U.S. Military Weapons Inscribed With Secret 'Jesus' Bible Codes

[StreetHazard]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9sPTR-nMds

This is something that is fairly easy to see in our conflicts in the middle east, but is not really talked about...also not easily "proved" because of the military's policy seems to present a constitutional paradox in that the First Amendment's Establishment Clause restricts the government's authority to fund and endorse religion, yet we see it violating these laws as easily as breathing in and out. I suppose Islam and Christianity are both religions of "peace" if it can ever be attained through killing and waging wars in the name of god, by all appearances this means the U.S. military is engaging in a religious war.

But Trijicon does make some very nice sights!

[Glides]

Yea I saw this too. My immediate reaction was, "Who cares".

Then I thought about it and I have to say it's a bit sickening. Christianity is already the one thing responsible for more wartime deaths than any other and now a company, who we are paying BILLIONS too, is taking it upon themselves to wage a Holy War against Muslims.

No matter who tries to justify this, it is just that, a Holy War against Muslims. We are putting Bible Scriptures on the sights that help our soldiers kill Muslims. Pretty shitty and i'm ashamed to say I live in the USA on this one.

I personally think the Muslim religion is a shithole that dismisses and often encourages violence against women, children and anyone they see as not belonging. But for us to wage a war without persecution, we cannot allow this to continue.

[One_Bad_SHO]

Geezus. Only in America would something like this be an issue. Fucking liberals.

[Glides]

Geezus. Only in America would something like this be an issue. Fucking liberals.

Interesting. That's a pretty ignorant statement you just made there.

It's NOT just America that brought the issue up. It's the Muslims it bothers the most, not too mention other countries that see it as a Religious Statement. But I can see the selfishness in your post. See the Muslims see this as an encroachment on their religious beliefs. There were also crates and crates of the Bible translated into Arabic to be passed out as well. When you add that to the Scopes that allow Christians to kill Muslims, they tend to get a little upset.

So you might try using your mind for more than Import Atlanta and see things from the other side before you toss out comments like this. They just make you look ignorant in others eyes.

[One_Bad_SHO]

Womp womp womp.

I am Ahmed the jihad-inclined Muslim and I hear about Jesus guns. Do I wait for someone like you to give me a well-reasoned explanation about why the Bible quotes are contextually relevant, or is this what pushes me over the edge causing me to declare death to the infidels and sign up with Al-Qaeda? I'm pretty sure Ahmed the Jihadist really doesn't need the Jesus Guns as a prime motivation to sign up for the chance to get those 72 virgins. It HELPS, but the chance of it being especially significant are relatively small. I co-sign that shit.

Aside from the fact that it is against military policy to endorse one religion over another and the whole separation of church and state bla bla bla, its not THAT big of a deal. Yes, its wrong (legally). However, as a soldier all I care about is that my weapon is on target. If anything, this “secret code” is there to remind those that are viewing the business-end of the weapon to say their fucking prayers. Pardon me for not giving a rats ass how my weapon makes Ahmed and his family feel while they fight us in this “religious war.” This is my opinion. :2cents:

[Glides]

Womp womp womp.

I am Ahmed the jihad-inclined Muslim and I hear about Jesus guns. Do I wait for someone like you to give me a well-reasoned explanation about why the Bible quotes are contextually relevant, or is this what pushes me over the edge causing me to declare death to the infidels and sign up with Al-Qaeda? I'm pretty sure Ahmed the Jihadist really doesn't need the Jesus Guns as a prime motivation to sign up for the chance to get those 72 virgins. It HELPS, but the chance of it being especially significant are relatively small. I co-sign that shit.

Aside from the fact that it is against military policy to endorse one religion over another and the whole separation of church and state bla bla bla, its not THAT big of a deal. Yes, its wrong (legally). However, as a soldier all I care about is that my weapon is on target. If anything, this “secret code” is there to remind those that are viewing the business-end of the weapon to say their fucking prayers. Pardon me for not giving a rats ass how my weapon makes Ahmed and his family feel while they fight us in this “religious war.” This is my opinion. :2cents:

Is Womp womp womp supposed to be some introduction to greatness?

You see, it's good that the informed and intelligent world does not share your thoughts on this. Since you think locally, let me enlighten you on how to think Globally.

You are correct, Ahmed the Jihadist and his family do not need a "Jesus Gun" reason to fight the Americans. I'll agree with you there. Also, yes, Soldiers care about their weapon being on target. I will agree with you there as well. Unfortunately, all soldiers are NOT like you. There are some like you, some like me, some are Christian nutcases like other people. So to put these on there only does one thing on a Global stage. Can you guess what that is?

Let me help you. Propoganda!. It gives the Muslims something to draw other Muslims into this fight with. You see, now America is attacking their religion. So people who might not have gotten into the fight will damm sure do it now because we are not attacking the Taliban for being Terrorists....we are attacking their God, their Prophet. So all that does is make the war worse and make more Americans die. Kind of counter productive of what it was meant to do yes? Save American lives?

I remember a time when we, as Soldiers, were almost attacked by an angry mob in Turkey because one of our people had a cruise jacket on with a Jewish flag on it. They sure as shit knew why they were angry, we....were not. And not knowing that almost got us lynched. Thank god for a bystander that got us in a cab and out of there before we got fucked up. We were ignorant to the rest of the world....because that is how the rest of the world views Americans, Ignorant.

You will also remember...or you won't, who knows, that most people in the Third World are not as distant from Religion like they are here. Where we probably wouldn't care if there were passages from the Kuran on their weapons, they will care greatly. It will cause their non-combatants to become angered with America and when, or if, you decide to travel abroad....it will be one more reason for them to hate America and knife you in a dark alley somewhere.

Now if you don't ever decide to travel, it's ignorant of you to say what you said because all this does is endanger Americans abroad and make us look worse in the eyes of the world. You may say, "Who cares, we are America. We are the baddest on the planet".

Ceasar said the same thing, so did Ghengis Khan and so did Alexander the Great along with Napolean, Hitler and Pol Pot.....I rest my case.

