Boosting a ITR??????

[simplyblurredmrT]

Before I get moved I'm posting in the all motor thread beacuse I would like to know the opinions of the all motor people like myself.

I have noticed several pics of Turbocharged/Supercharged ITR's or ITR motors. IMO doing so is a waste of a great all motor powerplant. Now I have seen great results from high compression boost. But I don't think that is what those motors are made for. Just wanted to know some other opinions.

[yerrow]

i agree with ya, to run any real boost numbers, you have to undo what the factory did so well and de-tune it. i'd rather boost an ls

[SLOWR/T]

ahhhh boost the hell outta it!!!

[flysi00]

my girl gots a boosted type R rebuilt and she loves the thing

i like something with vtec. i had a boosted LS and it wasnt nuttin like my girls type R

[speedminded]

look at Alfonso's Rrrrr....soo quick, i think all you really need to do it put on a thicker headgasket or even a thin plate just to drop the compression a little...I'm still trying to figure out the high compression turbo's.

[Big Rick]

look at Alfonso's Rrrrr....soo quick, i think all you really need to do it put on a thicker headgasket or even a thin plate just to drop the compression a little...I'm still trying to figure out the high compression turbo's.

whats alfonso running at the strip?

[Vteckidd]

its not that high of a compresion , its 10.6 or 10.8:1 i cant remember. All the guys locally making 550+whp run at least 10:1. Its a good way to run good numbers wihtout having to do much to the motor. you can boost 10lbs with the right management system. dont be afraid of it.

as far as a waste of a good all motor plant, well, i personally would ratehr have a GSR over an ITR. you can get a full GSR swap for roughly $2000 less. with that $2000 you can buy a sweet header, cams, valvetrain and intake manifold, and put out much better numbers thatn the ITR. the only disadvantage is that you lose LSD, and the gearing.

[dwnsthGABOY]

as far as a waste of a good all motor plant, well, i personally would ratehr have a GSR over an ITR. you can get a full GSR swap for roughly $2000 less.

The place that ur getting these engines from is it a place that ne body can go purchase an engine from, or is it a wholesale operation and u have to be a shop owner an buy in bulk or something. Either way, how much can u get a h22a1 w/ecu for?
Also how much for a full b16 swap?

[speedminded]

The place that ur getting these engines from is it a place that ne body can go purchase an engine from, or is it a wholesale operation and u have to be a shop owner an buy in bulk or something. Either way, how much can u get a h22a1 w/ecu for?
Also how much for a full b16 swap?

H22's run like $1,800 all day long with transmission.

[Vteckidd]

im with speedminded, h22 swaps are cheap

[simplyblurredmrT]

^^^Well you have a copy of the Fax don't you 'kid?

[-S Double C-]

type r= worst motor to turbo

[speedminded]

type r= worst motor to turbo

and why is that?

Is it just because of the initial cost of the engine? I paid $2,600 for a brand new honda factory assembled b18c5 block and a brand new unassembled, mostly still in the honda baggies, P73 head. For another $1,000-1,500 i could drop the compression with a plate between the head and block and put together a turbo kit...can you build a brand new turbo engine (never been turned over) with the same parts or of equal quality & reliability for $4,000? ...of course would need to spend another $1,000 on engine management though.

[Vteckidd]

type r= worst motor to turbo

Please tel me why? im interested to hear your reasons

[Professor X]

Please tel me why? im interested to hear your reasons

I am also interested in hearing this. I can't think of how this would be the worst motor to boost when it's the best B-series motor produced. However, I would be interested in hearing your thoughts on your statement.

[THEONE]

so how hard would it be to drop 13:1 compression down to a low enough level to run a turbo? im considering doing this on my ls/vtec.

[Danny]

type r= worst motor to turbo

worst post ever^^^

-----
static compression is somthing not to worry about as much, what you have to worry about is compression under load. Do the math and figure a safe loaded compression, and go from there. Most high powered turbo motors run a decent high compression.

[speedminded]

so how hard would it be to drop 13:1 compression down to a low enough level to run a turbo? im considering doing this on my ls/vtec.

Who's running 13:1?

[THEONE]

Who's running 13:1?

my little hatch.any suggestions?

[speedminded]

my little hatch.any suggestions?

13:1 on an LS/VTEC? What internals you running? Is this with a B16 head?

