So where do you get these educators from if everyone is moving out of the city?Originally Posted by BanginJimmy
So where do you get these educators from if everyone is moving out of the city?
its not their fault david, it would be short sighted to blame the people actually responsible for all that. It makes much more sense to blame the failing auto industry
/sarcasm
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Detroit should have gone after the banking industry - Charlotte, NC did, and they have continuously improved. Detroit could have gone after the IT industry - lots of jobs there also. Cities compete for companies to relocate all the time. Detroit's leadership just failed to attract the amount of businesses that it needs.
"Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting." - Steve McQueen
I didnt say industry as a whole, I said the auto industry, who's life blood is in Detroit, who was directly impacted by the crash.
You're right. Detroit democrats were directly responsible for auto industry technological advancements and the mass relocation of jobs. LOL.
It almost hurts pulling this narrative out of my throat. Lol
Detroit Public Schools currently employs 7,839. 1% of the population are employed as educators in public schools.
Wayne State University employs another 5,924.
"Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting." - Steve McQueen
So, how does that answer my question? Lol
This doesn't even tell me how many people are actually educators. If the public school system employs 8000 people, some are administrative, some are custodial, some are coaching staff. How many of those 8000 in Detroit and 6000 at Wayne are strictly educators?
How do you get quality educators from a pool that's consistently dwindling?
The steel industry went through a massive collapse in the 1970s, and Pittsburgh was built on the steel industry. It was very similar to Detroit, and has also been under Democratic mayoral leadership for even longer. In the 1980s and 1990s, they also lost their top four corporate companies and about half their population, as well as the most educated.
Today, they have no steel mills left at all - but still didn't file bankruptcy, even though they went through the same Great Recession as everyone else.
What they did was raze a steel mill site, and built the Pittsburgh Technology Center. It is considered to be one of the World's Most Livable Cities.
"Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting." - Steve McQueen
It wasn't to specifically answer your question, just to give some facts, that's all.
I do not know how many of the people are actually teaching in classes, nor what they teach, but I'm sure that you could get those numbers from them.
Are you aware that 40% of all Detroit students now attend charter schools? Or that the Emergency Manager closed over 100 schools and cut 800 teaching jobs last year, increasing the classroom sizes dramatically? They are over 40 students in a classroom, and up to 60 in a high school classroom. All of this was widely broadcast through the media.
Maybe you don't fire the ones that you have?
"Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting." - Steve McQueen
If you water your grass too much, the roots will not go deep into the soil and the grass will be more likely to die in a shortage of water. Grass that isnt over watered will reach deeper into the soil and will be more able to sustain itself during a water shortage and need less watering.
Even grass understands personal responsibility.....
something we've been trying to teach democrats since the beginning of time.
If you're a quality educator, and services are going belly up, crime is climbing, house prices are plummeting, and you don't know if the city can pay you or not, are you more or less inclined to stick around?
Thank you for that horticultural aside.
Disagree here. IMO if you want to improve schools you fire the bad teachers and administrators and make rooms for ones that care. It is nearly impossible to fire a bad teacher and as a result, most school districts don't even try. Our dwindling test scores and tech advantage is proof positive of this.
Sent from my Galaxy SIII using Tapatalk 2.
That works when you have the plan to improve the system overall, and have the classroom ratios in check. Detroit has some of the worst classroom ratios already, and took steps to make it worse. Saddling a good teacher with way too many students can be worse than having them deal with a few not-as-good teachers. Our local schools are losing their good teachers right now from overcrowding the classrooms - I've seen that myself.
"Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting." - Steve McQueen
Dont put words in my mouth.
Let me make it simpler for you , other cities have re-invented, why cant detroit?
MAYBE, JUST MAYBE , its because they bowed to the unions for so long that they became UNCOMPETITIVE , and forced the companies (WHO OWNED THOSE JOBS ANYWAY) to go to places that didnt have crime, high taxes, and shitty corporate environments.
YES , i hold leaders responsible, unlike you
if they arent responsible, why even hold elections?
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AND WHO IS RESPONSIBLE FOR THIS...............
ILL GIVE YOU A HINT, THEY ARE ELECTED AND IN POWER.....................
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I get you. I think everyone can agree that fixing our school system should be the #1 priority at all levels. The mess we have going right now isnt working for a lot of reasons and I have yet to see someone come out with a large scale idea to fix it. Charter and private schools take some pressure off the govt ones, but there is no possible way to expand either of those enough to make it universally feasible.
I say it should be #1 because it is an unarguable fact that higher education leads to lower crime and higher earnings. Improvements in those 2 areas lead to improvements in many other problem areas of our society also.
