"Christians" Look Here - Questions & Answers

[Ran]

You'd be surprised to see that most of the Christian congregations are full of crap these days. Mindless taking in whatever spew is thrown at them from their preachers. Did you know that almost all of your protestant "beliefs" are misguided? Some examples...


1) The "Trinity" (the belief that God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit are one in the same) is NOT in the Bible. There are completely seperate.

2) Christmas is a pagan religion and NOT condoned by God or the Bible. Same for Easter. If you celebrate these holidays, then you are defying God's commandment to not associate him with them. Good job.

3) Unless you are one of the 144,000 chosen by God, YOU ARE NOT GOING TO HEAVEN. Those with salvation will inherit the New Earth after the great tribulation and armageddon. No wings, halos, or pearly gates. Sorry.

4) There is no "Hell" with eternal suffering. There is only eternal destruction. Which is yet another way how God is merciful if you think about it.

5) The Passover (bread and wine) IS NOT FOR EVERYONE. It's for the select 144,000 that will inherit the kingdom and reign with Jesus. That's why the original ceremony was held in private amongst Jesus and his diciples and not amongst the masses. Look it up.

6) God's name is Jehovah, not "God". It appears in the Bible over 100 times. Hence why you have "Jehovah's Witnesses". It makes sense.


I can back up any of these with scriptural reference if you'd like later. If you have other questions, ask and I'll answer.

Also, for the record, I'm pretty much agnostic with christian tendencies due to upbringing. I'm not an atheist trying to bash you.

[Killer]

you should always post the scripture for reference with things like this....

as for easter and christmas... yeah, you are exactly right on they are pagan holidays... some priest or roman catholic "leader" of some sort (i don't remember who) decided to start having christmas and easter on whatever those pagan holidays were so that it would look and appear like "everyone" was celebrating christ... (i could be a bit off on this... but i know i'm pretty close to the reasoning)

most christians know this.... if not they def need to...

but you've also gotta remember... those pagan holidays are kinda long gone and forgotten about... the days that everyone celebrate christmas and easter now are just that... christmas and easter...

do you celebrate either of them????

if so... why??? your agnostic....

further more... if you do, and aren't celebrating them for what most christians do... are you going back to the paganistic(- is that even a word? lol) roots of the holidays yourself?....

no... you're just happy to have some time off work get some extra presents and what not...

i'd be more than willing to bet God is pretty pleased with the fact that christians/catholics.. turned what were once pagan holidays/rituals into two different days of the year that even non christians are basically forced to think about Him/Jesus......

[Ran]

you should always post the scripture for reference with things like this....

I'll get my books are post them up later.

do you celebrate either of them????

Yes, but for no real reason other than to get off work and swap gifts, eat food, ect... They hold no religious meaning to me. Also, since I'm agnostic, I don't have to claim them to be something they're not. If you're a real Christian, you shouldn't be celebrating them. End of story.

i'd be more than willing to bet God is pretty pleased with the fact that christians/catholics.. turned what were once pagan holidays/rituals into two different days of the year that even non christians are basically forced to think about Him/Jesus......

You think, but you'd be wrong. I'll try to find the scripture for you. God SPECIFICALLY says to NOT associate his name with pagan beliefs or religions. He tells you not to do something, but you do it anyway because you "think" it's the right thing to do if you slap a Jesus sticker on it? You'd still be wrong. The path to Hell (which doesn't exist BTW) is paved with good intentions.

[Killer]

I'll get my books are post them up later.

not that i don't know where you're going with this stuff.. but please do...

Yes, but for no real reason other than to get off work and swap gifts, eat food, ect... They hold no religious meaning to me. Also, since I'm agnostic, I don't have to claim them to be something they're not. If you're a real Christian, you shouldn't be celebrating them. End of story.

..... exactly i already stated this.... but with your reasoning the only reason you should celebrate these days is with the pagan beliefs... and if you don't believe in them you shouldn't celebrate them...

You think, but you'd be wrong. I'll try to find the scripture for you. God SPECIFICALLY says to NOT associate his name with pagan beliefs or religions. He tells you not to do something, but you do it anyway because you "think" it's the right thing to do if you slap a Jesus sticker on it. You'd still be wrong. The path to Hell is paved with good intentions.

it's in what ever book that speaks about moses and all that... it's even in the ten commandments... "not to worship idols" like the golden bull they made to "worship god" when moses went and spoke with god on the mountain and received the commandments.....

