New Stadium for the Braves

[David88vert]

Atlanta Braves moving to Cobb County in 2017 | 11alive.com (http://www.11alive.com/news/article/312568/8/Atlanta-Braves-moving-to-Cobb-County-in-2017)

What's wrong with Turner Field? Seems fine to me.

[Browning151]

I like Turner Field as well, seems like traffic and lack of development opportunities played a significant role in the move.

[Vteckidd]

Atlanta Braves moving to Cobb County in 2017 | 11alive.com (http://www.11alive.com/news/article/312568/8/Atlanta-Braves-moving-to-Cobb-County-in-2017)

What's wrong with Turner Field? Seems fine to me.

Nothing is wrong with Turner Field. The issue isnt with the venue, its with the broken promises Atlanta has not fulfilled to the Braves.

Great move for the Braves, much better location, much better fan experience. Turner Field was a great venue, terrible location and terrible experience. There is a lot more to this than what the Falcons deal was.

City Of Atlanta promised the Braves 100s of millions in investment into the surround infrastructure for restaurants, bars, retail, hotels, etc. After the crash of 2008 all that never happened. Braves have tried for YEARs to get something done and it never worked out. Atlanta always was too greedy to let them plan and build their own facilities. When Atlanta bent over backwards to give the Falcons a new stadium, the Braves were upset. And they moved, rightfully so.

Read this , excellent piece

The Other 284 Days - Features - Atlanta Magazine (http://www.atlantamagazine.com/features/2013/06/21/turner-field-development)

[Vteckidd]

Also, this is where the Braves Tickets sales come from by location:

[Vteckidd]

Swapping the Atlanta Braves for pari-mutuel betting? | Political Insider | www.ajc.com (http://www.ajc.com/weblogs/political-insider/2013/nov/11/atlanta-braves-moving-cobb-county/)

[Browning151]

I think it will prove to be a great move for the Braves, Falcons should have done the same thing.

[ISAtlanta300]

Traffic is gonna be a bitch now (more than it already was).....

But Cumberland Mall and restaurants are gonna thrive...

Plus it's true. There isn't a decent hotel close to Turner Field other than that old Holiday Inn... and no restaurants for post game hanging out. Cumberland area has great restaurants now, and I assume with this move, even more will come.

[C230K]

Braves deserve a new stadium because AT LEAST they won a world series, unlike the Falcons who can't fucking win a Superbowl.

[Vteckidd]

I think it will prove to be a great move for the Braves, Falcons should have done the same thing.

Falcons I disagree, because they have loyal fans. its 8 games a year on a sunday you have to make the trip. I live right in the middle of it, and even yesterday all the lots were full with a 2-6 record. I think Atlanta needs a major franchise like NFL to thrive and keep people investing downtown. Falcons have Marta, Hawks have marta, etc.

Braves were left out in the cold, in a bad part of town. This make more sense when you have a sport like baseball that has 80+ games a year at home

[Vteckidd]

Braves deserve a new stadium because AT LEAST they won a world series, unlike the Falcons who can't fucking win a Superbowl.

Well teams who dont win superbowls get new stadiums all the time. The Cowboys havent won a SB in 20 years, but tehy got a Billion dollar stadium. I think the Falcons Ownership under Arthur blank has done very well for the city and fans.

Also the Braves never chose Turner Field, it was a retro fitted olympic stadium

[Browning151]

Falcons I disagree, because they have loyal fans. its 8 games a year on a sunday you have to make the trip. I live right in the middle of it, and even yesterday all the lots were full with a 2-6 record. I think Atlanta needs a major franchise like NFL to thrive and keep people investing downtown. Falcons have Marta, Hawks have marta, etc.

Braves were left out in the cold, in a bad part of town. This make more sense when you have a sport like baseball that has 80+ games a year at home

I agree the Braves got screwed as far as infrastructure and surrounding development goes, they are in a crap part of town with horrible access. That being said, I still think the Falcons could have done the same and benefited from it, maybe not as far north as Alpharetta area as some were suggesting but to a slightly more accessible area, but I do understand the economic impact that would have on the city and further investment and development. Guess we know why Reed was fighting so hard to keep them downtown now, knowing the Braves were about to make a move.