[StreetHazard]

I actually agree with both of you...So I am not sure where I stand in the matter. By far Trijicon makes the best sights and scopes available to mankind, and they ARE a private company, they are free to label their products however they see fit and in whichever way they desire, which is just another example of what makes this country so great.

I just have a problem with their use as a "context" of religious warfare. It can also be used to exemplify the dangers of the fanatical religious mind and the destruction those ideas produce. Christian and Islamic

[One_Bad_SHO]

Is Womp womp womp supposed to be some introduction to greatness?

No. Its meant to be sounded out. You know, like when you get a question wrong on a game show. :goodjob:


You see, it's good that the informed and intelligent world does not share your thoughts on this. Since you think locally, let me enlighten you on how to think Globally.

You are correct, Ahmed the Jihadist and his family do not need a "Jesus Gun" reason to fight the Americans. I'll agree with you there. Also, yes, Soldiers care about their weapon being on target. I will agree with you there as well. Unfortunately, all soldiers are NOT like you. There are some like you, some like me, some are Christian nutcases like other people. So to put these on there only does one thing on a Global stage. Can you guess what that is?

In case you missed what I stated earlier I will repeat what I wrote at the end of my previous post. "This is my opinion." Informed and intelligent people can easily conclude that in no way was I speaking on the behalf of ALL soldiers. That was a waste of a paragraph. You will not convince me to share your political and/or religious views.


Let me help you. Propoganda!. It gives the Muslims something to draw other Muslims into this fight with. You see, now America is attacking their religion. So people who might not have gotten into the fight will damm sure do it now because we are not attacking the Taliban for being Terrorists....we are attacking their God, their Prophet. So all that does is make the war worse and make more Americans die. Kind of counter productive of what it was meant to do yes? Save American lives?

As stated earlier, my OPINION differs from yours in that I do not believe this will be much of a contributing factor to recruit more human bombs. When they rock the fist-pump in the air during battle yelling "Allah Snackbar!", I do not take it as an attack on my god. Why should a simple encryption on my gun be any different? Austin 3:16 would be more inspiring in a gun fight, though. *tsk *tsk


I remember a time when we, as Soldiers, were almost attacked by an angry mob in Turkey because one of our people had a cruise jacket on with a Jewish flag on it. They sure as shit knew why they were angry, we....were not. And not knowing that almost got us lynched. Thank god for a bystander that got us in a cab and out of there before we got fucked up. We were ignorant to the rest of the world....because that is how the rest of the world views Americans, Ignorant.

The "rest of the world" does not view Americans as ignorant. Thats a pretty bold statement. I do agree that we are viewed as such by certain cultures. Cultures that do not understand our way of life. Coincidentally, cultures that bash us for being so involved around the world and then turn around and bash us for not doing enough when they need help. *coughHAITIcough* I've been to Turkey as well. Gotta love the cheap gold for sale in the market places huh? We got rocks thrown at us because the women that were with us did not have their heads/faces covered by a towel. I'm sure that was our fault though, because we were ignorant and insulting their god, right?


You will also remember...or you won't, who knows, that most people in the Third World are not as distant from Religion like they are here. Where we probably wouldn't care if there were passages from the Kuran on their weapons, they will care greatly. It will cause their non-combatants to become angered with America and when, or if, you decide to travel abroad....it will be one more reason for them to hate America and knife you in a dark alley somewhere.

Yes, because the fact that we are at war with them doesn't anger them enough to make them want to shank me in a dark alley. You know, because these "secret codes" are whats going to make them REALLY want to tape a bomb to their chest and give me a hug. I feel like I'm repeating myself. COMPREHEND what you read, kid, and we wouldn't be going in circles. Furthermore, why would any normal American be walking around a dark alley in a Third World Muslim country anyway? The scenarios you are making up are preposterous.


Now if you don't ever decide to travel, it's ignorant of you to say what you said because all this does is endanger Americans abroad and make us look worse in the eyes of the world. You may say, "Who cares, we are America. We are the baddest on the planet".

Ceasar said the same thing, so did Ghengis Khan and so did Alexander the Great along with Napolean, Hitler and Pol Pot.....I rest my case.

Funny. Thats what Sadam said too. :cheers:

AMERICA. FUCK YEAH!!

[Jaimecbr900]

Ummm, super duper repost. I posted this yesterday, but in the WL. I figured people would be able to read it more there, but I guess I was mistaken.....:(:goodjob:

[StreetHazard]

Ummm, super duper repost. I posted this yesterday, but in the WL. I figured people would be able to read it more there, but I guess I was mistaken.....:(:goodjob:

in the whoreslounge you need to drastically scale back the intellect it takes to have a conversation. I would be surprised if you had a response at all

[Glides]

COMPREHEND what you read, kid, and we wouldn't be going in circles.

And here...is where you lost me. You do realize, or you would if you paid attention to who you were talking too. I'm 14 years older than you.

Interesting that you keep trying to make me understand that this is your OPINION.....when i'm giving you my OPINION. That is what a debate is about. I debate nicely while you slide in nicely veiled shots at Arabs. You rock!. Way to spread hate in your opinions.

Once again. Like I said early on in this debate. Ignorance is your best weapon. You exude it like sweat from your skin. Your parents taught you well.

[One_Bad_SHO]

And here...is where you lost me. You do realize, or you would if you paid attention to who you were talking too. I'm 14 years older than you.

Interesting that you keep trying to make me understand that this is your OPINION.....when i'm giving you my OPINION. That is what a debate is about. I debate nicely while you slide in nicely veiled shots at Arabs. You rock!. Way to spread hate in your opinions.

Once again. Like I said early on in this debate. Ignorance is your best weapon. You exude it like sweat from your skin. Your parents taught you well.

"Kid" was not meant to be taken literally. I can edit my post and insert *cupcake* and it would hold the same weight in water.

Once again, if you could COMPREHEND what you read, you'd understand that I realize you are giving an opinion which should have been apparant when I wrote: "As stated earlier, my OPINION differs from yours in that..." Circles. We're going in circles here!

Last but not least, you make the mistake of taking my humor for ignorance. I have no hatred towards Muslims. I respect your wrong opinions and your right to spew them. :goodjob:

[Starrfire]

Fuking gay. That's a different way to spread Christianity, with bullets lol.

