every person from the immagration topic please read.

[fight club]

i felt like making my own thread for the simple fact the other one got sidetracked, and i would like these points heard, flamed, whatever, because it gets it out there. and the shit i read pissed me off.

1.) Bush doesnt hate black people. the stupidity of this statement cannot begin to register to most people. now, to go ahead and take care of the arguements.
1a.He took his time giving aid. damn, sorry congress didnt have billions of dollers laying around. dispite most beliefs, those "rich white guys" dont just chill with that kind of cash. there is protocol for those kind of operations, which is funny, because you are all for protocol with immigration, but if your people are in trouble, fuck it all to hell you want it now.
1b. Marshal law if Bush wanted to kill of the african american population, he wouldnt make it this public. now, what could of caused the decleration of shoot to kill? could it be the stealing of TVs, raping, murdering, the shooting and attacks agianst rescue helicopters and personell trying to help them out? no, it must be racism. lets play a game, imagine a tornado broke a damn near a trailer park, and all the white trash started raping, shooting, and looting, and Bush declared marshal law, would he hate whites?

2.) Illegals dont have insurance its funny, i bet alot of people on here dont have insurance, or pay for their insurance. and even better, out of the people i know, the ones without insurance are legal citizens, so lets not start the stereotypes when addressing a problem, stick to fact. there will always be someone without insurance, because someone will always have a better use for that money, they wont wreck, bla bla bla, doesnt make them illegal.

3.) Illegals took my job etc. Im gonna use a QD statement "theres a paper, with classifieds, pick one up" Americans, yes i am one, have giot this fucking idea that a job should be handed to them, because they are American, well to those with that mentality, i say fuck you, give me some of my illegal friends, at least they take pride in their jobs. Illegals arent taking your job etc, they are doing the jobs you are too proud to do/ think you are worth more bla bla bla. i work two jobs and its amazing, it took me 2 weeks to find one. at my evening job, its 100+ degrees moving 1400lb pallets by hand, for 12/hr. manuel labor. how many of you look to these jobs? i know of 6 warehouses hiring manual labor at 10+ dollers an hour, why not work there? because your American and your too good. Damn the company for not giving you an office and an easy job making 60k a year with no responcibility fresh out of high school, give me a fucking break.

4.) They contribute nothing i could say that about 86% of the people complaining. what do you contribute to the country? you call our leader a racist, whine about the state of affairs and do nothing. majority of immegrants are involved in the community, trying to make it better, because they know what ghetto really is, not the bullshit we declare to be ghetto. as a close friend said to me "its harder to get into this country than it is to move out of a so called "ghetto"" people in this country live in poverty because they choose to, and yes i can say that. in 1991, my mom was a single mom with 3 kids working full time and we lived in a shit neighborhood, the "Ghetto" ive heard it called. funny how she worked and saved and did the best she could to get our family where it is now. she never let us just give in and expect hand outs from the government etc. we have never had food stamps, welfare, etc, because she felt there were people out there that needed it more. i can say i truely pity them then. how many on here can say they worked side by side with their mom cleaning out maggot infested duplexes for the land lord in order to keep a roof over their head at age 6. spare me your bullshit.

5. I did it legally so they should too yea, and America broke free of Englands tyranny by themselves "legally" too, so all those dictatorships whose citizens yearn for freedom from opression should just do it. they dont need help. some people cant wait 10+ yrs to have an income, you do what you have to to support your family, to keep them alive. its a risk being here. the ones who come and exploit, deport them. the ones who are hear, are still trying to be legalized and working to better themselves and the community, i feel they should be given citizenship. also, to the Asian americans complaining, it is a hell of alot easier coming from an asian country than it is to immegrate legally from mexico. just not easier to do it illegally. if they could they would, and do. dont act all high and mighty, your people do it too.