1. if you don't believe in God/The Bible, you interpretations mean nothing... because they are just that... your interpretations... you can't tell me or anyone else that they are wrong for what they are doing.. or going against God... how am i going against something if it "doesn't exist" to you.... ?????

2. Man was basically made to fail... God knows we're gonna screw up... and we're allowed to do so... People put christians on to high of a pedestal sometimes.... christians are made of flesh too... they aren't perfect... and only the ones pretending to be christians claim they are perfect...

so it makes perfect sense that we would "do something we're not supposed to" we're human!!!!

[Ran]

1. if you don't believe in God/The Bible, you interpretations mean nothing... because they are just that... your interpretations... you can't tell me or anyone else that they are wrong for what they are doing.. or going against God... how am i going against something if it "doesn't exist" to you.... ?????

Agnostic != Atheist

I believe in a God or higher power, I just believe that organized religion is hideously flawed. Primarily Christianity.

Also, I'm not giving you my "interpretation". There is no "interpretation" to be made. I'm giving you what is written in your very own Bible. Unless you follow that BS King James Version with Unicorns.

And yes, I can tell some that they're wrong if their own book tells them that they're wrong but they're too stupid to read for themselves. I don't have to share beliefs with someone to know that what they're doing is wrong. The show me their ignorance everyday.

2. Man was basically made to fail... God knows we're gonna screw up... and we're allowed to do so... People put christians on to high of a pedestal sometimes.... christians are made of flesh too... they aren't perfect... and only the ones pretending to be christians claim they are perfect...

so it makes perfect sense that we would "do something we're not supposed to" we're human!!!!

I never said otherwise. But it's funny how all of these protestant religions (Baptist, Presbyterian, Catholic [ROFL], ect...) claim to have the answers but most of them don't understand it themselves. So in turn, they take their own flawed information and fool other people into false and misguided beliefs. I'm sure that makes God happy, right?

Sorry Killer, but your counter argument is weak at best. I'm not claiming to be perfect or anything of the sort. I'm only looking to correct the so-called "christians" on this site about THEIR OWN BELIEFS WITH THEIR OWN BIBLE. In essence, you could say that I'm doing them a favor.

[kadabra]

I'll post up my two cents in alittle bit. This is going to get good...

[Kelly]

1) The "Trinity" (the belief that God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit are one in the same) is NOT in the Bible. There are completely seperate.

The Bible teaches that there is only one God. (Isaiah 43:10, Isaiah 44:6-8, Isaiah 45:22)

The Bibles teaches that there is one who is called the Father and is identified as being God. (1 Peter 1:2)

The Bible teaches that there is one who is called Jesus and is identified as being God. (John 1:1-3&14-18, John 20:28-29, 1 John 1:1-4&5:20, Philippians 2:5-8, Revelation 1:17-18, Revelation 22:12-20)

The Bible teaches that there is one who is called the Holy Spirit and is identified as being God. (John 14:16-17, John 15:26, John 16:7-15, Acts 5:3-4, Acts 13:2, 1 Corinthians 12:4-18, Hebrews 9:14, Hebrews 10:15-18)

2) Christmas is a pagan religion and NOT condoned by God or the Bible. Same for Easter. If you celebrate these holidays, then you are defying God's commandment to not associate him with them. Good job.

What Colossians 2:16-17 forbids is the celebration of religious seasons or holy days when they have been prescribed as religious duty and necessary for holiness or spirituality.

In this passage, the Apostle is talking about the Old Testament festivals which were shadows of the person and work of Christ--but Christ has now come. To continue to celebrate them is to dishonor the fact of His coming, or to act as though He were not enough for salvation or spirituality. Note what the Apostle says, "let no one act as your judge in regard to . . ." He is saying don't let anyone tell you these things are requirements for fellowship with God. They were only shadows of the person and work of Christ, and He has not only come and fulfilled those shadows, but He is totally sufficient.

Colossians 2:16 and 17 in no way forbids believers from commemorating something such as the birth of Christ if it is done out of love, devotion, and the joy the season gives when used as a way of focusing on the Savior and not as a religious duty. The issue is not the observance, but the reason, the attitudes and the spirit in which it is done.