[.blank cd]

Braves deserve a new stadium because AT LEAST they won a world series, unlike the Falcons who can't fucking win a Superbowl.

Braves are the only Atlanta sports team with a title. Ever.

[Vteckidd]

I agree the Braves got screwed as far as infrastructure and surrounding development goes, they are in a crap part of town with horrible access. That being said, I still think the Falcons could have done the same and benefited from it, maybe not as far north as Alpharetta area as some were suggesting but to a slightly more accessible area, but I do understand the economic impact that would have on the city and further investment and development. Guess we know why Reed was fighting so hard to keep them downtown now, knowing the Braves were about to make a move.

Internally they say he had NO IDEA ( dont know if i believe that, someone had to have talked).

I guess what i meant to say is, I would have zero doubts the Falcons could have made a similar move. Its an easier sell to keep them downtown than say the Braves. The Hawks have a dual purpose with Philips being a major concert venue so they arent going anywhere anytime soon.

This makes the most sense for the braves

[Browning151]

Internally they say he had NO IDEA ( dont know if i believe that, someone had to have talked).

I don't really buy that either.

This has been one of the best kept secrets in major league sports that I can remember though, I don't think a Braves move was on much of anyone's radar until this morning.

[.blank cd]

I don't really buy that either.

This has been one of the best kept secrets in major league sports that I can remember though, I don't think a Braves move was on much of anyone's radar until this morning.

I had a good idea. They're lease is up in 2017. Figured they would at least rebuild. Didn't think it would come out this far though.

[Julio]

Great move.

[-EnVus-]

I dont think the move will happen but what is hilarious is these New business and home owners crying over the idea. Fox5 with the guy crying venting his sandy vagina for buying a home near the Stadium is sad.

[David88vert]

There are winners and losers in every transaction, and that is what this is, a transaction. I'm sure that Braves management has studies the costs and risks in detail, but a couple of things that instantly come to mind for me are:

1) Traffic. 7:05pm games on Mon-Fri, specifically.
If you are coming from Gwinnett down I-85, then once you get inside I-285, you have lots of options to get around the Grady curve.
At the new location, Mon-Fri games just got near impossible to make. How early are you expected to leave Gwinnett at to make a 7:05pm game when you use I-285?

2) Downtown businessmen/workers - 7:05pm games on Mon-Fri, specifically.
Again, if you work downtown, you can get off work, and shoot over to Turner Field quickly. Traffice going up I-75 to Cobb gets backed up in rush hour, and will only get worse.

3) Hotels/restaurants/neighborhood - big plus moving to Cobb

4)East Cobb - The Braves management is moving to where there is the most emphasis on baseball. Look at the Lassiter/Pope area, almost every park seems to have 4 or more baseball fields.

5) City of Atlanta - City management has proven their ineffectiveness at managing and developing. They had the opportunity to build up the area around Turner Field during the boom years, yet did not accomplish anything.

6) Season ticket holders - no one on here appears to be a season ticket holder.

[.blank cd]

We were season ticket holders. I will be again once the stadium moves

And if you're coming from Gwinnett, you can cut across 92 and 120

[Browning151]

A take on the traffic situation:
| www.wsbradio.com (http://www.wsbradio.com/Player/102177141/)

[David88vert]

We were season ticket holders. I will be again once the stadium moves

And if you're coming from Gwinnett, you can cut across 92 and 120

It's good for you that they move to Cobb - anyone in Cobb or Cherokee will have it much easier - and honestly, that is a lot of the people that are into Braves baseball.

I know the traffic on 120 and 92 - and it is even slower. You wouldn't take 92 anyway, you would be more likely to take Roswell Rd to Marietta instead. Traffic isn't going to be good any route you take though.

[Vteckidd]

There will be transportation solutions, I GUARANTEE IT considering the Braves were subsidizing the Braves Shuttle anyway. I would wait to see what comes out. There are rumors of a split from 75 that splits in between 285

[Vteckidd]

Photos of Braves' new Cobb County stadium released - Talking Chop (http://www.talkingchop.com/2013/11/20/5127094/new-braves-stadium-design-photos)

[Echonova]

Where do you park?

