What does it take for an EF to run 13s

[Vteckidd]

Im having a conversation via PM with Halfwit. I just though id get everyone else opinion.

Assume you have a 90 CRX SI, curb weight is about 2200lbs. Its stock, nothing done to it, you have a $5000 budget, what would it take to make it run mid 13s with whatever combo you want, and it must be RELIABLE.

All Motor sets must be from HMOTORSONLINE.COM with their pricing. So dont say you can buy a GSR swap for $1500.


Here were my Top 3 reccomendations since i have to factor in labor as well.

1) B16 Swap from Hmotorsonline.com $1499
Avid racing motor mount kit $230
shift linkage $75
labor $735
axles $100
$2800ish

2) GSR swap from Hmotorsonline.com $3100
Hasport Hydro mount kit $390
OBD0-OBD1 conversion harness $100
Labor $735
Shift Linkage $75
$4400ish

3) D15B VTEC engine 130hp $450
CRX SI tranny $150
Clutch Stage2 $300
MSPi Turbo Kit $3500 installed
OBD1 ECU an conversion harness $280
$4900ish

his best bet is the GSR swap, its the best platform to build on. the FASTEST would be the D15 turbo, however, its a SOHC, and its a stock motor, so ..... but the good thing is if you blow it up, you can find another SOHC for CHEAP ($100 or so). you blow a GSR or B16 up its ALOT MORE EXPENSIVE.

The B16 is the easiest an cost effective, however it wont run 13s, an they dont like boost at all. they have weak ringlands and pop consistently.

I think the best bet is the GSR swap, with a simple wet kit, however, he would have to get it tuned which is more $$.

If you have any other input please share

[Nopaintsls]

Im having a conversation via PM with Halfwit. I just though id get everyone else opinion.

Assume you have a 90 CRX SI, curb weight is about 2200lbs. Its stock, nothing done to it, you have a $5000 budget, what would it take to make it run mid 13s with whatever combo you want, and it must be RELIABLE.

All Motor sets must be from HMOTORSONLINE.COM with their pricing. So dont say you can buy a GSR swap for $1500.



There's still ppl out there that can get it for that low.... :rant: fags...

[Vteckidd]

reason i say that is because im a SHOP. i cant sell someone a 3rd party motor that isnt backed by a warranty or have papers. I have to be able to back the product i supply.

[Nopaintsls]

reason i say that is because im a SHOP. i cant sell someone a 3rd party motor that isnt backed by a warranty or have papers. I have to be able to back the product i supply.

Your right, I was just sayin...

[IntegraXTR]

why not just sohc vtec boost? thats under 5k. But if it wasn't for the third party thing, I say you could def break easy 13s with a 5k budget, and I can get a b18c1 longblock for around 1500. But since it has to have papers and such, I say single cam turbo.

[fight club]

if i wasnt using hmmotorsports and could use forums

k20a3 full swap- 1000
crower stage 2 n/a cams- 380
crower valves n springs- 380
toda itb setup- 1000
full race header, straight exhaust- 800
engine mounts- 250
stripped interior- free.99
lightweight race seat- 200
rotas (something with low rotational mass)- 300
tires- 200
used kpro- 300
75 shot- 150
im around 5k, dont know what it would run tho? it would rev to 8k tho :)

[Vteckidd]

if i wasnt using hmmotorsports and could use forums

k20a3 full swap- 1000
crower stage 2 n/a cams- 380
crower valves n springs- 380
toda itb setup- 1000
full race header, straight exhaust- 800
engine mounts- 250
stripped interior- free.99
lightweight race seat- 200
rotas (something with low rotational mass)- 300
tires- 200
used kpro- 300
75 shot- 150
im around 5k, dont know what it would run tho? it would rev to 8k tho :)


WOW, your WAY OFF. try:

k20a3 full swap- 1500
crower stage 2 n/a cams- 380
crower valves n springs- 380
toda itb setup- 2000
full race header, straight exhaust- 800
engine mounts- 550
stripped interior- free.99
lightweight race seat- 200
rotas (something with low rotational mass)- 300
tires- 200
used kpro- 900
75 shot- 350


i was doing a K series in my CRX, i priced it all out, for a TYPE-S its still $8000 WITH ME DOING THE LABOR. SHow me where you can buy Toda ITBs for $1000, KPRO for $300, nad mounts for $250 an ill buy them today, cause ill make MAD PROFIT on them.

a K20A3 with what you have listed, MAY make 180whp, and the Kblock only rev to 6500, you can push it to 8000, but they spit rods out the block at that high of an RPM. If you want to rev to 8000, do a b16, they can handle 9500 as long as you have the valvetrain

K series is OUT OF THE QUESTION, you cannot do it for $5000, no way. an your missing ALOT of stuff to make the K work in an EF. my estimate is more accurate, then add $1000 for misc stuff like FPR, fuel lines, GE fuel rail, and more. an its a VERY complicated swap which requires an halfcore radiator, cahssis welding, its not a bolt in swap by any means.

Krucial, look at option 3 i posted, it was SOHC VTEC boost ;) Even a GSR longblock for $1500 doesnt give him a Trans, (cable $300, hydro $600-700), mounts, axles, ecu, shift linkage, etc.

[fight club]

well, my mistake then LOL i was just goin by prices i saw on k20a.org. ill check for ya and see if they r still that cheap lol.

[Vteckidd]

im on K20A.org all the time. The CHEAPEST i found a used KPRO WITH ecu was $1050 shipped. if he has an ECU already, the cheapest i found was $850.

My hasport mounts were $550 with a hookup. Toda ITBS are BIG money , especially for Ks, TWMs are cheaper, skunk2 has a set for $1500

[fight club]

k , im not tryin to argue lol. you do this for a living, i just fuck around. yea i was again not looking at prices, just what i could remember/think i remembered. i saw some twm's going for 1200. lol

[speedminded]

k , im not tryin to argue lol. you do this for a living, i just fuck around. yea i was again not looking at prices, just what i could remember/think i remembered. i saw some twm's going for 1200. lolYou can get just about anything at whatever price you're willing to pay if you have the time to look and watch ALL the forums and websites...i picked up a brand new ITR longblock for $2,600, would need $1,500+ in parts and a B-series transmission, then you'd have an EF in 13's...low 13's on slicks...but that's not the point. A shop has to be able to back there work and parts up to be successful and profitable.

[99SI]

He would need my motor that you're building now. That should get him into the thirteens pretty deep with slicks. But if I were doing the 5k budget without having anything but a stock EF to start with. SOHC turbo would be the way I'd go. Sooooo much torque even with low daily driven boost. If he could find a good D16 vtec(or non v for that matter) and supply it for yall to build it could save a few bucks and although you take your chances on the reliability factor maybe freshen it up a bit with the money saved. For instance, high mileage D16 that still has good compression, runs good, no knocking. New bearings, ARP rod bolts, new pistons, rings, slight bore and crosshatch and deck. Then you have a good as new motor to throw a little boost at.

[99SI]

Although I do agree on some levels as far as getting a GSR and throwing it in, but that eats up pretty much all the budget and will 150-155whp get 2200lbs into the 13's? I am sure on slicks with the correct gearing that it would be right at it but you have to consider that he doesn't have the budget left to buy a set of wheels and slicks to run so I am thinking stock ef with GSR swap(stock) on street tires would probably be right on the 14.0 threshold give or take a tenth. Again, not sure on any of these things, just speculating

[BABY J]

--> 100 - 150 shot wet on refreshed D (preferably the D16Z6 I have wasting away in my garage... LOL)

--> slicks

--> weight reduction

--> full bolt-ons

--> Uber

[IntegraXTR]

He would need my motor that you're building now. That should get him into the thirteens pretty deep with slicks. But if I were doing the 5k budget without having anything but a stock EF to start with. SOHC turbo would be the way I'd go. Sooooo much torque even with low daily driven boost. If he could find a good D16 vtec(or non v for that matter) and supply it for yall to build it could save a few bucks and although you take your chances on the reliability factor maybe freshen it up a bit with the money saved. For instance, high mileage D16 that still has good compression, runs good, no knocking. New bearings, ARP rod bolts, new pistons, rings, slight bore and crosshatch and deck. Then you have a good as new motor to throw a little boost at.

^^ thats what I said, sohc turbo FTW!

[Halfwit]

keep ideas coming guys, but i definatle want a dohc vtec, i have a d16 in my dd and hate it with bolt ons..

dont wnat to spend money on a sohc, reliability issues, only so much it can amount to ect.
ill probably go with gsr, with bolt ons plus few internals plus nitrous, to start out with.

WHAT WOULD A GSR WITH I/E/H CAMS, CAM GEARS, GET ME IN THE 1/4? WITH AND WITHOUT NITROUS?

[speedminded]

keep ideas coming guys, but i definatle want a dohc vtec, i have a d16 in my dd and hate it with bolt ons..

dont wnat to spend money on a sohc, reliability issues, only so much it can amount to ect.
ill probably go with gsr, with bolt ons plus few internals plus nitrous, to start out with.

WHAT WOULD A GSR WITH I/E/H CAMS, CAM GEARS, GET ME IN THE 1/4? WITH AND WITHOUT NITROUS?*shakes head* quit worrying about 1/4 mile times for one. I've seen a stock H22 in an EF wagon run 13.0 on slicks all night long.

[Halfwit]

*shakes head* quit worrying about 1/4 mile times for one. I've seen a stock H22 in an EF wagon run 13.0 on slicks all night long.
hey thanks for contribution but SOMEONE else seems to believe that h22 is too much trouble. lol j/k
vteckidd
answer the ?

[Vteckidd]

if you doubt the turbo D, come take a ride in scottys d16 NON VTEC, stock motor, turbo kit.

makes 202/206

now go find me a GSR that makes the much power

[Halfwit]

if you doubt the turbo D, come take a ride in scottys d16 NON VTEC, stock motor, turbo kit.

makes 202/206

now go find me a GSR that makes the much power i would like to take u up on that, but is my car gonna blow up when i drive it hard?

i finally have two cars so i am not up a creek if i break a car so i am gonna red line, nitrous ect.

[BABY J]

keep ideas coming guys, but i definatle want a dohc vtec, i have a d16 in my dd and hate it with bolt ons..

dont wnat to spend money on a sohc, reliability issues, only so much it can amount to ect.
ill probably go with gsr, with bolt ons plus few internals plus nitrous, to start out with.

WHAT WOULD A GSR WITH I/E/H CAMS, CAM GEARS, GET ME IN THE 1/4? WITH AND WITHOUT NITROUS?

Stick w/ the single cam. You can trip over a D series at the grocery store while looking for condoms. Stock for stock (exculding K, dunno much about 'em) they can take more NOS than any other Honda motor. Not to mention it's a non-interference motor, if you break a D you did it on purpose. :) I sprayed 100 shot wet on my old fully bolted Si for over a year and the motor took it all day.

[Halfwit]

Stick w/ the single cam. You can trip over a D series at the grocery store while looking for condoms. Stock for stock (exculding K, dunno much about 'em) they can take more NOS than any other Honda motor. Not to mention it's a non-interference motor, if you break a D you did it on purpose. :) I sprayed 100 shot wet on my old fully bolted Si for over a year and the motor took it all day.

oooooh fight! VTECKIDD told me d series = not good for nitrous cause i was gonna do it on my dd ek

[speedminded]

hey thanks for contribution but SOMEONE else seems to believe that h22 is too much trouble. lol j/k
vteckidd
answer the ?yeah, if you don't do the work yourself it will cost you more in fabrication to shoehorn it in then just buying a b-series.

[BABY J]

^^ this will be the 1st time I call out VTECKIDD. Tell me another motor in the Honda family that can take more spray.... waiting... :) I am not telling you what I HEARD, I am telling you what I DID! That motor is STILL in my garage, and was running when I took it out of my 92 Si.

[Halfwit]

^^ this will eb te 1st time I call out VTECKIDD. Tell me another motor in the Honda family that can take more spray.... waiting... :) I am not telling you what I HEARD, I am telling you what I DID!
i talksed to him on aim about a month ago when i got hte ek and wanted spray and he said no good.

[speedminded]

^^ this will eb te 1st time I call out VTECKIDD. Tell me another motor in the Honda family that can take more spray.... waiting... :) I am not telling you what I HEARD, I am telling you what I DID!green91 was getting 230hp on his wasn't he...yo where are you chris?

[mumbles]

i thought you guys said reliable. sohc turbo really isn't that reliable. :2cents:

[BABY J]

You WILL need to refresh the motor before going that big... no1 owned my 92 before me, so I knew the motor was babied (back then I was a mini-trucker so I could care less about the car).

[BABY J]

i thought you guys said reliable. sohc turbo really isn't that reliable. :2cents:

YOU sir are smoking crack. LOL.

[Halfwit]

You WILL need to refresh the motor before going that big... no1 owned my 92 before me, so I knew the motor was babied (back then I was a mini-trucker so I could care less about the car).
well i cant be swappin insurance back and forth every two weeks when i mess the motor up all the time. need reliability.

[BABY J]

well i cant be swappin insurance back and forth every two weeks when i mess the motor up all the time. need reliability.

A refreshed D can take a hundred shot wet (w/ full bolt-ons) like a CHAMP!!! I DID IT FOR OVER A YEAR!!!!!

[speedminded]

well i cant be swappin insurance back and forth every two weeks when i mess the motor up all the time. need reliability.save your pennies until you can afford something worthwhile...slowly put stuff together as you find good deals.