6. this kid is white, he was given everything/ he has an advantage read post 4. and then this: ive worked at companies, since i was 15. i have two jobs. my parents give me a room and food. go them. its funny that if i had an advantage, how are there minorities with more than me? the answer is simple, but alot will not like it. PEOPLE WHO USE THIS ARE LAZY, ARROGENT, NARSISTIC ASSHOLES WHO DO NOT WORK FOR SHIT its funny, everytime a story is told of, for example, an african american lifting himself out of poverty etc, there is always an excuse. he sold out, he isnt true to his roots, theres still plenty suffering, etc. try not having drinkable water, no food, to the point your stomach is eating itself. id like to see everyone who thinks I as a white person has the upper hand in life to live my life. just one day. i work for what i have. simple as that. you dont have something you desire, work harder. yea it sucks, but its life. my ancestors immigrated here too. they wanted a better life. samer situation here. let me quote sometyhing famous that i will +1 anyone who knows what it is
" give us your tired, your sick, your poor" . the Americans who believed, and still believe it today, are true Americans. you rest are nothing but a discrace to the greatest nation ever.

7.) ive suffered too. why iraq? we have problems at home etc i am addressing this here because i know the same people bitching about immagration bitch about the war. let me ask you. in your "suffering" did you ever have a neighbor pulled out of their house and killed because of their religious beliefs? do you worry when you talk because the wrong inference of your point could result in your death? do thousands of your people dissapear and end up dead due to vx or any other type of chemical warfare? do your sisters and mothers fear walking down the street, as they know anymoment they could be taken and raped and gang banged by a group of elitist who hold power by milatary means? i thought not....


8.) Im black and we fought for our rights, and still fight today SHUT THE FUCK UP. not one of you can name a slave in your IMMEDIATE FAMILY. stop using the race card. it was wrong, too bad. the crutch doesnt work anymore. you are on the same playing field i am. its not the man holding you down, its ethic. why work for something when you could use your skin color to gain it with half the work. i am tired of people using this. my people were beaten and raped by the british and our crops stolen, our women raped. do you see me asking for restitutions? NO because it doesnt fucking effect me, just like slavory doesnt truely effect you. show me the plantation you used to work on, ill give you a prize. and dont take this as a anti-african remark. i hate all affermitive action, in fact, i feel the same way about women bitching that shit happens because they have breast. as for i get jobs because im white male, lets think. most people i work under arent white. why would they favor me? could it be im more qualified? agian, it goes back to the attitude of shit should be handed to you. at least you can say you truely are american, you have the mentality.


im done, im ranted out. my advice to all before you respond: put yourselves in their shoes, what wouldnt you do for your family? the answer should be nothing.

[TIGERJC]

wow thats one angry white boy. Too much bitching for me to read

[fight club]

lol not bitching, just laying the truth out for some people who want to avoid it.

[ShooterMcGavin]

keep in mind that your opinions may only be truths to yourself.

[LemonAJAX]

keep in mind that your opinions may only be truths to yourself.

if so, then me and him think alike.. lol +1 for oyu when i can lol

[Hektik]

+1 Awesome post man....

[Tank]

i gota agree with the post and yes im black ladies and gentlemen i will say our president/leader is still a fucking idiot and needs to take a acid bath quick however, i will say i agree with mostly everything else you said good productive rant man much respect from me. and you didnt use the N word LOL J/P

[Romeyo07]

I agree, but not completely on 5. The reference you made is not relevant. The issue is not them leaving their country, but coming into another one. Plain and simple, we have laws in this country, and although not everyone follows them, they do exist. I've got personal friends who waited 4 years before getting everything squared away to become legal here.

How about this...I'll break into your house and you have to sit there and like it. While you're at it, I've got some bills I need paid, and please make me breakfast.

Too poor to bring your family here....here's an idea...STOP HAVING KIDS. If you can barely support yourself, what makes you think you can support 8 kids? Maybe then would you be able to save up money. I've got a good friend who was born and raised in Mexico City. The opportunity within Mexico to live a normal life is there. Many poor people join the military. They give you meals and shelter, not to mention you get paid as well.

I grew up in South Florida where there were migrant camps and workers everywhere. You say those who are here are wanting to better themeselves and their communities, but that is not the case, at least for the most part. Every migrant worker neighborhood I've been to was dirty, had trash laying around (mostly beer cans), unkept houses and yards, etc. They get drunk daily, have poor hygene, fight often and always turn to violence.

Don't believe me? Watch Carlos Mencia. Think he's kidding when he jokes about them getting wasted and stabbing each other?

I know there are people in this country that do the same thing that are here legally. Does it make it right? No, not at all. Don't try to sugar coat how they are because I grew up with them, went to school with them, lived around them, and have been there myself. MOST of them don't care...I don't know where you're getting your information from.

[{X}Echo419]

+1 to all you MF's!

