Tim Tebow 5-1 as a starter.
Get used to it.....
9/18 143 yards passing and a TD, lots of dropped passes kind of hide the fact that Tebow was very efficient passing the ball today in limited attempts. At least 2 balls bounced off the chest of WRs, could of been a 11/18 160-175 stat line. Either way, only stat that matters is the W. Tebow wins games.
Last edited by Sinfix_15; 11-27-2011 at 09:02 PM.
I am a fan of him and I wish him well every game. But as soon as another team figures out the Denver defense Denver is toast. Their offense just isn't putting up enough points.
i gotta agree the defense is winning these games tebow is doing just enough to win (not turning the ball over) he's a ok backupOriginally Posted by Captain-Obvious™
Yeah. I watched the game.
My mistake. I thought you wanted to have a discussion about football. Apparently you just wanted to swing on Tebow's nuts.
I do agree here. I hate that credit always goes to the teams' QB when a team wins. In this case, it really isn't so. He's not doing anything on any sort of superstar level. He's barely getting by. I mean a win is a win and that's all that counts, but I'd be lying if I said that Tebow is leading this team right now. Later, QD.
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I agree partially with you QD, Tebow isnt "winning" all of these games, but he def has won 2-3 of them...you can def say the defense won the game tonight but you also have to agree that this team as a whole is a different kinda team since he took over. He isnt an elite qb by any means but he is, at the moment, a winning QB so no need to change it yet
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Denver defense gets the credit on this one 80%. Tebow gets 10% for getting tiring fieldgoal
Chargers get 10% for missing game winning field goal.
Still, only victory really worth noting is jets. Chargers are another sub par team. Jets was a good win and I give him credit.
Will get destroyed by any A list team which he hasn't played yet
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I see him as a QB on a winning team. Not a winning QB. Right now, that is. Later, QD.I agree partially with you QD, Tebow isnt "winning" all of these games, but he def has won 2-3 of them...you can def say the defense won the game tonight but you also have to agree that this team as a whole is a different kinda team since he took over. He isnt an elite qb by any means but he is, at the moment, a winning QB so no need to change it yet
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I'm swinging from Tebow's nuts.... you say he isnt scoring enough points.... last time i checked, 1 more point than the other team was enough points.
Tebow is the only QB in the NFL who would get criticized this much. He throws a should be 60% passing game, doesnt turn the ball over and wins a road game, but it had nothing to do with Tebow. The same way it didnt have anything to do with Tebow when he had 92 of 95 yards on the game winning drive.
Easy to forget that the ONLY denver WR you could name would be Eric Decker who is a 2nd year guy. The broncos have NO tight ends, no WRs, even though theyre running the ball well......... its absolute fucking luck that Willis Mcgahee hit a 2nd wind in his career.... the starting running back is Knowplay Moreno...... When Orton was the QB of Denver, they had BRANDON MARSHALL AND BRANDON LLOYD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Lance Ball the #2 running back was just brought up off the practice squad...... the only QB in the NFL who could produce stats with this PUTRID!!!!!! offense would be Tom Brady.
Tebow threw the ball very well today, had to throw a few balls away, had a few dropped passes and went 50%. He only threw 1 bad pass the entire day.....you haters better recognize. The guy improved THROWING every single game. His running is and always was perfectly fine.
Last edited by Sinfix_15; 11-28-2011 at 06:28 AM.
you're right.... the 1-4 Broncos were a winning team. They were also a winning team last season when they went 3-10... i mean look at how much better they got in the offseason right???? they got rid of 2 top 10 WRs and Knowshawn Moreno got injured.... really amazing how theyre not a superbowl contender..... 3-10 team who lost their top 3 players on the team.
The stats just simply dont support this argument..... name another QB who could have 210 yards in a game and have nothing to do with the victory. I should take people like you's criticism as a Tebow compliment, your expectations are clearly very high for this guy.