[bigdare23]

How about a fully build d16a6 (with ZC pistons) with a y8 head (with the works and milled). ZC tranny (with Si final gear) with lsd, and a lot of weight reduction (jdm bumpers front and rear and nothing in the car). If that don't work throw a small shot on it, and it should get you into the 13's.

[BABY J]

^^ stop talking about your setup!!! LOL. Go away!!!

[mumbles]

YOU sir are smoking crack. LOL.

you tell me one boosted honda owner that can't resist turning the boost up on there little car and next thing you BOOM!!!

[Halfwit]

save your pennies until you can afford something worthwhile...slowly put stuff together as you find good deals.

afford something worth while? wtf thats what we are discussing, are u saying a gsr isnt worhtwhile?

i dont slowly put stuff together.

[BABY J]

you tell me one boosted honda owner that can't resist turning the boost up on there little car and next thing you BOOM!!!

One that has COMMON DAMN SENSE!! I suggest you google an article "CAMDICAPPED" from DSPORT mag. Z6 bottom, Y8 top, 17lbs --> 345WHP @ 17 lbs. UNSLEEVED, and 10PSI daily. I back-ordered this magazine just to get the specs on the build. I can post them if you like.

http://www.dragsport.com/issue/2004/0904_toc.shtml

Please do not post when you do not know what you are talking about.

[bigdare23]

^^ stop talking about your setup!!! LOL. Go away!!!

:blah: don't believe him! B-series all the way!

[BABY J]

:blah: don't believe him! B-series all the way!

When you get it dialed in, please add "I Got The Idea On This Build From Baby J" sticker on the hood of your car. That's all I ask.

[Halfwit]

wtf answer my ?s about gsr with bolt ons and spray and a few internals.

[speedminded]

afford something worth while? wtf thats what we are discussing, are u saying a gsr isnt worhtwhile?

i dont slowly put stuff together.Are you gonna be happy with a stock GS-R? ........Didn't think so. Then what about traction? Gonna need the gearing and the differential otherwise you'll just the spinning ALL the way down the track. Then a upgraded clutch & flywheel. That's all just for a stock GS-R then you would you want all motor (maybe a lil spray) or turbo? You're looking at double the budget with the list of next 5 items needed either way you go.

[bigdare23]

When you get it dialed in, please add "I Got The Idea On This Build From Baby J" sticker on the hood of your car. That's all I ask.

Only if you put a "BigDare23>>>>Baby J" graphic on all your hoods!

[BABY J]

wtf answer my ?s about gsr with bolt ons and spray and a few internals.

^^ You sir are irking me too! You can build 2 IDENTICAL motors w/ IDENTICAL parts and get 2 VERY different motors. THAT is why you RESEARCH and spec your shit out (I suggest building a spec sheet, then RE-doing it, then RE-doing it, then email it to VTECKIDD so he can ignore you and then have to send your block to WEST BUBBLEFUCK Virginia b/c he ignores you and won't respond) LOL. Do not look for ETs when you spec a build, too many variables. Look for expected WHP or even CRANK HP. There is NO SUCH THING AS A 13 SECOND CAR!!! There is a such thing as a 13 SECOND CAPABLE CAR. There are a LOT of variables when it comes to ETs, driver, altitude, tires, etc. The HP/WEIGHT math is easier to figure out than to spec an engine combo for 13.XX.

TAKE YOUR TIME!!! When you rush a project something always goes wrong... NE1 who has built more than bolt-on projects will tell you to BE PATIENT.

[mumbles]

One that has COMMON DAMN SENSE!! I suggest you google an article "CAMDICAPPED" from DSPORT mag. Z6 bottom, Y8 top, 17lbs --> 345WHP @ 17 lbs. UNSLEEVED, and 10PSI daily. I back-ordered this magazine just to get the specs on the build. I can post them if you like.

http://www.dragsport.com/issue/2004/0904_toc.shtml

Please do not post when you do not know what you are talking about.

if you have an issue with what i post come see we can talk about it. and i can't count how many times someone has popped their boosted single cam. are there miracle cases of course there is. And most boosted honda owners don't have common sense. if they did i would have a job lol!

[Halfwit]

Are you gonna be happy with a stock GS-R? ........Didn't think so. Then what about traction? Gonna need the gearing and the differential otherwise you'll just the spinning ALL the way down the track. Then a upgraded clutch & flywheel. That's all just for a stock GS-R then you would you want all motor (maybe a lil spray) or turbo? You're looking at double the budget with the list of next 5 items needed either way you go.
ive posted what i was gonna do to motor in this thread u did not see it.

VTECKIDD PUT THE BUDGET, NOT ME

that is just a standard for what we are going for

[speedminded]

^^ You sir are irking me too! You can build 2 IDENTICAL motors w/ IDENTICAL parts and get 2 VERY different motors. THAT is why you RESEARCH and spec your shit out (I suggest building a spec sheet, then RE-doing it, then RE-doing it, then email it to VTECKIDD so he can ignore you and then have to send your block to WEST BUBBLEFUCK Virginia b/c he ignores you and won't respond) LOL. Do not look for ETs when you spec a build, too many variables. Look for expected WHP or even CRANK HP. There is NO SUCH THING AS A 13 SECOND CAR!!! There is a such thing as a 13 SECOND CAPABLE car. There are a LOT of variables when it comes to ETs, driver, altitude, tires, etc. The HP/WEIGHT math is easier to figure out than to spec an engine combo for 13.XX.I said all that in 1 sentence, "For one, quit worrying about your 1/4 mile times." :tongue:

[Halfwit]

^^ You sir are irking me too! You can build 2 IDENTICAL motors w/ IDENTICAL parts and get 2 VERY different motors. THAT is why you RESEARCH and spec your shit out (I suggest building a spec sheet, then RE-doing it, then RE-doing it, then email it to VTECKIDD so he can ignore you and then have to send your block to WEST BUBBLEFUCK Virginia b/c he ignores you and won't respond) LOL. Do not look for ETs when you spec a build, too many variables. Look for expected WHP or even CRANK HP. There is NO SUCH THING AS A 13 SECOND CAR!!! There is a such thing as a 13 SECOND CAPABLE CAR. There are a LOT of variables when it comes to ETs, driver, altitude, tires, etc. The HP/WEIGHT math is easier to figure out than to spec an engine combo for 13.XX.

TAKE YOUR TIME!!! When you rush a project something always goes wrong... NE1 who has buil more than bolt-ons will tell you to BE PATIENT.

im not rushing shit i am getting ideas ready

fuk u, i did not as kfor the exact time i want to know about where it should be, and can it handle nitrous well.

[BABY J]

if you have an issue with what i post come see we can talk about it. and i can't count how many times someone has popped their boosted single cam. are there miracle cases of course there is. And most boosted honda owners don't have common sense. if they did i would have a job lol!

I do not have issues w/ you posting, but you make "blanket" statements about things that are SIMPLY not true... if you were SMART then you would KNOW that Halfwit ALREADY has had a boosted 240, he is already "BOOST smarter" than a lot of people on this board. He KNOWS what to do and what not to do.

"And most boosted honda owners don't have common sense."

I guess you have counted them all huh and done the math? Do you know how many people you just insulted? So which manufacturer's have all the SMART boosted guys since it's not Honda?:jerkit: You're on talking restriction until my dick rots and falls off.

[BABY J]

ive posted what i was gonna do to motor in this thread u did not see it.

VTECKIDD PUT THE BUDGET, NOT ME

that is just a standard for what we are going for

That is the mark of a SMART tuner. ESPECIALLY since he works at a shop. That already tells you that you are in good hands and he is not out to make a buck from your build. +1 for Mike.

[93H22ACX]

mike...here is what you can do to...

EF with GSR and 100shot.

shit peter ran EG with stock GSR, 100shot single fogger wet, jg im, stock open header, slicks and ran CONSISTANT 12.01@114 (couldnt break 11's). This is UNTUNED...just run richer fuel jetting and retard the timing.

or h22 eg, 70 shot, slicks, 12.1@115 :)

[BABY J]

^^ H22 is MUCH harder to swap in an EF chassis than a B series though... so pick your poison. :)

[93H22ACX]

^^ H22 is MUCH harder to swap in an EF chassis than a B series though... so pick your poison. :)

bee-series with 100 shot:D

[mumbles]

I do not have issues w/ you posting, but you make "blanket" statements about things that are SIMPLY not true... if you were SMART then you would KNOW that Halfwit ALREADY has had a boosted 240, he is already "BOOST smarter" than a lot of people on this board. He KNOWS what to do and what not to do.

"And most boosted honda owners don't have common sense."

I guess you have counted them all huh and done the math? Do you know how many people you just insulted? So which manufacturer's have all the SMART boosted guys since it's not Honda?:jerkit: You're on talking restriction until my dick rots and falls off.

look man there is a big difference between an sr20 and a honda motor. for one they are meant for boost and you can turn the boost up in those up to 18lbs on stick everything, which makes you average person happy. you seem to be the only one offened i used to have boost honda myself before you even knew what a honda was. so i think i may have little more esperience at this than you. and i've had a boosted 240. honda motors have to be purpose built for boost too much money for such little power if you ask me. save you money boost a b-series and make real power not i hope it doesn't blow up single cam 345 power.

[Spyder]

If I were going to build one the only motor I would consider is an H22, in factory trim (even stock air box) is capable of running mid to high 13's in that light of a chassis. I have seen it done several times (only once with a factory air box.. most atleast do an intake lol) These cars have made several passes with these ET's AND most important retain factory Honda reliability... If you dont do anything to the internals it doesnt at all comprimise the motor... It all depends on what your end goal is.. judging from the inital post (yes I know Mike made it not you.) all that you are looking for is 13's and reliability, that gives you both.

Baby J:
That is a wise statment that there are only 13 second capable cars , but it takes a driver to make it that way.

Speedminded: He may be perfectly happy with a car that can run 13.99 and last 200k.. he never said either way.

Vteckidd: Are you trying to push him away from an H22 because you dont want to shoe horn it in there or is there something else im missing here?My guess is you know more about the expected goals then we do at this point..

[BTEC]

B-SWAP 1300
NAWS 600
HEADER 600
MOUNTS 400
SHIFTLIKAGE 100
AXLES 300
CLUTCH AND FLYWHEEL 500
INTAKE 200
15" BGF's 200
CROME TUNED 300
CONVERSION HARNESS AND DIZZY 250
GSR CAMS 80
SKUNK 2 INTAKE 230
TANK OF 93 OCTANE $15
OCTANE BOOSTER WITH NITROMETHANE 15
ENTRY FEE AND TECH CARD 30
2 BAGS OF ICE TO COOL INTAKE AFTER TIME TRIAL 10
CHEESEBURGERS AND GATORADE IN BETWEEEN ASS WHOOPINS 20
FOOD AFTER RACE AND A COUPLE DRINKS TO CELEBRATE MY VICTORY 50

$5000 WELL SPENT TO RUN MID 12'S BC IM THE PIMPEST DRIVER ULL EVER MEET.
PRICE OF TAKING HOME THE TROPHY FOR THE OVER ALL FASTEST CAR OF THE DAY $ PRICELESS. :lmfao:

[Vteckidd]

this is where i get arrogant, please excuse me (removes mainstream hat, puts on VTECKIDD hat)

1) how is a D series motor NOT a interference motor? please explain, last time i checked they use a timing belt, cam gear around the crankshaft. it controls the valve opening with a timing belt, its an interference motor, all hondas are.

2) If you want to say that using a 100shot on a stock D series is reliable, then thats OPINION, i have seen PLENTY of D series motors pop with spray, not alot pop on turbo. Nitrous build cylinder pressure faster, has more heat, and the CAST OEM pistons dont like it. sorry, i wouldnt recomend it.

3) If it were my call, the best thing to do would be a turbo SOHC, itll make 200+whp, MORE TQ THAN ANY SWAP YOU COULD POSSIBLY DO, and they are cheap if they pop. Scotty has had his for 3 years boosted, non vtec, 10psi.

4) A gsr with bolt ons CAN GO 13s in the right chassis. But, its still a stock 150whp motor. However, the GSR is very easy to mod, turbo or na, an it can handle 300whp, D series cant, B16s/LS cant. not RELIABLY.

5) I have plenty of dynos to back it up, stop by anytime.

6) It costs MONEY, plain and simple, people that want to shop around, buy used parts, slap together a bunch of stuff from ebay etc, be prepared to face the consequences.

7) My resume is longer than most poeple on this board. from my 190whp OEM motor that only few remember i had 2 years ago, to my 240whp lsvtec. i know what it costs, and you cant do it for $3000. you might be able to, but dont say reliable in the same sentence.

8) until i see RESULTS from people an not "im building something that makes XXX", i take everything with a grain of salt. the way it sits right now, i had the highest whp all motor car, and no one has beaten it YET.

9) Turbo D series, if you want fast. YOu mentioned kevins motor, he had a $3000 b16 swap, blew it up, then built a $3000 swhortblock, with tuning, an everything else , hes got $7000 in his car. His car only runs 14s because he HASNT TUNED WITH NITROUS YET, HIS MOTOR WAS BUILT FOR NOS, NOT ALL MOTOR. so dont compare his track times

[Halfwit]

If I were going to build one the only motor I would consider is an H22, in factory trim (even stock air box) is capable of running mid to high 13's in that light of a chassis. I have seen it done several times (only once with a factory air box.. most atleast do an intake lol) These cars have made several passes with these ET's AND most important retain factory Honda reliability... If you dont do anything to the internals it doesnt at all comprimise the motor... It all depends on what your end goal is.. judging from the inital post (yes I know Mike made it not you.) all that you are looking for is 13's and reliability, that gives you both.