Furthermore, I believe there is scriptural precedent for commemorating and remembering the birth of Christ. This is in keeping with the events that occurred around the time of Christ's birth These include:

1. The appearance of the angel of the Lord with the glory of the Lord to announce the birth of Christ to the shepherds (Lk. 2:10-12).

2. The response of the angels at the announcement of Christ's birth (Lk. 2:13-14).

3. The actions of the shepherds who left their flocks to go and see which was nothing short of a celebration (Lk. 2:15-20).

4. And the arrival of the men from the east bearing gifts as much as a year to two years later (Matt. 2:1-12).

There is, of course, the New Testament precedent for believers meeting together on Sunday. In essence this is a celebration of the Lord's resurrection. The early church automatically did this, but Scripture does not command us to do so. In fact, the early church at first met daily and took the Lord's Supper daily, but we don't do that today. Why not? Because these are not binding. We are not under the Law. Believers meet on Sunday because of its significance and because the early church set a precedent for it, but it was never commanded in the Bible. Believers did it out of love and adoration for the risen Savior.

The point is this: If the early church could celebrate the resurrection without a specific command from God, only the spirit of legalism or the letter of the law would forbid the celebration of Christ's birth as a special season of joy and adoration. Ultimately, the issue is not the season, its the attitude and reason behind it and the distortion of it. Let's not throw out the baby with the wash.

3) Unless you are one of the 144,000 chosen by God, YOU ARE NOT GOING TO HEAVEN. Those with salvation will inherit the New Earth after the great tribulation and armageddon. No wings, halos, or pearly gates. Sorry.

Beloved, we simply do not know exactly how many will be in heaven. However, all who obey Jesus will be saved, whatever the total number (Heb. 5: 9).

4) There is no "Hell" with eternal suffering. There is only eternal destruction. Which is yet another way how God is merciful if you think about it.

Matthew 18:8
If your hand or your foot causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life maimed or crippled than to have two hands or two feet and be thrown into eternal fire.
Matthew 18:7-9 (in Context) Matthew 18 (Whole Chapter)
Matthew 25:41
"Then he will say to those on his left, 'Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.
Matthew 25:40-42 (in Context) Matthew 25 (Whole Chapter)
Jude 1:7
In a similar way, Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding towns gave themselves up to sexual immorality and perversion. They serve as an example of those who suffer the punishment of eternal fire.
Jude 1:6-8 (in Context) Jude 1 (Whole Chapter)

Matthew 5:22
But I tell you that anyone who is angry with his brother will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to his brother, 'Raca, ' is answerable to the Sanhedrin. But anyone who says, 'You fool!' will be in danger of the fire of hell.
Matthew 5:21-23 (in Context) Matthew 5 (Whole Chapter)
Matthew 5:29
If your right eye causes you to sin, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell.
Matthew 5:28-30 (in Context) Matthew 5 (Whole Chapter)
Matthew 5:30
And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell.
Matthew 5:29-31 (in Context) Matthew 5 (Whole Chapter)
Matthew 10:28
Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell.
Matthew 10:27-29 (in Context) Matthew 10 (Whole Chapter)
Matthew 18:9
And if your eye causes you to sin, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life with one eye than to have two eyes and be thrown into the fire of hell.
Matthew 18:8-10 (in Context) Matthew 18 (Whole Chapter)
Matthew 23:15
"Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You travel over land and sea to win a single convert, and when he becomes one, you make him twice as much a son of hell as you are.
Matthew 23:14-16 (in Context) Matthew 23 (Whole Chapter)
Matthew 23:33
"You snakes! You brood of vipers! How will you escape being condemned to hell?
Matthew 23:32-34 (in Context) Matthew 23 (Whole Chapter)
Mark 9:43
If your hand causes you to sin, cut it off. It is better for you to enter life maimed than with two hands to go into hell, where the fire never goes out.
Mark 9:42-44 (in Context) Mark 9 (Whole Chapter)
Mark 9:45
And if your foot causes you to sin, cut it off. It is better for you to enter life crippled than to have two feet and be thrown into hell.
Mark 9:44-46 (in Context) Mark 9 (Whole Chapter)
Mark 9:47
And if your eye causes you to sin, pluck it out. It is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye than to have two eyes and be thrown into hell

5) The Passover (bread and wine) IS NOT FOR EVERYONE. It's for the select 144,000 that will inherit the kingdom and reign with Jesus. That's why the original ceremony was held in private amongst Jesus and his diciples and not amongst the masses. Look it up.