I'm with Romeyo on #5. but everything else, it's like you were reading my mind.
p.s. don't ever run for political office. someone will dig this up and you'll be branded a racist

[babygurl]

+1 to all you MF's!

I'm with Romeyo on #5. but everything else, it's like you were reading my mind.
p.s. don't ever run for political office. someone will dig this up and you'll be branded a racist

I agree with Romeyo as well...I have lived in the ghettos with alot of Illegals, mostly hispanics, asains, and some Indians, and the hispanics werent the cleanest, at least the ones I came in contact with. And also working in Gainesville, at a bonding company for over 3 years, I did see alot of hispanics arrested for violent crimes, drugs, Dui's. And 9 times out of 10 were illegal. And on welfare, and had 5-6 kids.

Now there were also alot of Whites, blacks, and other races, that were arrested for the same crime, but most is hispanic that get arrested in Hall County.

I am not racist, by any means, but I do feel people sugar coat illeagals immigrants, being here. There are alot that abuse the system, and there are also alot of citizens that abuse the system too, and the government is to blame for letting that happen, and we are also to blame for letting it happen as well.

Question thoough, isnt Bush trying to legalize the illegals here, and let them become citizens? Or am I wrong on that part?

[fight club]

I agree with Romeyo as well...I have lived in the ghettos with alot of Illegals, mostly hispanics, asains, and some Indians, and the hispanics werent the cleanest, at least the ones I came in contact with. And also working in Gainesville, at a bonding company for over 3 years, I did see alot of hispanics arrested for violent crimes, drugs, Dui's. And 9 times out of 10 were illegal. And on welfare, and had 5-6 kids.

Now there were also alot of Whites, blacks, and other races, that were arrested for the same crime, but most is hispanic that get arrested in Hall County.

I am not racist, by any means, but I do feel people sugar coat illeagals immigrants, being here. There are alot that abuse the system, and there are also alot of citizens that abuse the system too, and the government is to blame for letting that happen, and we are also to blame for letting it happen as well.

Question thoough, isnt Bush trying to legalize the illegals here, and let them become citizens? Or am I wrong on that part?

yes its true some our criminals, but like you said, whites, blacks, and the rest of the rainbow have criminals too. as for welfare and such, how did they get that if they are illegal? you need a SSN for welfare.... serious question, i would like to know if you do. because if they "stole" one , then that means they have to be paying taxes as well. welfare isnt as easy to get as one thinks, i had to take a class regarding it.

Bush is offering to offer the illegal immagrants a "guest worker program" it allows the ones in our country to come and register and be given temporary citizenship for 5 years, much like a visa. the policy would also help them become citizens by alotting more money to the INS to allow them to hire more people and become more effiecent on the backlog of applications for citizens. the policy DOES state that a background check etc will be done, just like you have to be to become a citizen, so all criminals would be deported. so it would be akin to doing a group interview for immagration instead of one on one as we typically do. they go, get a background check, they pass, they have 5 years to work and complete the process. in those 5 years, they pay taxes etc.

side note: another arguement agianst the not contribuiting anything. they buy stuff. food. cars. clothes. cowboy hats . those things get.... TAXED.

[Speedm0(\)key]

I agree with Romeyo as well...I have lived in the ghettos with alot of Illegals, mostly hispanics, asains, and some Indians, and the hispanics werent the cleanest, at least the ones I came in contact with. And also working in Gainesville, at a bonding company for over 3 years, I did see alot of hispanics arrested for violent crimes, drugs, Dui's. And 9 times out of 10 were illegal. And on welfare, and had 5-6 kids.

Now there were also alot of Whites, blacks, and other races, that were arrested for the same crime, but most is hispanic that get arrested in Hall County.

I am not racist, by any means, but I do feel people sugar coat illeagals immigrants, being here. There are alot that abuse the system, and there are also alot of citizens that abuse the system too, and the government is to blame for letting that happen, and we are also to blame for letting it happen as well.

Question thoough, isnt Bush trying to legalize the illegals here, and let them become citizens? Or am I wrong on that part?

werent the cleanest?.. who the fuck cares?.. why did you have to make that commment.. i dont beleive cherrykoolaid argued about "clean" at all. stupid racist bitch


everyone bitching about illegals will continue to do just that..whine and bitch, they'll continue to piss me off by talking shit behind a monitor.. but would one of these racist idiots ride down a buford highway neighborhood and make these comments outloud?.. lol.. i think not., its an inevitable invasion bitches.. get used to it and practice your spanish.. cause we're taking over regardless.

call me a SPIC if you want..

