Best way to make a FWD car more oversteer biased?

[Jecht]

I'm putting together my plans for my suspension setup, and I want the car to be a little more oversteer biased. I absolutely hate understeer. Anything to lessen the amount of understeer or something that would give it a tendency to oversteer. I was thinking that getting larger rear roll bars would help some. Opinions and thoughts on this anyone?

[man]

thick rear sway bar, suspension bushings.

If neither of those work, ummm handbrake?

[Jecht]

Bump. I want some more opinions and thoughts on this.

[The BUCKY]

sell it for a rwd car

[Jecht]

I had a 240sx. I don't want another RWD car.

[yudalicious]

relatively higher spring rates in the rear... I would rather try that before getting a sway bar.

[§treet_§peed]

Yank the E-brake up as hard as you can while you are going 60 MPH and DREEEEEFT!!!!



















Into a tree Preferably....

[SampaGuy]

wider wheels and/or better tires up front. and higher spring rate in the rear

[HiPSI]

why would you want oversteer? why not set the goal at making the car nice and neutral?

[Benefit]

oversteer is for the devil

[man]

why would you want oversteer? why not set the goal at making the car nice and neutral?

I think that's kinda what he's going for. He did say he wanted to reduce understeer... Either way an oversteer biased car can be better than a neutral car depending on the driver's style, which is what really matters.

[Formally...]

I would do the larger rear sway bar and even look at getting a smaller front bar. This will make the turn in of the car a little slower but will allow the front to bite better. Most people think that you want a car to stay as flat as possible through a turn but it depends on the turn and speeds. If you are planning to auto-x the car then I would do the larger rear bar and slightly stiffer spring rate if you have an adjustable shock to match to the spring. In auto-x a slightly tall happy FWD car can out run a RWD and AWD car.

[man]

In auto-x a slightly tall happy FWD car can out run a RWD and AWD car.

Very true, those ITRs out there are wicked.

[yudalicious]

Very true, those ITRs out there are wicked.

and those crazy CRXes... seriously though, an autocross-centric (big rear bar, set up to rotate crazily well) set up like they mentioned *might* not be ideal for a street car or a hpde car, it all comes down what your goal is. However, I'd suggest against getting better tires in the front or more tire in the front BEFORE you try the other, more common solutions.

[Jecht]

Thanks guys, I appreciate the info. I mostly want it set up like this because of the way I drive. I simply find a little bit of oversteer easier to control than all the understeer I'm getting now. I'm getting some coilovers soon, so I'm gonna see how that change the car's characteristics and then I'm going with a 28mm adjustable rear bar. Going from that 240sx of mine to this understeer monster is like night and day.

Oh and about the better tires in the front... I already put some nice Pirelli tires on all four wheels, so I don't want to get rid of them just yet. lol

[~The_Duke~]

Rear sway bar :goodjob: bushings.

[§treet_§peed]

Paint your Valve cover Type-R red and instantly gain 30 whp ftw!!!!! :goodjob:

[Five*Star*]

Run the Skunk2 coilover kit with some koni adj. shocks. Run that adj. rear swaybar like you mentioned too. Also, run 4" jacking point clearance (ride height) in front and 4.5" jacking clearance in the rear. Get some good tires like Falken RT-615 or other auto-x tires.... tires make all the difference in the end after the chassis is set-up.


I use to run GC coilovers on my old cx hatch. I had no front swaybar and a stock LS teg rear swaybar. On auto-x it was about perfect on some Falken Azenis.


Also, look into chassis braces... starting with strut bars and lower tie-bars. It will help your responsive-ness, and feel for the car.


Hope that helps... the rear sway makes a big difference, as well as the ride heights like I mentioned. Too-low is not good at all (bouncing off bump-stops kills the handling!!!), and too-high can be bad too.

[Jecht]

Paint your Valve cover Type-R red and instantly gain 30 whp ftw!!!!! :goodjob:
:rolleyes: Thanks.


Run the Skunk2 coilover kit with some koni adj. shocks. Run that adj. rear swaybar like you mentioned too. Also, run 4" jacking point clearance (ride height) in front and 4.5" jacking clearance in the rear. Get some good tires like Falken RT-615 or other auto-x tires.... tires make all the difference in the end after the chassis is set-up.
I use to run GC coilovers on my old cx hatch. I had no front swaybar and a stock LS teg rear swaybar. On auto-x it was about perfect on some Falken Azenis.
Also, look into chassis braces... starting with strut bars and lower tie-bars. It will help your responsive-ness, and feel for the car.
Hope that helps... the rear sway makes a big difference, as well as the ride heights like I mentioned. Too-low is not good at all (bouncing off bump-stops kills the handling!!!), and too-high can be bad too.

I appreciate you trying to help, but I already have everything figured out. I already have my Patec Holeshot coilovers, they came in yesterday. I already have nice Pirelli tires. Those aren't true coilovers, those are coilover sleeves. Even with the adjustment in both the shocks and those coilovers sleeves, the amount of work you would have to do to balance the dampening and the ride height doesn't seem like it would be worth it. I plan on setting my coilovers so that the A arms are parallel to the ground.


/thread guys.

[josh green]

just b/c its a sleeve coilover doesnt mean that its shitty. Just about anyone on H-T will tell you to get G/C coilovers with koni yellow shocks. This is not a cheap setup for what it is. You can get any spring rate you want and the koni shocks are badass. I bought the G/C/koni setup for my hatch and it was around $750 for shocks and coilovers. Granted I got a little too stiff of a spring rate than I was comfortable with. I had 500lbs springs front and rear in a basically gutted hatch with a weld in roll bar. If I was to do it all over again, omni coilovers front and rear, they are cheaper and its a threaded shock coilover, not that that makes a difference I just like them.

[voca164e]

a nice cheap way to reduce understeer in a FWD is to disconnect the front anti-sway bar. and add a stiffer rear bar. that is a pretty common low buck trick that I've seen quite a few SCCA guys use. And a good alignment will also help, a bit of toe out on the rear can help also.

[Jecht]

just b/c its a sleeve coilover doesnt mean that its shitty. Just about anyone on H-T will tell you to get G/C coilovers with koni yellow shocks. This is not a cheap setup for what it is. You can get any spring rate you want and the koni shocks are badass. I bought the G/C/koni setup for my hatch and it was around $750 for shocks and coilovers. Granted I got a little too stiff of a spring rate than I was comfortable with. I had 500lbs springs front and rear in a basically gutted hatch with a weld in roll bar. If I was to do it all over again, omni coilovers front and rear, they are cheaper and its a threaded shock coilover, not that that makes a difference I just like them.

I didn't say they were necessarily bad. The coilovers I have are Patec Holeshot Series 4. It only cost me $745 shipped for them, brand new. This isn't a Honda. This is a Volkswagen they are going on, I would rather trust a tried and true part that is common with other Volkswagen drivers. I already have them though, so there is no point in arguing about it.

[§treet_§peed]

^^ Btw...your -1 really killed me :gay:

[RandomGuy]

drive in reverse :)

[MTA_Rep]

:stupid:

[Nismo9220]

A much stiffer rear swaybar will do it to a certain extent. Adding rear toe out will cause the car to rotate in turns, but excessive adjustment causes lift-throttle oversteer, if that's what you're going for. A lot of negative camber on the rear wheels will do it too. :goodjob: