Organized Religion
whats the point of it? a sense of belonging?
isnt religion supposed to be your own beliefs and its between you and your god/lack there of a god?
lets discuss this
The thing that bothers me about organized religions is the herd mentality.
"Herd mentality describes how people are influenced by their peers to adopt certain behaviors, follow trends, and/or purchase items"
Val for President
I see it as most see people see other organizations they join; to be with like minded individuals. If you believe in Christianity it is nice to have a place where the teachings can be taught, and understood. Same goes further for Methodist, Baptist, Catholithc, etc.
The herd menality is everywhere you go. It is more prevalent in religion due to the impact religion has on the world as a whole. Same as the extremist theory. People, individuals may I add, will go on the deep end to defend what THEY believe and not realize the trouble they cause.
"Dear Lord ... please protect me from thy followers... Amen.
J'son"
"I'm not a gynecologist... but I'll take a look."
If that is the logic that you're using to describe organized religion, then it would be no different from anything else. Car enthusiasm, frats, colleges, philosophy, scientology,... everything. People, in general, require themselves to have social influences and community in order to maintain themselves as a civilized people. Tracing people all the way back into history, mankind has always followed the same communal patterns of socialized groups. Evolutionists would also agree, studying the behavioral patterns of primates.Originally Posted by Hulud
So if you see organized religions as utilizing the herd mentality, then yes, you are correct but again, it's not different from all other things.
Quick question: What would be considered disorganized or unorganized religion?
i agree its not any different that a lot of things in life. but what you chose to ignore was the fact that i said "isnt religion between you and god"
its not that its disorganized but if you're religious you shouldnt feel like you have to goto church/temple/etc.. to serve your god. because these people who lead and are in the church tell you how you're supposed to praise your god.
Val for President
You are absolutely right about going to church. Depending of course on the religion, I can only speak of Christianity for my own defense, but no, I don't have to nor am I require nor obligated to go to church for a place to worship because within my faith, "the church" is not a structure of buildings. It's contained within the people. The people are the church, they don't need elaborate buildings nor fancy doo-hickees to worship.
Why then with all the huge buildings and elaborate technologies and the like??? That is what draws people who are looking and seeking for themselves the meaning of what a full life really is to them. It's not for everybody because everyone has their own convictions.
The people within some churches that lead, you're also correct, in that they do tell you how to worship and praise (which to me is sometimes wrong, based biblically) But there are those few that serve to add clarification to what values and standards "may" mean, as it "may" have intended it to be. Much like any teacher or professor must take into account the variables of that time along with cultural differences.
about disorganized/unorganized religion
I was just asking really just to ask, not to try to make you answer it in anyway... but just out of curiosity how the term "organized" ever got associated with "religion".
Did a google search on it and found a lot on the Catholic and Episcopal churches. I don't agree with a lot of their values and beliefs anyway but I think that's one of the spear-heads leading the charge in negativity for church and religion as a whole. The other is just church fans, they do all the right things on Sunday but life is different for them 6 days out of the week.
i can agree with this except the car enthusiast groups. some of you guys think the hondas and VW's with a rusted out hood and clean painted body is attractive. I say EFF that.
Objects in Mirror Appear to be losing.
i wouldn't say religion *utilizes* the herd mentality - bc that too is unfortunately human nature and one of the drawbacks up large socialized groups with centralized leadership. most ppl will find it easier to listen to the charismatic leader and leave the thinking to them.
i'd say instead that any organization taking advantage of this is abusing their power/influence. it's not unique to religion at all, i agree with you. but religion is what the OP is talking about in this topic. and SOME religions do abuse their authority, encourage the herd mentality, and discourage free-thinkers.
from a Christian standpoint...I'd say a good church would be one that teaches the basic bible concepts, encourages members to read the Bible for themselves and gives them guidance on how to approach advanced topics once they get the basics down by providing a good support system with experienced elders or whatever. the goal should be to help ppl develop that personal relationship with God and go wherever it takes them, even if it is away from that church, but always be there for support if ppl need it. there are churches like that out there...but they are in the minority.