Spanish People In Control

[fight club]

werent the cleanest?.. who the fuck cares?.. why did you have to make that commment.. i dont beleive cherrykoolaid argued about "clean" at all. stupid racist bitch


everyone bitching about illegals will continue to do just that..whine and bitch, its an inevitable invasion bitches.. get used to it and practice your spanish.. cause we're taking over regardless.

call me a SPIC if you want..

Spanish People In Control

lol, i knew drama would hit. on the cleanest comment, imagine you deal with crimanals they wont be the cleanest people. i wasnt discussing the criminals. and to be honest, i prefer the cowboy look to the sheet-shirt and pantshort look, and the cowboy hat to the gangsta A hat anyday LOL. i still like my style better. and will, i know spanish puto.

[Ruiner]

werent the cleanest?.. who the fuck cares?.. why did you have to make that commment.. i dont beleive cherrykoolaid argued about "clean" at all. stupid racist bitch

everyone bitching about illegals will continue to do just that..whine and bitch, its an inevitable invasion bitches.. get used to it and practice your spanish.. cause we're taking over regardless.

call me a SPIC if you want..

Spanish People In Control

Umm, no. A lot of shit is going to be done in the next few years that will greatly crack down on illegal immigration. GA has already started the trend with laws that will take over in the summers of 2007, 2008, and 2009 depending on business size.

[babygurl]

werent the cleanest?.. who the fuck cares?.. why did you have to make that commment.. i dont beleive cherrykoolaid argued about "clean" at all. stupid racist bitch


everyone bitching about illegals will continue to do just that..whine and bitch, they'll continue to piss me off by talking shit behind a monitor.. but would one of these racist idiots ride down a buford highway neighborhood and make these comments outloud?.. lol.. i think not., its an inevitable invasion bitches.. get used to it and practice your spanish.. cause we're taking over regardless.

call me a SPIC if you want..

Spanish People In Control

THink I am racist all you want, but truth be told...the CRIMINALS I came in contact with working in a bonding company, werent the cleanest...and that ios putting shit nicely....And I also did state other races...so stop trying to make it like I am talking strickly about mexicans. I added more than that....thank you...

And I am not going to call anyone a spic I am sorry but I am not in 5th grade...And I have had discussions OUT LOUD with plenty of mexicans, and with other races as well! Believe it or not I do have a life outside of IA!

I grew up in the "hood" or ghetto whatever you want to call, so I have seen all types of different people...you dont know shit about me, nor my life...my opinons are my opinons....so get over yourself!

[bigdare23]

Damn people get bold when they are behide a computer screen!

[redlinenprelude]

and the hispanics were by far the dirtiest..

lol.

[{X}Echo419]

he's pandering to the ignorant public. same reason democrats want to let illegals vote and they get their pantys in a wad when you talk about making people "Prove" they are Citizens b4 they vote

[4dmin]

i guess this was a topic of opinion... here is mine.

1) as for Bush, i think its difficult for you or i to make any assumptions that he is or isn't racist... just b/c he took long or finally came through w/ aid says nothing. Politicians are motivated by 2 things: votes/money (remember that)

2) the majority of illegals do not have insurance, if you were in the healthcare industry you would know this. and if they do it is very well possible they have stolen SSN they are using to obtain such (in that case if found their policy would be terminated)

3) this is another opinated question... yes/no... jobs have been given to illegals not b/c they will do them and americans won't, but b/c they will work for less and ask for less. are they americans that think they are too good, i'm sure there is, but i know first hand to say they are just doing jobs americans won't is FALSE. my father has been a garbage man for 15+ years and a truck driver for most of his life. i don't want to hear shit about what americans are too good for b/c the true hardworking americans exsist today.

4) contributions... ummm ya i'm just wondering what they are contributing to the country they are in illegally? its not like they are fucking tourist. they live here using public owned roads, schools, healthcare, etc... w/o having to pay taxes. i don't find that contributing considering any american w/ a SSN is having to pay taxes on the wages earned.