The Broncos had 351 yards of offense today, Tebow accounted for 210 of them. you act like he wasnt on the field or something.
Last edited by Sinfix_15; 11-28-2011 at 02:19 AM.
Everytime the Broncos win, the argument is "they will get destroyed by the next team".
He's 5-1....... people expected him to be 0-6..... The Broncos were 4-10 with Orton last season and 1-4 with Orton this season. Theyre already a BAD team..... but they lost Moreno for the season and traded Brandon Lloyd the best WR..... honestly what do you expect???
the 3 biggest weapons on this team are eric decker, willis mcgahee and lance ball...... seriously.
No. I don't expect anything from the guy. I'm not a Tebow fan. I don't hate the guy, though. I just don't see his stats adding up to the hype he receives by Tebow fans. You say the stats don't support my argument. I think they do and you're reading more into my statements about him because you see my as a Tebow "hater." I'll add more when I get in from work later this evening to try and support this, dude. Have a good one until then. Later, QD.
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Facts are facts. He's a winning QB. he's won games that people didn't think he would win. He's had some impressive stats rushing.
But if your beating teams like the chargers, dolphins, chiefs, raiders (missing personnel ) by having to go to OT or doing last minute game tieing / winning drives, you aren't going to the next level.
The jets was a GREAT win and showed heart. But eventually it will take skill to win, any A list team will destroy them, and until he gets over that hump I'm still not OMG. I think he's earned his starter status for sure. But he's still not anywhere near tom Brady or Manning or big ben etc
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I dont think anyone in here is comparing him to any of those 3 qbs...i just think he is winning these ganes and is a motivating factor to his team being revitalized. Without tebow I see the broncos as a 2-3 win team at best. Facts are facts even if you dont like the guy he is winning games without much help around him.
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My point is he is not on the next level, hes a jake plummer, hes a carson palmer. The Broncos are better with him than with orton, but thats still not saying much.
Theres a few things that are interesting about him and its what will happen in the offseason. If the broncos go out and pick up pieces to surround Tebow to run an option style college offense, will it work? Will Elway really commit to Tebow?
I suspect NO. Because it would be a huge gamble to revamp your entire offense around 1 player than it is to run an offense that is proven to work.
Elway is in this to win superbowls, and there is nothing from Tebow that shows he is capable of that right now, he has yet to REALLY play team in the top tier. The Jets was a great win, but even they are B-List.
I want to see the option offense work against a Steelers, Ravens, Patriots, Saints, Falcons, Giants type team. Teams i consider to be the upper part of the league.
Tebow is beating (barely) teams that are mediocre. Which is fine, but that doesnt win championships. Hes doing it with a pretty shitty team around him, which means its special, but it doesnt win superbowls.
off season will be interesting
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^^^ I agree with all of this lol
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The fact remains that any team in the NFL would be hard pressed to win a Super Bowl scoring so little. Their defense can't carry them forever. The Denver offense needs to figure out how to score more than they have.
a future with Tebow doesnt mean you're going to be an option team. If you're asking me if Tebow can be the broncos long term QB running the exact same scheme theyre running right now? absolutely fucking not.... they dont have to and have no plans to revamp their offense in the future. Tebow is starting to and will continue to make passes.
Tebow is improving passing. He was an efficient passer vs the chargers. if you give him credit for balls that bounced off his WRs chest, he went 13/18. only 1 pass was bad all day. So Tebow threw the ball 18 times and had 1 bad throw???? is that not enough?????????? and THESE ARE THE DEVELOPMENT YEARS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! do you have to throw the ball 35 times and torch the other team like Brady and Rodgers to be an NFL QB? if so.... they need to go ahead and shut the bitch down and let the Packers and Patriots play 16 times a season because theyre the only 2 teams that can do it. I watched the Bengals game yesterday and it made me sick.... watching a grown ass man like AJ Green jumping and running all over the field catching every ball thrown in his zip code..... Tebow doesnt have that.... nobody seems to be acknowledging this.
