SICKO

[tony]

Well if you pay proportionally, shouldn't the care be proportional as well?

You even mentioned yourself in another post...


Well if they're killing the pay right now, just imagine how much worse it would be with them being increased thanks to universal healthcare. And you know if universal healthcare gets adopted, they'll push for universal education. So then you'll have to pay even more taxes just so Joe Blow can do keg stands 5 nights a week and barely pass class.

I'll take the pain of that additional tax if I have the peace of mind knowing I can pursue entrepreneurship like I want without the worry of health coverage, sign me up now!

So you're saying that healthcare should be proportionate? That the person who makes less (For instance a teacher who will never make 6 digits but remains a great asset to society) should get less quality healthcare because she does not make enough for better care?

And in my statement I said that proportionately we are paying the same thing. Again, if I make $50,000 a year and pay $50 a month then the person making $30k a month pays $30 a month.. we are both paying the same percentage of our wages so we should be entitled to the same care.. I see nothing wrong with that.. its proportionate and fair.

[ironchef]

I'll take the pain of that additional tax if I have the peace of mind knowing I can pursue entrepreneurship like I want without the worry of health coverage, sign me up now!

So you're saying that healthcare should be proportionate? That the person who makes less (For instance a teacher who will never make 6 digits but remains a great asset to society) should get less quality healthcare because she does not make enough for better care?

And in my statement I said that proportionately we are paying the same thing. Again, if I make $50,000 a year and pay $50 a month then the person making $30k a month pays $30 a month.. we are both paying the same percentage of our wages so we should be entitled to the same care.. I see nothing wrong with that.. its proportionate and fair.

Let's take a look at it from an entrepreneurship point of view. Lets say you're some sort of provider of medical services or equipment as your business. Person A contributes his share to "society" @ $50/month, and person B contributes the $30/month, but your service or equipment costs $100. So while people are paying proportionally to what they make, its not covering your costs, not even break even costs. How do you feel about losing money on your entrepreneurship?

I agree with you in that teachers are a great asset to society, as well as cops/firefighters/military personnel and the like. They should all be paid way more than they currently are.

Proportionality is fair, thats true. But to use another example, some guy gets taxed on his $1 million in income. But guy B falls below the line and doesn't get taxed on his earnings. Yet guy a's taxes went to building the roads and infrastructure that support guy b even having a job or sending his kids to public school. Wheres the fairness in that?

[tony]

Let's take a look at it from an entrepreneurship point of view. Lets say you're some sort of provider of medical services or equipment as your business. Person A contributes his share to "society" @ $50/month, and person B contributes the $30/month, but your service or equipment costs $100. So while people are paying proportionally to what they make, its not covering your costs, not even break even costs.

The figures I've provided show that with universal healthcare costs go DOWN, furthermore taxes received will cover the cost of care without shortage. If the taxes do not cover then that is a problem with the government for now distributing funds as they should and not the system.

[ironchef]

The figures I've provided show that with universal healthcare costs go DOWN, furthermore taxes received will cover the cost of care without shortage. If the taxes do not cover then that is a problem with the government for now distributing funds as they should and not the system.

There is another problem right there. It would take a highly intelligent, efficient, and potentially non corrupt government for that to happen. The U.S. Government possesses maybe only one of those qualities.

[tony]

There is another problem right there. It would take a highly intelligent, efficient, and potentially non corrupt government for that to happen. The U.S. Government possesses maybe only one of those qualities.

When the government is afraid of the people and not the people being afraid of the government then progressive measures can be achieved. There needs to be consequences for corruption and I think things are beginning to change. Watch how this whole thing goes down with the democrats and I think you will see an awakening from the american people never seen in our lifetime.

You have the political machine going up against the people and the two are going to clash.. at the same time whats worse, the government or an industry whose #1 incentive is to make a profit?

[ironchef]

When the government is afraid of the people and not the people being afraid of the government then progressive measures can be achieved. There needs to be consequences for corruption and I think things are beginning to change. Watch how this whole thing goes down with the democrats and I think you will see an awakening from the american people never seen in our lifetime.

I really hope some sort of awakening does happen, and reform happens across the board. Do I realistically think it will happen? No, and the reason goes back to your statement of people being afraid of the government.

[Turbo04]

When the government is afraid of the people and not the people being afraid of the government then progressive measures can be achieved. There needs to be consequences for corruption and I think things are beginning to change. Watch how this whole thing goes down with the democrats and I think you will see an awakening from the american people never seen in our lifetime.

You have the political machine going up against the people and the two are going to clash.. at the same time whats worse, the government or an industry whose #1 incentive is to make a profit?

I agree that the government should be afraid of the people. But the very nature of unviersal healthcare is setting us up to be dependant upon a government for a necessity...not the other way around. I'm a bit confused about who the political machine is in your statment. I wouldn't trust the government to provide for my family if something happened to me, yet this issue ties right in together with that aspect. I pay super high amounts of taxes to keep roads and other "public" works in good reapir and stuff yet the money is never there to fix them when needed. And you expect me to believe governement funded health care is a good idea? No sir.....

[tony]

I agree that the government should be afraid of the people. But the very nature of unviersal healthcare is setting us up to be dependant upon a government for a necessity...not the other way around. I'm a bit confused about who the political machine is in your statment. I wouldn't trust the government to provide for my family if something happened to me, yet this issue ties right in together with that aspect. I pay super high amounts of taxes to keep roads and other "public" works in good reapir and stuff yet the money is never there to fix them when needed. And you expect me to believe governement funded health care is a good idea? No sir.....

Again, government provides free education.. police protection.. fire, military, or should we be paying for that on an individual basis too?

And about the Military.. I'm all for funding it but I am not for funding wars that can be avoided, that is not efficient.

[Batlground]

And in my statement I said that proportionately we are paying the same thing. Again, if I make $50,000 a year and pay $50 a month then the person making $30k a month pays $30 a month.. we are both paying the same percentage of our wages so we should be entitled to the same care.. I see nothing wrong with that.. its proportionate and fair.

Tony what is your position on taxes then, would you want to pay taxes the same way.......

[tony]

Tony what is your position on taxes then, would you want to pay taxes the same way.......

Now that is where it gets tricky for me since I don't like how medicaid and social security is drawn from checks but that is the one way I see it implemented. Its the same way we're funding the war we are in currently (through taxes) and nobody seems to care about that. The president just submitted a $3.4 Trillion budget but we complain about the possible cost of healthcare, I do not understand that.