5) do it legally... "the ones who come and exploit, deport them." hold on if they don't pay taxes they are exploiting our laws and country. and the reason why it is easier to come form an asian country is b/c you don't see 1000's hoping our boarders daily. if you go to another country you are required to follow their laws, we should expect the same; thats why only the mexican population is complaining. last time i checked canadians weren't protesting about rights they don't have in our country.

6) whites/blacks/hispanic... who gives a fuck? work hard and you will get what is coming to you. hand outs are for quitters.

7) iraq? we shouldn't be there, we shouldn't be policing the world. do they need help yes, but 200+ billion could of been spent alot better

8) +25

[Ran]

i guess this was a topic of opinion... here is mine.

...

Nice summary. +1 to both of you guys.

[fight club]

i guess this was a topic of opinion... here is mine.

1) as for Bush, i think its difficult for you or i to make any assumptions that he is or isn't racist... just b/c he took long or finally came through w/ aid says nothing. Politicians are motivated by 2 things: votes/money (remember that)

2) the majority of illegals do not have insurance, if you were in the healthcare industry you would know this. and if they do it is very well possible they have stolen SSN they are using to obtain such (in that case if found their policy would be terminated)

3) this is another opinated question... yes/no... jobs have been given to illegals not b/c they will do them and americans won't, but b/c they will work for less and ask for less. are they americans that think they are too good, i'm sure there is, but i know first hand to say they are just doing jobs americans won't is FALSE. my father has been a garbage man for 15+ years and a truck driver for most of his life. i don't want to hear shit about what americans are too good for b/c the true hardworking americans exsist today.

4) contributions... ummm ya i'm just wondering what they are contributing to the country they are in illegally? its not like they are fucking tourist. they live here using public owned roads, schools, healthcare, etc... w/o having to pay taxes. i don't find that contributing considering any american w/ a SSN is having to pay taxes on the wages earned.

5) do it legally... "the ones who come and exploit, deport them." hold on if they don't pay taxes they are exploiting our laws and country. and the reason why it is easier to come form an asian country is b/c you don't see 1000's hoping our boarders daily. if you go to another country you are required to follow their laws, we should expect the same; thats why only the mexican population is complaining. last time i checked canadians weren't protesting about rights they don't have in our country.

6) whites/blacks/hispanic... who gives a fuck? work hard and you will get what is coming to you. hand outs are for quitters.

7) iraq? we shouldn't be there, we shouldn't be policing the world. do they need help yes, but 200+ billion could of been spent alot better

8) +25

1. it is hard to tell that, its true, but its common sence to know hes not a racist. i seriously doubt ole dubbya has a clan hood in his closet, nor did he think "hell, i aint sendin help to those colored people"

2. i said that many illegals didnt. what i also said was that many citizens dont as well. it is like the pot calling the kettle black.

3. +1 to your dad for being a true American and a hard worker, however, when i wrote that, i was refferring to this generation. the current work force. one needs but to look at the business forum to know what i mean. people are too fucking lazy to even look for a job let alone work one. on another forum, a 16 yr old was asking if anyone was hiring, he needed his first job. someone said they were hiring a package sorter, he asked how much they were paying. they said 8.50. he told the guy to go to hell that he deserved more money if he was going to do manuel labor. its kids like that that serve as case and point for my arguement.

4. agian, research the illegal community. majority of them ARE paying taxes, due to the fact that many places refuse to hire anyone with out a ssn. how did they get one? see your number 2 responce. this is true for majority of the population. its a small number that live in squander in migrant camps. you would be surprised at what jobs illegals have.

5. canadians dont like us, we blame them for everythign, our relationship works. but seriously, Canada does not have a standard of living anywhere near that of Mexico. as for not exploiting us, see number 4.

6. i know. that was my point. lol.

7. thats going to be a matter of opinion. i personally am glad that 200 billion went to stop a tyranny in the world and that people can now live in freedom. i feel as Americans we take our freedom for granted, and while we believe everyone is created equal, we seem to limit that to our soil only. everyone deserves freedom,and we as a world power have the means and resporces to bring it to those who are held down by reigning powers such as hussian. i feel we should, but this is America, we can have different views.

8. + whatever im worth back to you!

[ShooterMcGavin]

1. it is hard to tell that, its true, but its common sence to know hes not a racist. i seriously doubt ole dubbya has a clan hood in his closet, nor did he think "hell, i aint sendin help to those colored people"

2. i said that many illegals didnt. what i also said was that many citizens dont as well. it is like the pot calling the kettle black.

