Stimulus Funds

[David88vert]

So, how is the current administration allocating the taxpayers' money?

This was on the news last night, and you will notice this is not Fox News.

http://abcnews.go.com/WN/wind-power-...ory?id=9759949

"Nearly $2 billion in money from the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act has been spent on wind power, funding the creation of enough new wind farms to power 2.4 million homes over the past year. But the study found that nearly 80 percent of that money has gone to foreign manufacturers of wind turbines."

Obama's administration blatantly lies about it.
"Matt Rogers, the senior adviser to the Secretary of Energy for the Recovery Act, denied there was a problem.
"The recovery act is creating jobs in the U.S. for American workers," said Rogers, "That is what the recovery act is about, that is what it is doing. Every dollar from the recovery act is going to create jobs for the American workers here in the U.S.""

Fact:
"Iberdrola, one of the largest operators of renewable energy worldwide, is based in Spain, and has received the most U.S. stimulus dollars -- $577 million. It buys some of its turbines from another Spanish manufacturer, Gamesa, which has a U.S. connection. Gamesa has two facilities to manufacture turbine blades in Pennsylvania, but the company said the market forced it to temporarily lay off nearly 100 workers."

And soon...
"A Chinese company called A-power is helping to build a massive $1.5 billion wind farm in West Texas. The consortium behind the project expects to get $450 million in stimulus money.
Walt Hornaday, an American partner on the project, said it would create some American jobs. "Our estimation," he said, "is that we are going to have on the order of 300 construction jobs just within the fence of the project."
But that's in addition to 2,000 manufacturing jobs -- many of them in China. "

Remember Van Jones, Obama's "green czar".....

[Total_Blender]

Fact:

Van Jones resigned in September 2009, and a replacement for him has not been named, so I don't see what the "Green Jobs Czar" has to do with any of the contracts that have been handed out. One might even say that had Van Jones been able to do the job he was appointed to that the situation might have been different and the turbines would be sourced using as more US labor.

2.) You left out the part of the article that discusses how the US only has 2 companies that can produce wind turbines, and that those two companies also contract a lot of their manufacturing to foreign companies. Not to mention one of the companies not selected is GE, the owner of MSNBC. If GE/MSNBC is in cahoots with the socialists/czars/welfare cheats in the current administration, why wouldn't they GE be chosen for the contract?

3.) It makes sense to use foreign contractors who can produce tested/reliable equipment to get the ball rolling on wind power. Set up a few wind farms as a trial to see how the infrastructure works so that we know what we are doing when we go into the manufacturing phase for ourselves.

4.) The guy says "But that's in addition to 2,000 manufacturing jobs -- many of them in China," but he doesn't say all 2,000 manufacturing jobs are in China. Also, even if all 2,000 jobs are in China its not really that big of a deal when you consider what the average Chinese manufacturing worker gets paid, which is about $100 a month. We're getting a bargain

[Browning151]

3.) It makes sense to use foreign contractors who can produce tested/reliable equipment to get the ball rolling on wind power. Set up a few wind farms as a trial to see how the infrastructure works so that we know what we are doing when we go into the manufacturing phase for ourselves.

4.) The guy says "But that's in addition to 2,000 manufacturing jobs -- many of them in China," but he doesn't say all 2,000 manufacturing jobs are in China. Also, even if all 2,000 jobs are in China its not really that big of a deal when you consider what the average Chinese manufacturing worker gets paid, which is about $100 a month. We're getting a bargain

Did you miss the part where the stimulus is supposed to be helping fix OUR economy not China or Spains economy? I couldn't possibly care less how little the Chinese are working for, even if it's $1 a month that money is supposed to be creating jobs here, not China.

[Total_Blender]

Did you miss the part where the stimulus is supposed to be helping fix OUR economy not China or Spains economy? I couldn't possibly care less how little the Chinese are working for, even if it's $1 a month that money is supposed to be creating jobs here, not China.

It is... because the wind farms will need American workers to assemble the turbines once they are manufactured, and the wind farms that are being built will be operated and maintained by American workers. And wind power also cuts our dependence on dirty forms of energy like coal, as well as foreign oil.

Also, only when we have a working knowledge of wind power and the specifics of its application within the US, can we probably proceed to manufacture our own equipment for it. Right now we don't have any American sourced equipment that works, and building our own from scratch would be a shot in the dark.

And if it were not for the use of foreign labor the hardware portion of this project might cost billions more.