We take Communion- the bread is in remembrance of his body that was broken and abused for us... the grape juice is in remembrance of the blood he shed.

6) God's name is Jehovah, not "God". It appears in the Bible over 100 times. Hence why you have "Jehovah's Witnesses". It makes sense.

God has many many names in the Bible
http://ldolphin.org/Names.html



Yeah, I did google some things- don't have the time to write out every verse.
Forgive me...

Is the Bible contradicting, yes... Why? I have no idea... It's all based on faith.

[JDMEK18]

Quote: 2. People put christians on to high of a pedestal sometimes.... christians are made of flesh too... they aren't perfect... and only the ones pretending to be christians claim they are perfect...

so it makes perfect sense that we would "do something we're not supposed to" we're human!!!!


I agree with you 100% - I'm a Christian (def. not a perfect person) if i were then i wouldn't need what makes me a Christian = Jesus!!

Friendly mentioning... (to the creator of the forum - I'm not passive but I am respectful so everything i write please rec' it as conversation and not battling you) I'm sure you could point out some stuff to us that we might of over looked in the bible but is it in its true context?

Quote: 1) The "Trinity" (the belief that God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit are one in the same) is NOT in the Bible. There are completely seperate.

Trust me, All bible readers know that the word trinity is not in the bible.. its a created word to represent the 3 in 1 (Father,Son,HolySpirit) ... we would have to talk in depth to explain this but its kind of like and egg (Shell,White,Yoke) They are all 1 item. Maybe that helps..

Quote: 3) Unless you are one of the 144,000 chosen by God, YOU ARE NOT GOING TO HEAVEN. Those with salvation will inherit the New Earth after the great tribulation and armageddon. No wings, halos, or pearly gates. Sorry.

I would like for you to be more specific with this.. The bible does talk about a new heaven and new earth but, it mentions nothing about us not being in God's presence whether thats us all walking around with God, Jesus, etc.. in heaven or if its like in the Garden when "God walked with Adam" , who knows? I have never read anything extremely clear with extreme description as to what life after "Christ Return" will be like... This i do know - that the bible talks about seperation from Him (Hell, lake of fire, etc.. for those that don't believe and he talks about the place that Jesus is going to prepare for those that believe in him.. What ever the fine details are, I want to be in the place that gives me eternal life with HIM!!

[Kelly]

I would like for you to be more specific with this.. The bible does talk about a new heaven and new earth but, it mentions nothing about us not being in God's presence whether thats us all walking around with God, Jesus, etc.. in heaven or if its like in the Garden when "God walked with Adam" , who knows? I have never read anything extremely clear with extreme description as to what life after "Christ Return" will be like... This i do know - that the bible talks about seperation from Him (Hell, lake of fire, etc.. for those that don't believe and he talks about the place that Jesus is going to prepare for those that believe in him.. What ever the fine details are, I want to be in the place that gives me eternal life with HIM!!

It's in Revelations:

The Lamb and the 144,000
1Then I looked, and there before me was the Lamb, standing on Mount Zion, and with him 144,000 who had his name and his Father's name written on their foreheads. 2And I heard a sound from heaven like the roar of rushing waters and like a loud peal of thunder. The sound I heard was like that of harpists playing their harps. 3And they sang a new song before the throne and before the four living creatures and the elders. No one could learn the song except the 144,000 who had been redeemed from the earth. 4These are those who did not defile themselves with women, for they kept themselves pure. They follow the Lamb wherever he goes. They were purchased from among men and offered as firstfruits to God and the Lamb. 5No lie was found in their mouths; they are blameless.

Again with Faith...

[Sport1.3]

One word. Dinosaurs

[Killer]

Agnostic != Atheist

I believe in a God or higher power, I just believe that organized religion is hideously flawed. Primarily Christianity.

Also, I'm not giving you my "interpretation". There is no "interpretation" to be made. I'm giving you what is written in your very own Bible. Unless you follow that BS King James Version with Unicorns.

And yes, I can tell some that they're wrong if their own book tells them that they're wrong but they're too stupid to read for themselves. I don't have to share beliefs with someone to know that what they're doing is wrong. The show me their ignorance everyday.