[Vteckidd]

Where do you park?

irrelevant

[ISAtlanta300]

Hmmm...new overpasses.....

[Vteckidd]

new overpasses and new roads that are not there, HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM


Echo, i was wondering the same thing, I feel that there are "parking decks" in those pictures, or what appear to be parking decks

[Echonova]

new overpasses and new roads that are not there, HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM


Echo, i was wondering the same thing, I feel that there are "parking decks" in those pictures, or what appear to be parking decksPer the AJC: About 2,000 spaces would be built under the stadium, along with roughly 4,000 other spaces on the 60-acre site. A total of 30,000 parking spaces would be located within two miles, and the team envisions a pedestrian bridge across Interstate 285 linking to Cobb Galleria.

“Cobb County is a very progressive county,” said Plant. “Stay tuned for more good things on transit, traffic and parking.”

[D3UC3S]

Bullshit. 285 and 75 will be a nightmare on games that coincide with rush hour traffic.

Plus, from what I have been hearing, there is major opposition to the move from residents of Cobb and the City of Atlanta. They are a 1/3 owner of the Ted and have a lot of money to lose in this deal. I wouldn't be surprised if this shady, secret move the Braves pulled backfires in their faces.

[Vteckidd]

If Cobb residents are smart they will approve this as long as taxes don't rise.

Huge benefit to that area.

Traffic problems are being massively overstated and overblown imo.

[David88vert]

If Cobb residents are smart they will approve this as long as taxes don't rise.

Huge benefit to that area.

Agreed. Unfortunately, taxes will rise, regardless of whether they build the stadium or not.



Traffic problems are being massively overstated and overblown imo.

Spoken like someone who lives downtown and doesn't drive on I-75 in rush hour traffic. Or maybe like someone who likes to sit in parking lots for extended periods of time.

[Vteckidd]

Spoken like someone who lives downtown and doesn't drive on I-75 in rush hour traffic. Or maybe like someone who likes to sit in parking lots for extended periods of time.

I live downtown , but i work in East Cobb , i deal with Cobb Traffic EVERY DAY. :)

Look lets be reasonable.

1) We dont know what fixes they have in place because no details have been released, so getting all upset about traffic is premature.
2) Tell me how moving 40k fans from downtown to Cobb or anywhere else doesnt create traffic?
3) People are ignoring the fact that the stadium is moving closer to the fan base=less traveling= LESS TRAFFIC BECAUSE LESS CARS? MAYBE
4) Lets be honest, the Braves dont sell out EVERY game, average attendance i think was in the 20K? So, if HALF that 20K is local to the new stadium, you are talking about maybe 5000 extra cars? or less? People are acting like its 40k cars coming to the area.
5) Traffic is always a problem, im sure the Braves and Cobb know that.

When I leave East Cobb at 630 and dont go to my gym, i have to sit in East Cobb surface street traffic, 285 > 75 Cobb traffic, 75 South into downtown traffic , you know what thats like if say, the Braves or like tonight, THURSDAY NIGHT FOOTBALL IS IN TOWN? Its rediculous, but its what happens.

Whats the solution, building a stadium in the boonies where no one will travel anyway? Seems legit

[David88vert]

I live downtown , but i work in East Cobb , i deal with Cobb Traffic EVERY DAY. :)

Look lets be reasonable.

1) We dont know what fixes they have in place because no details have been released, so getting all upset about traffic is premature.
2) Tell me how moving 40k fans from downtown to Cobb or anywhere else doesnt create traffic?
3) People are ignoring the fact that the stadium is moving closer to the fan base=less traveling= LESS TRAFFIC BECAUSE LESS CARS? MAYBE
4) Lets be honest, the Braves dont sell out EVERY game, average attendance i think was in the 20K? So, if HALF that 20K is local to the new stadium, you are talking about maybe 5000 extra cars? or less? People are acting like its 40k cars coming to the area.
5) Traffic is always a problem, im sure the Braves and Cobb know that.