[David88vert]

Fact:

Van Jones resigned in September 2009, and a replacement for him has not been named, so I don't see what the "Green Jobs Czar" has to do with any of the contracts that have been handed out. One might even say that had Van Jones been able to do the job he was appointed to that the situation might have been different and the turbines would be sourced using as more US labor.

2.) You left out the part of the article that discusses how the US only has 2 companies that can produce wind turbines, and that those two companies also contract a lot of their manufacturing to foreign companies. Not to mention one of the companies not selected is GE, the owner of MSNBC. If GE/MSNBC is in cahoots with the socialists/czars/welfare cheats in the current administration, why wouldn't they GE be chosen for the contract?

3.) It makes sense to use foreign contractors who can produce tested/reliable equipment to get the ball rolling on wind power. Set up a few wind farms as a trial to see how the infrastructure works so that we know what we are doing when we go into the manufacturing phase for ourselves.

4.) The guy says "But that's in addition to 2,000 manufacturing jobs -- many of them in China," but he doesn't say all 2,000 manufacturing jobs are in China. Also, even if all 2,000 jobs are in China its not really that big of a deal when you consider what the average Chinese manufacturing worker gets paid, which is about $100 a month. We're getting a bargain

Fact: The contracts were setup long before Van Jones resigned. Of course, that does not mean that he personally picked them, signed the contracts, etc. I'm not blaming him, just pointing out that this is happening exactly as it was predicted and warned about, but Congress did not make provisions to prevent it.

Fact: We have wind turbine technology that works here. We make wind turbines here in the US. Go out to Texas and drive to California on I-10. There are lots of wind farms there.

Fact: They are sending large amounts of American taxpayer money to foreign countries to create jobs in those countries. Those jobs pay their local workers. Their local workers do not spend in large amounts on US produced goods. Bluntly, that is plucking money out of the American public's pockets, and giving it away to foreign governments.

You really don't seem to understand world economics. Or you are just blindly ignoring it.

[David88vert]

It is... because the wind farms will need American workers to assemble the turbines once they are manufactured, and the wind farms that are being built will be operated and maintained by American workers. And wind power also cuts our dependence on dirty forms of energy like coal, as well as foreign oil.

Also, only when we have a working knowledge of wind power and the specifics of its application within the US, can we probably proceed to manufacture our own equipment for it. Right now we don't have any American sourced equipment that works, and building our own from scratch would be a shot in the dark.

And if it were not for the use of foreign labor the hardware portion of this project might cost billions more.

Incorrect. We already have the knowledge of wind power, and its specifics. We already can manufacture wind turbines here, and have large amounts of them deployed in Texas already.

I'm sure that China can make them cheaper, as their labor is cheaper. That does not help our economy. You would only increase the trade deficit.

[Total_Blender]

You really don't seem to understand world economics. Or you are just blindly ignoring it.

It doesn't seem like you understand the situation completely either. Do you know if the wind farms in Texas and California use equipment that is 100% American made? Your article states that there are 2 companies based in the US that could source the turbines, but that those companies also use foreign manufacturing.

I agree with you that it would be preferable if we could source turbines that are 100% US manufactured, but given the gap between the US and the rest of the world and the high cost of developing the technology at this point it makes sense to use the cheaper foreign units. It still creates American jobs in sustainable energy, and it will serve to foster the demand for American produced equipment once the project gets up and running.

[David88vert]

I agree with you that it would be preferable if we could source turbines that are 100% US manufactured, but given the gap between the US and the rest of the world and the high cost of developing the technology at this point it makes sense to use the cheaper foreign units. It still creates American jobs in sustainable energy, and it will serve to foster the demand for American produced equipment once the project gets up and running.

The amount of jobs that this effort will produce in the US is minimal, at best - while sending a large amount of taxpayer dollars overseas that will directly benefit nations in competition with the US companies.
US companies will not produce the equipment here, if they have the option to manufacture the products overseas, yet still get free grants from the taxpayers.

As for US job expansion, how much money do you think will be going to the 200-300 US workers? Assuming that they make an average of $30/hr (yes, I am estimating high), that is $18 million at best staying in our local economy, while sending approximately $450 million to China. Does that seem like an appropriation that is going to benefit the taxpayers? And of that money paid to the workers, how much of that will end up spent on products "made in China"?

Face it, this administration and Congress is giving away the wealth that our forefathers worked for. Neither Republican nor Democrat is more at fault than the other. Both are guilty of not looking our for their constituents.