I never said otherwise. But it's funny how all of these protestant religions (Baptist, Presbyterian, Catholic [ROFL], ect...) claim to have the answers but most of them don't understand it themselves. So in turn, they take their own flawed information and fool other people into false and misguided beliefs. I'm sure that makes God happy, right?

Sorry Killer, but your counter argument is weak at best. I'm not claiming to be perfect or anything of the sort. I'm only looking to correct the so-called "christians" on this site about THEIR OWN BELIEFS WITH THEIR OWN BIBLE. In essence, you could say that I'm doing them a favor.

The Bible itself was written by man, has been translated by man, and every man has his own interpretation of "what means what" in the Bible... So even if you think my argument is "weak" I'm still right... You don't believe as we/they believe (i myself believe in a lot different way than what most christians do... so i'm kinda reluctant to include myself) there for even if it's in bold/and blatantly says "you shall not do this"... you still don't have the right to tell someone they are wrong for doing/believing/worshiping however they wish...

In my OPINION God convicts different people in different ways... just like i believe that Satan may tempt different people with different things....

















you know what just hit me...... in your original statement.... ???

1) The "Trinity" (the belief that God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit are one in the same) is NOT in the Bible. There are completely seperate.

2) Christmas is a pagan religion and NOT condoned by God or the Bible. Same for Easter. If you celebrate these holidays, then you are defying God's commandment to not associate him with them. Good job.

If God/Jesus/Holy Spirit are not One....

Why can't we celebrate Jesus birthday/death on pagan holidays???

YOUR argument contradicts itself.........

[JDMEK18]

It's in Revelations:

The Lamb and the 144,000
1Then I looked, and there before me was the Lamb, standing on Mount Zion, and with him 144,000 who had his name and his Father's name written on their foreheads. 2And I heard a sound from heaven like the roar of rushing waters and like a loud peal of thunder. The sound I heard was like that of harpists playing their harps. 3And they sang a new song before the throne and before the four living creatures and the elders. No one could learn the song except the 144,000 who had been redeemed from the earth. 4These are those who did not defile themselves with women, for they kept themselves pure. They follow the Lamb wherever he goes. They were purchased from among men and offered as firstfruits to God and the Lamb. 5No lie was found in their mouths; they are blameless.

Again with Faith...

Yeah.. I've read this before but i don't know where he is getting that they are the only ones going to "HEAVEN" (Thanks for pointing this out though!)

[Kelly]

The Bible itself was written by man, has been translated by man, and every man has his own interpretation of "what means what" in the Bible... So even if you think my argument is "weak" I'm still right... You don't believe as we/they believe (i myself believe in a lot different way than what most christians do... so i'm kinda reluctant to include myself) there for even if it's in bold/and blatantly says "you shall not do this"... you still don't have the right to tell someone they are wrong for doing/believing/worshiping however they wish...

In my OPINION God convicts different people in different ways... just like i believe that Satan may tempt different people with different things....

















you know what just hit me...... in your original statement.... ???




If God/Jesus/Holy Spirit are not One....

Why can't we celebrate Jesus birthday/death on pagan holidays???

YOUR argument contradicts itself.........

You completely lost me on that last part...

[JDMEK18]

Quote: Agnostic != Atheist

I believe in a God or higher power, I just believe that organized religion is hideously flawed. Primarily Christianity.

Question: Do you believe in the One True Living God? or is it another god?

[Killer]

One word. Dinosaurs

what about em???

[BABY J]

^^ IDK, but they are pretty tasty.

[Killer]

You completely lost me on that last part...

the last part hit me it's not related to the rest of the post...





ran is stating that GOD SAYS not to associate HIM with PAGAN rituals yadda yadda yadda.....

he also stated that GOD JESUS AND THE HOLY GHOST ARE NOT ONE....


Chirstmas and Easter celebrate JESUS life and death...

not God Himself.... (as far as rans argument is concerned)

he's contradicting himself.. by saying that the pagan holidays that celebrate jesus offend god because he said not to associate GOD with the pagan rituals....

do you not get it?


i'm having a hard time finding the right words for this!!! lol

[Ran]

The Bible teaches that there is only one God. (Isaiah 43:10, Isaiah 44:6-8, Isaiah 45:22)

The Bibles teaches that there is one who is called the Father and is identified as being God. (1 Peter 1:2)

The Bible teaches that there is one who is called Jesus and is identified as being God. (John 1:1-3&14-18, John 20:28-29, 1 John 1:1-4&5:20, Philippians 2:5-8, Revelation 1:17-18, Revelation 22:12-20)

1 John 1:15 - John told the truth about him when he cried out, "This is the person about whom I said, 'The one who comes after me ranks higher than me, because he existed before me.'"