When I leave East Cobb at 630 and dont go to my gym, i have to sit in East Cobb surface street traffic, 285 > 75 Cobb traffic, 75 South into downtown traffic , you know what thats like if say, the Braves or like tonight, THURSDAY NIGHT FOOTBALL IS IN TOWN? Its rediculous, but its what happens.

Whats the solution, building a stadium in the boonies where no one will travel anyway? Seems legit

Living downtown, you are going in the opposite direction of traffic.

Don't you think that they have already considered traffic, and yet don't release any potential strategies early about how they plan to address it? In the document of understanding, they only had one page for transportation, and some of the proposed traffic reduction plans, like a bus system that will cost an approximated $500 million do not have any funding for them.
Residents express concerns over traffic after Memorandum of... | www.ajc.com (http://www.ajc.com/videos/news/residents-express-concerns-over-traffic-after/vCJpkK/)


I'm not against them moving to Cobb. I just think that anytime you commit your taxpayers to spending a large sum like that, you should put it to a vote, and I think that it won't be quite as simple to implement as they are trying to sell it.
Quite a few people are against it though:
FWIW: Emails run heavily against Cobb stadium | www.myajc.com (http://www.myajc.com/news/news/local-govt-politics/fwiw-emails-run-heavily-against-cobb-stadium/nbzC9/)

Cobb County Commission chairman, Tim Lee, is planning to spend $300 million of Cobb County tax money on the new stadium, including $9 million from property taxes - but that's not the whole story.
While the number reported is $300 million, the truth is that at annual payments of $17.9 million for 30 years, the actual public outlay including interest will be $537 million, plus $14 million for an upfront "transportation contribution." This is in addition to the county's 50 percent share of future improvements and repairs. This figure EXCLUDES the $10 million Cobb CID businesses will contribute in self-imposed taxes.
When he was asked why no public hearing is scheduled before the commissioner vote on Tuesday to spend at least $551 million in public money over the next 30 years on the new Braves stadium, he said, "We've made a decision we're not going to do that. I don't know that having a public hearing would add to the objective of getting more input since we've got a lot of input to date."

Seems like those in Cobb will end up paying for everyone else to watch the Braves play ball, and the people who have been buying up the land in the Cobb Galleria are this year will make a fortune.

[Vteckidd]

Living downtown, you are going in the opposite direction of traffic.

Don't you think that they have already considered traffic, and yet don't release any potential strategies early about how they plan to address it? In the document of understanding, they only had one page for transportation, and some of the proposed traffic reduction plans, like a bus system that will cost an approximated $500 million do not have any funding for them.
Residents express concerns over traffic after Memorandum of... | www.ajc.com (http://www.ajc.com/videos/news/residents-express-concerns-over-traffic-after/vCJpkK/)


I'm not against them moving to Cobb. I just think that anytime you commit your taxpayers to spending a large sum like that, you should put it to a vote, and I think that it won't be quite as simple to implement as they are trying to sell it.
Quite a few people are against it though:
FWIW: Emails run heavily against Cobb stadium | www.myajc.com (http://www.myajc.com/news/news/local-govt-politics/fwiw-emails-run-heavily-against-cobb-stadium/nbzC9/)

Cobb County Commission chairman, Tim Lee, is planning to spend $300 million of Cobb County tax money on the new stadium, including $9 million from property taxes - but that's not the whole story.
While the number reported is $300 million, the truth is that at annual payments of $17.9 million for 30 years, the actual public outlay including interest will be $537 million, plus $14 million for an upfront "transportation contribution." This is in addition to the county's 50 percent share of future improvements and repairs. This figure EXCLUDES the $10 million Cobb CID businesses will contribute in self-imposed taxes.
When he was asked why no public hearing is scheduled before the commissioner vote on Tuesday to spend at least $551 million in public money over the next 30 years on the new Braves stadium, he said, "We've made a decision we're not going to do that. I don't know that having a public hearing would add to the objective of getting more input since we've got a lot of input to date."

Seems like those in Cobb will end up paying for everyone else to watch the Braves play ball, and the people who have been buying up the land in the Cobb Galleria are this year will make a fortune.