[THEONE]

13:1 on an LS/VTEC? What internals you running? Is this with a B16 head?

i belive its a b16 head and it was decked and it has itr pistons,arp rod bolts and studs,itr cams valves and springs and the list goes on. so how can i drop the compression?

[speedminded]

i belive its a b16 head and it was decked and it has itr pistons,arp rod bolts and studs,itr cams valves and springs and the list goes on. so how can i drop the compression?

the cheapest & easiest way is a thicker head gasket...i think HKS makes a 2.6mm but it's pricey. The most reliable way would be switch out the ITR pistons.

[THEONE]

the cheapest & easiest way is a thicker head gasket...i think HKS makes a 2.6mm but it's pricey. The most reliable way would be switch out the ITR pistons.

then i would need my block machined again right? the engine is still new.dammit how low will that gasket drop my compression?and should i ditch the head too,since it was decked?

[speedminded]

then i would need my block machined again right? the engine is still new.dammit how low will that gasket drop my compression?and should i ditch the head too,since it was decked?

There are several disadvantages of simply putting on a thicker head gasket and if i were to build a turbo engine i'd want a taller block w/ new rods, pistons, etc. that had a little longer & smoother stroke...i'm not familiar enough with forced induction to be recommending much so i'd wait for feedback from VTECkidd or one of the sponsors.

[Vteckidd]

get some cams and a good header, and rock the All motor beast!

If your wanting to go turbo, then youd need to switchthe pistons out for it to be reliable.

if its indeed 13:1, which it pulled like it when we tuned it, there is nothing you can do.

to get your compression to a safe level youd need like a .100 headgaket which is 5 times the stock thickness roughly. what you have to remember is that the head will not be sealed as well since its farther away from the blocks metal surface. so you try running boost on it, your most likely gonna blow the headgasket out.

Plus, even with that thick of a gasket (which would have to be custom made from Cometic) your compression would still be pretty high for a turbo application, esepcailly since you have stock rods and sleeves. if you want to go turbo, youll have to pull the block apart and switch to forged internals with a 9:1 ration, since the block has been decked and milled.

[-S Double C-]

I am also interested in hearing this. I can't think of how this would be the worst motor to boost when it's the best B-series motor produced. However, I would be interested in hearing your thoughts on your statement.

Professor ask Virgil you know as good as i do i was gonna buy a hatch with boosted type r and he explain about an hour worth of talking to me why not to get it and why the motor wasnt good on boost.

[Vteckidd]

Professor ask Virgil you know as good as i do i was gonna buy a hatch with boosted type r and he explain about an hour worth of talking to me why not to get it and why the motor wasnt good on boost.

anyone who said that is a MORON. A type R is actually better to boost, it has strong ringlands, LSD, decent compression (10.6) which is good for low boost. (10lbs)

Its got better cams for boost (ITR which is what most poeple run)

For a stock motor, its fine to boost, as LONG AS ITS DONE RIGHT. you slap a turbo kit on with 10lbs, and its gonna blow if you dont TUNE IT.

Fuck ask Alfonso in UNDER PRESSURES forum he had a ITR with a thick headgasket and a turbo kit running 12s i belive, in a HEAVY ass DC2 chassi

[WINDSOR]

anyone who said that is a MORON. A type R is actually better to boost, it has strong ringlands, LSD, decent compression (10.6) which is good for low boost. (10lbs)

Its got better cams for boost (ITR which is what most poeple run)

For a stock motor, its fine to boost, as LONG AS ITS DONE RIGHT. you slap a turbo kit on with 10lbs, and its gonna blow if you dont TUNE IT.

Fuck ask Alfonso in UNDER PRESSURES forum he had a ITR with a thick headgasket and a turbo kit running 12s i belive, in a HEAVY ass DC2 chassi

alphonso running 12s? hahaha! Try almost in the 10s..He ran 11.0@133 at montgomery.

[THEONE]

[QUOTE=vteckidd]get some cams and a good header, and rock the All motor beast!

thats the other idea,i just want to get as much power as i can out of this motor so im thinking cams or boost but i have not found anyone to tell me how much labor would be on cams. i got a price from you on cams but i have no idea how to change cams in a honda .the turbo thing i guess will never happen with this motor. so how can i check to see if the compression is as high as ive heard.ive heard 13:1 , 13:5.1 , and 13:3.1 .im not sure but the little hatch will move pretty good

[Vteckidd]

alphonso running 12s? hahaha! Try almost in the 10s..He ran 11.0@133 at montgomery.