Philippians 2-6: In God's own form existed he, and shared with God equality, deemed nothing needed grasping.

John 1:1-3 - In the beginning, the Word existed. The Word was with God, and the Word was God. He existed in the beginning with God. Through him all things were made, and apart from him nothing was made that has been made.

The Bible teaches that there is one who is called the Holy Spirit and is identified as being God. (John 14:16-17, John 15:26, John 16:7-15, Acts 5:3-4, Acts 13:2, 1 Corinthians 12:4-18, Hebrews 9:14, Hebrews 10:15-18)

John 15:26 - "When the Helper comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, the Spirit of Truth who comes from the Father, he will testify on my behalf."

Conclusion: THERE IS NO TRINITY

Also, your quotes about "eternal fire" are mistranslated. The original text reads "Gehenna" which was a firey wastepit in which things and bodies were discarded in. However, the people are already dead and no longer "existing" upon being thrust into the fire. The terms "Hell" and eternal suffering weren't applied until much later.

The Bible itself was written by man, has been translated by man, and every man has his own interpretation of "what means what" in the Bible... So even if you think my argument is "weak" I'm still right... You don't believe as we/they believe (i myself believe in a lot different way than what most christians do... so i'm kinda reluctant to include myself) there for even if it's in bold/and blatantly says "you shall not do this"... you still don't have the right to tell someone they are wrong for doing/believing/worshiping however they wish...

So you Christians can pick and choose which parts of the Bible to follow and which not to? Awesome.

If God/Jesus/Holy Spirit are not One....

Why can't we celebrate Jesus birthday/death on pagan holidays???

YOUR argument contradicts itself.........

So then you're just celebrating a Pagan religion? Yeah, because that's a lot better. lol

I would like for you to be more specific with this.. The bible does talk about a new heaven and new earth but, it mentions nothing about us not being in God's presence whether thats us all walking around with God, Jesus, etc.. in heaven or if its like in the Garden when "God walked with Adam" , who knows? I have never read anything extremely clear with extreme description as to what life after "Christ Return" will be like... This i do know - that the bible talks about seperation from Him (Hell, lake of fire, etc.. for those that don't believe and he talks about the place that Jesus is going to prepare for those that believe in him.. What ever the fine details are, I want to be in the place that gives me eternal life with HIM!!

It does say that God will be among us once again, which would put us in his presence. However, only the select 144,000 will reign in Heaven as kings with Jesus. Read Revelations and it's all pretty cut and dry.

[Killer]

^^ IDK, but they are pretty tasty.

never tried it...

[kadabra]

The Bible itself was written by man, has been translated by man, and every man has his own interpretation of "what means what" in the Bible... So even if you think my argument is "weak" I'm still right... You don't believe as we/they believe (i myself believe in a lot different way than what most christians do... so i'm kinda reluctant to include myself) there for even if it's in bold/and blatantly says "you shall not do this"... you still don't have the right to tell someone they are wrong for doing/believing/worshiping however they wish...

I don't think he was saying that you are WRONG for believing in the Bible/god. All he was saying was that the Holy book is covered with flaws, and that Religion or better yet, Christianity has a bunch of hypocrites and followers that don't care about the rules "God" created. Thus giving a your religion a bad name.

And like you said on your post, the bible was written by "man." Not a higher power like so many people choose to believe.

The new testament, the old. Which one is faker than the other? Hmm Im going to go with both. Just what I think. They both contain false tails.

In my OPINION God convicts different people in different ways... just like i believe that Satan may tempt different people with different things....

And just like you have your opinions on how things work, others do to. In my OPINION, God does not exists, but an evil does. And no, im not Satanic, but there are evil spirts out there and VERY LITTLE good.

[Ran]

he's contradicting himself.. by saying that the pagan holidays that celebrate jesus offend god because he said not to associate GOD with the pagan rituals....

If your son was associated with something you didn't want him to be, would you not in turn be associated with it indirectly? Same thing.

[Kelly]

Yeah.. I've read this before but i don't know where he is getting that they are the only ones going to "HEAVEN" (Thanks for pointing this out though!)