People coming from 400 to the southside use 75/85 connector, people going from Cobb to downtown use the connector. Its against main traffic patterns sure, but come sit with me at 630 pm trying to go southbound on 75/85. Its bad, not as bad as 75 NB past cobb cloverleaf, but close.

Theres gonna be problems no matter what, to me, this was the best solution, traffic or not. Traffic solutions havent really been released mainly because we dont know about funding and what is planned.

As far as no public vote, depends how they levy the taxes and who are affected . Cobb Business taxes is a win win. They pay more in taxes , to generate more revenue by the stadium. More of a "investment".

Individual property taxes, not so sure thats a win win. Unless somehow their property is worth more, which isnt usually the case

[ISAtlanta300]

LOL at Traffic. We in Atlanta are soooo spoiled. We bitch when we sit 30 minutes in traffic to go from Downtown to the Perimeter. My commute in Miami was 2 hours in the morning for barely 10 miles. Talk about REAL Traffic. Leaving work there at 5 meant getting home at around 7PM just in time for primetime TV. News watching was always at 10:00PM... LOL

And there are ways around the traffic. Stuck on 85? Take Buford or Peachtree Industrial. Stuck on 75? Take Northside drive to Cobb Parkway. or Atlanta road to Vinnings. I've never been stuck until 7PM in Atlanta traffic unless it was snowing or storming with accidents.

[Vteckidd]

Not a fan of Rocker usually, but hes right on the money


ATLANTA -- Former Atlanta Braves pitcher John Rocker hurled his opinion on the team's move to Cobb County, suggesting the Turner Field neighborhood's problems are the main cause.
In a column tiled "Who wants to fight crime on way to ballpark?" for conservative opinion website WND.com, Rocker said he heard the shocking news of the move while coming back from a hunting trip. He recalled fond memories of being cheered by Atlanta fans at Turner Field, but said he understood the need to build a new stadium in a safer environment.

"A heavy metal screen at the counter of a laundry/cleaning business, to protect the owner and his employees from both his customers and the residents of the community surrounding Turner Field?" he writes. "That is the environment Atlanta Braves' fans must endure before and most notably AFTER an evening of cheering on their hometown heroes."

Rocker said Turner Field was supposed to revitalize its surrounding neighborhood.

"But that's a task easier said than done," Rocker writes. "The crime and violence that has plagued the community since the 1970s -- when the city wooed the Braves franchise from Milwaukee and built Atlanta Fulton County Stadium -- wasn't just going to pack up and leave simply because a baseball stadium popped up, and the good residents of metro Atlanta weren't about to risk their lives by moving there, either."

[Vteckidd]

Released today........hmmmmmmmmmmm

State lands federal loan for Northwest Corridor | www.ajc.com (http://www.ajc.com/news/news/state-regional-govt-politics/state-lands-federal-loan-for-northwest-corridor/nbzxY/)

248405

[David88vert]

Read the agreement - Cobb County is getting screwed.
https://docs.google.com/file/d/1qP6awUp6c6mfsTUtPr8hA3S818NIdAKN2LpV8HaShKSfGekPp 70DHZwlepfY/edit

Basics.
Cobb County pays for half of the stadium, and the Braves will pay $3M in rent each year, but Cobb County has to pay half of maintenance and repair. The revenue from parking, games, etc, all go to the Braves and Cobb County can only have 3 events per year there themselves, and those cannot be concerts or sporting events. Any sporting event or concert revenue goes to the Braves.
Cobb pays out $300M minimum, and then gets $60M back in rent if the Braves stay 20 years (like they just did with Turner Field). That means that Cobb County can host 60 events over the next 20 years and each event needs to bring in an average of $4M per event just to break even. What kind of events besides concerts and sporting events will bring in that kind of money? County fairs?
Oh wait, that doesn't take into account the interest on the loans or the cost of maintenance on the stadium over the next 20 years. Wonder where they will get the money.... sounds like higher taxes will be likely.