Baby J:
That is a wise statment that there are only 13 second capable cars , but it takes a driver to make it that way.

Speedminded: He may be perfectly happy with a car that can run 13.99 and last 200k.. he never said either way.

Vteckidd: Are you trying to push him away from an H22 because you dont want to shoe horn it in there or is there something else im missing here?My guess is you know more about the expected goals then we do at this point..

he didnt say he wouldnt do it, he said it would take a considerably larger amount of money to do so.

[Spyder]

8) until i see RESULTS from people an not "im building something that makes XXX", i take everything with a grain of salt. the way it sits right now, i had the highest whp all motor Honda, and no one has beaten it YET.



Please correct that lol :tongue:

[Halfwit]

this is where i get arrogant, please excuse me (removes mainstream hat, puts on VTECKIDD hat)

1) how is a D series motor NOT a interference motor? please explain, last time i checked they use a timing belt, cam gear around the crankshaft. it controls the valve opening with a timing belt, its an interference motor, all hondas are.

2) If you want to say that using a 100shot on a stock D series is reliable, then thats OPINION, i have seen PLENTY of D series motors pop with spray, not alot pop on turbo. Nitrous build cylinder pressure faster, has more heat, and the CAST OEM pistons dont like it. sorry, i wouldnt recomend it.

3) If it were my call, the best thing to do would be a turbo SOHC, itll make 200+whp, MORE TQ THAN ANY SWAP YOU COULD POSSIBLY DO, and they are cheap if they pop. Scotty has had his for 3 years boosted, non vtec, 10psi.
4) A gsr with bolt ons CAN GO 13s in the right chassis. But, its still a stock 150whp motor. However, the GSR is very easy to mod, turbo or na, an it can handle 300whp, D series cant, B16s/LS cant. not RELIABLY.

5) I have plenty of dynos to back it up, stop by anytime.

6) It costs MONEY, plain and simple, people that want to shop around, buy used parts, slap together a bunch of stuff from ebay etc, be prepared to face the consequences.

7) My resume is longer than most poeple on this board. from my 190whp OEM motor that only few remember i had 2 years ago, to my 240whp lsvtec. i know what it costs, and you cant do it for $3000. you might be able to, but dont say reliable in the same sentence.

8) until i see RESULTS from people an not "im building something that makes XXX", i take everything with a grain of salt. the way it sits right now, i had the highest whp all motor car, and no one has beaten it YET.

9) Turbo D series, if you want fast. YOu mentioned kevins motor, he had a $3000 b16 swap, blew it up, then built a $3000 swhortblock, with tuning, an everything else , hes got $7000 in his car. His car only runs 14s because he HASNT TUNED WITH NITROUS YET, HIS MOTOR WAS BUILT FOR NOS, NOT ALL MOTOR. so dont compare his track times
see i dont want to swap a new one every 3 months and u make it seem like they will pop BUT their cheap to replace..

i jsut cant see spending that much on a sohc than the potential of a gsr..

u have to remeber guys we put 5k as a standard, that will not be final product. i may do a swpa then come back 3 months later, do a turbo set up, or a na setup .

[BABY J]

look man there is a big difference between an sr20 and a honda motor. for one they are meant for boost and you can turn the boost up in those up to 18lbs on stick everything, which makes you average person happy. you seem to be the only one offened i used to have boost honda myself before you even knew what a honda was. so i think i may have little more esperience at this than you. and i've had a boosted 240. honda motors have to be purpose built for boost too much money for such little power if you ask me. save you money boost a b-series and make real power not i hope it doesn't blow up single cam 345 power.

I am not offended. I'd actually have to give a shit about you in order for you to offend me. For some1 who is SO much "in the game" you have contributed less technical TRUTH to this thread than NE1 else. I am 27 and have been in the game for a LONG time I assure you... you been in longer? good for you! ACT LIKE and stop making stupid comments. Who cares if you have more experience? You played 1/2wit (w/out even knowing him) by assuming he knew nothing about boost and basically called 90% of boosted Honda owners stupid. Then you say it's a waste of money to boost a NON-INTERFERENCE motor? LOL. There are at least 2 300+ hp single cams on this board, and 2 more being built as we speal. One of those was NOT rebuilt before the boost. That's pushing it if you ask me, but do not tell me what's doable and what's not. You are making a "such little power" argument when he can CARELESS about power. He ASKED about making an EF go 13seconds, and a boosted D is an option, if not THE best option seeing as replacements are $100 tops.

[Spyder]

[/B]

he didnt say he wouldnt do it, he said it would take a considerably larger amount of money to do so.

I dont know what the cost of installing one is in comparison to a B series... I honestly dont know the current shop rates of installing various honda motors into various honda chassis... I didnt think they would be that much more... My bad.

[speedminded]

I dont know what the cost of installing one is in comparison to a B series... I honestly dont know the current shop rates of installing various honda motors into various honda chassis... I didnt think they would be that much more... My bad.Leave the stock D15/D16 up front and put a stock H22 in the rear :)

[Vteckidd]

if you know anything about an h22 , then you would know why you dont do it in an EF, an you can BARELY do it for $5000.

1) H22s are cable shifters, NOT LINKAGE
2)THERE ARE NO MOTOR MOUNTS AVAILABLE FOR AN H22 INTO A CRX, custom are neccesary, an you must weld the tranny mount on, unless you do a H series with B series adapter plate.
3) Yes, its a shoehorn to get an H22 into an EF, firewall barely clears, its nearly impossible to get the hood to shut.
4) the alternator on the H22 stick out RIGHT BY THE DRIVER SIDE HEADLIGHT, a custom bracker an belt must be used, unless you reomve your headlight, which makes it a non street car.
5) you must convert to OBD1, there is nor OBD0 ECU that will run an H22 properly, they have EGR, secondariy butterflies, the wiring doesnt ever come CLOSE to plug an play

the sheer amount of labor involved is EXPENSIVE. an its not worth it when you can do an GSR that WILL bolt in with a $500 mount kit

[mumbles]

I am not offended. I'd actually have to give a shit about you in order for you to offend me. For some1 who is SO much "in the game" you have contributed less technical TRUTH to this thread than NE1 else. I am 27 and have been in the game for a LONG time I assure you... you been in longer? good for you! ACT LIKE and stop making stupid comments. Who cares if you have more experience? You played 1/2wit (w/out even knowing him) by assuming he knew nothing about boost and basically called 90% of boosted Honda owners stupid. Then you say it's a waste of money to boost a NON-INTERFERENCE motor? LOL. There are at least 2 300+ hp single cams on this board, and 2 more being built as we speal. One of those was NOT rebuilt before the boost. That's pushing it if you ask me, but do not tell me what's doable and what's not. You are making a "such little power" argument when he can CARELESS about power. He ASKED about making an EF go 13seconds, and a boosted D is an option, if not THE best option seeing as replacements are $100 tops.

please explain to me how a d-series opperates without a timeing belt. please tell me and everyone else here. maybe you know more than us b/c your 27 and all. like i care how fucking old you are.

[Spyder]

Leave the stock D15/D16 up front and put a stock H22 in the rear :)

Im guessing that is over the budget to... reguardless of if its 5k or 15k lol.

[Vteckidd]

see i dont want to swap a new one every 3 months and u make it seem like they will pop BUT their cheap to replace..

i jsut cant see spending that much on a sohc than the potential of a gsr..

u have to remeber guys we put 5k as a standard, that will not be final product. i may do a swpa then come back 3 months later, do a turbo set up, or a na setup .
i didnt say they WOULD blow, but its possible.

i dont see how you can say you dont want to have any issues, but in the same sentence you want to do a GSR with a 100shot.

the D series is more relaible than the nitrous motor, sorry.

[Vteckidd]

welcome to modded cars, you want to run 13s, be prepared for shit to break. GOing fast isnt CHEAP. i gave you the most reliable options in my PROFESSIONAL OPINION.

[Spyder]

if you know anything about an h22 , then you would know why you dont do it in an EF, an you can BARELY do it for $5000.

1) H22s are cable shifters, NOT LINKAGE
2)THERE ARE NO MOTOR MOUNTS AVAILABLE FOR AN H22 INTO A CRX, custom are neccesary, an you must weld the tranny mount on, unless you do a H series with B series adapter plate.
3) Yes, its a shoehorn to get an H22 into an EF, firewall barely clears, its nearly impossible to get the hood to shut.
4) the alternator on the H22 stick out RIGHT BY THE DRIVER SIDE HEADLIGHT, a custom bracker an belt must be used, unless you reomve your headlight, which makes it a non street car.
5) you must convert to OBD1, there is nor OBD0 ECU that will run an H22 properly, they have EGR, secondariy butterflies, the wiring doesnt ever come CLOSE to plug an play

the sheer amount of labor involved is EXPENSIVE. an its not worth it when you can do an GSR that WILL bolt in with a $500 mount kit

Good information, Most of the H22's I have seen were in 92-95 civic chassis.. don't know the name of them but they seem more common now I know why lol. Im sure it still isn't easy.. but perhaps easier.

Just curious how much, roughly, is it to install a H22 into an EF?

[speedminded]

What's the goal and what's the budget? Period.

[Vteckidd]

if you think for 1second that a 345whp D series was on a STOCK motor, your on the crack.

[speedminded]

Good information, Most of the H22's I have seen were in 92-95 civic chassis.. don't know the name of them but they seem more common now I know why lol. Im sure it still isn't easy.. but perhaps easier.

Just curious how much, roughly, is it to install a H22 into an EF?You mean EG?

[Vteckidd]

Good information, Most of the H22's I have seen were in 92-95 civic chassis.. don't know the name of them but they seem more common now I know why lol. Im sure it still isn't easy.. but perhaps easier.

Just curious how much, roughly, is it to install a H22 into an EF?
the wiring, chassis fabrication, motor moutns etc

i wouldnt do it for less than $2000

we charge $735 for a B vtec swap :)

[Spyder]

You mean EG?

No I was asking about the EF in question, but I take that to mean an EG is the 92-95?

[BABY J]

please explain to me how a d-series opperates without a timeing belt. please tell me and everyone else here. maybe you know more than us b/c your 27 and all. like i care how fucking old you are.

It IS an interference motor... but let me load up some cross-sections and I will show you WHY you can snap a timing belt on a D at 3k RPMs and NEVER hurt the head, vs a B at idle and trash it. Gimme a sec.

[Vteckidd]

It IS an interference motor... but let me load up some cross-sections and I will show you WHY you can snap a timing belt on a D at 3k RPMs and NEVER hurt the head, vs a B at idle and trash it. Gimme a sec.
i dont care about what a spec sheet says.

PERSONAL EXPERIENCE:
Keirons GSR, cam bolt backed out, lost a cam gear an keyway at 2500rpms, bent 1 valve.

SOHC D series , jumped timing AT IDLE, bent a valve

A timing belt controls the piston TDC and the valve opening. if you seriously think that they arent interference motors, go put an adjustable cam gear on a SOHC, advance it to 10 degrees, an let me know what happens

[mumbles]

It IS an interference motor... but let me load up some cross-sections and I will show you WHY you can snap a timing belt on a D at 3k RPMs and NEVER hurt the head, vs a B at idle and trash it. Gimme a sec.

that took you a while for someone that is so sure of hisself. i guess google told you, you were wrong. hury go read some more magazines b/c that seems to be the only place that you get your info from.

[1civic]

this is where i get arrogant, please excuse me (removes mainstream hat, puts on VTECKIDD hat)

1) how is a D series motor NOT a interference motor? please explain, last time i checked they use a timing belt, cam gear around the crankshaft. it controls the valve opening with a timing belt, its an interference motor, all hondas are.

2) If you want to say that using a 100shot on a stock D series is reliable, then thats OPINION, i have seen PLENTY of D series motors pop with spray, not alot pop on turbo. Nitrous build cylinder pressure faster, has more heat, and the CAST OEM pistons dont like it. sorry, i wouldnt recomend it.

3) If it were my call, the best thing to do would be a turbo SOHC, itll make 200+whp, MORE TQ THAN ANY SWAP YOU COULD POSSIBLY DO, and they are cheap if they pop. Scotty has had his for 3 years boosted, non vtec, 10psi.

4) A gsr with bolt ons CAN GO 13s in the right chassis. But, its still a stock 150whp motor. However, the GSR is very easy to mod, turbo or na, an it can handle 300whp, D series cant, B16s/LS cant. not RELIABLY.

5) I have plenty of dynos to back it up, stop by anytime.

6) It costs MONEY, plain and simple, people that want to shop around, buy used parts, slap together a bunch of stuff from ebay etc, be prepared to face the consequences.

7) My resume is longer than most poeple on this board. from my 190whp OEM motor that only few remember i had 2 years ago, to my 240whp lsvtec. i know what it costs, and you cant do it for $3000. you might be able to, but dont say reliable in the same sentence.

8) until i see RESULTS from people an not "im building something that makes XXX", i take everything with a grain of salt. the way it sits right now, i had the highest whp all motor car, and no one has beaten it YET.