I need to read more into... Gotta love Revelations The part where we win!

Seems like this may be who fights during the Tribulation- the 3 year period where God is totally NOT PRESENT on Earth. After the Rapture...

Step 1- The dead in Christ shall rise 1st
Step 2- We get raptured
Step 3- "The Tribulation"- People on Earth have their second chance and for 3 years get to decide if they are gonna believe in God this time. Tough choice since God will not be present on Earth. It's hard enough now, when we get to feel Him in a church service every now and then. Not to mention the fact that you will be martered if you believe. I think I'll stick it out the first time- much easier .
Step 4- Those who don't believe get condemned to Hell, then God brings Heaven down to Earth... Eternally... Woo!

Probably won't happen exactly that way, but

[Ran]

I don't think he was saying that you are WRONG for believing in the Bible/god. All he was saying was that the Holy book is covered with flaws, and that Religion or better yet, Christianity has a bunch of hypocrites and followers that don't care about the rules "God" created. Thus giving a your religion a bad name.

And like you said on your post, the bible was written by "man." Not a higher power like so many people choose to believe.

According the belief, the Bible is God's word written through man. God inspired if you will.

But yes, modern day religion is a joke and Christianity is leading the revolution in producing a bunch of non-informed morons into a new false religion.

[Ran]

Step 4- Those who don't believe get condemned to Hell, then God brings Heaven down to Earth... Eternally... Woo!

Wrong. No Hell. Please read into it. There is NO HELL FOR US. It specifically says "eternal destruction". No fire, no brimstone, no eternal suffering. DESTRUCTION. NON EXISTING.

Man, I wish I had my Bible and study guides on me.

[Killer]

So you Christians can pick and choose which parts of the Bible to follow and which not to? Awesome.

Not what i said... My point is If you don't even believe that the words in the bible are true... WHY ARE YOU PREACHING THEM?... it shouldn't concern you... let people believe as they want to... as an agnostic its not your job to "spread the message"

So then you're just celebrating a Pagan religion? Yeah, because that's a lot better. lol

dude, you're just pulling stuff out of no where....

again.. point made is you say there is no trinity...

but god says not to associate HIM with pagan holidays...

nothing about associating jesus with them....

if god and jesus are not the same person then your argument is void....

[Kelly]

Wrong. No Hell. Please read into it. There is NO HELL FOR US. It specifically says "eternal destruction". No fire, no brimstone, no eternal suffering. DESTRUCTION. NON EXISTING.

Man, I wish I had my Bible and study guides on me.

You're telling me I'm wrong because every scripture I gave you was "mistranslated". That's all you got?

[kadabra]

According the belief, the Bible is God's word written through man. God inspired if you will.

Exactly, belief. I find it funny when people continue to say that the HOLY BOOK was created by the HOLY GOD. There is no scientific proof that this EVERY happened. NO proof of a person with his caliber every existing, NO proof that such events from the bible EVERY took place. So it amazes me when people STILL CHOOSE TO BELIEVE IN IT.

But yes, modern day religion is a joke and Christianity is leading the revolution in producing a bunch of non-informed morons into a new false religion.

But hey, we're the bad guys when we choose to not believe in it. Right? Riiighhht...

[kadabra]

You're telling me I'm wrong because every scripture I gave you was "mistranslated". That's all you got?

No, he just corrected your attempt at trying to make a point.

[Ran]

You're telling me I'm wrong because every scripture I gave you was "mistranslated". That's all you got?

What version of the bible are you using?

But hey, we're the bad guys when we choose to not believe in it. Right? Riiighhht...

Apparently, to be uninformed or misguided is no fault of our own. I don't think any of these modern-day congregations have the answers, but they think they do. According to Revelations, we'll be shown the answers during the Tribulation and they we make our choice. To not be informed is one thing, but to openly deny the truth is another.

[Killer]

I don't understand why you care.... other than to "rile up" some people on ia..... care to explain that to me?




btw, you and i get along very well on this site.. non of this is an attack or an out lash towards you...

[Kelly]

Listen, I will be the first to tell you that I haven't read all of the Bible, etc...

But I'm telling you right now I have felt God. Believe me or not He is as real to me as my mother. And no one can tell me any different because again, I have experienced it...