[Vteckidd]

Read the agreement - Cobb County is getting screwed.
https://docs.google.com/file/d/1qP6awUp6c6mfsTUtPr8hA3S818NIdAKN2LpV8HaShKSfGekPp 70DHZwlepfY/edit

Basics.
Cobb County pays for half of the stadium, and the Braves will pay $3M in rent each year, but Cobb County has to pay half of maintenance and repair. The revenue from parking, games, etc, all go to the Braves and Cobb County can only have 3 events per year there themselves, and those cannot be concerts or sporting events. Any sporting event or concert revenue goes to the Braves.
Cobb pays out $300M minimum, and then gets $60M back in rent if the Braves stay 20 years (like they just did with Turner Field). That means that Cobb County can host 60 events over the next 20 years and each event needs to bring in an average of $4M per event just to break even. What kind of events besides concerts and sporting events will bring in that kind of money? County fairs?
Oh wait, that doesn't take into account the interest on the loans or the cost of maintenance on the stadium over the next 20 years. Wonder where they will get the money.... sounds like higher taxes will be likely.

Who makes all the money on the restaurants? Braves signed a 30 year lease IIRC.

[David88vert]

Who makes all the money on the restaurants? Braves signed a 30 year lease IIRC.

You just ignored the math. The bottom line is that the 3 events per year that the county can hold will not cover the cost of the stadium that the county has to pay out. It's not even remotely close.

You want to know who will make the money on the restaurants? Let me ask, which restaurants? I hope that you mean the new ones that they will build in the stadium complex, because the ones in Cumberland Mall, like Uncle Vito's New York Pizza, won't make money off it it, but Cumberland Mall falls inside the new Cumberland District tax zone, which is expected to bring in $5.15M each year in tax revenue. The manager of the pizza restaurant is already concerned that the management of Cumberland Mall is just going to pass the tax down to him through raising the rent, but it is highly unlikely that people going to the game are going to go to the mall first to eat pizza.
When the game is over, most people don't hang out around the stadium patronizing local restaurants - especially the evening games (you know, when the mall is already closed).

The real issue is how much of the cost of a stadium that is being built for the benefit of a private entity is going to be paid for in public funds. Should county taxpayers start funding the building of Wal-Marts next? After all, those generate traffic and create jobs as well.

[Vteckidd]

You just ignored the math. The bottom line is that the 3 events per year that the county can hold will not cover the cost of the stadium that the county has to pay out. It's not even remotely close.

You want to know who will make the money on the restaurants? Let me ask, which restaurants? I hope that you mean the new ones that they will build in the stadium complex, because the ones in Cumberland Mall, like Uncle Vito's New York Pizza, won't make money off it it, but Cumberland Mall falls inside the new Cumberland District tax zone, which is expected to bring in $5.15M each year in tax revenue. The manager of the pizza restaurant is already concerned that the management of Cumberland Mall is just going to pass the tax down to him through raising the rent, but it is highly unlikely that people going to the game are going to go to the mall first to eat pizza.
When the game is over, most people don't hang out around the stadium patronizing local restaurants - especially the evening games (you know, when the mall is already closed).

The real issue is how much of the cost of a stadium that is being built for the benefit of a private entity is going to be paid for in public funds. Should county taxpayers start funding the building of Wal-Marts next? After all, those generate traffic and create jobs as well.

SO . MUCH . HOSTILITY. I Was honestly asking, wasnt rhetorical. I thought maybe you knew, I know there was discussion of the braves splitting profit or something on the restaurants. If COBB owns all the property around the complex, then all those restaurants = RENT MONEY and TAXES for 30 years. Money you arent factoring in

As far as your estimation, i disagree. Cobb County OWNS THE STADIUM. Its THEIR PROPERTY. In 30 years the braves will stay, or move on, and Cobb will still own the land, property, etc. Cobb will make money on this , EASILY, without breaking a sweat.

As to uncle vito , i disagree. Tourism is Tourism. he SHOULD see more customers, foot traffic, shoppers, etc. That area they are talking about building Hotels and such to it could be a nice little hub in North Atlanta.

Cobb COunty is going to have to come up with around 100-150 million over the next 30 years, Im sure taxes will be raised, but how much and to whom? Not sure I have seen that (unless you know where that is explained).

