and electrolysis will eventually burn holes in the radiator & engine. Oops. lol!

BMW engine at the thermostat...


There have been cases of wheel bearing getting destroyed, transmissions leaking, and throttle cables frying all because of bad engine grounds. If there is not a direct route for the power to get to the chassis then it will find a way or try it's best. Have to be careful with properly grounding BMW engines or the power may travel up through the engine harness and destroy the DME/ECU. Crazy shit.

[Humphrizzle]

cool.. thanks.

[BABY J]

[tdurr]

good thread. i think im gonna reground my motor lol.

[Meatball546]

I forget the technical name of the phenomena when you spin a metal core at high rpms inside of a metal surround --- but it has its own special name

I believe it's called induction.

[scttydb411]

need to keep in on the engine. improper grounding can cause a host of issues with the ignition systems and ecu electronics. same thing goes for running non-ngk/denso plugs, wires, stock honda cap/rotor. 99% of the time i have a car i'm tuning that is having ignition issues it's related to these issues and changing it to the way it was intended miraculously fixes it. it's even worse on the k-series engines and swaps if you don't have all the grounds and put them where they were intended. move one away and all hell breaks loose.

moral of the story-ground it!! get a pretty one if you have to, but keep it there.

[BABY J]

Oh yeah --- remember ALSO that a ground wire needs to be as SHORT as possible. I know you kids wanna be kool and hide shit... but a ground is intended to be and SHOULD be very short. Electronics Principles 101.

[Humphrizzle]

care to explain the reasoning behind why the wire should be so short?

[speedminded]

care to explain the reasoning behind why the wire should be so short?

The alternator creates a lot of electrical energy. It's wired to the starter which is wired to the engine and battery. Your entire power train is charged with current and it will find the shortest distance to a ground, if it's not the wire that is intended to be the ground then it will find it somewhere else. As I mentioned before, if that energy is not grounded properly then it may travel up the engine harness burning up the ECU and killing sensors on the way...or it can even travel through the drive train destroying bearings as the current arcs across them.

If the ground cable is too long then the coolant to the radiator may be the shortest distance to a ground. Current in the coolant will turn it to an acid essentially making the radiator a giant battery. The coolant will then eat holes in aluminum, both the engine and the radiator itself...

[BABY J]

^^^ beat me to it... also...

The longer a wire, the more resistance it has. When a current flows through a resistance, a voltage drop is produced. Because of this, the ground reference at the source is no longer the same as that at the chassis of the vehicle. This ground potential differential can lead to noise (electronic), improper operation of the source (alternator / battery). If your voltage source is operating improperly... what do you think that does for the ECU - harness -- lights --- I could go on. ALSO... if there is electrical noise... knock sensors, MAFs, TPS, and many other sensors can go ape shit.

[5spdfrk]

Reps to all those who have posted useful info in this thread! I wish more posts were this useful!

[speedminded]

^^^ beat me to it... also...

The longer a wire, the more resistance it has. When a current flows through a resistance, a voltage drop is produced. Because of this, the ground reference at the source is no longer the same as that at the chassis of the vehicle. This ground potential differential can lead to noise (electronic), improper operation of the source (alternator / battery). If your voltage source is operating improperly... what do you think that does for the ECU - harness -- lights --- I could go on. ALSO... if there is electrical noise... knock sensors, MAFs, TPS, and many other sensors can go ape shit.

Yep, most sensors operate between X and Y voltage...if it goes above or below that then they can't be read properly and everything goes nuts.

[Tech5]

this is a funny thread

[scttydb411]

going to a larger gauge wire helps lower the resistance as well and will help too.

[turbob20]

also as stated the valve cover is sitting ontop of a rubber gasket and grommets isolated from the head so the best location is under a valve cover nut that way it ties in with a stud that goes into the head. some hondas have a extra jumper ground tied in with this one just so that it also jumps to the isolated valve cover from the stud..