pretty much it. thoughts?
Afirmative Action
pretty much it. thoughts?
I hate affirmative action, but unfortunately it is necessary. In a perfect world one would be hired and promoted based on merit and achievements, but it will never happen.
^ agree
well if i want it, i'll go get it. that's the way i see things,. but in a world where biases and prejudices abound. i see it (AF-A) as a necessity. it's a crude way of trying to make the playing field a little more level.
Well damn. I finally disagree with you, lolol. I think AA is a joke. What makes the playing field level is having qualified people in each spot available to make a company operate at it's full potential. If it is all whites that do it and none of the other races qualified, then so be it. Same if the situation is reversed. Later, QD.Originally Posted by ahmonrah
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no it doesnt
how does giving someone whos unqualified the position based on race make it equal?
if i went to work for a primarily black company but i didnt know shit about what i was doing but htey had to hire me to make it more "even" as you said. i believe the black person who was passed up would be pissed. its not fair, not in the least bit
Val for President
I think it's just stupid.. My mom lost a job she was highly qualified for back in the 80's, so a black lady who had some, but not much experience in the field could fill there "quota". Just hire the person best suited for the job, not because your forced to do some shit like that.
I wanna to disagree with you.... but I can't.
If this affirmative action thing keeps going then what next? ramps for people in wheel chairs
I'd rather be hired for my merit than to fill a quota
It's instances like those that make AA unjust, but in some cases moreso in the past AA was definately needed.
So i'm FOR and AGAINST it, it depends on the situation.
And that's how it should be!
I agree with Chris in terms of a perfect world scenario. We shouldn't have to implement a system like that but unfortunately people aren't fair (that goes for all fuckin' races) so we'll always need a system like that in place.
Topics like this require more than just a simple poll.
Leisa and S. 4 Life NM?
afirmative action fucked up my life. i put in an application to go to the university of michigan over 6yrs ago and was passed over i didnt rank high enough on their admitance scale to be eligable for admission. to put this in context i scored a 1300 on my sat, got a 26 on the act, had 12 college credits already, had a ton of extra curicular activities, coached the boys varsity soccer team at our school, and had been appointed to the Air Force Academy. i was even named in a law suit filed against the school as someone who should have been admited and wasnt. needless to say i ended up at georgia state university where being a white male pretty much makes you the spawn of satan.
"...I'm a thief, I'm a liar, There's my church, I sing in the choir..."
I don't need the government to tell me to specifically hire a minority. I want to hire the person of the correct color - green. Whoever is the most qualified applicant for the job should get it - white, black, Asian - it doesn't matter. I don't care what their skin color is, what political group they belong to, their personal philosophies, etc. I simply look for who can put the most money in MY bank account. Then I make certain to take care of that person, as they become very valuable to your business quickly.
how many people of minority that were more qualified than your mom that didn't get hired when she got hire because of their color
world isn't perfect, i don't support or disagree with AA, i feel you should be hired on your qualifications not your color
maybe it would go away if the employers would be more honest about who they hire
well said.
FOR
did you slice it with your driver?
So basically im fucked?
Next time around if we could post this shit before i make plans to go a a university... that would be awesome.
Seriously though... what do you mean?
I'm for affirmative action. I wish there was no need for it, but that's just how America is. Affirmative action is there to not even the playing (cuz we all know thats never going to happen), but to DIVERSIFY. If a company is ran by all whites, blacks, asians, or ..... how can you market your product to other races and ethnics? Most ethnics tend to stay together and we all know we communicate among ourselves differently. So this could and would benefit the company with ideas coming from different point of views.
Next, if a company is all one race, I see that as promoting racism (why can't a black man or asian work along side of you? what they not good enough). I don't care what type of job it is, but there's going to be many different races qualified for that position. So you can diversify any field (if the head people want to)!
I hate this "I didn't get the job or get in my school because of affirmative action" thing. How do you know that you are more qualified than the next person? More degrees or a degree from a better university does not make you more qualifed? If that person is in consideration then they must be atleast "somewhat" qualifed. That other person might have more hands on experience, might be a better communicator, or shows signs of leadership. That's what's the work force and universities are looking for now days!
I just wish everyone was treated equal and have the same opportunities and affirmative action was just a slight step toward that. But, this is just my opinion thats all.
I don't understand why someone would want to work at a place just because the Co. had to hire you not b/c they wanted to. if a Co. doesn't want to hire me b/c of my race than fuck em'! I'm probally better off without them.
Affirmative Action is just more evidence that it is ok to discrimnitate against some.
Does anyone think the reverse would be acceptable, lets say in Japan? No of course not.
if I had a business I would want to hire the "most qualfied" person that I think would help me make the most $$$ even if he/she is Canadian.