[David88vert]

SO . MUCH . HOSTILITY. I Was honestly asking, wasnt rhetorical. I thought maybe you knew, I know there was discussion of the braves splitting profit or something on the restaurants. If COBB owns all the property around the complex, then all those restaurants = RENT MONEY and TAXES for 30 years. Money you arent factoring in

As far as your estimation, i disagree. Cobb County OWNS THE STADIUM. Its THEIR PROPERTY. In 30 years the braves will stay, or move on, and Cobb will still own the land, property, etc. Cobb will make money on this , EASILY, without breaking a sweat.

As to uncle vito , i disagree. Tourism is Tourism. he SHOULD see more customers, foot traffic, shoppers, etc. That area they are talking about building Hotels and such to it could be a nice little hub in North Atlanta.

Cobb COunty is going to have to come up with around 100-150 million over the next 30 years, Im sure taxes will be raised, but how much and to whom? Not sure I have seen that (unless you know where that is explained).


I wasn't try to come across as hostile. I didn't realize that you were genuinely asking that question either, as there has been a lot of discussion online about it already, and I made the assumption that you were already informed on it, and were asking as a rhetorical response only. That assumption is my mistake, sorry for it.

Actually, I am factoring in the tax revenue from the local businesses. There are two special taxes for that Cumberland area attached to this proposal already. Those figures include the new hotel tax and district tax. Under the proposed plan, the county would use a mix of $9.61 million in existing revenue and $8.29 million in new taxes on business and tourism to collect the $17.9 million per year to cover the principal and interest of its share of the 30-year bonds that would be issued, according to the terms. They haven't said yet what revenue sources might be used for capital maintenance expenses to be shared 50/50 by the team and the county (see page 8 , section 9 of the stadium proposal). Of the new taxes, the county plan calls for $5.5 million would be generated annually through a new levy on area businesses, as well as $400,000 in a new 3 percent car rental tax in unincorporated parts of the county and $2.7 million from a new $3 per-room, per-night charge for surrounding hotels and motels.

Property will be owned by the Cobb-Marietta Coliseum and Exhibit Hall Authority. It will be operated by the Braves though. In 30 years, what will the stadium sell for? Who many are lining up to buy Turner Field right now? Who did Atlanta-Fulton County Stadium sell to back in the 1990s?

Do you know why it is especially bad for restaurants in Cumberland Mall, like Uncle Vito's? They have to pay out the tax money as it will likely be factored into their rent, yet they won't get the customers. Do you know why? Because the Braves are planning on building their own $400M entertainment complex complete with restaurants. Tourists aren't going to travel over to the old mall when the new dedicated entertainment plaza is where they already are at.
Braves unveil stadium entertainment district plan | www.wsbtv.com (http://www.wsbtv.com/ap/ap/georgia/braves-unveil-stadium-entertainment-district-plan/nbyy5/)

Cobb County has already factored in a tax for hotels, and for the Cumberland district. Where else can they go for money other than the local residents and businesses? How will those local residents see a return on their public money being used to build a local business?

Right now, it appears that 55% of Cobb residents are against it, but Lee's plans to only listen to 6 residents before voting. Doesn't that strike you as being not in the public's best interest?
Even worse, look at what he predicted earlier:
County leader predicts unanimous vote on stadium | www.wsbtv.com (http://www.wsbtv.com/ap/ap/georgia/county-leader-predicts-unanimous-vote-on-stadium/nbsr6/)
Sure sounds like he already knows of some backroom deals.

IMO, Cobb county residents should be voting on any expenditure this big and should have all of the details ahead of time. I'm surprised that you would feel differently. When Obamacare was voted on without time to read the legislation, you certainly didn't have the same viewpoint that you have now.

[Vteckidd]

I wasn't try to come across as hostile. I didn't realize that you were genuinely asking that question either, as there has been a lot of discussion online about it already, and I made the assumption that you were already informed on it, and were asking as a rhetorical response only. That assumption is my mistake, sorry for it.

You seem VASTLY more informed than me on this matter, so im genuinely asking sir :) Im not being facetious or condescending.