3. +1 to your dad for being a true American and a hard worker, however, when i wrote that, i was refferring to this generation. the current work force. one needs but to look at the business forum to know what i mean. people are too fucking lazy to even look for a job let alone work one. on another forum, a 16 yr old was asking if anyone was hiring, he needed his first job. someone said they were hiring a package sorter, he asked how much they were paying. they said 8.50. he told the guy to go to hell that he deserved more money if he was going to do manuel labor. its kids like that that serve as case and point for my arguement.

7. thats going to be a matter of opinion. i personally am glad that 200 billion went to stop a tyranny in the world and that people can now live in freedom. i feel as Americans we take our freedom for granted, and while we believe everyone is created equal, we seem to limit that to our soil only. everyone deserves freedom,and we as a world power have the means and resporces to bring it to those who are held down by reigning powers such as hussian. i feel we should, but this is America, we can have different views.

a few quick comments i'd like to make, don't really want to get into it heavily bc i know me and you and others like us can talk and debate about this shit until we're blue in the face...

1) gw might not be a racist, but you can't tell me you honestly believe he cares as much about those living in squalor as he does his rich friends and family (many of which constantly shove $$$ in his direction). i think that's a fair statement.

2) don't know that you'd say it's the pot calling the kettle black, some of those that don't have insurance might actually have legitimate reasons for not having it or simply not being able to afford it, especially health insurance, but at least they are legal residents?

3) agree with you there for the most part, but like paul had pointed out earlier, even those that do the hard jobs are finding it more difficult to land them because the fact of the matter is, illegal immigrants almost always will be willing to get paid less in order to get that job.

7) personal opinion or not the fact of the matter is, iraq and iraqi citizens didn't have it that bad! if you want bad, and tyranny and overall chaos, go take a look at about 90% of african countries, makes iraq look like disneyland compared to some hotbeds of craziness in africa. but as myself and others have discussed previously, there is next to NOTHING to gain from helping out the poor and dying there, so that's why you won't see the US (or any other nation for that matter) ever dumping that kind of money or effort into a "saving the world" project and to establish a democracy there.

[fight club]

a few quick comments i'd like to make, don't really want to get into it heavily bc i know me and you and others like us can talk and debate about this shit until we're blue in the face...

1) gw might not be a racist, but you can't tell me you honestly believe he cares as much about those living in squalor as he does his rich friends and family (many of which constantly shove $$$ in his direction). i think that's a fair statement.

2) don't know that you'd say it's the pot calling the kettle black, some of those that don't have insurance might actually have legitimate reasons for not having it or simply not being able to afford it, especially health insurance, but at least they are legal residents?

3) agree with you there for the most part, but like paul had pointed out earlier, even those that do the hard jobs are finding it more difficult to land them because the fact of the matter is, illegal immigrants almost always will be willing to get paid less in order to get that job.

7) personal opinion or not the fact of the matter is, iraq and iraqi citizens didn't have it that bad! if you want bad, and tyranny and overall chaos, go take a look at about 90% of african countries, makes iraq look like disneyland compared to some hotbeds of craziness in africa. but as myself and others have discussed previously, there is next to NOTHING to gain from helping out the poor and dying there, so that's why you won't see the US (or any other nation for that matter) ever dumping that kind of money or effort into a "saving the world" project and to establish a democracy there.

+1 for good responces. only two i will comment on

1.) only god, bush, and his accountant can say for sure. i feel majority of the people who think he is like this believe it because he is republican. and because he doesnt go to the lengths that, say clinton, did to show how he values the other races. i mean, if Bush moves to Harlem like Clinton did, would you retract your statement? fun fact tho, go look up the cost Clinton spent for his "office" there. how many families could have been helped in that same neighborhood. i will say this tho, in politics, money gets you heard. but noone can say that the marshal law wasnt called for, and that they did get help.

7.) that may be true, but most african nations are not in a position to become a threat to us. let the US intellegence get wind of the THREAT of wmod's in an African country, and that they hate America, and see how fast we go in there.