BLAME CANADIA
valid point for business. but not in medicine or law
i dont know about you but i would like the best quallified to get the spot in school they should go by scores only not on a quota. if someguy can weld better than me let him have the job. but if they are giving him the job because he is a certain race, well that is just wrong.
I agree with ya, but I believe the main point is opportunity! It's kinda like a chain reaction. If you stayed in the hood, chances are your parents lived in the hood and so on. That's already putting you at a disadvantage. Why? Because your school district is one of the worse in the city. What that = worst SAT's and ACT's scores, making you automatically under qualified. Making minorities fall further and further behind. This is very unfair to start out with. It's like starting a race already 20 laps down, with 50 laps to go.
I agree with you on the best qualifed person should get the job or get in the school, but test scores are not the only factor! Back in high school (if you already graduated), when the SAT scores came back wasn't there a person that got a score that made you say "How the hell did he/she get that damn high?" or that other person's score that made you say "I can't believe that person made that low!" Think about it now, would you want the first or second person operate on you if both were doctors from your personal experience with them.
Lastly, now days most jobs train on the site. A good example, is my past summer internship I worked (and still work for) USGS, United States Geological Survey. I was a mathematics and geology major (now I'm a mathematics and mech. engineer). There were only 3 people with degrees in geology working there. So I was like how the hell do you work in a field that you didn't even major in. It's because they are looking for other characteristics besides the "best" in that field. I know they could have hired many other geologist, but they didn't fit the description they wanted. People get hired based mostly on there work habitats, goals, communication skills, leadership skills, personality, and lastly their scores and G.P.A.. Think about it, with training anybody can basely do anything (to a certain degree). So now, even though I changed my major I got a guaranteed job when I finish my masters, because I have the characterisics they want!
Just think about it, you still have to be qualified to get the position, no matter what race. On paper you might be more qualifed, but that definitely does not make you the best candidate! I hate that people see affirmative action as just a quota.
i have no problem with giving people an opportunity i have a problem taking away anothers. this is were you run into issues. in the work place i can see how its harder to determine who is better, you cant place everything on test scores. but in entrance exams race should not be a factor
i am agianst it. i feel at one time in this country, minoritys were discriminated agianst in the work place. i feel, having had numerous jobs, that its not that way anymore, FOR THE MOST PART. here is a perfect example of why af-a is wrong.
UGA rates incoming freshman applicants on a scale of 250, number may be off but its a scale. your gpa nets u points, your sats, and your overall essay "Grade". if you are a black male, you get a point, for being a black male. if you are a female, you get 5. that is discrimination agianst white males. now, for the person arguing that its evening it out for the people form the hood bla bla bla. i did not say 1 point for a black male rasied in the hood, hell my neighbor got the point and we didnt live in the hood. everyone views af-a as a way to elevate the minorities onto the same level as the white man, but its not. not anymore, it is now nothing more than reverse racism for the injustices done in yesteryear. to give companies quotas of minorities to hire is rediculous and frankly, if i was a black, or asian, or female, i would be outraged to know i only got accepted to school, or only got my job, over another coompetitor who was EQUALLY OR GREATER qualified as me, because i was a minority. to me, accepting that is no different from admitting that i am below that person, that i need help to do the same thing they do. i believe carlos mansia phrased it best on this subject..
"i have no problem with giving you special rights. when you admit you are a second class citizen to me, when you say that i am smarter, faster, and more of a better human than you, then i will give you your special rights. when you say you need all the help you can get to be comparable to me, then ill give it to you. and all yall who said "fuck that, im not any different", thats my point so earn it like the rest of us" -paraphrased
Last edited by cherry kool aid; 04-18-2006 at 06:25 PM.
When I was a child, I used to talk as a child, think as a child, reason as a child; when I became a man, I put aside childish things.
those fuckers, I knew they were up to something
AA is a well intentioned system that has outlived it's usefulness. It should be banned.
The whole notion of righting the wrongs of the past but doing so in the PRESENT DAY is flawed.
Perhaps the indians should be paid more for Manahattan, maybe Mexico deserves a better deal on what we took/got from them, maybe the Irish should be compensated for the potato famine and having to relocate to America, the tea dumped in Boston harbor should be "restored" to England, perhaps the 500,000,000 acres of land we got from France in the Louisiana Purchase should be re negotiated at a more fair price, the Chinese who worked building the trans-continental railroad with their blood should be paid damages, Cains children should pay for him killing Abel etc etc etc etc etc
Any self respecting person, of ANY race, should be insulted at being nothing more then someones quota.
lol ruiner would love this sentence in so many ways.
haha
BTW I have strong work habitats
smartest post in this thread +1 + 1 + 1
Who gives a fuck what whitey says
BLACK POWER BITCH
2006 Evo IX - Bolt ons
damn why you gotta -1 me?
Heh. The white guy in your sig looks a little...out of place?