[StreetHazard]

Fuking gay. That's a different way to spread Christianity, with bullets lol.

OH! like etching scripture on bullets and dipping them in holy water. Now that's how you hunt werewolves and vampires since we are talking about supernatural beings...

[Glides]

"Kid" was not meant to be taken literally. I can edit my post and insert *cupcake* and it would hold the same weight in water.

Once again, if you could COMPREHEND what you read, you'd understand that I realize you are giving an opinion which should have been apparant when I wrote: "As stated earlier, my OPINION differs from yours in that..." Circles. We're going in circles here!

Last but not least, you make the mistake of taking my humor for ignorance. I have no hatred towards Muslims. I respect your wrong opinions and your right to spew them. :goodjob:

I fought for your right too give your opinion, so spew it all you want. :)

I mistake your humor for hatred, when you aim it at someone it's pretty easy to do so. You keep saying to comprehend what you are saying. That's how I comprehend it and I am sure I would not be alone.

But, like I said, say what you will. It's the American way. :goodjob:

[One_Bad_SHO]

I fought for your right too give your opinion, so spew it all you want. :)

I mistake your humor for hatred, when you aim it at someone it's pretty easy to do so. You keep saying to comprehend what you are saying. That's how I comprehend it and I am sure I would not be alone.

But, like I said, say what you will. It's the American way. :goodjob:

Thank you for your service. Thank you for fighting for my rights. I'll take it from here. As a soldier, I will continue to fight for my rights. TEAMWORK!

You have been calling me ignorant this whole thread. Lets not get into a pissing match because nothing here is personal. Unless you are muslim, none of my quips could be taken personally. Cry me a river. :blah:

[RandomGuy]

I agree with Glides COMPLETELY

couldn't articulated it better myself so I'm just going to read this thread,

intelligent exchange going on here

[Glides]

Thank you for your service. Thank you for fighting for my rights. I'll take it from here. As a soldier, I will continue to fight for my rights. TEAMWORK!

You have been calling me ignorant this whole thread. Lets not get into a pissing match because nothing here is personal. Unless you are muslim, none of my quips could be taken personally. Cry me a river. :blah:

My pleasure.

Also, I don't take this personal, but I understand that others might. You don't seem to get that point so therefore it must not matter. Since i'm not Muslim, it's makes it ok for you to say it. That....is a prime example of Ignorance. Or it could be Apathy. "Hey, i'm not Muslim so who gives a shit what Muslims think"

[5speed]

Hmmm... Its doesnt really matter now. The only reason we are at war with them is because the terrorist were initiating a Holy War or using that as a propaganda to give reason for war. The scriptures on the the weapons aren't anything new. They have been doing it for awhile, and there are only problems rising up now? Of course it could be used as propaganda against the U.S.A by saying that we are trying to oppress Christianity on them. This has been a problem in history for VERY VERY long time. It's not going to be made worse after thousands of years of turmoil. The only thing that gets worse is warfare because technology has changed. My only problem with it is that it is illegal and there should always be regulation on that.

[StreetHazard]

My pleasure.

Also, I don't take this personal, but I understand that others might. You don't seem to get that point so therefore it must not matter. Since i'm not Muslim, it's makes it ok for you to say it. That....is a prime example of Ignorance. Or it could be Apathy. "Hey, i'm not Muslim so who gives a shit what Muslims think"


No religion "deserves" any respect in my mind. It deserves about as much respect as someones willingness to stab themselves in the eye with an ice pick. I can stand by and watch them do it, but I will not congratulate them for it.

I am well past the friendly banter when there are people killing themselves for these false ideas. As BOTH of you may have experienced.

[One_Bad_SHO]

My pleasure.

Also, I don't take this personal, but I understand that others might. You don't seem to get that point so therefore it must not matter. Since i'm not Muslim, it's makes it ok for you to say it. That....is a prime example of Ignorance. Or it could be Apathy. "Hey, i'm not Muslim so who gives a shit what Muslims think"

That is not a prime example of ignorance. That was a statement directed to you and only you since you have claimed that my posts reeked of hatred pointed in your direction. Unless I misunderstood you, my comment makes perfect sense.

I was unaware that I needed to throw out a disclaimer when debating. I apologize for being late in the process and will remedy that by posting my disclaimer immediately following the period that will conclude this sentence.

Disclaimer:

The information transmitted in electronic forum messages sent from one_bad_sho, or referencing this disclaimer, and any posts attached:
1. is intended only for the person, persons, entity, or entities to which it is addressed.
2. does not necessarily represent the views of all soldiers.
3. may contain humor not meant to be taken literal
3. may contain confidential, controversial and/or privileged materials.
In the case of confidential, controversial and/or privileged materials, any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of or taking of any action in reliance upon these materials, by persons or entities other than the intended recipient may be the subject of legal action.
If you read posts in error from one_bad_sho and were offended, please:
1. punch yourself in the face



HOOAH!

[One_Bad_SHO]

On a serious note, someones opinions will inevitably become fact. Only time will tell. I've said what I had to say. No hard feelings. :goodjob:

[Glides]

That is not a prime example of ignorance. That was a statement directed to you and only you since you have claimed that my posts reeked of hatred pointed in your direction. Unless I misunderstood you, my comment makes perfect sense.

I was unaware that I needed to throw out a disclaimer when debating. I apologize for being late in the process and will remedy that by posting my disclaimer immediately following the period that will conclude this sentence.

Disclaimer:

The information transmitted in electronic forum messages sent from one_bad_sho, or referencing this disclaimer, and any posts attached:
1. is intended only for the person, persons, entity, or entities to which it is addressed.
2. does not necessarily represent the views of all soldiers.
3. may contain humor not meant to be taken literal
3. may contain confidential, controversial and/or privileged materials.
In the case of confidential, controversial and/or privileged materials, any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of or taking of any action in reliance upon these materials, by persons or entities other than the intended recipient may be the subject of legal action.
If you read posts in error from one_bad_sho and were offended, please:
1. punch yourself in the face



HOOAH!