NO im talking about him running 12s with JUST a thicker HEADGASKET. not on his 500WHP+motor. which NEGATES this whole arguemnt, cause its no longer a TYPE-R stock motor, its a sleeved and built Low compression motor. we are talking about a stock ITR motor with stock compression, or stock internals

but nice try Ford boy :P

[Vteckidd]

[QUOTE=bodydropped]

get some cams and a good header, and rock the All motor beast!

thats the other idea,i just want to get as much power as i can out of this motor so im thinking cams or boost but i have not found anyone to tell me how much labor would be on cams. i got a price from you on cams but i have no idea how to change cams in a honda .the turbo thing i guess will never happen with this motor. so how can i check to see if the compression is as high as ive heard.ive heard 13:1 , 13:5.1 , and 13:3.1 .im not sure but the little hatch will move pretty good

only way to do it is CC the block, which means it has to be apart.

Install cams/valvesprings and retainers i charge $500(with valvetrain), i pull the head and resurface, reseat the valves, comes with heagasket, cam seals, valve seals, and valve cover gasket.

If you already have good vavletrain (NOT ITR) then its $150 to install cams, comes with cams seals and valve cover gakset

[-S Double C-]

there's a 4 door 93 civic around here thats was for sale on IL with a typr r and a rev hard stage 2 turbo kit and i busted his ass with my b16/greddy turbo kit setup..but the guy has nasty fuel problems and really needs a tune hell even i was running untuned at the time... and had my own problems

[Professor X]

Sean,
I'm not sure what motor Virgil is talking about, but as Vteckidd has stated, the Type-R actually has more boost-friendly components than the other b-series motors.
If you look at Nissan and Toyota stock turbo setups, you will see that they use low-comp to reduce pre-ignition. This is because it's a stock setup designed to run 1,000,000 miles without warranty issues.
Now, consider a Honda with higher compression. This just means that the tune has to be more precise, to prevent pre-ignition. Add larger injectors, a fuel pump, add an EMS that can control valve timing, ignition timing, and tune an engine that was designed to work without the assistance of a turbo.
The problem with Honda's and turbos is that most people spend too much on the turbo setup and have nothing left to tune. I can speak from personal experience on this. I was a victim.
I was speaking with the owner of Tiger Racing one day and he made it simple for me. He said how people will spend $3,000 on a motor and $3,000 on a turbo setup and then want to control it all with a $150 VAFC. That doesn't make much sense does it?
It isn't the B18c5 at fault, it's the TUNE!
Repeat after me, TUNING IS YOUR FRIEND!!!
HTH!

[WINDSOR]

NO im talking about him running 12s with JUST a thicker HEADGASKET. not on his 500WHP+motor. which NEGATES this whole arguemnt, cause its no longer a TYPE-R stock motor, its a sleeved and built Low compression motor. we are talking about a stock ITR motor with stock compression, or stock internals

but nice try Ford boy :P

oh shit,my bad man. I wasn't paying attention.

[Vteckidd]

how people will spend $3,000 on a motor and $3,000 on a turbo setup and then want to control it all with a $150 VAFC. That doesn't make much sense does it?

this man speaks the truth.

And no offense Sean, but "i busted this guys ass with my b16" doesnt mean jack shit to me. I beat STIs and EVOs all day long with my all motor CRX. I beat turbo K series hondas, i beat sr20 swapped 240s.

who cares, on the street its all about gearing and mph. especially from a roll.

Its all about chassis wieght, and traction,

Show me full DYNO numbers from both cars, and where peak HP was made and what the midrange was, then ill care.

You cant say a TURBO ITR sucks cause you beat one on one occasion. hell, I beat tons of sr20 powered 240sx's. does that mean all SR20s suck cause i "busted their ass?" NO, ask silviadrftr, i wouldnt touch his car, runs 11.7s , its a SR20 with mild mods.

EDIT: I "heart" windsor

[speedminded]

I was speaking with the owner of Tiger Racing one day and he made it simple for me. He said how people will spend $3,000 on a motor and $3,000 on a turbo setup and then want to control it all with a $150 VAFC. That doesn't make much sense does it?
It isn't the B18c5 at fault, it's the TUNE!
Repeat after me, TUNING IS YOUR FRIEND!!!
HTH!

sam had a mean little crx, running low 13's with just an ITR swap. Wise man, i like his work...if only i could have one of those FD's.