Keep drinking the kool aid
Keep drinking the kool aid
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Laura Ingrams an idiot. For once in my life I actually somewhat agree with Bill O'Riley
That's what I was thinking. He didn't ask for it and he seemed surprised himself that he won.Originally Posted by tony
He also didn't ruin the US during his presidency ("yet" or whatever someone is bound to say). It hasn't been long enough for him to ruin all 200 years of the US since January. He has just been assigned the task of trying to clean it all up. YES, that is his job and it is a fucking hard one and NO I don't agree with everything, but I do agree with the notion. Not that it helps much. I'd love to see y'all have his position and the choices you would make. ANYONE would be hard pressed to do good a job given our state of affairs at this point.
Call it an argument for arguments sake if you will, but Obama derangement syndrome? Sounds like a bit of a stretch to me. Let's recap the main accomplishments that Rachel Maddow cites for him to be deserving the award.
1) He persuaded the people of this nation to believe in his vision of strength through diplomacy enough to elect him as a president, since when did winning an election become grounds to recieve a Nobel Peace Prize?
2) He persuaded the people of this nation, the holder of the largest nuclear stockpile in the world, that the next president should try to abolish nuclear weapons worldwide. So he persuaded the people of the US to believe this, and what about the rest of the world? Iran continues to strengthen its nuclear program and blatantly flaunts that it is doing so now with missile testing. North Korea has tested nuclear weapons as well as long range ballistic missiles? What did Obama have to say about either of these? He recently demanded access to Irans recently discovered nuclear facility, other than that I haven't heard much more.
3) He decided that the most powerful nation on Earth would try again to work with other countries through international institutions. From what I have seen he has done nothing more than apologize for us, bow to muslim leaders and pander to anyone that he can find to pander to.
4) He declared that we would close our secret prisons, Gitmo and we would no longer support a policy of torture. What kind of message does this really send to terrorist groups? To me it says weakness, it sends a message that we will more than likely back down from terrorists rather than fight back. That, however, is a personal opinion, not fact.
While all of these are noble ideals, and things that may very well make the world a better place I fail to see what he was/is actually doing to accomplish these things other than making speeches and persuading people of his vision. The Nobel Prize is often awarded on grounds of things that are currently being done, but not yet completed, which is fine but I don't see what he has actually done to set these things in motion. At the end of the day, none of this actually has an effect on any of our lives, I just feel like there was someone or some organization who has accomplished more in the way of promoting peace other than speeches and persuasion to believe in someones ideals.
THIS JUST IN: The following Nobel Peace Prizes will be renounced Monday due to the fact that they were only based on speeches and persuasion to believe in someones ideals:The Nobel Prize is often awarded on grounds of things that are currently being done, but not yet completed, which is fine but I don't see what he has actually done to set these things in motion. At the end of the day, none of this actually has an effect on any of our lives, I just feel like there was someone or some organization who has accomplished more in the way of promoting peace other than speeches and persuasion to believe in someones ideals.
Barack Obama
Martin Luther King Jr.
Desmond Tutu
Al Gore
Oh. Wait. Just take em all back
Nobody is questioning the task and mess that Obama inherited with the presidency. Even though Im not an Obama supporter i can definitely respect the shitstorm he walked in to. Thats not in question. What is in question is what he has done to actually EARN the Nobel Peace Prize.. and honestly I just cant see how it was justified.
MLK really? Just gave speeches?
Al Gore, i didnt agree with him winning either, but he was at least an advocate with a LONG RESUME with YEARS of service
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We know you guys dont get how he EARNED it. Cause You're only looking at the peace prize two dimensionally. By your logic, none of the laureates have EARNED it. It is a SYMBOL that recognizes EFFORT, not ACHIEVEMENTS.
Yes. He gave speeches and persuaded people to believe in his ideals. This is why he won the award
YOU FAIL SO BAD
Martin Luther King, Jr. (January 15, 1929 – April 4, 1968) was an American clergyman, activist and prominent leader in the African-American civil rights movement. His main legacy was to secure progress on civil rights in the United States and he is frequently referenced as a human rights icon today. King is recognized as a martyr by two Christian churches. [1] A Baptist minister,[2] King became a civil rights activist early in his career. He led the 1955 Montgomery Bus Boycott and helped found the Southern Christian Leadership Conference in 1957, serving as its first president. King's efforts led to the 1963 March on Washington, where King delivered his "I Have a Dream" speech. There, he raised public consciousness of the civil rights movement and established himself as one of the greatest orators in U.S. history.