The question was "why is Detroit filing bankruptcy today" not "why didnt Detroit re-invent itself". The answer to the original question is "the auto industry and its magnates were largely responsible in failing the city that supported them, and Detroit's leadership was unsuccessful at stopping the train wreck that would eventually happen."
Every place is different. Pittsburg may not have experienced the same decline as Detroit for many reasons. I'll give leadership some responsibility, but I'm not gonna give businesses a free pass just because I'm a staunch supporter of the free market. They're largely responsible, everyone else knows that
What you're seeing here is an unintended negative externality of capitalism.
GM, Ford, Chrysler aren't elected. They may have a lot of power though...
You shouldn't see a "large scale solution". Primary public education is run at a state level, and should not be at a federal level. Let states compete and use education to draw people to their state - it already works this way. Unfortunately, GA is way behind many other states in regards to competition with other states.
"Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting." - Steve McQueen
Youre welcome. If our president quit throwing water on all of our problems, things might grow strong enough roots not to need the government sprinkler system.
Pittsburgh is almost identical in its problems, and even its leadership - that's why I picked them.
The auto industry did not fail Detroit - they chose to develop their business in a more profitable manner for their shareholders. That's what competition does.
The answer to "why Detroit filed bankruptcy" has clearly been laid out by the Emergency Manager, and he did not claim that the 1950's auto industry was the answer.
To claim that the Big Three are responsible for Detroit's bankruptcy filing shows that you do not understand how businesses work, or how cities are managed.
"Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting." - Steve McQueen
Even on the state level I dont see anyone with a solution. I do agree with you that the federal govt needs to stay out of way. The Dept of Ed is nothing more than a bureaucratic mess that takes money from the system and offers nothing positive to the system.
WTF would a business be responsible for keeping a city afloat? The at is the responsibility of the city and state govt. The sole purpose of a business is to make money, not neighborhood upkeep. A lot of businesses do that to improve their identity both locally and nationally, but that is seen by the business as an opportunity cost.
That's why we have county boards of education.
"Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting." - Steve McQueen
Its pointless to argue when someone cant see the forest through the trees.
Detroit is filing bankruptcy because it failed to re-invent itself and change with the times. we are talking 50 YEARS OF FAILURES. Despite all the uniuon outcry, all the bailouts an money, they still FAILED. Leadership is to blame, despite the many ways you shift blame and refuse to answer the question.
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GM FORD AND CHRYSLER dont pay for govt services, collect taxes, enforce policies and regulations, and they damn sure dont pay teachers salaries.
troll post is trolling
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Even when they're largely responsible, businesses can do no wrong. LOL
Who said anything about a businesses responsibility for keeping a business afloat? The city (its people and its economy, not its government operations) relied on that industry, that industry made other plans
Its not automakers responsibility to keep the city afloat, but that's what it was doing whether it wanted to or not. It essentially employed the city.
Sorry, but you can't place all the blame on the leadership. Too many variables involved.
You said it.
I agree with you here. Far too many varibles to put all the blame on any 1 entity. Political leadership does hold the vast majority of the blame though.
Detroit's leadership had over 60 years to save the city when the automakers started moving jobs out of the city. NO contract or union agreement lasts that long, and that is exactly what Detroit's bankruptcy filing states as the main factor that they need relief from. These contractual agreements were entered into by the city decades after the auto industry had shrank to a small employer. There is no possible way that any of these failures can be blamed on an industry that had done most of its downsizing before 1980. Leadership that cannot effect change with over 30 years of effort is not the way forward.
"Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting." - Steve McQueen
Seems like a lot of cities are filing for bankruptcy these days.....
just curious....
are these cities ran by democrats or republicans?
Bankrupt Cities, Municipalities List and Map
List of Bankruptcy Filings Since January 2010
All Municipal Bankruptcy Filings: 36
City and Locality Bankruptcy Filings (8):
-- City of Detroit
-- City of San Bernardino, Calif.
-- Town of Mammoth Lakes, Calf. (Dismissed)
-- City of Stockton, Calif.
-- Jefferson County, Ala.
-- City of Harrisburg, Pa. (Dismissed)
-- City of Central Falls, R.I.
-- Boise County, Idaho (Dismissed)
You will have to look each one up as to elected officials - and you will find some Democrats and some Republicans on each.
"Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting." - Steve McQueen
rhetorical question.
Why does it matter to you? Running out of ammunition for your "anti-democrat" narrative? If a city is going bankrupt, leadership could be one small part of a larger problem, as it was in Detroit.
Do you plan on including all the cities and states that are way in the black that are run by democrats?
I say po(tay)toe you say po(tah)toe..... you say anti democrat... i say pro america.
and the thought of running out of ammo against democrats is just silly.....
How dare you hold Obama accountable for words that come out of his own mouth.... that's racist.
On a side note: This is the most addictive "game" ever.
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