[Killer]

Exactly, belief. I find it funny when people continue to say that the HOLY BOOK was created by the HOLY GOD. There is no scientific proof that this EVERY happened. NO proof of a person with his caliber every existing, NO proof that such events from the bible EVERY took place. So it amazes me when people STILL CHOOSE TO BELIEVE IN IT.

When you learn some more FACTS.. and that the word EVER AND EVERY are two different words... you can talk....

[JDMEK18]

Sorry for the *** trying to seperate!

*** Quote ***
1 John 1:15 - John told the truth about him when he cried out, "This is the person about whom I said, 'The one who comes after me ranks higher than me, because he existed before me.'"

John 1:1-3 - In the beginning, the Word existed. The Word was with God, and the Word was God. He existed in the beginning with God. Through him all things were made, and apart from him nothing was made that has been made.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelly
The Bible teaches that there is one who is called the Holy Spirit and is identified as being God. (John 14:16-17, John 15:26, John 16:7-15, Acts 5:3-4, Acts 13:2, 1 Corinthians 12:4-18, Hebrews 9:14, Hebrews 10:15-18)

John 15:26 - "When the Helper comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, the Spirit of Truth who comes from the Father, he will testify on my behalf."

Conclusion: THERE IS NO TRINITY


**********

I see what your saying but this doesn't prove there is no Trinity - it proves that there is!! We are not saying that you can't put God, Jesus, and The holy spirit next to each other.. were saying that the word Trinity represent all tree of them!!! But they are all of God and From God.. Jesus is sitting on the Right hand of the Father in Heaven so we know that they are seperate ...but ONE!! Jesus said that he was sent by the Father and what he speaks is not of him but of the Father.... He also Said that the HolySpirit would speak and confirm what He has said about the Father!! There is only one GOD!!! Jesus is the Son of GOD!! The HolySpirit is the spirit of truth, comforter, etc..

There is a Trinity!!!!

[Kelly]

What version of the bible are you using?

New Internation Version

Most all of the versions mention an eternal fire in Jude 1:7

[Kelly]

I see what your saying but this doesn't prove there is no Trinity - it proves that there is!! We are not saying that you can't put God, Jesus, and The holy spirit next to each other.. were saying that the word Trinity represent all tree of them!!! But they are all of God and From God.. Jesus is sitting on the Right hand of the Father in Heaven so we know that they are seperate ...but ONE!! Jesus said that he was sent by the Father and what he speaks is not of him but of the Father.... He also Said that the HolySpirit would speak and confirm what He has said about the Father!! There is only one GOD!!! Jesus is the Son of GOD!! The HolySpirit is the spirit of truth, comforter, etc..

There is a Trinity!!!!

Exactly

[kadabra]

Listen, I will be the first to tell you that I haven't read all of the Bible, etc...

But I'm telling you right now I have felt God. Believe me or not He is as real to me as my mother. And no one can tell me any different because again, I have experienced it...

This is exactly what my mother tells me. No one is clowning on you for believing in it, it's just hard for others who haven't experienced certain phenomenons to understand. You probably feel the "heat" of his hands, right? Thus making a your own conclusion that it was actually the hand of GOD that touched you.

[kadabra]

When you learn some more FACTS.. and that the word EVER AND EVERY are two different words... you can talk....

Haha, damnit!

[JDMEK18]

One word. Dinosaurs

Yeah, i know - the bible doesn't say anything about dinosaurs but it doesn't say anything about Sport1.3 (Put your name here) either but your real and breathing..

(I don't know why people base there hole faith or no faith on dinosaurs)

Mentioned in love though!

[Kelly]

This is exactly what my mother tells me. No one is clowning on you for believing in it, it's just hard for others who haven't experienced certain phenomenons to understand. You probably feel the "heat" of his hands, right? Thus making a your own conclusion that it was actually the hand of GOD that touched you.

Can't say that I have. I've just felt his presence. Not only at church...

[kadabra]

Yeah, i know - the bible doesn't say anything about dinosaurs but it doesn't say anything about Sport1.3 (Put your name here) either but your real and breathing..

(I don't know why people base there hole faith or no faith on dinosaurs)

Mentioned in love though!

It's not that we're putting our faith into them, just that we should put them out there to show that the theory of evolution and the start of life did not come from Adam and Eve. But like Sport1.3 is real and breathing, thus making him real. Shouldn't we be able to see GOD doing the same?