the term religion implies organization. religions are organizations that put a framework on spirituality by describing it via a fixed set of rules/regulations/observances/etc. there's really no such thing as an "unorganized" religion, the terms don't match
i believe that organized religion is whats wrong in the world these days. its a personall relationship with God that we need to have. the first church after christ did not have a denomination or a name. they were a group of believers that sought the truth, supported eachother and all, and loved eachother and all. its the different oppinions and theories of men that made it into what it is today. we as believers are supposed to be unified as one body and Christ as the head, that is the ideal church and what it should be. as the bible says, there is one faith, one God, and one body with Jesus Christ as the head.
riding for God crew member #1
IA Domestic Alliance
couldnt have said it better
Val for President
church is no longer what it was intended to be but dont get me wrong...a GOOD church is still important. the bible states that hearing of the word brings faith. which if you think about it is very important. if you have no preachers how would you hear of God anyway? i guess it all comes down to where you find a comfortable place to worship God, hear the word, and find support and encouragement. i know its hard to believe but there are still some churches and people out there that do what they are supposed to, dont judge or comdemn, love all, and try to be a good example
riding for God crew member #1
IA Domestic Alliance
well i dont say anything about others peoples religion or what they believe in nor do i let other people influence me and my beliefs. I mean its not my place to tell them what to believe in. I hate it when other people say shit about what I or someone else believes in. It not like im hurting them by doing this. They just make things worse by saying what they do.
I think most people who go to church are looking for a sense of belonging and there is certainly a danger of group think but a group of people who are all looking to connect with god personally can still help each other by discussing their thoughts and ideas. It doesn't mean you have to believe exactly the same just because someone shares something they believe to be true for themselves.
All religions are organized.
How do you think they get started?
1 extremist has something interesting to say
<others hear him and start agreeing/believing due to his or her communication with god, allah, satan, whatever
<their numbers grow
<leaders are formed to study/invent new ideas and beliefs to keep people interested and loyal
<beliefs are turned into laws
<beliefs expand to the extent of converting even more to "the truth"
<murders ensue
etc
etc
etc
Religion is the best example of organized crime and control EVER seen.
god or evolution?
those are not even related. it is not the same argument
Objects in Mirror Appear to be losing.
organized religions are like government schools...LOL
still...they do serve a purpose. it's a fairly efficient way to easily teach basic spirituality/morality to people in a society, just like schools are a fairly efficient way to teach ppl how read/write/etc. and it's always uplifting to be around like-minded ppl who can encourage you to be a better person, etc...religion provides a good social network and that's why they subscribe to it.
everybody wants to feel loved and belong and religion fills that void for a lot of ppl, and it produces pretty decent individuals generally speaking so I don't knock it. the downside as you said...is that free-thinkers generally don't thrive in religions (unless they are leading them, lol). so you have the herd mentality.
my only gripe with some religions is that they don't encourage ppl to learn and grow on their own once they reach a certain maturity. some of them stifle the free-thinker rather than giving him the tools to keep growing. but this isn't the case for ALL of them though
What I'm confused about is the notion that just because we believe in a certain religion or belief that it somehow "limits" free thinking... I'm confused. Please somehow enlighten me. That's like saying because you join the military, you're no longer capable of free thinking or if you join IA, that it somehow limits your thinking.
Herd mentality or group think can be associated with almost anything, please drop it. Heck, IA is an example of herd mentality. Everyone thinks of CARS... oh noes! Somehow that stifles free thinking...?
note that i said SOME religions. not all but SOME. the very nature of how religions are set up tend to create a dependency between the leader of the religion and his followers. basically you go to church every week to receive instruction from the same leadership about spirituality. i've been to churches where the pastor spoke for over an hr without even opening his Bible or mentioning scripture to verify or validate what he was saying. that's ridiculous. this is a situation that can be very easily abused, and we see it happen all the time.
Herd mentality or group think can be associated with almost anything, please drop it. Heck, IA is an example of herd mentality. Everyone thinks of CARS... oh noes! Somehow that stifles free thinking...?
and you're right...herd mentality can be associated with almost any organization with centralized leadership. hell, look at how many ppl on IA or honda-tech are quick to call any teg or civic that doesn't have a clean OEM look or has wheels bigger than 16s RICE. lol. ppl get lazy and if the leadership doesn't encourage the members to think for themselves...they'd rather kick back and let the leader tell them what to do. we have the same problem with government but that's a different discussion lol.
the DIFFERENCE with religion though is that the stakes are much higher. it's not fads or trends...it's ppls lives we're dealing with.
everyone likes to feel like they're a part of something, else how you explain car clubs and such?
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