In 1964, King became the youngest person to receive the Nobel Peace Prize for his work to end racial segregation and racial discrimination through civil disobedience and other non-violent means. By the time of his death in 1968, he had refocused his efforts on ending poverty and opposing the Vietnam War, both from a religious perspective. King was assassinated on April 4, 1968, in Memphis, Tennessee. He was posthumously awarded the Presidential Medal of Freedom in 1977 and Congressional Gold Medal in 2004; Martin Luther King, Jr. Day was established as a U.S. national holiday in 1986.
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Mike, whats your point? LOL, that he didnt persuade people to believe in his ideals? Dont debate MLK with me because you will fail. Horribly
please COMPARE
Obama previously served as the junior United States Senator from Illinois from January 2005 until he resigned after his election to the presidency in November 2008.
Obama is a graduate of Columbia University and Harvard Law School, where he was the president of the Harvard Law Review. He was a community organizer in Chicago before earning his law degree. He worked as a civil rights attorney in Chicago and taught constitutional law at the University of Chicago Law School from 1992 to 2004.
Obama served three terms in the Illinois Senate from 1997 to 2004. Following an unsuccessful bid for a seat in the U.S. House of Representatives in 2000, Obama ran for United States Senate in 2004. His victory in the March 2004 Democratic primary election for the United States Senator from Illinois brought him to national attention. His prime-time televised keynote address at the Democratic National Convention in July 2004 made him a rising star nationally in the Democratic Party. He comfortably won election to the U.S. Senate in November 2004.
He began his run for the presidency in February 2007. After a close campaign in the 2008 Democratic Party presidential primaries against Hillary Clinton, he won his party's nomination. In the 2008 general election, he defeated Republican nominee John McCain and was inaugurated as president on January 20, 2009. On October 9, 2009 Obama was awarded the Nobel Peace Prize
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If you cant see that he was much more than an orator, then you have no clue what you are talking about.
Besides being a reverend, a martyr, and activist, etc.
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My point was not that he should never get the award, just that he should have a little more showing of acheivement of actually making things happen before he was awarded such a prize i.e. next year given some of the things he stands for were actually in motion and making changes it would have been more fitting.
Come on now Tracy. Each and every major policy he wants to force through congress will obviously hurt the US.
Cap and trade will kill the manufacturing industry in the US. Even a corporation like Lockheed is already sending more and more work overseas to avoid some of the environmental regulations. That same bill will also, at least, double energy costs and make everything we buy more expensive. This includes the costs for in home utilities.
Healthcare will lower the standard of care in the US, no one can make even a half way reasonable argument otherwise. You can listen to any politician you want, but in the end, nothing in any bill in congress will lower costs AND even keep the levels of care the same, nor will they cover even half of the citizens that are currently uncovered. What those plans will do is cause employers to cut jobs to pay the fines imposed. Personal choice is no longer relevant either. More fines to pay if you feel the risk is worth the reward.
Diplomacy under Obama is nothing more than appeasement. All he does when he is overseas is bash America. Look at the people that are praising him, then look at the ones warning him of the effects of his politics. He has done nothing to prevent additional attacks on our soil or any of our other possessions. If anything, he has damaged our ability to counter these attacks.
Obama's politics and the way he is pushing his agenda will kill the American economy. Dems from solidly democrat districts have completely ignored public opinion, they simply say it is racist conservatives. Everything that isnt going well, blame Bush, yet every prediction made by this administration has been horribly wrong. How much longer are people going to allow him to use the blame Bush defense? Even the 1.4 TRILLION dollar budget deficit is being blamed on Bush when we can look at just 2 pieces of legislation signed by Obama that are worth more than 1.2T in money we dont have.
I know EXACTLY what MLK did. I said he made speeches and persuaded people to believe in his ideals. Was I wrong? did he not do that?
That is what I'm saying. I have friends that are liberal that were harshly critical of Bush but I had to explain to them that they dont have to walk in that mans shoes, its so easy to point the finger and say what they should do but when you're actually there its a totally different story.
I'm not seeing the effort from Mr Obama that was Nobel Peace Prize worthy.
Yes, he did that along with much, much more than just speeches.
Would I be safe in saying that his marches and sit-ins would be persuading people to believe in his ideals? or is that totally off base?
He got a Nobel Peace Prize award for calling Kanye West a Jackass? lol JK He's having a hard time being Pres. but he is also not doing what he said he would do
Have you heard of the guy who rolls and pulls fenders in Atlanta? YEAH, I'M THAT GUY! Hit me up!https://www.facebook.com/VipFenderRolling
Yes, those do persuade people to believe in his ideals, however is that not more than a speech? That is taking action, making a difference and forcing things to change. Up until this point Obama has only made the speeches, which is why I said I believe that next year would have been more fitting.