9) Turbo D series, if you want fast. YOu mentioned kevins motor, he had a $3000 b16 swap, blew it up, then built a $3000 swhortblock, with tuning, an everything else , hes got $7000 in his car. His car only runs 14s because he HASNT TUNED WITH NITROUS YET, HIS MOTOR WAS BUILT FOR NOS, NOT ALL MOTOR. so dont compare his track times


Mike you make good Points....But Not everyone likes to be in the Spotlight...lol... Something as simple as a B18b N/A could run 13's....
I think we all have been in this game for a While...I know I have.. No point in making All kinds of Claims...
Its not easy to dump 5k in anything, Not unless you have other resorces..
If you like to be known then so be it...But there are other people that will out run you and may not have Half the money in there car... I'm still new to the Forum yes, So People don't know What I have or have had... I could give a Shit... I have Fun When I want and try to pick fair races... Damn Some dyno numbers Thats how I see it... To much goes into the other things, Not just the Motor..
You can have 400 whp and get Drug by a 200whp car in the 1/4 mile.. Make a Car useful and Make it make Sense.....No Sense in braging about what HP you have..
Its always somekind of Pissing contest on here...WHY ?.. We all like cars, So wtf... There is always a Smart ass that claims to know shit yes...We know what we know and unless you have been around the person you have no clue for sure... Its life on the internet.... :bigok: ... I'm done with my Rant and I wasn't pointing any fingers.. :goodjob: ...Later...

[BABY J]

:( What was ENDYNs site? "Old 1", "the old one" .com... some shit. URL has changed from what I have bookmarked. I used it for reference when I sprayed my SOHC w/ a full 100 shot... SUCESSFULLY. I'd trust their site b4 "some guy" on a forum. LOL. And I STAND CORRECTED on the interference motor, it IS an interference motor... happy? :) Doesn't change the fact that you were WRONG technically and have still failed to contribute TECHNICALLY. It's taking me a while b/c I am at work... if the crossections are still there I will load them up... I am pretty sure that NE1 who can read will understand what it's saying and understand it. The only thing that I am SURE of is:


i thought you guys said reliable. sohc turbo really isn't that reliable.

^^ THAT statement is not reliable


you tell me one boosted honda owner that can't resist turning the boost up on there little car and next thing you BOOM!!!

Neither is that 1.


... and most boosted honda owners don't have common sense. if they did i would have a job lol!

That 1 either...


As far as calling me out about a D not bein an interference motor, THANK YOU VTECKKID for the education and the initial knock upside my head... YOU though, are just co-signing and riding his coattails... he should ne honored. :) I have NO problem w/ being educated on the forums... but YOU (mumbles), well...

[Vteckidd]

Mike you make good Points....But Not everyone likes to be in the Spotlight...lol... Something as simple as a B18b N/A could run 13's....
I think we all have been in this game for a While...I know I have.. No point in making All kinds of Claims...
Its not easy to dump 5k in anything, Not unless you have other resorces..
If you like to be known then so be it...But there are other people that will out run you and may not have Half the money in there car... I'm still new to the Forum yes, So People don't know What I have or have had... I could give a Shit... I have Fun When I want and try to pick fair races... Damn Some dyno numbers Thats how I see it... To much goes into the other things, Not just the Motor..
You can have 400 whp and get Drug by a 200whp car in the 1/4 mile.. Make a Car useful and Make it make Sense.....No Sense in braging about what HP you have..
Its always somekind of Pissing contest on here...WHY ?.. We all like cars, So wtf... There is always a Smart ass that claims to know shit yes...We know what we know and unless you have been around the person you have no clue for sure... Its life on the internet.... :bigok: ... I'm done with my Rant and I wasn't pointing any fingers.. :goodjob: ...Later...


once again you guys are ALL TALK. show me an NA EF with a B!8B LS that is running 13s, please post a timeslip.

Im not bragging, im stating FACTS. I KNOW what it takes to make an all motor car make power, i know what it takes to make a d sereis Turbo , i know what it takes to make a turbo B series, i have unlimited dyno sheets of all different setups an whp ranges.

This is not the first time i have been questioned, but in the end im always the one with PROOF, no one else has any.

if you can anme me an ALL MOTOR CAR THAT MAKES MORE POWER THAN MY OLD MOTOR, BRING IT HERE, B SERIES/H SERIES, I DONT GIVE A FUCK, I WILL PAY $100 TO SOMEONE THAT MAKES MORE THAN I DID.

the only cars that could have beat my old crx was a turbo car or V8, no NA honda was worth my time, period, maybe AccordM3, thats it.

[BABY J]

once again you guys are ALL TALK. show me an NA EF with a B!8B LS that is running 13s, please post a timeslip.

Im not bragging, im stating FACTS. I KNOW what it takes to make an all motor car make power, i know what it takes to make a d sereis Turbo , i know what it takes to make a turbo B series, i have unlimited dyno sheets of all different setups an whp ranges.

This is not the first time i have been questioned, but in the end im always the one with PROOF, no one else has any.

if you can anme me an ALL MOTOR CAR THAT MAKES MORE POWER THAN MY OLD MOTOR, BRING IT HERE, B SERIES/H SERIES, I DONT GIVE A FUCK, I WILL PAY $100 TO SOMEONE THAT MAKES MORE THAN I DID.

the only cars that could have beat my old crx was a turbo car or V8, no NA honda was worth my time, period, maybe AccordM3, thats it.

Off topic, but we feel ya. So SHUT UP!!! LOL :eye:

[Vteckidd]

that wasnt directed at anyone at in particular.

an mumbles was my old boss HEHE

[mumbles]

:( What was ENDYNs site? "Old 1", "the old one" .com... some shit. URL has changed from what I have bookmarked. I used it for reference when I sprayed my SOHC w/ a full 100 shot... SUCESSFULLY. I'd trust their site b4 "some guy" on a forum. LOL. And I STAND CORRECTED on the interference motor, it IS an interference motor... happy? :) Doesn't change the fact that you were WRONG technically and have still failed to contribute TECHNICALLY. It's taking me a while b/c I am at work... if the crossections are still there I will load them up... I am pretty sure that NE1 who can read will understand what it's saying and understand it. The only thing that I am SURE of is:



^^ THAT statement is not reliable



Neither is that 1.



That 1 either...


As far as calling me out about a D not bein an interference motor, THANK YOU VTECKKID for the education and the initial knock upside my head... YOU though, are just co-signing and riding his coattails... he should ne honored. :) I have NO problem w/ being educated on the forums... but YOU (mumbles), well...

that mother fucker used to work for me what the hell are you talking about.

[BTEC]

YAWL TOTALLY RUINED THIS THREAD. YAWL TOOK IT WAY TOO SIRIUS. LETS HAVE A BUILD OFF THEN LIKE THEY DID WITH THE B-SERIES SHOOTOUT. WHO CAN BUILD THE FAST EF/EG FOR THE LEAST AMOUNT OF MONEY, GET THE CLOSEST GUESS TO HOW MUCH HP AND WHAT KINDA TIMES THEIR PROJECT WILL MAKE/RUN.

[99SI]

lol, I'm sorry I got busy and left this thread for a while. Halfwit, go back to vteckidd's statement about Scotty's turbo NON VTEC d series. over 200whp and 200lb/fttq at 10lbs boost for over THREE YEARS! If that is not reliable and a fast ass little combo I don't know what is. Yes you can do the GSR, then if you go with nitrous you have taken out the reliability factor of it. If you get a tank of bad gas and spray, nitrous backfire, etc. You can run it with a wet shot 100 but you still can't say it's "reliable." And also, a motor set up for nitrous with colder plugs and less timing is not going to make good power when it's not being sprayed on. IE: when you are daily driving it's not going to be all that impressive unless you're spraying it constantly. If you do the GSR with intake/header/exhaust don't be upset when you make 155whp. Then if you want to go with NA, 1,000 for good cams and valvetrain to go with it. To take advantage of the extra lift and RPM where those cams will make power you will at least need to go with ARP rod bolts to make it reliable at higher rpm. Also you will need to tune with something so, 185 for p28 chipped, 300 for dyno time. It's all a matter of preference, you can do any of the above mentioned things and get a thirteen second car. Ultimately it's up to you to decide. However, if it were me and I were starting out with a stock EF to build up, I would absolutely go with a d16 vtec motor and run a turbo, if you get a good unit on your own you can put arp rod bolts in, freshen the bottom end, and put some budget forged pistons in with a little lower compression(scat). The mainstream turbo kit is complete from top to bottom so you won't have to worry about scrambling to come up with the dough for injectors, miscellaneous shit, etc.

[BABY J]

that mother fucker used to work for me what the hell are you talking about.

And the relevance there is??? You called me out AFTER he did. (which I have NO problem with being educated in this game...) THAT'S what I am talking about. :)

[BABY J]

YAWL TOTALLY RUINED THIS THREAD. YAWL TOOK IT WAY TOO SIRIUS. LETS HAVE A BUILD OFF THEN LIKE THEY DID WITH THE B-SERIES SHOOTOUT. WHO CAN BUILD THE FAST EF/EG FOR THE LEAST AMOUNT OF MONEY, GET THE CLOSEST GUESS TO HOW MUCH HP AND WHAT KINDA TIMES THEIR PROJECT WILL MAKE/RUN.

So Mike automatically wins. What's the fun in that? And outside of me, who has an xtra EF shell that's willing to contribute? Easier said than done. And SOME1 will cheat (prolly me). LOL

[Vteckidd]

this thread just got way off track, i still havent seen any SERIOUS comments.

im voting D16 Turbo for ease, relaiblity, cost, etc

[mumbles]

And the relevance there is??? You called me out AFTER he did. (which I have NO problem with being educated in this game...) THAT'S what I am talking about. :)

whatever man. keep reading your magazines and talking about shit you have no idea about. and relevance is that vtekkid used to work for me and we both exchange information and you can read as many magazines and web sites you want and not catch up to us in hands on knowledge of motors

[BABY J]

My vote...

REFRESH BLOCK

Z6 TOP

100 SHOT WET

UBER/HONDATA

FULL BOLT-ONS

[BTEC]

So Mike automatically wins. What's the fun in that? And outside of me, who has an xtra EF shell that's willing to contribute? Easier said than done. And SOME1 will cheat (prolly me). LOL
I GOT ONE. MIKE GOT A COUPLE. I CAN TAKE A CRASH COURSE IN BOOSTING CARS 101 AND GET THOSE WHO NEED ONE FOR A SMALL FEE. lol!!!!

[mumbles]

my vote, gsr swap basic bolt ons. learn to drive. very reliable and you don't to worry about a boost creep blowing your motor for you on your way to work.

[BTEC]

this thread just got way off track, i still havent seen any SERIOUS comments.

im voting D16 Turbo for ease, relaiblity, cost, etc
I SAID B16, BOLT ONS AND NITROUS. IF U CAN DRIVE I THINK U CAN GET LOW 13'S.

[Vteckidd]

Baby J, man, im not a master engine builder, im not a master mechanic. i will hold my skills against anyone elses, lots of poeple just think i sit behind a desk, but hey, i really could care less what they think. people that KNOW me, KNOW me. an they know i need lots of loctite.

the rest are just jealous or haters. i have a head full of knowledge, because i learned frmo the best.

but, in all reality, im good at what i do, which is sales, consultation, marketing, product development, occasional labor work/engine building.

i dont build motors for customers anymore, i strictly do it for close personal friends. I do it for fun, for enjoyment, for boredom. To prove a point.

there are other people with more experience on this board, or do the same thing i do like bee, danny, spoolin, etc. in an engine building contest, NA, ill be arrogant and say ill win, cause out of anyone in this thread i have built the highest whp out of you, but for a turbo motor, i would side wiht spoolin or BTEC, as they have more knowledge hehe

[BABY J]

whatever man. keep reading your magazines and talking about shit you have no idea about. and relevance is that vtekkid used to work for me and we both exchange information and you can read as many magazines and web sites you want and not catch up to us in hands on knowledge of motors

And I never will!! I am not a grease-monkey, do not claim to be, and do not want to be. I'ma "drop it off, call the bank and enjoy" type. I make too much money to trade off. But I do respect those that know. But I still can't be BSd on much when I am swiping my plastic... I assure you. No offense to you, and I hope none was taken.

[BABY J]

my vote, gsr swap basic bolt ons. learn to drive. very reliable and you don't to worry about a boost creep blowing your motor for you on your way to work.

Hey Mumbles... 13 second capable???? Maybe... I think it's a stretch. I dunno.

[BTEC]

Baby J, man, im not a master engine builder, im not a master mechanic. i will hold my skills against anyone elses, lots of poeple just think i sit behind a desk, but hey, i really could care less what they think. people that KNOW me, KNOW me. an they know i need lots of loctite.

the rest are just jealous or haters. i have a head full of knowledge, because i learned frmo the best.

but, in all reality, im good at what i do, which is sales, consultation, marketing, product development, occasional labor work/engine building.

i dont build motors for customers anymore, i strictly do it for close personal friends. I do it for fun, for enjoyment, for boredom. To prove a point.

there are other people with more experience on this board, or do the same thing i do like bee, danny, spoolin, etc. in an engine building contest, NA, ill be arrogant and say ill win, cause out of anyone in this thread i have built the highest whp out of you, but for a turbo motor, i would side wiht spoolin or BTEC, as they have more knowledge hehe
HOLY SHIT, HE KNOWS ME. ALMOST AS GOOD AS MICHEAL JACKSON SAYING WHATS UP TO ME (BEFORE HE STARTING TOUCHING KIDS).