BLACK POWER BITCH
Hey, I went to Georgia Tech, and I can say that Blacks and Hispanics get a little bit of the Affirmative Action support, because they are considered, "underprivelaged minorities." However, East Asians and Indians, although they are in abundance there, don't reap the same benefits. Also, did you know, standards for Asians in California are actually higher than for Whites, because there are a greater amount of Asian students admitted than Whites in CA universities. Lets face it guys...The old America of hard work and self-efficacy is gone..Now its a nation of undeserved equality. Yes. I believe we are equal as human beings, but not everyone deserves to drive a Mercedes or BMW. Now we live in the land of lawsuits and beauracracy, and the standards are so low it makes me sick. We get rewarded for doing the most menial things like, "telling the truth," or "not stealing." As long as we feel good, that's all that matters! You know, "fat dumb and happy!'
I have one question..Under which category do True Africans fall? Are they "underprivelaged minorities?" Do they reap the same benefits in the work force or educational institutions that "African Americans" reap?
I am currently responsible for hiring two new people into the company I work for. Never while I was interviewing did I think "Oh hell, he's asian, maybe I should hire him to sell our Wok" or "shit...he's black maybe he can sell our fryer better then the white guy over there". Talk about racist....I'm for affirmative action. I wish there was no need for it, but that's just how America is. Affirmative action is there to not even the playing (cuz we all know thats never going to happen), but to DIVERSIFY. If a company is ran by all whites, blacks, asians, or ..... how can you market your product to other races and ethnics? Most ethnics tend to stay together and we all know we communicate among ourselves differently. So this could and would benefit the company with ideas coming from different point of views.
Next, if a company is all one race, I see that as promoting racism (why can't a black man or asian work along side of you? what they not good enough). I don't care what type of job it is, but there's going to be many different races qualified for that position. So you can diversify any field (if the head people want to)!
I hate this "I didn't get the job or get in my school because of affirmative action" thing. How do you know that you are more qualified than the next person? More degrees or a degree from a better university does not make you more qualifed? If that person is in consideration then they must be atleast "somewhat" qualifed. That other person might have more hands on experience, might be a better communicator, or shows signs of leadership. That's what's the work force and universities are looking for now days!
I just wish everyone was treated equal and have the same opportunities and affirmative action was just a slight step toward that. But, this is just my opinion thats all.
Now I'm not saying that your theory wouldnt be valid for certain types of buisness's but certainly not all. I dont need a variety of races to sell a dam oven...I just need intelligent and nice people.
And if the "ethnics that stay together" as you said...wouldnt buy something from a salesmen of a different race then so be it... I'm not going to cater to the racists by hiring this multi racial mix of people just to satisfy. I'm going to hire whoever is best for the job, regardless.
Good question.
AA by its very nature is a program that itself is racist. It uses skin color/ethnicity to determine a persons "right" to be admitted/considered to school/jobs etc etc.
If a well to do educated African who immigrated here (who has "black" skin) was to apply for a government job for example, they would pushed to the top of the list because of SKIN COLOR only...regardless of their qualifications of lack therof. By the same token, any white skinned person who applied for the same job would be pushed down the list, regardless of their qualifications or lack therof.
That is racism in action in a nutshell.
Two wrongs don't make a right.
I dislike how AA is currently based on the applicant's race. Just because I'm asian doesn't mean I'm well off and I should be subjected to higher standards. I immigrated here when I was 10 w/o knowing a word of English, my parents worked multiple and demeaning jobs to make ends meet, how can I be subjected to higher standards than say, an african american student from a upper middle class family who speaks English as a first language just because I'm asian?
If somehow, a new system could be employed where the criteria for being underprivileged is determined by social background instead of race, that possibly could work much better. For example, say, a student from a lower income family who wouldn't have had the same opportunity as a student from a higher income family should receive a little preferential treatment, regardless of race.
Last edited by yudalicious; 05-31-2006 at 12:06 AM.
Please tell me if you think my car looks good. But don't tell me if you think it's ugly - only on IA
U forget that alot of compaines in the 80's and 90's looked over minorities for employement b/c of thier race. It stills happens today, but not as much as in the 80's and 90's. I dont know why ppl make such a big deal about AA, u ppl must think that every company goes by this. Its a system to me, that makes a company open its eyes if they are not hiring any minorities.
I would go in depth, but im tired. I will edit my grammar and spelling tomorrow
2006 Evo IX - Bolt ons
if a company was doing that why would you even want to work there?
Yeah, but three rights make a left.Two wrongs don't make a right.
"DON'T FLOOD THE CAR PICS SECTION WITH YOUR BULLSHIT
FORMULA D PICS" SQUAD MEMBER
i'm just wondering how many people would want a doctor to do surgery on them who just was given the job on quota rather then his merit? umm i don't think anyone would so we shouldn't settle for this in any position.
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