I just wonder how many of you watch CSpan and the hearings they display on a regular basis? I just see this.. "Well I havent seen this, I havent seen that," well change the channel from Fox News and you might.
Do you listen to his weekly addresses?
Do you follow whitehouse.gov?
No because that would be drinking the kool aid I'm sure. lol This whole thing is funny to me.
Well thats fine. Like I said before, If it wasnt this year, It would have been next year for sure. Im just saying to the people who say "He doesnt deserve it" or "It makes a mockery of the whole NPP" to stop watching Glenn Beck, stop listening to Rush Limbaugh and look at the bigger picture here
The marches and sit ins were a way of motivating people but the speeches that MLK gave was his strong point. If we're comparing the two and their influence then Obama is very much so on par with MLK. You must understand that MLK saw much of the same scrutiny that Obama sees today, MLK was labeled a socialist, communist, and a marxist because he preached equality when that was frowned upon.. he was not so revered until after his death.
You can sit here and say MLK did much more than speeches but really what he did was engage those who opposed his ideals and inspired those who supported them which is what Obama does, this is why you hear the term "Direct Diplomacy" and the "Fierce urgency of now," these are terms MLK used and that is how he carried out his agenda.
Reps for actually having a discussion about it. Even though they dont count for anything, lol.
I agree with this post 101%
back atcha
MLK Was actually a catalyst for change and took a stance when it was dangerous to do so. Obama has done nothing revolutionary (as far as his ideals / stance). To compare the two is apples / oranges
Negative. Maybe Obamas change wont be exactly on par with what MLK did, but both are apples. You're saying this because you have SEEN the change that MLK set in motion. It is happening RIGHT NOW. Maybe Obama's change hasnt exactly happend yet, but you CAN NOT say he isnt a catalyst. Im still challenging those who think otherwise to name ONE PERSON who would be more qualified to receive such a prize.
BiLL GATES FOR ALL HE HAS DONE LOL U SAID NAME ONE PERSON
Have you heard of the guy who rolls and pulls fenders in Atlanta? YEAH, I'M THAT GUY! Hit me up!
What revolutionary position was there to take at this point? Other than support for gay rights which Obama is doing currently the conditions don't require anything revolutionary.. although diplomacy is pretty close when the previous 8 years we would not engage those who opposed us.
Considering both sides of the political aisle lie on a regular basis, CSPAN, weekly addresses, and whitehouse.gov are all useless. Obama has been caught in lies on so many occasions that I wouldnt even believe him if he told me the was POTUS.
I would like to say I believe non-partisan groups such as the CBO, but politicians have shown that their numbers can be skewed by the way a bill is written. The healthcare bill is one of those. The CBO numbers start from the day the bill is law, it doesnt take into account the fact that the bill doesnt take effect until 2014 and the true costs of it will not really start to be seen until 2016 or 2017.
Continuing the fight against terrorism and nuke treaties for 1. Instead he has chosen appeasement to our enemies and the UN.
Who did we not engage that the previous administration did? I cant think of anyone.
We wouldn't address Iran, Palestine received the cold shoulder while Israel always had our support. We didn't engage Iraq and overlooked the fact that Pakistan holds many of the people that we went looking for in Iraq in Afghanistan. When I say engage I mean diplomacy, not this far right definition of diplomacy that many of you call appeasement.
To bring the analogy of MLK back, one of his harshest critics (Malcolm X) called his methods appeasement too... its all in the eye of the beholder. Malcolm changed his tune after completing his pilgrimage to Mecca.
See, I give you sources and they're all useless. Does it have to be skewed to the right to be useful? I guess the BBC is useless too?
Um. Apparently whoever did whatever up until January did their fair share to ruin our economy. Like I said, I don't agree with everything, but I agree that some things have to change—radically. Do you? Or are you fine with our state right now? Remember, Obama didn't get us here (so leave that alone while you answer this), so are you fine with our state of affairs even if you don't agree with any of the proposals?
Lockheed is sending more work overseas also because they aren't going to be building the F22's anymore for the US. It makes common sense that they will seek out business else where. Should we keep building F22's so they won't take their business elsewhere? I mean, we need to cut the budget don't we? Those things are expensive. I don't know enough on the trade subject to interject anymore. I only know abut the F22's because we have tons of customers who work there.