[speedminded]

Let's built a couple rat rods out of donated IA shit and go race! Pair of shells, couple d-series...doesn't matter if the finish line is 17 or 18 seconds away! :D

[mumbles]

Hey Mumbles... 13 second capable???? Maybe... I think it's a stretch. I dunno.

an ef chasis is lite as fuck and i personaly could get that to run 13's. hints the comment learn to drive.

[1civic]

once again you guys are ALL TALK. show me an NA EF with a B!8B LS that is running 13s, please post a timeslip.

Im not bragging, im stating FACTS. I KNOW what it takes to make an all motor car make power, i know what it takes to make a d sereis Turbo , i know what it takes to make a turbo B series, i have unlimited dyno sheets of all different setups an whp ranges.

This is not the first time i have been questioned, but in the end im always the one with PROOF, no one else has any.

if you can anme me an ALL MOTOR CAR THAT MAKES MORE POWER THAN MY OLD MOTOR, BRING IT HERE, B SERIES/H SERIES, I DONT GIVE A FUCK, I WILL PAY $100 TO SOMEONE THAT MAKES MORE THAN I DID.

the only cars that could have beat my old crx was a turbo car or V8, no NA honda was worth my time, period, maybe AccordM3, thats it.


Mike you got a Big ass Piss stream you know it... I said Clearly...Not pointing any fingers.... I no longer own this car and sorry no slip...They went with it..
1/8 and 1/4 mile is my game... I work to them not some highway..Sry..
And for you being such a Smart ass...I guess I need to build another one..
Oh and Ask Kevin what happen down low With My "STOCK" B16 EG...That was lately... "He would have got Drug On Spray"
Hp got me on the TopEnd...Once again was over 105+mph...You will never have a car that traps over 120 so...And I'm saying you....Not anyone elses cars... :goodjob: Both cars you built have No Lowend power...WTF... I raced you with the stock B16 and I hit the Speed cut..You pulled yes...Thats on the topend After 115 mph.....Run that car from a Dig or Kevins from a Dig... You will get Drug..I promiss...This was Not Sopose to be Whos Dicks Bigger.. You jumped so This is my jump back... You Don't have a Car to run and its been well over 30 days...And I'm still waiting on that race Also... We can have a Bobby Vs Mike Night... Cool with me... I don't get mad over stuipd shit, I just like to Race... ;) .. You know I'm talker...Just like you.. :D .. Be happy Mike...Its just street Racing... :bigok:

[BTEC]

Let's built a couple rat rods out of donated IA shit and go race! Pair of shells, couple d-series...doesn't matter if the finish line is 17 or 18 seconds away! :D
I ALREADY SUGGESTED THAT ASSHOLE. GET UR OWN IDEAS

[BABY J]

an ef chasis is lite as fuck and i personaly could get that to run 13's. hints the comment learn to drive.

Kool. Good enuff for me.

[99SI]

bitches ain't nothing but tricks and ho's

[Vteckidd]

you like to talk about cars you beat. yet you have no proof

Bobby, for the last time, i dont have to prove i know more, I KNOW THAT I KNOW MORE.

YOU SAID YOU BEAT KEIRONS CAR, I PROVED YOU WRONG. I WAS PULLING YOU WELL BEFORE IT WAS 105mph. ADMIT IT, i was EASILY .5-1car ahead. Now, it was close, but why dont you tell the whole story. it was a GUTTED OUT EF hatch back with ZERO INTERIOR vs a FULL INTERIOR, FULL WEIGHT ABS DC2 INTEGRA. you had 500-700lbs on his car. he only makes 200whp, you said your car made 150ish, so yeah 50whp more, 600lbs less, it was close i still won

mike +1
Bobby 0

Now you said you beat Kris car, which is Kierons brother, then, AFTER I BEAT YOU IN KEIRONS CAR, you apolagized and said "thats not the same car i was talking about"

Mike 2
Bobby 0

Kevins car isnt impressive, for the last fucking time, ITS A NITROUS CAR WITH NO NITROUS. its like building a 9:1 compression sleeved GSR, an running no turbo. its slow, so you beat a 170whp CRX, wow, CONGRATUFUCKINGLATIONS. go race GGPIS3, see if you can hang with him, i beat him off the bottle. BOth cars we have have no bottome end power? lol WTF, come dyno your B16, an ill post the TQ graphs. you are comparing a GUTTED OUT CHASSIS to full interior chassiss. you simply have no idea what you are talking about. Keirons makes 136TQ frmo 3000-8000 rpms, looks like a supercharged car, please, show me a tq graph like that on an NA car. no bottom end power, thats really funny

Mike 3
Bobby 0

I have DNO PROOF OF SEANS MOTOR THAT I BUILT MAKING 185whp, i can post the dyno. I have vouches that i built hte motor personally. cna you post a dyno of ANY MOTOR YOU HAVE EVER BUILT besides the NA LS? nope. sorry man, all talk, no proof.

Mike 4
Bobby 0

The NA LS you said you built that never maxed power out, an made more power than our LS, i posted the dyno, i was right, we made more, with less mods.

Mike 5
Bobby 0

YOu said EJALLMOTAs car COULDNT be reringed without honing. i did it, it doesnt smoke a drop, made 152whp YESTERDAY with a CTR header. str8 LS with 403s

Mike 5
Bobby 0

your right about 1 thing, i have no car to race yet. the stuff i build takes time. You can race me when im done, trust me, ill be calling for you. but please, dont try an make yourself sound bigger becuase you beat kevs 170whp car, beat something FAST and ill be impressed. so far, you have a 240 with an RB that dynoed at our shop an i know hat it makes. its a nice car, but please tell me that isnt your only claim to fame.

i never jumped you, stop thinking i singled you out, an you made the first comment not me. i live my life based on PROOF, not "he said she siad".

[BABY J]

You Don't have a Car to run and its been well over 30 days...And I'm still waiting on that race Also...

Got nothing at stake in you and Mike's race, but this comment is irrelevant. You were the 1st to say that not every1 wants the spotlight or some shit. Well, not every1 rushes their projects for the sake of "satisfying" people from IA. There people on the board that's DRIVEN/SEEN ALL of my cars, and there are people who have only seen my daily. I really can give 2 shits about who thinks I am "slowplaying" b/c racing is what I do outside of my career and my daughter. It's "extra" non-manditory shit. Do not knock some1 for not having something to race "currently", some people's pockets are more nervous than others, and some people are in between projects. Not tryna flame, just saying.

[Vteckidd]

once again this is going to turn into bobby vs mike, i coud really care less man, say whatever you want. our cars an mine speak for themselves

[BTEC]

once again this is going to turn into bobby vs mike, i coud really care less man, say whatever you want. our cars an mine speak for themselves
I CHALANGE BOTH U BABBLING ASS BITCHES. BRING A CAR TO THE TRACK ADN RUN ME. I GOT GREEN STAMPS THAT SAY OLE SMOKEY WILL TAKE THE WIN. WHAT NOW (1CIVIC THIS IS FOR YOU TOO).

U CAN GO GET UR NEIGHBORS MUSTANG WITH 8000WHP AND ILL KICK ITS ASS WITH U DRIVING, IT DNT MATTER BOYS.

[Vteckidd]

no im too scared of jesse :)

[BABY J]

So uhhh, yeah halfwitt... Like we all said and agreed upon:

** motor from a 72 Ford Pinto (must be the wagon)

** tinted windows

** Cobb County Schools school-bus tranny (or Dekalb, try Cobb 1st)

** 99 Si wheels

** convert to AWD

and you're in the 13s.

[BTEC]

no im too scared of jesse :)
OK MIKE ADMITTED IT. NOW ITS UR TURN 1CIVC

[BABY J]

no im too scared of jesse :)

I'm scared of Mike w/ NO car... and Mike is scared of BTEC... so I guess BTEC > BABYJ

[BTEC]

I'm scared of Mike w/ NO car... and Mike is scared of BTEC... so I guess BTEC > BABYJ
OH SO NOW U WANNA ACT LIKE U DIDNT KNOW THAT? NICE TRY

[Vteckidd]

oh an yes i said 30days, but , then i had a change of heart, and decided to build something else. my car will be out by tunerfest. i have alot of it in the mail, so when it gets here ill have tp put it together.

[1civic]

you like to talk about cars you beat. yet you have no proof

Bobby, for the last time, i dont have to prove i know more, I KNOW THAT I KNOW MORE.

YOU SAID YOU BEAT KEIRONS CAR, I PROVED YOU WRONG. I WAS PULLING YOU WELL BEFORE IT WAS 105mph. ADMIT IT, i was EASILY .5-1car ahead. Now, it was close, but why dont you tell the whole story. it was a GUTTED OUT EF hatch back with ZERO INTERIOR vs a FULL INTERIOR, FULL WEIGHT ABS DC2 INTEGRA. you had 500-700lbs on his car. he only makes 200whp, you said your car made 150ish, so yeah 50whp more, 600lbs less, it was close i still won

mike +1
Bobby 0

Now you said you beat Kris car, which is Kierons brother, then, AFTER I BEAT YOU IN KEIRONS CAR, you apolagized and said "thats not the same car i was talking about"

Mike 2
Bobby 0

Kevins car isnt impressive, for the last fucking time, ITS A NITROUS CAR WITH NO NITROUS. its like building a 9:1 compression sleeved GSR, an running no turbo. its slow, so you beat a 170whp CRX, wow, CONGRATUFUCKINGLATIONS. go race GGPIS3, see if you can hang with him, i beat him off the bottle. BOth cars we have have no bottome end power? lol WTF, come dyno your B16, an ill post the TQ graphs. you are comparing a GUTTED OUT CHASSIS to full interior chassiss. you simply have no idea what you are talking about. Keirons makes 136TQ frmo 3000-8000 rpms, looks like a supercharged car, please, show me a tq graph like that on an NA car. no bottom end power, thats really funny

Mike 3
Bobby 0

I have DNO PROOF OF SEANS MOTOR THAT I BUILT MAKING 185whp, i can post the dyno. I have vouches that i built hte motor personally. cna you post a dyno of ANY MOTOR YOU HAVE EVER BUILT besides the NA LS? nope. sorry man, all talk, no proof.

Mike 4
Bobby 0

The NA LS you said you built that never maxed power out, an made more power than our LS, i posted the dyno, i was right, we made more, with less mods.

Mike 5
Bobby 0

YOu said EJALLMOTAs car COULDNT be reringed without honing. i did it, it doesnt smoke a drop, made 152whp YESTERDAY with a CTR header. str8 LS with 403s

Mike 5
Bobby 0

your right about 1 thing, i have no car to race yet. the stuff i build takes time. You can race me when im done, trust me, ill be calling for you. but please, dont try an make yourself sound bigger becuase you beat kevs 170whp car, beat something FAST and ill be impressed. so far, you have a 240 with an RB that dynoed at our shop an i know hat it makes. its a nice car, but please tell me that isnt your only claim to fame.

i never jumped you, stop thinking i singled you out, an you made the first comment not me. i live my life based on PROOF, not "he said she siad".


Mike You make Claims All over the Boards...NOT me...Sry.. You always have Smart ass Comments Towards People...Read Your own Post...The Shit gets Old... Also Bring All these People out at One Time..We will Race since You claim they Won Everything... Story was you never showed up to race me..Your ass was at the House... Also Adam Told me once we where there that wasn't the car..."You were not there"...We talked to all them people waiting on you..NO SHOW... You called me out and I had to find your ass...lol.. I could give a Shit what anyone thinks of me on this Board.. I don't have to Post some bullshit ass Piece of paper..Sry.. How the Hell would you know it was real..Dumb Ass... Come Race...Damn the E-thug Bullshit... Race your car not your Mouth... I'm ready Hell Why not.... :D .. All in fun...Sry for the Bad words.. ;) ...lol...

[IntegraXTR]

wow, just got done reading all of this, how did it go from telling halfwit advise to arguing back and forth about motors/power.

SOHC Turbo ftw!

[1civic]

OK MIKE ADMITTED IT. NOW ITS UR TURN 1CIVC


BTEC Is My Daddy.... :lmfao: ....

[Vteckidd]

Mike You make Claims All over the Boards...NOT me...Sry.. You always have Smart ass Comments Towards People...Read Your own Post...The Shit gets Old... Also Bring All these People out at One Time..We will Race since You claim they Won Everything... Story was you never showed up to race me..Your ass was at the House... Also Adam Told me once we where there that wasn't the car..."You were not there"...We talked to all them people waiting on you..NO SHOW... You called me out and I had to find your ass...lol.. I could give a Shit what anyone thinks of me on this Board....Sry.. How the Hell would you know it was real..Dumb Ass... Come Race...Damn the E-thug Bullshit... Race your car not your Mouth... I'm ready Hell Why not.... :D .. All in fun...Sry for the Bad words.. ;) ...lol...
bitch I CALLED KEIRON AN TOLD HIM TO BRING YOU TO MY HOUSE. i went to the Varsity, you werent there, so i left. then keiron told me you were there, an i told him TO BRING YOU TO MY HOUSE.

i never showed up, please shut the fuck up, you run your mouth more than anyone.

IM NOT MAKING CLAIMS IDIOT, IM STATING FACTS, SHIT I HAVE DONE, SHIT I KNOW AN CAN PROVE FOR A FACT. I CAN BACK UP AN PROVE EVERYTHING I POSTED , I BEAT YOU, ME DRIVING KEIRONS CAR I WON. NOW YOU WANT TO ACT LIKE IT DIDNT HAPPEN.

you dont like me, OH WELL, ill still sleep at night, some people think im an asshole, well, thats there problem. i seem to get along with other people fine. if i have a crass attitude, you should see the shit i deal with everyday. sorry man, like it or love it, i aint changing to make you feel better.