Awww. That's cute. Did I upset you enough that you felt the need to post this?

Also...on the COMPREHENSION note. I said your posts aimed veiled hatred towards Muslims....not me. I'm sure you missed that though in your race to try and poke more fun. :goodjob:

Never hard feelings. It's a debate, what you say matters not one bit when I hit the X button. :)

[One_Bad_SHO]

Awww. That's cute. Did I upset you enough that you felt the need to post this?

Also...on the COMPREHENSION note. I said your posts aimed veiled hatred towards Muslims....not me. I'm sure you missed that though in your race to try and poke more fun. :goodjob:

Never hard feelings. It's a debate, what you say matters not one bit when I hit the X button. :)

Clearly I misunderstood your post... you know, seeing as it says nothing about Muslims:



I mistake your humor for hatred, when you aim it at someone it's pretty easy to do so. You keep saying to comprehend what you are saying. That's how I comprehend it and I am sure I would not be alone.


At least, thats the post I was referring to. No need to dissect this whole thread. We are veering away from a debate and shifting towards a pissing contest now, of which I have no interest in participating.

God Bless ya. Or... Allah Snackbar. Whichever. :yes:

[bu villain]

Both parties are at fault here but probably more so the government. The business should have made it clear that they make sights with scripture references on them and then the goverment should have asked them to not put it on the ones they buy. Since it is now after the fact, they should simply require that all future purchases don't contain them and switch out the old ones. Problem solved! Not that difficult was it?

[Starrfire]

OH! like etching scripture on bullets and dipping them in holy water. Now that's how you hunt werewolves and vampires since we are talking about supernatural beings...


That makes me wonder. I was going to buy some trijicon illuminated sights, or some meprolites. Maybe the trijicons will be the front sight dot as a cross lol. Very subtle how they did it though. Really trying hard to push the belief when you put it on a mass produced product to kill people. If I did have a problem with it I'd file it off and paint it back black.

[mushroom_toy]

Question: Will scripture sights be more accurate?


Jk, was gonna jump in on this convo, but I dont think I will right now anyway lol.

[apex2305]

God Bless ya. Or... Allah Snackbar. Whichever. :yes:

Wow, I don't know you, nor am I muslim, but saying ignorant crap like you do CAN'T get you very far in life. Amazing. But this is exactly why I love this country, no matter how stupid your comments, you are given the right to say them..........good job fella!

[apex2305]

But to make sure it is understood. I think its cool that they are written on the scope, but I understand its a terrible image for our country. People already SWEAR we are waging a holy war against islam............we dont need anything else for the propaganda, brain washing terrorists to be able to show as an example to recruit people. Every time they get low on numbers they find anything and everything they can to point out to young impressionable kids that this IS in fact a holy war, that they MUST fight for their god. And I believe the less we give them, the better. Will this stop them from recruiting, no, will they find something else, hell yes. But why give them more ammo? If a soldier wants to inscribe something on their weapon, more power to them, but to have a mass produced item that basically shows that the gov't is behind it, thats not what we need to help our cause. All my brothers and sisters are in the armed forces one way or the other, so trust me when i say I understand a need for religion on the battlefield, but like i said, we have to be more thoughtful to not give them something else to fight for. Just imagine al-jazeera right now. All they can talk about is shit like this, when they can't find anything, they make crap up, at least we can disprove some of it, but this, how do we dispute it?

[mushroom_toy]

Next Up: We shall now lobbest thy holy hand grenade.

[ahabion]

You know... I was driving down the interstate today and saw somebody with a Darwin fish sticker on their bumper. I said to myself... "Oh miGosh! How dare they?!" and then to make things worse... there was a South Carolina driver with a Clemson paw on their back windshield... "Oh miGosh! How dare they?!"

Put whatever you want on the gun... if I'm using it, I'm going to fire any gun for it's intended use... to shoot something. Woopty doo... stop crying and evolve.

[5speed]

I think people should learn a good deal of history before they start posting in here.

[Got Milk?]

Yea I saw this too. My immediate reaction was, "Who cares".

Then I thought about it and I have to say it's a bit sickening. Christianity is already the one thing responsible for more wartime deaths than any other and now a company, who we are paying BILLIONS too, is taking it upon themselves to wage a Holy War against Muslims.

No matter who tries to justify this, it is just that, a Holy War against Muslims. We are putting Bible Scriptures on the sights that help our soldiers kill Muslims. Pretty shitty and i'm ashamed to say I live in the USA on this one.

I personally think the Muslim religion is a shithole that dismisses and often encourages violence against women, children and anyone they see as not belonging. But for us to wage a war without persecution, we cannot allow this to continue.


There is religion, than there is culture.

In Quran it actually states that everyone should be treated equally, suicide is a sin, and so much other stuff those Eastern muslims do is against Islam. I hate most of Eastern "muslims", they just give the rest of the muslims people in the world a bad name.


You guys should understand that what eastern arabs, somalians "muslims" do over there is not based on religion of Islam, but its bassed on their culture. I put quotes on the muslim part because those are not muslims, they break about every rule and way of Islam.

Most things they do, like beat their women, commit suicide bombing, all that is against the religion of Islam, and based on Quran, it will send you straight to hell.

I know most of you don't give a shit about what I just wrote, but I hate when people mix culture ways with religion ways.

I always tried to educated people about Islam, but they just don't wanna hear it.

:cheers:

[5speed]

There is religion, than there is culture.

In Quran it actually states that everyone should be treated equally, suicide is a sin, and so much other stuff those Eastern muslims do is against Islam. I hate most of Eastern "muslims", they just give the rest of the muslims people in the world a bad name.


You guys should understand that what eastern arabs, somalians "muslims" do over there is not based on religion of Islam, but its bassed on their culture. I put quotes on the muslim part because those are not muslims, they break about every rule and way of Islam.

Most things they do, like beat their women, commit suicide bombing, all that is against the religion of Islam, and based on Quran, it will send you straight to hell.

I know most of you don't give a shit about what I just wrote, but I hate when people mix culture ways with religion ways.

I always tried to educated people about Islam, but they just don't wanna hear it.