The Broncos arent running the ball because Tebow cant throw... theyre running the ball because their defense is packed with crafty old veterans and once they finally got Orton out of town they realized "holy shit, this defense plays lights out when we dont turn the ball over on our side of the field"... they also believe they can win games now. Broncos coaches are simply playing to an under talented team's strengths.... All jokes aside..... Florida's offense was better than this Broncos offense. The Broncos easily have the least talented offense in the NFL, you couldnt pick another team in the NFL that has worse WRs TEs and RBs than the Broncos. They also simplified the game for the offensive line. Linemen struggle a lot more with pass blocking than they do run blocking. Defensive lines also have to wait a minute to see what Tebow is going to do every single play. That aura of unpredictability is there every single time Tebow takes a snap. Whether Denver lines up in the i formation or 5 wide, your defensive line has run in their mind. They cant pin back and blitz, see Jetz for an example why. There's a lot more to Tebow than being a big guy who can run.
Last edited by Sinfix_15; 11-28-2011 at 11:51 AM.
The stats dont add up if you're comparing him to Tom Brady. Fact is.... you and others say he had little to do with the win yesterday, he had 210 of 350 yards. he usually has a much higher % of the offense than that. I think people are spoiled by Brady/Rodgers and forgot what football is suppose to look like. Teams who can run the ball run the ball. Tebow has yet to have an off season to actually prepare for being an NFL QB..... hes 5-1 on a team that went 1-4 4-10....... i think he's earned a training camp and a full season. Any other QB would be signing a new contract by now.
they just lost Brandon Marshall and Brandon LLoyd, Knowshawn Moreno is out for the season, the #2 running back came off the practice squad. What they need to score more points is another WR or a young WR to get better quickly, a tight end and someone as good as Moreno should have been to replace Moreno. Trent Richardson or Justin Blackmon is what the Broncos need.
I agree that i would like to see Tebow with a really healthy Broncos and supporting cast. The fact hes winning is good, but i tend to agree with the analysts, the Broncos arent winning solely because of Tebow. The Defense is playing MUCH better now than it was under Orton, Tebow continues to get better and do better (as the passing yards showed yesterday). Hes really NOT turning the ball over at all.
The running game and the defense is really doing the broncos well, but can that hold up against a real offense that can put up 400+ yards AGAINST them? Yet to be seen....
Week 14 ,15, 16 will be interesting to see.
I suspect the Tebow magic will cease to exist once he meets the Bears Defense, the Patriots Offense, and the bills (although i would say they have a decent shot at the Bills).
They CAN beat the bears, mainly because they may have more offense with Cutler being out. The Patriots can put up retarded numbers on offense, that will be a true test to see if the Broncos Defense can measure up.
Patriots are my team, so if you beat Brady ill wear a Tebow Jersey LOL
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I'm feeling a little better about the Bears game after seeing what the Raiders did to them and knowing they dont have Cutler. Still agree with you on that one though, that is a game they should lose. Hester is too much of a game changer and should get more than a few chances vs the Broncos. Not having Cutler doesnt change that the Bears D should be able to hold back the Broncos pretty well.
If the Broncos beat the Patriots, i'll be in Church next sunday.
Broncos really need to beat the Viking to avoid going on a 3 game skid, gonna be hard to beat Chicago and nearly impossible to beat the Patriots. Bills is a toss up, should beat Chiefs.
The Broncos had no answer for Rivers to Gates......... theyre gonna have nightmares watching film on Brady to Hernandez.
Well the Bears Defense should be in full swing barring injuries and will test Tebows offensive skills. If its a close game (which i think it can be) even if they lose i would be feeling good.
The Patriots you gotta look at the offense. If they can hold Brady to under 25 points i would take that as a win. I do think that Tebow can score against the Pats seeing as our front DL sucks, and our secondary is really hurt and if Tebow can put together a few 10-15 yard runs, then itll be interesting.