I don't have to Post some bullshit ass Piece of paper

thats all i need to see, you cant cause you dont CARE ENOUGH TO DYNO your car, or, you dont have a slip anyways. thanks, and have a great day.

[sirhatch1030]

i had a 90 si with a b16 and bolt ons and a 75 shot (drykit) car weighting in at 2500 pounds with me in it on bfg,s and a jdm si tranny and ran a 13.3 all day long. also had a freind with a ls crx running 13.7 all day long with bolt ons and a 75 kit . so i say go with a b serries and some gas . and mine was my dd for a year and still ran good when i pulled the motor.

[BABY J]

some people think im an asshole

--> yeah, I think you are an asshole... but so do you.


well, thats there problem. i seem to get along with other people fine.

--> you do NOT get along w/ people, we "tolerate" you b/c we ALMOST like you


if i have a crass attitude, you should see the shit i deal with everyday.

--> I'ma computer engineer for the Dept of Defense... you haven't dealt with SHIT!!! LOL


sorry man, like it or love it, i aint changing to make you feel better.


--> you change to make me feel better, why not him? LOL

:D

[BTEC]

BTEC Is My Daddy.... :lmfao: ....
THERE U HAVE IT FOLKS, MIKE JAWNZ, BABY J AND 1CIVIC KNOWS WHAT THE DEAL IS. I SUGGEST U OTHER FUCKS TRY NOT TO FIND OUT THE HARD WAY BC THE WAY I TEACH ENVOLVES PAIN AND LOTS OF EMBARRASMENT. DO URSELF A FAVOR AND DNT TEST ME.

[1civic]

bitch I CALLED KEIRON AN TOLD HIM TO BRING YOU TO MY HOUSE. i went to the Varsity, you werent there, so i left. then keiron told me you were there, an i told him TO BRING YOU TO MY HOUSE.

i never showed up, please shut the fuck up, you run your mouth more than anyone.

IM NOT MAKING CLAIMS IDIOT, IM STATING FACTS, SHIT I HAVE DONE, SHIT I KNOW AN CAN PROVE FOR A FACT. I CAN BACK UP AN PROVE EVERYTHING I POSTED , I BEAT YOU, ME DRIVING KEIRONS CAR I WON. NOW YOU WANT TO ACT LIKE IT DIDNT HAPPEN.

you dont like me, OH WELL, ill still sleep at night, some people think im an asshole, well, thats there problem. i seem to get along with other people fine. if i have a crass attitude, you should see the shit i deal with everyday. sorry man, like it or love it, i aint changing to make you feel better.



thats all i need to see, you cant cause you dont CARE ENOUGH TO DYNO your car, or, you dont have a slip anyways. thanks, and have a great day.


Mike You came and went Huh... He had no clue where you went... It don't matter its done.. I lost at 115 mph... You Win.. Whats That car run in the 1/4 mile and the trap speed...lol.. I know I lost.. I said that... It was a Stock B16A Vs Your Built 202whp All motor.. :goodjob: ...
Did I say I did not like you...No, I said you are a Smart ass.. Looks bad On Mainstream... You Blow people Off...That Looks bad too... We have talked alot of times...Never had anything bad to say...Sry.. You can be cool when you want..... Just need to get off your high Horse sometimes thats all... :)
We will have are day soon...Just waiting on you to build another car... :goodjob:

[BABY J]

that took you a while for someone that is so sure of hisself. i guess google told you, you were wrong. hury go read some more magazines b/c that seems to be the only place that you get your info from.

http://www.theoldone.com/articles/d%5Fseries%5Fengine%5Fbuilding%5Ftips/

There used to be an article in this section on why the D has less intereference than a B series... this was Dec of 1998 when I 1st started playing w/ heavy spray on D blocks seriously. It looks like this section has been deleted or moved somewhere else. It DOES stand that the D is an interference motor... but w/out the article I lack "proof" (you guys like proof here... LOL) of how it's less of an interference motor than the B. I remember printing it out and I think I may still have it, but I may not. Just want every1 on the board to know that I did NOT forget, and I was wrong by saying it's a NI motor. Unlike some people I do not mind admitting to the masses when I am wrong. I'm still not gonna be happy till I find the article though... LOL.

[1civic]

THERE U HAVE IT FOLKS, MIKE JAWNZ, BABY J AND 1CIVIC KNOWS WHAT THE DEAL IS. I SUGGEST U OTHER FUCKS TRY NOT TO FIND OUT THE HARD WAY BC THE WAY I TEACH ENVOLVES PAIN AND LOTS OF EMBARRASMENT. DO URSELF A FAVOR AND DNT TEST ME.


Yeah BTEC is the Man.. :king: ...

[BABY J]

BTW, the link I posted is just the beginning. They have some HOTT articles in their archive. Not a bad place to get smart, or get a better idea of engine-building and machining.

**smoke bomb**

**runs away to find the interference write-ups**

LOL

[93H22ACX]

What does it take for an EF to run 13's....

NO REBUILDIG....

just 13's will be GSR.

good lowend capeable of 12's and spanking alot of other cars....H22.

I still think H22 is the way to go even though its a bit more indepth. if properly installed and driven...it'll run alot faster...

want to keep the h22 stock but got a $1000+ to spend... nitrous and ITR tranny or if you can find it.... Accord Type R Tranny.

this is my opinion and i think it would be best... I'm pretty biased :D


oh and btw..i dont build motors..i build PC's / servers BUWWHWHHW..well..i should say i dont...i only do mine with alot of help from peter and danny. i hve master mechanic peter build it for me.... he is one though....he was a mechanic at Ford for years....

[BABY J]

SLOW EF

http://www.theoldone.com/articles/Larryscivic/Larrys_Civic.htm

[sirhatch1030]

a b16 on a 75 shot with a jdm s1 tranny and tires will do mid to low 13.

[BABY J]

http://www.theoldone.com/articles/d16a%5Fhead/ ACTUALLY THIS is the section where it used to be. FUCK I can't believe it's not here!

[Vteckidd]

Peter is in the wrong business, MUSTANGS FTW!!

1000ft/lbs of TQ at IDLE LOL

[Vteckidd]

Endyns website is shut down.

[BABY J]

^^ linx work just fine for me.

[green91]

Having run a SOHC turbo setup for over 2 years i couldnt recommend going any other route. Im not saying that b-series arent good, but there are many points to consider when it comes to sohc turbo..

-No need to buy motor mounts
-TORQUE! Its not uncommon for sohc turbos to dyno similar hp/tq numbers.
-Cost of engines
-Direct bolt in with some wiring depending on model

I ran my turbo setup for 4-5 mos on my d15b2 with over 145k miles and finally retired it once the rings were worn out. I then put in a used d16z6 and drove it daily (100 miles/day for over a year) for nearly 2 years, boosting between 7-12psi daily, and abused the heck out of it. It hurt many feelings on the highway and i beat on it hard in the mtns.. it was a quick and fun car.

They key to sohc turbo is 1) tuning and 2) recognizing the limits. Ive personally known several people putting down 200-240whp with a good tune and have the motors last. Run the hack @ 12psi and your sohc's ringlands will cry.

[BABY J]

^^ An idea I pushed early in the thread but was flamed for. So I take it that you are not voting for this:

---VVVVV---


So uhhh, yeah halfwitt... Like we all said and agreed upon:

** motor from a 72 Ford Pinto (must be the wagon)
** tinted windows
** Cobb County Schools school-bus tranny (or Dekalb, try Cobb 1st)
** 99 Si wheels
** convert to AWD
and you're in the 13s.

I thought it was doable. Oh well. :)

[BABY J]

if you know anything about an h22 , then you would know why you dont do it in an EF, an you can BARELY do it for $5000.

1) H22s are cable shifters, NOT LINKAGE
2)THERE ARE NO MOTOR MOUNTS AVAILABLE FOR AN H22 INTO A CRX, custom are neccesary, an you must weld the tranny mount on, unless you do a H series with B series adapter plate.
3) Yes, its a shoehorn to get an H22 into an EF, firewall barely clears, its nearly impossible to get the hood to shut.
4) the alternator on the H22 stick out RIGHT BY THE DRIVER SIDE HEADLIGHT, a custom bracker an belt must be used, unless you reomve your headlight, which makes it a non street car.
5) you must convert to OBD1, there is nor OBD0 ECU that will run an H22 properly, they have EGR, secondariy butterflies, the wiring doesnt ever come CLOSE to plug an play

the sheer amount of labor involved is EXPENSIVE. an its not worth it when you can do an GSR that WILL bolt in with a $500 mount kit

http://www.explicitspeedperformance.net/

A lil more info for ya HALFWIT

[BABY J]

... I have owned a B series crx and I would say that it is the same or better at handling...

This is where I call BS. Just b/c you "learn" to "tolerate" and "anticipate" your cars handling does NOT mean it handles great. W/ the nice (yet not overkill) suspension setup he has, I will say a B swap would KILL this car in the handling dept... I will DEF push more w/ the H.... no way around it. My Spec V torque steers like a MUTHA FUCKA (they do stock at 153 WHP, so imagine the same car at 240+ WHP) but over the years I've learned to anticipate it and I call it "normal". I REALLY do not notice it anymore yet I make subconcious adjustments everytime I floor it. I would bet that a road course, slalom, or taking stock measurements w/ cornerweighting will prove to this guy the the B EF will outhandle the H EF all day.

[BABY J]

MAYBE in an EG handling changes are less noticeable between the B and H series. In the CRX though w/ a MANUAL RACK vs PS (EG), I say that the handling is the only part where he is prolly stretching it a bit.

[speedminded]

This is where I call BS. Just b/c you "learn" to "tolerate" and "anticipate" your cars handling does NOT mean it handles great. W/ the nice (yet not overkill) suspension setup he has, I will say a B swap would KILL this car in the handling dept... I will DEF push more w/ the H.... no way around it. My Spec V torque steers like a MUTHA FUCKA (they do stock at 153 WHP, so imagine the same car at 240+ WHP) but over the years I've learned to anticipate it and I call it "normal". I REALLY do not notice it anymore yet I make subconcious adjustments everytime I floor it. I would bet that a road course, slalom, or taking stock measurements w/ cornerweighting will prove to this guy the the B EF will outhandle the H EF all day.It's only like 40lbs differance if i remember correctly, with the right differential and tires any torque steer will go away.

[Vteckidd]

ive never seen an H22 with PS in an EG. i dont think its possible, but ive been wrong before.

I think the handling thing is overexaggerated. I think the H22 is only 60lbs more than a GSR. but, 60lbs is 60lbs.

the motor is only 1 aspect of HANDLING. gearing, suspension, wheels, RPMrange, powerband have alot to do with it. an bottom line is if you run the right shocks, sway bars, and suspension, you can make an H22 handle fine in an EF.

i just do not like the idea of an H in an EF. sorry, just my opinion, if its an EG, well, its much more room to work with, they are obd1, they have mount kits etc.

[93H22ACX]

if you know anything about an h22 , then you would know why you dont do it in an EF, an you can BARELY do it for $5000.

1) H22s are cable shifters, NOT LINKAGE --- true..but easier to install than rods :D

2)THERE ARE NO MOTOR MOUNTS AVAILABLE FOR AN H22 INTO A CRX, custom are neccesary, an you must weld the tranny mount on, unless you do a H series with B series adapter plate.
there are...forgot who... oh and btw thanks BABYJ:goodjob:

3) Yes, its a shoehorn to get an H22 into an EF, firewall barely clears, its nearly impossible to get the hood to shut.
its ok...it clears

4) the alternator on the H22 stick out RIGHT BY THE DRIVER SIDE HEADLIGHT, a custom bracker an belt must be used, unless you reomve your headlight, which makes it a non street car.
any motor swap is fab work...h22 just takes a little more and worth it IMO

5) you must convert to OBD1, there is nor OBD0 ECU that will run an H22 properly, they have EGR, secondariy butterflies, the wiring doesnt ever come CLOSE to plug an play
you can elminate egr by running a chip ECU and use an OBD0 jumper harness


the sheer amount of labor involved is EXPENSIVE. an its not worth it when you can do an GSR that WILL bolt in with a $500 mount kit
Custom EF Civic/Crx 88-91 H22A motor (http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1644032&postid=22016977#) mount kits $449 shipped US
Custom DA 90-93 Integra H22A motor mount kits $449 shipped


H22 swap complete FRONT clip from NADS (local) = $2400
H22 motor mount kit = 449
P28/P72 ECU = 150
Jumper Harness = 100 (or DIY http://diy.prostreetonline.com/howto/showarticle.asp?articleid=40)

axles = 200 brand new or used for $100
_________________________________________________
TOTAL = $3200


It is my daily driver. The car sits on some AGX shocks and Skunk2 coils with a 2" drop. I have 3 1/2" of ground clearance to the oil pan. There is 3/8" clearance from the highest point on the valve cover to the USDM hood. I haven't yet found a bump my car hasn't won. As far as the BS about being too front end heavy, this is not true. It weighs about 35 lbs. more than a GSR maybe less. My car weighed in at 2020 lbs with no driver. I have full faith in my car around corners and turns. I have owned a B series crx and I would say that it is the same or better at handling. My mount kit distributes the motor perfectly. It is very hard to throw up a con with the potential of 200 whp and 150 ft lbs of torque and the engine swap costing half as much as the Type R swap. It puts out more whp and torque. I love the swap and looks OEM!

side note peter's gsr hatch turbo gutted with cage with him 2300lbs
my hatch with me gutted, turbo, cage, misc tools (my shit breaks LOL)...2315lbs

so without peter in his car= 2115
without me ni my car = 2150
weight difference = 35lbs
maybe difference in gas in tank and bs like that

[BABY J]

if you know anything about an h22 , then you would know why you dont do it in an EF, an you can BARELY do it for $5000.