:cheers:

Thank you, I think everyone needed that. Same goes for Christianity.

[One_Bad_SHO]

Wow, I don't know you, nor am I muslim, but saying ignorant crap like you do CAN'T get you very far in life. Amazing. But this is exactly why I love this country, no matter how stupid your comments, you are given the right to say them..........good job fella!

Oh my god! I poked a jab at Allah! That means I'm ignorant! I'm such an ass. How will I ever get far in life. I should never make fun of anything or anyone if I plan to succeed in life. Thank you for your advice. Without it, I'd be lost. You have really opened my eyes. :goodjob:

[bdydrpdmazda]

who fucking cares what is written on the side of our sights? some people act like it is a different sight because it has some sort of secret code on the side of it. What is engraved on the sights or weapons we use doesnt change anything. it just gives religion haters something to whine and complain about. People make it out like we are out shooting random people when really all we are trying to do here is protect our selves and the innocent people of the countries we are protecting. I have comment on the way i feel about the wars we are fighting and I wont ever post one on here but if the company making these sights wants to put these "secret codes" on the weapons they make it is their right to do so. they are the ones making them and the US is buying them as they are.

[StreetHazard]

Question: Will scripture sights be more accurate?


Jk, was gonna jump in on this convo, but I dont think I will right now anyway lol.




Next Up: We shall now lobbest thy holy hand grenade.


:lmfao::lmfao::lmfao: reps!

[apex2305]

Oh my god! I poked a jab at Allah! That means I'm ignorant! I'm such an ass. How will I ever get far in life. I should never make fun of anything or anyone if I plan to succeed in life. Thank you for your advice. Without it, I'd be lost. You have really opened my eyes. :goodjob:

I'm glad, that was my mission:goodjob: enjoy your new enlightened state!

[ISAtlanta300]

Me thinks that 80% of the soldiers prob. couldn't tell by memory what the scripture reference is... let alone 80% of the population......

So why is it an issue again?

[bu villain]

who fucking cares what is written on the side of our sights? some people act like it is a different sight because it has some sort of secret code on the side of it. What is engraved on the sights or weapons we use doesnt change anything. it just gives religion haters something to whine and complain about. People make it out like we are out shooting random people when really all we are trying to do here is protect our selves and the innocent people of the countries we are protecting. I have comment on the way i feel about the wars we are fighting and I wont ever post one on here but if the company making these sights wants to put these "secret codes" on the weapons they make it is their right to do so. they are the ones making them and the US is buying them as they are.

Some of us actually want to follow the intent of the constitution. You know, the whole government not promoting any certain religion thing. Kinda important.

[geoff]

the U.S. secretly campaigning a Holy war? lolololololololololololol. please do show me where this American government promotes christianity? please show me one time where Obama has said a prayer in Jesus name or any other member of our government. In TRUE christianity there is no such thing as a Holy war. My Jesus tells me to love my enemies and not to kill. this has nothing to do with religion. there are one of two things going on here....

a. the american government really doesnt care whats on the scope or any other piece of military equiptment, they simply buy tools that get the job done, and someone came along and got their feelings hurt cuz they saw this scripture and turned it into some Holy war crap.

b. the american government knows exactly what is going on and is using it as a cover and trying to make people hate christians. prophecy in my bible says that this will happen and it seems to be unfolding right along.

either way, the american government doesnt care about God, Jesus, Muhamed, Allah, or any other thing to do with religion. its all about getting what they want done.

[Total_Blender]

This is the kinda shit you have to deal with you give contracts to the lowest bidder :ninja:

[Glides]

Hmm. I think 90% of the people in here missed the entire jist of why this is such a big deal.

I personally could give a shit less what is in the part number on the side of a Trijicon scope.....UNTIL is becomes one more reason for the people who are not fighting...to fight and kill Americans.

I know our government does not promote Christianity and anyone with common sense would know that too. The problem is, people we are fighting probably don't know that. and the Taliban or whoever we fight, will use that as a tool to sway their mind. Sort of like a Jedi Mind Trick. "These are the Americans you wish to kill, they hate Islam. See, it's on their weapons".

You want to see some good examples of Propaganda, check out North Korean posters.

http://calitreview.com/875

Are we dropping babies down wells? I don't think so. Or Russian ones.

http://englishrussia.com/?p=312

Is America promoting a Holy war against Islam? Nope. Will they draw a poster with a "Jesus Gun" on it shooting down innocent defenders of Islam? Probably. Will it make people furious even though it is completely untrue? You bet your ass it will.

It's like wearing a shirt that says "I fucked her" with an arrow pointing to your left and walking around standing next to guys wives. Did you actually fuck her? Nah. Does the guy know you didn't fuck his wife? Probably. But will her husbands buddies egg him on until he punches you in the face for doing it? Most likely. It's just more small pointless shit that will blow up into HUGE pointless shit that some dumbass will use to cause trouble somewhere. Easiest way to stop it....don't wear the shirt.

[geoff]

i get where your coming from buddy, and i strongly agree that it will be used to fuel the fire of hatred. my point was that if not this incident of the biblical engraving then it would be something else. the nation of islam isnt pissed that we have scriptures on our weapons, they are pissed that our weapons are pointed at them and we are swinging our red, white, and blue nutts around for the entire world to see.

[Glides]

i get where your coming from buddy, and i strongly agree that it will be used to fuel the fire of hatred. my point was that if not this incident of the biblical engraving then it would be something else. the nation of islam isnt pissed that we have scriptures on our weapons, they are pissed that our weapons are pointed at them and we are swinging our red, white, and blue nutts around for the entire world to see.

Exactly.

The scriptures just add alot of gas onto an already hot fire.

[ash7]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9sPTR-nMds

This is something that is fairly easy to see in our conflicts in the middle east, but is not really talked about...also not easily "proved" because of the military's policy seems to present a constitutional paradox in that the First Amendment's Establishment Clause restricts the government's authority to fund and endorse religion, yet we see it violating these laws as easily as breathing in and out. I suppose Islam and Christianity are both religions of "peace" if it can ever be attained through killing and waging wars in the name of god, by all appearances this means the U.S. military is engaging in a religious war.