Patriots Defense has been getting better but its the offense that is winning us games. With brady putting up 30+ points and 2-3 TDs a game, that is what is winning us games.
I think denver should beat MN, i think they CAN beat the bears and it will be their first REAL test (for tebow at least). Patriots prob NOT going to happen, but i could see the Broncos defense putting some pressure on the Pats.
Bills i think will be a REALLY good game depending on how the bills fare the next few weeks. THey arent as for real as everyone thought at the beginning of the season
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Until a QB leads his team to more than say 21 points in a single game, not 2 or 3 games combined, he isnt winning anything. Tebow is filling the roll of a #2 or #3 QB in the NFL. He is handing the ball off and he is running the ball himself. He isnt throwing a lot of INT's because if his receiver isnt wide open, he runs the ball. If anyone deserves credit for winning games, its Von Miller and Elvis Duberville. Those 2 are absolutely dominant.
I'm not comparing him to anyone, Sin. And I'm not saying he isn't providing any offense, either. What I am saying is that he is not putting up the stellar numbers to back up all the Tebow fan hype going around. Everyone is touting him as if he were still this great QB that came out of college. The facts show he isn't. He's shown himself to be mediocre AND he has shown himself to have potential to be a decent QB. <---Of course, these are my opinions. I don't see a future great here. He may show me wrong and if he does, definitely more power to the man. I also recognize that this is his first "season" and he has been thrown into the fire so I understand all that.
Also, you can't really be referring to me about the "spoiled by Brady/Rodgers" and forgetting what football is supposed to look like, dude. Remember my age, lolol. I was watching football well before your conception. Still even have my 1980 stamped Atlanta Falcons helmet that I got for Christmas in 1980. Remember watching the UGA win the Sugar Bowl in 1981. I was all about watching football through the late 70's to the early 90's. I'm not trying to talk down to you, though, Sinfix. Just wanted to let you know I'm definitely not infatuated with Brady and Manning and these guys. Later, QD.
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Name a team in the league that has less offensive weapons than the Denver Broncos?
I think thats the biggest issue. Tebow's "hype" is so big that his play will never satisfy his critics. Pretty much the same in any sport. If a boxer starts getting called the best ever, it doesnt matter if he goes 50-0... when he becomes 50-1, hes an overrated bum. For any other QB in the league, winning would be enough. The Broncos are one of the worst teams in football and theyre on the verge of a playoff birth with Tebow even though Orton handicapped them with a 1-4 start. Only Tebow would be criticized under these circumstances. When this all started and everyone said Tebow was the reason the Broncos sucked... my exact words were " i want to see the rest of the team playing well and then Tebow ruin it for them.... then you can say he sucks", well... the rest of the team is playing well and Tebow is commanding them just fine. I dont see a problem. His passing improves every game.
Broncos were 30th in time of possession before Tebow, 5th with Tebow. Any clue why the defense is playing better? All this talk about how horrible the offense is, theyre staying on the field longer than 27 other teams.
i dont follow the broncos enough to answer that but their Defense when i watched them play the jets was pretty impressive. Thats why i think how they handle the patriots will be interesting. If they hold the pats to sub 25 points...................
Point by Point
Their Offense faced 1 significant defense IMO this year , and that was the Jets. They looked horrible, all game they had no answer. Until the last drive.
Their DEFENSE faced 1 significant offense this year, and that was the Jets. They looked REALLY good and all game kept them contained, and i think thats what kept them in it and allowed tebow to score that last drive.
Now they get to face Forte/Cutler replacement and the Bears Defense with Urlacher (Former super bowl caliber team), the Patriots 30+ Point offense and growing defense, The bills extreme youth and quickness.
Its going to be a tough 3 games.
Now, honest question, lets say they beat MN, and lose the last 3 games , they lose to the bears by 14, by 40 to the PATS, and by 7 to the bills............do you still believe in Tebow?
I suspect as a player YES, as a teamate to build a team around, no
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Tebow has earned another season regardless of how this season concludes. Name any other rookie QB in the history of the NFL that a team would make the decision not to build a team around after less than 10 starts. Should Cam Newton be cut now too? hes had more games than Tebow, thrown a ton of picks and only won 3 games. Sam Bradford already a bust? Blaine Gabbert done too? I guess the 49ers developing Alex Smith was a mistake too? Jay Cutler threw for 48% his first season, why is he still around?
Any other QB who turned around a team like Tebow has done this season would be announcing his new long term contract on ESPN this morning.
So far Tebow has proved every critic wrong, theyre just sticking to their guns and riding their predictions until they crash and burn. Only difference is now the critics are starting to attach a disclaimer of "i hope im wrong" to their excessively negative assessments of Tebow.
challenge to anyone..... name a rookie QB who was cut, released, replaced or traded with less than 10 starts and a winning record.
you named all TRADITIONAL QBs who have proven they have a PASSING game. Tebow is getting BETTER but hes probably NEVER going to be a PASSING QB.
NFL is a passers game, the league made it that way. Cam Newton averaged 400+ yards his first 3 games (NFL RECORD IIRC). Still on a losing team. Alex SMith is 9-2 and leading the division, has a much better team around him too than Tebow or Cam.
The reason tebow doesnt have some major contract around is because everyone that knows football knows that he is not a future QB in this league. Cam can be developed into a QB and ill say he probably will be one of the top QBs in the next 4-5 years. Alex SMith i dont know if he caught magic in a bottle this year, but i dont see him being a tier 1 QB 2-3 years from now. They are also in a super weak division. I mean second place is 4-7........
Broncos are also in a super weak division.
The only way tebow becomes a powerhouse is by building a team around him because he doesnt throw or operate like 99% of the NFL QBs. So, you MUST have a super steroid O-Line to protect him because he cant take a snap under center and takes an extra 2 seconds to release the ball...........or he wants to run the option.
and you have to have a super stacked defense because his style of play doesnt put up the points that you need to win, so your defense has to contain the other teams.
The bears have /had an amazing defense but they realized defense just doesnt get it done. Likewise the Pats have the best offense in the league, but that doesnt make up for a horrible defense.
Im sorry but i think Denvers best play is to make Tebow into a receiver or full back of some kind, hes winning, but he will never be able to beat anyone that will get them a superbowl, which is what they are in this for.
You know that. Hes ISNT capable of beating those guys regardless of the team around him,
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And Braddford is putting up retarded numbers LOL
All those QBs have a passing game. Tebows best game is 180 yards passing. Thats good, but he will have to keep that up
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The only reason the Broncos cant pass is because Tebow. Has nothing to do with having a bunch of rookie WRs. Eric Decker is their biggest weapon. They have the least talented offense in the NFL. Jake Plummer, Jay Cutler, and Kyle Orton couldnt win with this team..... even when Brandon Marshall and Brandon Llyod were the WRs..... you make every excuse you can come up with to negate a WINNING QBs wins just because he isnt doing it the way you think it should be done. Tebow threw for 88 TDs in college and his completion % is right there with Andrew Lucks. His ball security is not a fluke..... its not accident that he doesnt turn the ball over. Tebow takes what he knows is there and doesnt risk forcing anything. With confidence and more play time things will open up.
I refuse to ignore everything i've watched with my own eyes over the last 6 years just because of people's opinions of Tebow's mechanics. The "experts" said he wouldnt get drafted as a QB. He did. The "experts" said he wouldnt get drafted in the 1st round. He did. The "experts" said he would get killed if he ran in the NFL like he did @ Florida. He's still alive. The "experts" said he would never win in the NFL. He is.
So, with all do respect, me and the "experts" are just gonna have to agree to disagree.
Last edited by Sinfix_15; 11-29-2011 at 12:53 PM.
I still say he has a chance to be a "good" QB, but could be an excellent TE.
Either way, I'm a Tebow fan.
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