1) H22s are cable shifters, NOT LINKAGE --- true..but easier to install than rods :D

2)THERE ARE NO MOTOR MOUNTS AVAILABLE FOR AN H22 INTO A CRX, custom are neccesary, an you must weld the tranny mount on, unless you do a H series with B series adapter plate.
there are...forgot who... oh and btw thanks BABYJ:goodjob:

3) Yes, its a shoehorn to get an H22 into an EF, firewall barely clears, its nearly impossible to get the hood to shut.
its ok...it clears

4) the alternator on the H22 stick out RIGHT BY THE DRIVER SIDE HEADLIGHT, a custom bracker an belt must be used, unless you reomve your headlight, which makes it a non street car.
any motor swap is fab work...h22 just takes a little more and worth it IMO

5) you must convert to OBD1, there is nor OBD0 ECU that will run an H22 properly, they have EGR, secondariy butterflies, the wiring doesnt ever come CLOSE to plug an play
you can elminate egr by running a chip ECU and use an OBD0 jumper harness


the sheer amount of labor involved is EXPENSIVE. an its not worth it when you can do an GSR that WILL bolt in with a $500 mount kit
Custom EF Civic/Crx 88-91 H22A motor (http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1644032&postid=22016977#) mount kits $449 shipped US
Custom DA 90-93 Integra H22A motor mount kits $449 shipped


H22 swap complete FRONT clip from NADS (local) = $2400
H22 motor mount kit = 449
P28/P72 ECU = 150
Jumper Harness = 100 (or DIY http://diy.prostreetonline.com/howto/showarticle.asp?articleid=40)

axles = 200 brand new or used for $100
_________________________________________________
TOTAL = $3200









Boy you got stock in Honda H22s or something? DAMN!!! LOL. When the LAST h22 block falls into a vat of "metal melter" you are gonna be one sick puppy!! LOL.

[93H22ACX]

Boy you got stock in Honda H22s or something? DAMN!!! LOL. When the LAST h22 block falls into a vat of "metal melter" you are gonna be one sick puppy!! LOL.


hahahah.. i'll ask Steph Pop. to build me one if he still remembers how to....tell him to stop drifting

[BABY J]

As far as the BS about being too front end heavy, this is not true. It weighs about 35 lbs. more than a GSR maybe less. My car weighed in at 2020 lbs with no driver. I have full faith in my car around corners and turns. I have owned a B series crx and I would say that it is the same or better at handling.


C'mon B. The guy is trying to sell HIS product and HIS line of thinking, of course he will say that. Key word is HE has faith in his car around corners. if I drove a dump truck for a living and got used to it I could tell you that I have full faith in it in corners... that doesn't mean it will outhandle any other car. His quote does NOT prove which setup handles better. My vote is the B... but liek Mike said there are more variables that go into it. W/ the torque increase though, you better believe that ride would be less stable in the twisties when you start stabbing the throttle. I was not posting to get a debate up, just to let 1/2Dick know that he has options. :)

[BABY J]

It's only like 40lbs differance if i remember correctly, with the right differential and tires any torque steer will go away.

FYI: Torque never "goes away", neither does torque-steer... it is just moved somewhere else in the powerband, or somewhere else in the drivetrain.

[93H22ACX]

http://www.kineda.com/photos/film/huo_yuanjia.jpg


As far as the BS about being too front end heavy, this is not true. It weighs about 35 lbs. more than a GSR maybe less. My car weighed in at 2020 lbs with no driver. I have full faith in my car around corners and turns. I have owned a B series crx and I would say that it is the same or better at handling.


C'mon B. The guy is trying to sell HIS product and HIS line of thinking, of course he will say that. Key word is HE has faith in his car around corners. if I drove a dump truck for a living and got used to it I could tell you that I have full faith in it in corners... that doesn't mean it will outhandle any other car. His quote does NOT prove which setup handles better. My vote is the B... but liek Mike said there are more variables that go into it. W/ the torque increase though, you better believe that ride would be less stable in the twisties when you start stabbing the throttle. I was not posting to get a debate up, just to let 1/2Dick know that he has options. :)

alot of others have said same thing...same as myself. it felt fine for me and i had stock suspension.

i dont know...35lbs.... with every swap u should have suspension upgrades and with that it should eliminate possibilities.

alot of h22 guys dont have problems with going around the corners (not the twisties but regular driving...) i mean my friend with a b16 EF hatch had problems.


The guy is trying to sell HIS product and HIS line of thinking, of course he will say that. Key word is HE has faith in his car around corners. if I drove a dump truck for a living and got used to it I could tell you that I have full faith in it in corners...
my point is...ITS PERFERENCES...my opinion is different..yours is different...my way of thinking is the same as his...u might not like it but the next person might like it...thats why there are OPINIONS


that doesn't mean it will outhandle any other car.

nope it sure doesnt but in my mind its good enough HEHEHHE i just need to make a 90 degree turn out of the 1/4 strip and a left on to my driveway into my garage:D

His quote does NOT prove which setup handles better.

yep it does not

My vote is the B... but liek Mike said there are more variables that go into it. W/ the torque increase though, you better believe that ride would be less stable in the twisties when you start stabbing the throttle. I was not posting to get a debate up, just to let 1/2Dick know that he has options.


b-series will have more torque steer than the stock motor....h will have more than bserie.
[/QUOTE]


BTW...not debating just pointing some stuff out :goodjob: and i know mike...he knows what he's talking about too LOL...

and ask any of the h22 swap guys..im sure they will tell u its fine.....

[Vteckidd]

where are these custom mounts for $449? i havent seen them.

Yes, best bang for the buck H22. however, i still stand against it in an EF, its not easy at all, i almost did one. I did lots of research on it.

$3200, add at least $1000 for labor(swap, wiring)
weld in mounts, shifter cables, alternaotr

shit adds up, i aint doing it for $700 like a standard B series swap. i wont do it for less than $2000 just because i know what it takes to do one, its no simple by any means. if ISP wants to do it for cheaper thats fine, ill send them over there lol

[93H22ACX]

where are these custom mounts for $449? i havent seen them.

Yes, best bang for the buck H22. however, i still stand against it in an EF, its not easy at all, i almost did one. I did lots of research on it.

$3200, add at least $1000 for labor(swap, wiring)
weld in mounts, shifter cables, alternaotr

shit adds up, i aint doing it for $700 like a standard B series swap. i wont do it for less than $2000 just because i know what it takes to do one, its no simple by any means. if ISP wants to do it for cheaper thats fine, ill send them over there lol
http://explicitspeedperformance.net/index.html
i cant remember who else made them...fudgeing a


hahah nah man u win on the price mike LOL

[Vteckidd]

i didnt see any mounts on their site. i was checking them out awhile back when i was thinking of doing an H2B. i know they make the alternator relocator

[speedminded]

FYI: Torque never "goes away", neither does torque-steer... it is just moved somewhere else in the powerband, or somewhere else in the drivetrain.My torque steer went away...nearly completely after the LSD.

Ha! I said 40lbs differance :)

[BABY J]

My torque steer went away...nearly completely after the LSD.

Ha! I said 40lbs differance :)

Impossible! :) Torque steer (caused by torque + sub-par driveline) does not GO AWAY. You simply beefed up parts that caused the torque to be transferred somewhere else in the driveline (in this case, the drive wheels). You can't ERASE torque... it is simply xferred somewhere else. ;)

[93H22ACX]

http://www.explicitspeedperformance.net/

here you go mike: EF
http://explicitspeedperformance.net/myPictures/IMG_1657.jpg

DA:


http://explicitspeedperformance.net/myPictures/IMG_1701.jpg


Included in the complete kit:


(1) Driver side motor mount


(1) Rear engine mount


(1) Rear chassis mount


(1) Weld in or bolt in passenger side chassis mount


(1) Passenger side motor mount


(1) Alternator upper bracket and bolts


(1) Tensioner bracket for upper (your choice of bracket for either H series or D series alternator)


(1) Clutch cable/hydro conversion bracket


(1) Passenger side chassis new hole template only for 90-93 DA H22A motor mount kit


$449 shipped US




If you want the Lower H22A Alternator/Tensioner kit for either H or D series alternators instead of the Upper please let us know an additional $20 will be added onto the motor mount kit price.


The Polyurethane 80A on the Durometer scale inserts are easily replaceable unlike most other kits. Choice of black or red insert colors. Powder coating finish is semi gloss black.

[93H22ACX]

btw...have fun at the dyno guys

[§treet_§peed]

damn i missed some entertainment to night! lol!

[§treet_§peed]

:goodjob: B18C1 (GSR)B18c1 (http://www.jazzproparts.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=B18c1) is all i have to say.....:D

[BABY J]

DSPORT MAG // OCT 2004// ISSUE #22

Eddy Feldmeier / Union City, CA / A DNR PERFORMANCE BUILD

345 WHP / 11.2 @ 125.70 on 118 OCTANE / .957 RT / 1.686 60FT

VEH INFO:
--> 95 EG
--> 1980 w/o driver (that's a bit less than a stock DX, so they shedded some lbs)
--> LAUNCH RPM: 7000
--> SHIFT RPM: 9000
--> PEAK BOOST: 17PSI @ 5500RPM
--> FUEL 118 OCTANE

ENGINE SPECS
--> D16Z6
--> DISPLACEMENT: 1590CC
--> BORE/STROKE: 75mmbor X 90mmstrk
--> PEAK HP: 347WHP @ 7800
--> PEAK TQ: 258LBS @ 6200
--> DYNO: DYNO JET
--> PISTONS/CR: JE / 9:0:1
--> RODS/ CRANK:
EAGLE RODS
BAL/MICRO POLISHED CRANK

BLOCK MODS:
--> NuFormz Block Guard (unsleeved block)
--> Bal/BluPrntd
MACHINE WORK:
--> DNR PERF
CAMS:
--> CUSTOM WEB CAM RACING
VALVETRAIN:
--> DNR P&P
--> MILLED .30
--> S2 IMANI
-->
FUEL:
--> 720CC
--> BOSCH PUMP
MANAGEMENT:
--> HONDATA S200 (FTW!)
SNAIL:
--> GREDDY T3/T4
--> TIAL 35MM WASTEGATE
--> GREDDY TYPER BOV
--> SPEARCO 24x9x3 INTERCOOLER
EX:
--> REVHARD EX MANI

MISC:
--> STOCK DX TRANNY, MSD DIGITAL 6, GRND CNTRL 550lb Springs (frnt). S2 Drag Launch (rears), ACT 6PUCK, LIGHTENED STOCK FLYWHEEL,


** I do not call this "magazine racing", b/c there is no use foraging new ground on a $100 motor when there is already a potent blueprint to build from. I kinda did that w/ my Spec V and while I am satisfied (and it's no knock on Sunbelt), there was quite a bit of trial and error which is directly proportional to COST. Good luck 1/2wit and I gotta fresh Z6 when you wanna get started (SHAMELESS PLUG).

[Vteckidd]

yeah thats a Z6 with RODS AN PISTONS. still out of his budget unless he does all the work himself.

[SLR]

i've seen stock CX civic eg's run 13's with nitrous. stripped out from drivers seat back, intake, custom exhaust. 50shot and a good driver.

[jdmcrx12]

do a b16 swap the total was only like 2800 and take the extra cash and do internal or boost thats my opinion but the sohc + spray is fun

[BTLFED]

i've seen stock CX civic eg's run 13's with nitrous. stripped out from drivers seat back, intake, custom exhaust. 50shot and a good driver.

A stock 8 valve CX with a 50 shot? Running 13s? I'm not sure I can believe that.

[BABY J]

^^ not sure on the non-vtec motors. But I DO know that a fresh fully bolted Z6 on a wet 100 shot + Hondata and DRs will, and that will be NOWHERE near busting his budget. 50 on a stock CX (even fully-bolted) doesn't say "13 second capable" in my mind though. I dunno.

[SLow_POke]

^^ not sure on the non-vtec motors. But I DO know that a fresh fully bolted Z6 on a wet 100 shot + Hondata and DRs will, and that will be NOWHERE near busting his budget. 50 on a stock CX (even fully-bolted) doesn't say "13 second capable" in my mind though. I dunno.


lol im with you i dont see a cx doing 13 sec pass on only 50 noway . or prove me wrong . always open to learning the things;)

[SLow_POke]

not a legit time but street raced a 13 sec rex (high 13)with my 89 dx hatch with a DOHC zc and 65 shot si trans ,took him by half a car 2x maybe he sand bagging or not . but i assumed i could brake 13's int he track never did it though( never assume:doh: )

i did do a 1/8 mile in Irwindale speedway in cali . 9.2 hope i can find the time slip :)

[BABY J]

lol im with you i dont see a cx doing 13 sec pass on only 50 noway . or prove me wrong . always open to learning the things;)

Same here. :goodjob: Steph couldn't even pull that off even w/ a tailwind. :)

[BABY J]

not a legit time but street raced a 13 sec rex (high 13)with my 89 dx hatch with a DOHC zc and 65 shot si trans ,took him by half a car 2x maybe he sand bagging or not . but i assumed i could brake 13's int he track never did it though( never assume:doh: )

i did do a 1/8 mile in Irwindale speedway in cali . 9.2 hope i can find the time slip :)

we are talking SOHC. ZC > SOHC at anything over 60mph.

[SLow_POke]

we are talking SOHC. ZC > SOHC at anything over 60mph.

oHHHHHH gotta read theu each thread . lol:o

[sirhatch1030]

i see it happen with a cx . it is a lite car , then if u gut it 1,975 pounds some where around there and with a good kit it is possiable, but i say do a b16 i,h,e and a 75 shot , i know it will do mid to low 13,s all day with a jdm s1 tranny.

[green91]

the cx is lite but squeezing the cx motor even with a light chassis isnt going to net 13s

[sirhatch1030]

swap out manifolds and in take , and my money is on the cx

[2.0civic]

A stock 8 valve CX with a 50 shot? Running 13s? I'm not sure I can believe that.


i would love to see that happen

[SLow_POke]

swap out manifolds and in take , and my money is on the cx i still dont see it even with a built head a cx head at that have u seen those heads taken apart .. no bueno

[sirhatch1030]

b16, 75shot is all it takes to go 13,s

[BTLFED]

i still dont see it even with a built head a cx head at that have u seen those heads taken apart .. no bueno

That's what I was thinking....8 valves = teh suck.

[Halfwit]

b16, 75shot is all it takes to go 13,s
then why did u have to have a gsr block type r head, and spray to run 13.8? seems like it would be faster than b16......

[BABY J]

^^ There are many ways to skin a cat. He is tryna get you there at the lowest pricepoint. B16 cheaper than B18.

[Halfwit]

^^ There are many ways to skin a cat. He is tryna get you there at the lowest pricepoint. B16 cheaper than B18.
i didnt ask for cheapest price point, i asked what would be a good setup to run 13,s and have potential for more, and not be the most expensive.

money isnt a option, it will just take time to save, if i wanted a k20 or some other shit it would get it, just in like a year,

but i should have this in 3-4 months.

gsr seems like a smart choice imo..for power,price,and potential.

[BABY J]

Well there ya go!

[99SI]

Casey stop listening to everyone's convoluted opinions get a GSR do some bolt ons and have a good little car to build upon. It leaves you many options to go with to start making bigger power.

[BABY J]

^^ nuh uhhh!!! LOL

[Vteckidd]

I think we settled on a GSR. It may not get him in the 13s off the bat, but itll DEF go low 14s, hell have the best B series platform to build on should he decide to go NA, boost, Nitrous.

[Vteckidd]

CX 80HP motor plus a 50shot=KABLOOEY

[BABY J]

LOL. He said "kablooey" LOL.

[sirhatch1030]

I NEVER SPRAYED THAT MOTOR , I RAN 13.8 ON MOTOR UN TUNED COULDENT FIND ANY GAS THAT DAY.

[sirhatch1030]

then why did u have to have a gsr block type r head, and spray to run 13.8? seems like it would be faster than b16......IT WAS ALL MOTOR , I DIDENT GET A CHANCE TO FILL MY BOTTLE BEFOR THAT SAT. I WAS RUNNING MID 14,S THEN SWAPED TIRES AND GOT SOME 110 OCTANE AND RAN 13.8

[IntegraXTR]

^^ still good times even without spray

[Halfwit]

I NEVER SPRAYED THAT MOTOR , I RAN 13.8 ON MOTOR UN TUNED COULDENT FIND ANY GAS THAT DAY.
OK, DONT GO CRAZY, IT WILL BE OK.....good run then.

[mp5o]

To the OP...

d16z6
Pistons/rods
Arp bolts/studs
HMT kit
Chrome/Uberdata
440's/walbro 255
Tuning

Cheapest way to get fast. Reliably. IMO

[BABY J]

^^ Now post the same thing w/ the "street price" for those parts.

[mp5o]

To the OP...

d16z6 ~500
Pistons/rods ~700
Arp bolts/studs ~400
HMT kit ~2000
Chrome/Uberdata ~200
440's/walbro 255 ~500
Tuning ~150/HR

Cheapest way to get fast. Reliably. IMO

Roughly 4500... The other 500 can be spent on machine shop labor.

[99SI]

That was what I originally suggested but he is fundamentally opposed to going with a single cam regardless of what's done to it. That has been ruled out. He only wants to look at twin cams and get opinions based on what people think would be the best route between those motors.

[BABY J]

He can get a Z6 for cheaper than that. :) I was just wanting him to have it outlined so he can see the budgeting. I personally would go for building the SOHC as well.

[mp5o]

That was what I originally suggested but he is fundamentally opposed to going with a single cam regardless of what's done to it. That has been ruled out. He only wants to look at twin cams and get opinions based on what people think would be the best route between those motors.


Im not sure I understand that logic... People give a budget and ask "how do I break 13's?" Then when given the most logical solution... They rule it out. Turbo D16 is simply the cheapest way to get fast, reliably.

[Halfwit]

gtfo with thes sohc's.....diaf

[BABY J]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/92-95-HONDA-CIVIC-EX-JDM-ENGINE-ZC-SOHC-VTEC-D16Z6_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ33615QQitemZ80743 91578QQrdZ1

[99SI]

^^^^ shut up Mr. "D16 is not an interferance motor" LMAO

[BABY J]

^^ U wanna lick my WHAT??? :eye:


PS: and when I find that damn ENDYN article we ALL will be educated as to why it's not as much an interference motor. Ass!!! LOL


**cries**

**leaves**

**counts checking account**

**feels better**


LMAO!!

[99SI]

Endyn does make good heads, he's also a smart guy that comes up with a bunch of theories. However, he has not had the greatest rep for pulling off what he says he can.

[BABY J]

I'd say "good" is a huge understatment. :) I'd like to see some examples (offline) of NOT pulling off stuff. IMO he has "arrived" to the upper echelon of automotive genius. :)

[99SI]

He does know his theory like I said, and he is a smart guy. But, "upper echelon of automotive genius." I wouldn't quite be ready to lay that one on him.

[EK9Type S]

Your best bet with room for expansion would definetly be a K swap, dont get me wrong B's are sweet but save your money and go K you wont regret it. Soon there will be K's all over and you will feel left out wondering what you could have done. Register on K20A.org and soak up all the information you can. If not a K20 get a K24, they are cheaper and have more torque than a K20. From there you could toss on a K20 head later on down the road. Options are just as endless with K's as they are with B's but if you want reliablity you can have one quick all motor K that would stomp some ass. I ran a 14.1 with a crappy lauch in my RSX Type S I/H/E/Kpro car is about 2800+ lbs, your car is at least 600 lbs lighter, power to weight thats where its at.

[speedminded]

Your best bet with room for expansion would definetly be a K swap, dont get me wrong B's are sweet but save your money and go K you wont regret it. Soon there will be K's all over and you will feel left out wondering what you could have done. Register on K20A.org and soak up all the information you can. If not a K20 get a K24, they are cheaper and have more torque than a K20. From there you could toss on a K20 head later on down the road. Options are just as endless with K's as they are with B's but if you want reliablity you can have one quick all motor K that would stomp some ass. I ran a 14.1 with a crappy lauch in my RSX Type S I/H/E/Kpro car is about 2800+ lbs, your car is at least 600 lbs lighter, power to weight thats where its at.14.1 on "stock" RSX...that with slicks?

[IntegraXTR]

well he did say I/H/E and KPRO

[BABY J]

K20 in an EG (+ exhaust) = 12.50s to 13.0s. www.hybrid-racing.com

I do not suspect the EF would be much worse. :)

[EK9Type S]

Im getting rid of my B18 and getting a K cuz it has so much more potential, theres guys running boosted stock K putting out 300+ hp easy. Hell heres a vid of a boosted stock K with 400+ hp making an 11.3 pass with a slipping clutch.

http://videos.streetfire.net/video/FF405C52-2420-4789-81D9-5BCCDAB95E41.htm

if that vid dont sell you on the whole K swap thing I dont know what will. The key to reliability with K's is tuning cuz they can take a beating.

[Vteckidd]

READ THE FIRST POST

K is OUT OF THE QUESTION, you cannot DO IT IN AN EF FOR LESS THAN $7000. Yes Ks are better, but they cost too much.

an there are STOCK BLOCK ks making 600whp BTW. and the keys to a K series lasting is oil pressure

[EK9Type S]

READ THE FIRST POST

K is OUT OF THE QUESTION, you cannot DO IT IN AN EF FOR LESS THAN $7000. Yes Ks are better, but they cost too much.

an there are STOCK BLOCK ks making 600whp BTW. and the keys to a K series lasting is oil pressure

I understand that he is one a budget and I understand the problem with K's spinning bearings and what not, but thats for bigger setups in most cases and even that can be solved ie oil pan baffles, etc. I have been researching K swaps for quite some time now and I understand that if you choose to get a K20 ur gonna be forking out some cash. Thats why I suggested him getting a K24, its cheaper and he could always grow from there. The video I posted is to show that he could toss a K20 head on, then if he wanted to he could even grow from there and boost it. But if he went with a B he would have to do all sorts of stuff to get the same power in then what, time for a K. Save your money and you can get that K up and running and be very satisfied.

just my .02 cents

[Halfwit]

Im not sure I understand that logic... People give a budget and ask "how do I break 13's?" Then when given the most logical solution... They rule it out. Turbo D16 is simply the cheapest way to get fast, reliably.
hmmm. maybe stfu, cause i didnt ask for the cheapest. itch. does the d16 have the potential of the gsr

ME/VTECKIDD WERE TALKING ABOUT OFF THE BAT, MAKING 13'S NOT THE OVERALL GOAL. THAT IS WHY I RULED OUT SOHC, BECAUSE I DONT BELIEVE THEY HAVE THE POTENTIAL OF THE GSR.

[93H22ACX]

I understand that he is one a budget and I understand the problem with K's spinning bearings and what not, but thats for bigger setups in most cases and even that can be solved ie oil pan baffles, etc. I have been researching K swaps for quite some time now and I understand that if you choose to get a K20 ur gonna be forking out some cash. Thats why I suggested him getting a K24, its cheaper and he could always grow from there. The video I posted is to show that he could toss a K20 head on, then if he wanted to he could even grow from there and boost it. But if he went with a B he would have to do all sorts of stuff to get the same power in then what, time for a K. Save your money and you can get that K up and running and be very satisfied.

just my .02 cents

honestly...k would be good for NA but you can make power with B,H, and even D if you want to be different when it comes to FI. But K would be easier to make hp with in NA form... K head > H, H head > B, stock vs stock head flow

[SiR_Boost]

:stupid:

[mp5o]

hmmm. maybe stfu, cause i didnt ask for the cheapest. itch. does the d16 have the potential of the gsr

ME/VTECKIDD WERE TALKING ABOUT OFF THE BAT, MAKING 13'S NOT THE OVERALL GOAL. THAT IS WHY I RULED OUT SOHC, BECAUSE I DONT BELIEVE THEY HAVE THE POTENTIAL OF THE GSR.

LOL Look at this E-tuff guy here. :blah: I simply answered the question "What does it take for an EF to run 13s?" With the 5,000 budget. Which IMO is the best way to do it. I didnt bother readin the whole thread cus I really don't care that much. So talk all the shit you want G. I aint stoopin that low.

Anyways... On topic... What are your main goals? 12's? 11's? Both can be accomplished with the SOHC.... ;) And I hope for ya own sake "itch" wasnt an attempt to call me a bitch.

[Halfwit]

LOL Look at this E-tuff guy here. :blah: I simply answered the question "What does it take for an EF to run 13s?" With the 5,000 budget. Which IMO is the best way to do it. I didnt bother readin the whole thread cus I really don't care that much. So talk all the shit you want G. I aint stoopin that low.

Anyways... On topic... What are your main goals? 12's? 11's? Both can be accomplished with the SOHC.... ;) And I hope for ya own sake "itch" wasnt an attempt to call me a bitch.
lol.. goal at the end is high 12's and i jsut thought it would be easier/cheaper to build the gsr to 12's than the sohc.

[mp5o]

lol.. goal at the end is high 12's and i jsut thought it would be easier/cheaper to build the gsr to 12's than the sohc.

Damn man! If high 12's is all your lookin for.... Well here, I'll let the numbers speak for themselves http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1643764&page=1

Mildy built sohc turbo + slicks should definatly get you what your lookin for.

[Vteckidd]

GSR is the best PLATFORM to build on.

a SOHC TURBO is the FASTEST out of anything

[SiR_Boost]

boost is best:D

[i4_garage]

get 5000 and go start a life....geshhh.....5000 on a 13s car that is still ugly as shit....lolz...no offense

[i4_garage]

^^i was only joking ...............EF FTW!!!!!!

[Halfwit]

^^i was only joking ...............EF FTW!!!!!!
lol thought u were partial to eks?

[SiR_Boost]

:werd:

[Halfwit]

:werd:
c'mon now, state your opinion. all is appreciate, not much is considered.

[BABY J]

Get the new SRT-8 Jeep and call it a day. The FIRST SUV I ever thought about owning. That says a lot. (although I do like the 03+ Navigators)

http://www.jeep.com/grand_cherokee/models/srt8.html

[Halfwit]

out of my price range