But Trijicon does make some very nice sights!

:rolleyes:

and since you've hopped on the Conspiracy Train, here's another one for you to watch:

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1ewpr_conspiracy-fact-911-was-an-inside-j_news

for being an atheist or whatever you claim to be... you sure do like to post in the religious section.
-jonathan

[5speed]

This one from the Russian link didnt have a good description so I take it upon myself to tell you, my grandfather was in the military for the Union Soviets and has told me the mentality of Russia and its government.

They dont like the idea of the UN bc it allows other people to butt into others business and eventually has potential for unified totalitarian world government. The olive leaves have long represented peace since ancient times. The USA and UN will destroy any chance of peace in the USSR

[StreetHazard]

:rolleyes:

and since you've hopped on the Conspiracy Train, here's another one for you to watch:

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1ewpr_conspiracy-fact-911-was-an-inside-j_news

for being an atheist or whatever you claim to be... you sure do like to post in the religious section.
-jonathan


That video does not pertain to me or any of my personal views, if you have any questions for me I will be more than happy to respond. Try to form them coherently though or you will be openly mocked accordingly, and to avoid any confusion.

I embrace the the fact that islamic extremist's attacked our soil, and killed our people. Because we get to see first hand the dangers of a theocracy (a government based upon religious values), and the destructive nature of the fanatical religious mind for everyone to behold.

And I post here to offer an opposing viewpoint to the growing cancer that is abrahamic religion. To avoid confusion I refer to abrahamic religion being the world's three primary monotheistic faiths of Judaism, Christianity and Islam, emphasizing their common origin and values as all being tied to the patriarch "Abraham"

[Dietcoke]

This is the kinda shit you have to deal with you give contracts to the lowest bidder :ninja:

You sir, are an idiot. Trijicon's ACOG sights are the best money can buy for their intended purpose. And no, no one gives a shit about the serial numbers. My job in the army is supervising a weapons shop attached to 4-9 infantry, and in the 5 years I've been in, I've never noticed or cared about the serial numbers, and neither has anyone else in my chain of command.

Lowest bidder is a fucking ignorant statement, seeing as the ACOG patent is held by one company, and trust me, there are less fine examples of sights in use in the Army but everyone wants either one of these for all around use, or a holo sight for CQM. Wonder why that is? :rolleyes: The Iraqi army here loves them too. Trust me when I tell you that these guys could really give a crap less about numbers on the side, compared to form or function. They are envious of our weapons, not offended by them.

[Total_Blender]

I'm happy for you that you like 'em, I guess. I wasn't insinuating that they are bad parts, I am not a gun person so I really couldn't care less.

[mushroom_toy]

:lmfao::lmfao::lmfao: reps!

Lolol thanks haha. I was hoping at least someone would get the 2nd one. :)

[Glides]

This one from the Russian link didnt have a good description so I take it upon myself to tell you, my grandfather was in the military for the Union Soviets and has told me the mentality of Russia and its government.

They dont like the idea of the UN bc it allows other people to butt into others business and eventually has potential for unified totalitarian world government. The olive leaves have long represented peace since ancient times. The USA and UN will destroy any chance of peace in the USSR

Exactly. You sir get reps for being smart enough to explain what Propaganda is. It is a person, governments, entities interpretation of something packaged and distributed to whoever they wish to stir a person or group of people to action. That's basically it. Whether it's true or not, doesn't matter. If a person see's the same sign over and over again saying how bad someone is, they might just believe it.

the power of persuasion.

[geoff]

kind of like when all people see is false christians trying to preach something they themselves dont follow and try and force their beliefs on non-believers and wave the bible in peoples faces and tell them to repent of burn in hell.....if thats all non believers see are hear it gives a false image of those that might actually be the real deal and makes people like me jobs harder

[5speed]

Exactly. You sir get reps for being smart enough to explain what Propaganda is. It is a person, governments, entities interpretation of something packaged and distributed to whoever they wish to stir a person or group of people to action. That's basically it. Whether it's true or not, doesn't matter. If a person see's the same sign over and over again saying how bad someone is, they might just believe it.

the power of persuasion.

Thank you very much. Their idea of the UN is stronger today as it has ever been.

[One_Bad_SHO]

As previously stated, Ahmed isnt going to get much propaganda to recruit more jihadists because of this. It's laughable. WE are the ones making a big deal about it. Pathetic. Its hardly in the news anymore. As I've said before... fuckin liberals. We've got bigger issues than a code inscirbed onto a scope that 99% of the population had no idea stood for a bible reference. Yes, its wrong legally. But you fucking liberal morons are the ones making a big deal about it. YOU are the ones dishing out propaganda. This country is losing its balls because of folks like you. Move to France or Venezuela. I revert back to one of my original posts:



I am Ahmed the jihad-inclined Muslim and I hear about Jesus guns. Do I wait for someone like you to give me a well-reasoned explanation about why the Bible quotes are contextually relevant, or is this what pushes me over the edge causing me to declare death to the infidels and sign up with Al-Qaeda? I'm pretty sure Ahmed the Jihadist really doesn't need the Jesus Guns as a prime motivation to sign up for the chance to get those 72 virgins. It HELPS, but the chance of it being especially significant are relatively small. I co-sign that shit.

I'm out of this one. Ya'll have fun. :goodjob:

[StreetHazard]

kind of like when all people see is false christians trying to preach something they themselves dont follow and try and force their beliefs on non-believers and wave the bible in peoples faces and tell them to repent of burn in hell.....if thats all non believers see are hear it gives a false image of those that might actually be the real deal and makes people like me jobs harder

sort of....people waving a Bible, the Quran or the Torah and forcing those beliefs onto others is part of the reason we have the current killing fields in the middle east, and that rectum of humanity, that sacred shit hole in the sand in the middle of it....Jerusalem

The other part is money and control. Those things love each others company like flies and shit.