[ShooterMcGavin]

+1 for good responces. only two i will comment on

1.) only god, bush, and his accountant can say for sure. i feel majority of the people who think he is like this believe it because he is republican. and because he doesnt go to the lengths that, say clinton, did to show how he values the other races. i mean, if Bush moves to Harlem like Clinton did, would you retract your statement? fun fact tho, go look up the cost Clinton spent for his "office" there. how many families could have been helped in that same neighborhood. i will say this tho, in politics, money gets you heard. but noone can say that the marshal law wasnt called for, and that they did get help.

7.) that may be true, but most african nations are not in a position to become a threat to us. let the US intellegence get wind of the THREAT of wmod's in an African country, and that they hate America, and see how fast we go in there.

short followup:

1) not so much that i'm convinced he hates minorities by any means, the main point i'm trying to get across is that he doesn't make the extra effort to show he cares. don't want to bring up statistics and whatnot but if you do a little research to see how many ppl clinton has lifted out of "poverty" (by some official definition based on income/family/yr i believe) compared with how many reagan and both bush's have, you'll notice a significant difference.

7) i believe before in your initial post you had also mentioned helping the ppl out in iraq and removing the tyranny that had seized the country. well if you want to base the war soley off of threat to the US, then that's A'ok by me. however, like many others out there finding reasons to justify what's going on over there, if you want to bring up tyranny, chaos and the suffering of the ppl, please don't because there are many countries worse off.

edit: +1 to you as well for making some educated and civilized posts here.

[ShooterMcGavin]

^^^thnx for saving me some time paul, well said +1

[2.0civic]

^^^thnx for saving me some time paul, well said +1

same here. good post all the way around

[Ruiner]

Thanks, Paul, I didn't feel like typing out a response.

[4dmin]

its still comes down to your own words, "the ones who come and exploit, deport them." ... they are exploiting our laws. ILLEGAL means just that. they all should be deported. Then the once who truely need to be here will be b/c they will be forced to do it legally.

people on this issue sound like tree huggers; if you don't like it leave this isn't THE UNITED STATES OF MEXICO.

[fight club]

its still comes down to your own words, "the ones who come and exploit, deport them." ... they are exploiting our laws. ILLEGAL means just that. they all should be deported. Then the once who truely need to be here will be b/c they will be forced to do it legally.

people on this issue sound like tree huggers; if you don't like it leave this isn't THE UNITED STATES OF MEXICO.

gotcha! i see now how my wording sounds. i take it that you know what i mean tho. the ones who are trying to do it legally but are doing the process here i think should stay. and i dont want to sound like a tree hugger i hate the fucking environment. lol.

[4dmin]

gotcha! i see now how my wording sounds. i take it that you know what i mean tho. the ones who are trying to do it legally but are doing the process here i think should stay. and i dont want to sound like a tree hugger i hate the fucking environment. lol.

i understood what you meant but the point is you don't illegally go to a country then try to become a citizen legally... you come over legally and stay w/ permission by the country. the problem is the majority come here to have children so they can stay or work to send $ home to families... that isn't helping us nor is it contributing to our country.

[{X}Echo419]

i understood what you meant but the point is you don't illegally go to a country then try to become a citizen legally... you come over legally and stay w/ permission by the country. the problem is the majority come here to have children so they can stay or work to send $ home to families... that isn't helping us nor is it contributing to our country.

true, the $$$ some that do pay taxes(and I guarntee it's the lesser) send the majority of their $$$ back to Mexico. that $$ not being spend here so we're not benefiting in the sales tax and the potential people they may hire. ie: eating @restaurants & other services.

[4dmin]

true, the $$$ some that do pay taxes(and I guarntee it's the lesser) send the majority of their $$$ back to Mexico. that $$ not being spend here so we're not benefiting in the sales tax and the potential people they may hire. ie: eating @restaurants & other services.

no doubt on a state level alone we are missing out on billions of dollars i couldn't even imagine the amount on a nationial level. flat tax may be the only way to make this work. keep what you make and pay higher tax on everything purchased

[fight club]

true, the $$$ some that do pay taxes(and I guarntee it's the lesser) send the majority of their $$$ back to Mexico. that $$ not being spend here so we're not benefiting in the sales tax and the potential people they may hire. ie: eating @restaurants & other services.

research it please. im not being an ass but please research it. while they do send money back to Mexico, they have to eat. they have to sleep. thats money into the economy. there are other taxes besides income. and i promise you, there are very few jobs (read jobs as in markets ie construction, dish washing) that can get away with paying them in cash. even construction workers pay taxes that are paid in cash. its a special tax you pay at the end of the year for doing contracting jobs. if the company doesnt report who tey paid and what they paid them, they will get fined etc. the IRS isnt as stupid as i like to believe, they know a contracter cant build 1000 240,000 doller homes with only a supervisor and a secretary.