I think it's awesome that we are now looking for water on the moon. I wonder if it's because we have fucked our environment up so bad. I guess we should just carry on ruining our plant too while we are at it. Fuck our kids and grandkids. Let's live in the now. Let's not address anything enbironmental so we don't have to send jobs over seas.
Not sure if you remember, but we had the health care thread already, in which I joined. I don't agree with each point, but I doubt I would agree with each point ANYONE provided. We are a vast country with a lot of levels. ANYONE is going to be hard pressed to please everyone. I am pretty sure that most of us in that thread decided there had to be some type of change. You think you just walk up to the drawing board of any project, write one or two ideas down, then say DONE! No, every plan, design, agreement goes through stages and refinements and approval processes. That's just the nature of things and THEN still SOMEONE is going to bitch.
So when it comes to these attacks on our soil, have we had one since January? How do you come to these conclusions? You just guess? I'm am being for real and not condescending. Honestly, if you were to ask me, I think making friends with other countries is a good thing. I make enemies all of the time—with what I say and how I act and a lot of the time it's not intentional. A lot of people don't like me just because they have heard about me. Sound familiar? Most of the time, at some point, I decide it's just not worth the tension since I have to see these people out. It's more worth it for me to call them up, apologize and be the mature one in the situation—even if I feel what I did wasn't wrong. It seems to work. Of course some people shake my hand then go behind my back and slam me or try to ruin me, but thats just part of being secure and strong—and jealousy is a bitch. That's just human nature.
Either way, I'm glad you are psychicIt's good to know that someone here knows what all of these plans will do to our country in the long run. You should run for office and make that your platform. "I am psychic. I can already tell what policies will work and which ones won't. So vote for me! I have it all figured out." While you're at it, can you pick next weeks lottery #'s for me?
p.s. I don't watch any of this shit on the news. Fuck the news. It's ALL a fucking biased lie. We will never know what really goes on because everything is filtered and translated. It's just like the fucking Bible!!!!! I just use my common sense to entertain these arguments based on what ya'll say. I use daily scenarios to help it all make sense, not quotes from Talk Radio or CNN. So don't go asking me which channel I get my info from. I get all of my info here, because in the long run, I know I'm not going to be able to do anything to make a change. ALL GOVERNMENTS are corrupt
On the topic of the Nobel Peace Prize. Maybe he didn't deserve it, but he didn't ask for it. That's all I was saying.
IMO of course:
The economy was on a downward spiral because of 80% Democrats in power fault, 20% George W. Bush fault.
Dems Fault:
They ENCOURAGED and pretty much made it mandatory to give loans to people that didnt qualify otherwise. They pressured banks to borrow from Freddie/Fannie to give these loans out under the Community Re-investment Act. Barney Frank, Dodd, others were the cultivators of this problem.
Bushs Fault: He artificially kept interest rates low through the FED after 9/11 to fight off a recession back then and to help spur lending. WHy would you take a loan if interest rates were so low. That created the frenzy that the dems took advantage of.
Thats it, thats simple and to the point. Bush however IMO was trying to keep the economy thriving and lets face it under him we saw TREMENDOUS prosperity. Dow over 14,000, all time LOW unemployment, huge boom in small business, but people want to forget all that. Like the last 5 months of his presidency defines the economy the entire 8 years he was in office. Remember he had Katrina and 9/11 to deal with , to huge domestic disasters that Clinton NEVER had to deal with.
Now that thats taken care of, Obama didnt ask to win this award, its not his fault. THAT IS NOT THE ARGUMENT. All im saying is he hasnt done anything to deserve it, and there is no great "movement" or "progress" that is worthy of his nomination. This was simply a slap in the face to Bush, and they gave it to Obama for being a great charismatic person.
Give it a year, when his approval ratings are under 40% we will see where we stand.
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Tremendous prosperity that just happened to go downward pretty much the day he was leaving office? Iono about all that. Seems like a scam if you ask me. It's like this: I am running a business but don't own it. I am just the boss for a while. So, I do a lot of stuff behind the scenes that just ain't right, but makes everyone money so no one really says anything (kind of like Enron?). So, just about retiring time for me, everything starts to go to shit because I'm not upholding or feeding the scam anymore. I'm going to collect my check, my retirement and dip out very soon, so my work/scam is done. In the meanwhile, I made MYSELF and my family and friends a lot of money and they are all getting ready to dip right along with me so who cares what happens next and for the new boos. That's his problem, right?
I have no side. To me all politics and gov't are dirty ass mother fuckers.
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