As previously stated, Ahmed isnt going to get much propaganda to recruit more jihadists because of this. It's laughable. WE are the ones making a big deal about it. Pathetic. Its hardly in the news anymore. As I've said before... fuckin liberals. We've got bigger issues than a code inscirbed onto a scope that 99% of the population had no idea stood for a bible reference. Yes, its wrong legally. But you fucking liberal morons are the ones making a big deal about it. YOU are the ones dishing out propaganda. This country is losing its balls because of folks like you. Move to France or Venezuela. I revert back to one of my original posts:



I'm out of this one. Ya'll have fun.


The video is just an underlying example of what I think is the current mindset of fundamentalist christians which everyone knows also holds a very strong base in the gun lobby. That is the reason I think the owner of Trijicon incorporated scripture into the serial numbers. Those numbers (admittedly I do not know for sure) were probably placed there long before they had any kind of government military contract as those scopes and sights are sold to law enforcement and civilians as well (even I used to own an ACOG scope), and the owners and manufactures have a full right to express their belief. But mostly, I just thought it was "interesting" and I personally don't feel strongly about it one way or another.

But I cannot ignore the connotations of putting holy symbols on military weapons. And you can call me whatever names you choose too, Liberal, Socialist, faggot, Devil Worshiper....I have heard it all before, but all it does is prove what a fucking infant you truly are, I suggest that you do leave this board because the scope of these conversations obviously fall far out of the scope of intelligence you are capable of.

[5speed]

sort of....people waving a Bible, the Quran or the Torah and forcing those beliefs onto others is part of the reason we have the current killing fields in the middle east, and that rectum of humanity, that sacred shit hole in the sand in the middle of it....Jerusalem

The other part is money and control. Those things love each others company like flies and shit.

LOL, you said rectum.

[geoff]

just to throw this out there, i believe 5speed stated that thats why the idea of the UN is growing stronger, a prophecy in the bible speaks of this and says that there will be a one world government, kinda funny how we have the EU, soon the NAU, and so on and so forth.

[5speed]

just to throw this out there, i believe 5speed stated that thats why the idea of the UN is growing stronger, a prophecy in the bible speaks of this and says that there will be a one world government, kinda funny how we have the EU, soon the NAU, and so on and so forth.

The Bible does say a lot about things like that. They have been pretty spot on for awhile now but that is just how it works. History has shown us time and time again that when a group of power nations combine they topple and crumble. It is inevitable. I am not saying that you are wrong or the Bible is wrong, but stating that it only makes sense because it has happened before. I.E. Roman, and Mongolian empires, and German and Italian unification.

[geoff]

yes its true that it has happened before. But the bible states clearly that in the prophesied end times the one world power would be a coalition of nations from the four corners of the earth whereas the Roman, Mongol, German, ect... was one nation that arose and deafeted the surrounding nations to take control. this world power in the bible is made up of all nations that willingly give their power to one being and are united. there will be no fighting, war, or power struggle to form this one world power.

[Got Milk?]

Hmm. I think 90% of the people in here missed the entire jist of why this is such a big deal.

I personally could give a shit less what is in the part number on the side of a Trijicon scope.....UNTIL is becomes one more reason for the people who are not fighting...to fight and kill Americans.

I know our government does not promote Christianity and anyone with common sense would know that too. The problem is, people we are fighting probably don't know that. and the Taliban or whoever we fight, will use that as a tool to sway their mind. Sort of like a Jedi Mind Trick. "These are the Americans you wish to kill, they hate Islam. See, it's on their weapons".

You want to see some good examples of Propaganda, check out North Korean posters.

http://calitreview.com/875

Are we dropping babies down wells? I don't think so. Or Russian ones.

http://englishrussia.com/?p=312

Is America promoting a Holy war against Islam? Nope. Will they draw a poster with a "Jesus Gun" on it shooting down innocent defenders of Islam? Probably. Will it make people furious even though it is completely untrue? You bet your ass it will.

It's like wearing a shirt that says "I fucked her" with an arrow pointing to your left and walking around standing next to guys wives. Did you actually fuck her? Nah. Does the guy know you didn't fuck his wife? Probably. But will her husbands buddies egg him on until he punches you in the face for doing it? Most likely. It's just more small pointless shit that will blow up into HUGE pointless shit that some dumbass will use to cause trouble somewhere. Easiest way to stop it....don't wear the shirt.

Intelligence just clicked in. :goodjob:

And If i was to ever to go to war for USA Army, I sure as hell would not hold a gun with bible writings on it. I rather take a knife and take my chances pretending to be rambo.

[5speed]

yes its true that it has happened before. But the bible states clearly that in the prophesied end times the one world power would be a coalition of nations from the four corners of the earth whereas the Roman, Mongol, German, ect... was one nation that arose and deafeted the surrounding nations to take control. this world power in the bible is made up of all nations that willingly give their power to one being and are united. there will be no fighting, war, or power struggle to form this one world power.

It was the empires intent for world domination and their idea of the world was minuscule then. Just weren't successful. You know why? Because we are human. People on IA cant even agree with each other most of the time, what makes you think involving the world in a matter could make it work. It is way too foolish to think that could ever happen and I dont think politicians are that stupid, not even Obama or Bush.

EDIT: The company has already agreed to remove the script codes from the weapons. But how do they do it? Recall all of them and trade with new ones or return the refurbished ones?

[eraser4g63]

Wow, It is the companies right to put what ever they want to on the scope. It is their product and they are allowed to market what ever they want. ( I am not a christian but sick of all the BS crap a lot of these people get).

[5speed]

Wow, It is the companies right to put what ever they want to on the scope. It is their product and they are allowed to market what ever they want. ( I am not a christian but sick of all the BS crap a lot of these people get).
I agree, but the military shouldn't be using it with that on there. I do believe in Jesus and all but the fact is it is illegal. I believe in full support of the Constitution, so this doesnt slip by.

[geoff]

actually my friend the only catalyst needed to bring forth a one world order would be a catastrophic event such as a huge natural disaster or nuclear war. the people would look for order and some form of organization and the entire world would work together to restore order. under extreme stress the natural human instinct is to submit to a natural leader

[Starrfire]

Intelligence just clicked in. :goodjob:

And If i was to ever to go to war for USA Army, I sure as hell would not hold a gun with bible writings on it. I rather take a knife and take my chances pretending to be rambo.