[4dmin]

on more thing i like to add.. the reason why we always hear "americans are too good for certain jobs" thats b/c some of us are. i'm sorry but my father and his father before didn't bust ass to provide for their families so their children would have it hard. i've had it good b/c my father/mother busted their ass they weren't handed anything. they allowed me to get a good education and pursue the things i enjoy. am i too good for certain jobs yes b/c i'm qualified for others... why would i break my back for 10$ an hour doing construction when i can make alot more money in IT.

no one is entitled to anything LEGAL and specially ILLEGAL. you want it you work for it.

[fight club]

yea, well i really dont have to find a reason to justify it because like it or not we are in it, and we are doing great things, so boycotting it and not supporting our troops does nothing. i see your point tho and i think i explained why we arent doing anything well.

as for clinton, yes im aware of how much he taxed us to pay for increased social services, and how that helped people. i for one see the good and bad in that. the good is obvious, but the bad... i dont work my ass off to help anyone but myself. selfish i know, but if i can do the work, so can they.


and paul, you have to right to hold out for an IT job AS YOU ARE QUALIFIED. you have worked and put yourself through alot to get to that point. agian, my arguement is for people like that 16 yr old i mentioned. there arent many illegals taking your job Paul lol. and its seems the cool thing to do with the younger people is to expect to work this kick ass 100k+ job while in high school, and when they get shot down because its a rediculous proposition, its the "in" thing to do to blame illegals, when i dont see many illegals working in offices etc, as english is usually needed. i just think my generation and the generations near me have lost the work ethic your and my parents have. and because we are better off, we feel that we should be given a plush job, qualified or not. you have to work to get there, which you have.

[4dmin]

i just think my generation and the generations near me have lost the work ethic your and my parents have. and because we are better off, we feel that we should be given a plush job, qualified or not. you have to work to get there, which you have.

that is true but that has alot to do w/ the college effect... people think that a college education entitles you to something... i have friends w/ college degrees still waiting tables

work ethic is something enviromental but even if your parents have it doesn't mean you will get it. i've been paying my own way since high school i bought my 1st brand new car at 19 b/c of my credit and the loan lady told me she had given maybe 5 loans in her career to kids of my age. this is a great example my parents are still paying the way for my 2 younger brothers both are in their 20's. my wife's family is the same, i've been supporting her while she is in school, and she will soon be Dr. Firestine; now her brother hasn't even finished his 2 year degree and he is 2 years older. he also pissed away a full ride scholarship to play soccer

some have it some don't; this has nothing to do w/ race or income

[fight club]

that is true but that has alot to do w/ the college effect... people think that a college education entitles you to something... i have friends w/ college degrees still waiting tables

work ethic is something enviromental but even if your parents have it doesn't mean you will get it. i've been paying my own way since high school i bought my 1st brand new car at 19 b/c of my credit and the loan lady told me she had given maybe 5 loans in her career to kids of my age. this is a great example my parents are still paying the way for my 2 younger brothers both are in their 20's. my wife's family is the same, i've been supporting her while she is in school, and she will soon be Dr. Firestine; now her brother hasn't even finished his 2 year degree and he is 2 years older. he also pissed away a full ride scholarship to play soccer

some have it some don't; this has nothing to do w/ race or income

indeed it doesnt. and tell that lady she's about to give her 6th. LOL

[fight club]

you didnt grow up in the ghetto. try subsaharan africa or the asian area that was hit by the tidal wave. that was the ghetto.

[babygurl]

you didnt grow up in the ghetto. try subsaharan africa or the asian area that was hit by the tidal wave. that was the ghetto.

that istrue....but an American Ghetto I did grow up in! Granted I am very lucky to have everything that I do have. But I worked my ass off for, and whatever was given to me when I was younger, my mother worked 2-3 jobs to keep food on the table, and clothes on my back...so I know what hard times and struggles are! Again not as much as others.

[fight club]

yea see, so do i, but i refuse to call it the ghetto cuz American ghetto is a oxymoron when viewing the world as a whole. see my original post and youll know my "suffering"