THIS

This is the reason it is wrong. This man is a muslim. He wants about as much to do with Christianity as I do which is none. I'd just file it off and take the punishment if there was one. But fuck religion being pressed on those who don't want it. And fuck the soldiers involved with the bibles and shit, its not their job and only makes them look like fools.

[5speed]

actually my friend the only catalyst needed to bring forth a one world order would be a catastrophic event such as a huge natural disaster or nuclear war. the people would look for order and some form of organization and the entire world would work together to restore order. under extreme stress the natural human instinct is to submit to a natural leader
That wouldn't work. We do look for leaders but not like that.

Just take a step back and think about this. Let's say we were in the Nuclear War scenario. Countries would be battling each other and destroying one another but citizens remain. They are still a nation even if their leaders have been toppled and armies beat down. Lets just throw North Korea out there as an example. N. Korea initiates warfare and the world fought on both sides, but we are now in the aftermath. Are you telling me that both sides would be willing to cooperate and form one government? After all of that devastation are we able to forgive and forget. No... that is not the human way.

Our religions and beliefs aren't enough to change that. Thats like saying Kung Pao (lol) slit my mothers throat and burned my family alive on his governments command. Some of those powers and people behind the curtain still remain, but I am going to forgive them and be on their side now. :no:

[StreetHazard]

Intelligence just clicked in.

And If i was to ever to go to war for USA Army, I sure as hell would not hold a gun with bible writings on it. I rather take a knife and take my chances pretending to be rambo.


I agree, but the military shouldn't be using it with that on there. I do believe in Jesus and all but the fact is it is illegal. I believe in full support of the Constitution, so this doesnt slip by.


THIS

This is the reason it is wrong. This man is a muslim. He wants about as much to do with Christianity as I do which is none. I'd just file it off and take the punishment if there was one. But fuck religion being pressed on those who don't want it. And fuck the soldiers involved with the bibles and shit, its not their job and only makes them look like fools.


:D

[geoff]

5speed- i said natural disaster. you look at whats happening in haiti right now, the world is joining together to help. take this scenario for example, a giant meteor hits earth ( actually very scientifically plausible ) and the world as we know it is changed. chaos is everywhere. in this scenario the fear we feel as humans would push us to find some sort of solid ground somewhere. the bible in revelations speaks of many natural disasters ( earthquakes, meteors, ect...) that will happen and thats when the anti-christ will rise up and take control. he will offer salvation to a dying world and we will give all power to him.

[Starrfire]

Who gives a fuck about an anti christ, I would hate him just as much. People are gullible, but I'm not a "sheeple" per say. Religion is religion, and I don't cheer for either side. Satanists don't give 2 shits about what Christians think, or any anti christ for the most part. Such an individual would get in the way of their thinking just as much as if Christianity was made mandatory. The concept of an anti christ is retarded.

[5speed]

Fuck the devil














that is all...

[geoff]

starfire- the bible says the anti-christ will be a smooth man, an orator who will soothe the people with his voice, astonish men with his knowledge, and proclaim to be God Himself with false miracles. its the non believers who look for tangible proof that will first be decieved. when this man comes he will be given power by the devil and will do miracles and provide tangible evidence. many will believe then, but this man will preach against us traditional christians and against Christ Himself. christianity will be seen as an enemy of the state. i know you dont believe me but think of this. the bible prophecies of the mark of the beast: "And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:and that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six." revelations 13:16-18. then look at this..http://www.verichipcorp.com/ this chip is to locate, identify, and " protect" peoples assets. funny thing is that it needs to be placed in an area that has minimal interference with skin and muscle tissue...like your hand.

seems similar no? if you want tangible evidence you go and read into the prophecy of the end times. and then look at the major news articles and take a look at the world around you. the biblical prophecies are not vague, they are very specific and are unfolding. how can men thousands of years ago guessed about this? unless it really came from God.

[geoff]

i know this is off topic but maybe not. the biblical end time prophecy also speaks that natural disasters will increase greatly before the second coming of the Lord. these past 10 or so years have seen the GREATEST number of deaths related to natural disaster, think the tsunami in the asian countries, and the numerous earthquakes....just to put that out there too.

[Starrfire]

The anti christ was Nero, of Roman times. I think we're good. And if someone does "miracles", then who is gonna just bend over backwards to follow the bastard. No one gives 2 shits in todays times to do such a backwards religiously driven thing as to hunt down Christians. Nobody cares that much.

Just fear tactics IMO.

[geoff]

yes the bible does refer to emperor nero but you have to also realize that the bible says a spirit of anti-christ has always been here and that it has been in control of i believe 6 empires so far, think roman, nazi, ect...but the bible clearly states this will be a literal man. and if a man came claiming to be God Himself and was healing and raising people up from the dead and calling down fire from heaven believe me many would follow and believe. and if people believed this man was God and he told them the christian believers or followers of the false " Jesus " Christ were the evil ones then people would persecute us.

[Starrfire]

I would like to say people are not stupid enough to follow someone like a little dog, but I know I'd be wrong because people are stupid and feel like they need to fit in. So they find a place to fit in and become sheep, unable to think for themselves. Happens a lot with religion, but it would be just as easy for the same bunch of dumb asses to follow someone else.

Smart people wouldn't follow this person, and since 2 billion people on the planet are of retarded Christian values, almost all political figures, would not let this pass.

So let the retarded image of an anti christ die because jesus doesn't rule the world, people do. And I don't give a shit about either side.

[geoff]

thats the exact problem, Jesus doesnt rule the world, people do and people by nature are selfish and when a man comes with power to actually change things and people see that he can promise and fulfill their deepest desires, they will follow. and you honestly think the corrupt governments of the world wouldnt jump on board of the anti-christ, remember he will promise them vast amounts of power and money.

[StreetHazard]

WIN! :D

[Starrfire]

^^^LOL, its like you found bigfoot or something there.

[StreetHazard]

^^^LOL, its like you found bigfoot or something there.


I did! you don't run across photos like that everyday, it might as well be the loch ness monster