Actually, I am factoring in the tax revenue from the local businesses. There are two special taxes for that Cumberland area attached to this proposal already. Those figures include the new hotel tax and district tax. Under the proposed plan, the county would use a mix of $9.61 million in existing revenue and $8.29 million in new taxes on business and tourism to collect the $17.9 million per year to cover the principal and interest of its share of the 30-year bonds that would be issued, according to the terms.
That pays for principal AND interest right? So stadium=Paid for out of these new taxes?


They haven't said yet what revenue sources might be used for capital maintenance expenses to be shared 50/50 by the team and the county (see page 8 , section 9 of the stadium proposal).
Understood



Of the new taxes, the county plan calls for $5.5 million would be generated annually through a new levy on area businesses, as well as $400,000 in a new 3 percent car rental tax in unincorporated parts of the county and $2.7 million from a new $3 per-room, per-night charge for surrounding hotels and motels.

5.5 Millionx 30 years = 165 million in revenue Doesnt include the Hotel/Car rental taxes.

Now, is this 5.5 Million in addition to the Business and Tourism taxes mentioned above? Or is this INCLUDED in those taxes?


Property will be owned by the Cobb-Marietta Coliseum and Exhibit Hall Authority. It will be operated by the Braves though. In 30 years, what will the stadium sell for? Who many are lining up to buy Turner Field right now? Who did Atlanta-Fulton County Stadium sell to back in the 1990s?

Developed land is worth more than undeveloped land. the correct question is what is Atlanta selling Turner Field to developers for................or what if the braves sign another 30 year lease.



Do you know why it is especially bad for restaurants in Cumberland Mall, like Uncle Vito's? They have to pay out the tax money as it will likely be factored into their rent, yet they won't get the customers. Do you know why? Because the Braves are planning on building their own $400M entertainment complex complete with restaurants. Tourists aren't going to travel over to the old mall when the new dedicated entertainment plaza is where they already are at.
Braves unveil stadium entertainment district plan | www.wsbtv.com (http://www.wsbtv.com/ap/ap/georgia/braves-unveil-stadium-entertainment-district-plan/nbyy5/)

Legitimate concern, agreed. However, you and i know, thats business. Vitos will adapt of go under. You cant legislate companies to survive when environments change.



Cobb County has already factored in a tax for hotels, and for the Cumberland district. Where else can they go for money other than the local residents and businesses? How will those local residents see a return on their public money being used to build a local business?

Should be put to a vote


Right now, it appears that 55% of Cobb residents are against it, but Lee's plans to only listen to 6 residents before voting. Doesn't that strike you as being not in the public's best interest?
Even worse, look at what he predicted earlier:
County leader predicts unanimous vote on stadium | www.wsbtv.com (http://www.wsbtv.com/ap/ap/georgia/county-leader-predicts-unanimous-vote-on-stadium/nbsr6/)
Sure sounds like he already knows of some backroom deals.

Agreed 10000% see what i said below this. I do feel it should be all on the table and residents should approve it. Anytime taxes are levied , residents should have an informed debate on whether to have new stadium or not.


I'm surprised that you would feel differently. When Obamacare was voted on without time to read the legislation, you certainly didn't have the same viewpoint that you have now.
HMMMMM ill just leave this here


If Cobb residents are smart they will approve this as long as taxes don't rise.
I in no way saaid they sholdnt have a voice or vote on this. You misunderstood me. Blank? is that you? :P

[Vteckidd]

Also, what are the split on concessions? Do braves keep 100% of all concessions? What about cost of beer/liquor permits ?

[Browning151]

The way it seems this thing is being put up for vote without much input from residents seems rushed, usually there's a reason for that. Every news story I hear about how the process is moving forward makes it sound a little less on the up and up than it originally sounded.

[Vteckidd]

The way it seems this thing is being put up for vote without much input from residents seems rushed, usually there's a reason for that. Every news story I hear about how the process is moving forward makes it sound a little less on the up and up than it originally sounded.

I agree, things have drastically changed in about a weeks time. Would like to know more specifics and details

[David88vert]

You seem VASTLY more informed than me on this matter, so im genuinely asking sir :) Im not being facetious or condescending.

I only have the information that they have published so far. Most of it has been on WSB.



That pays for principal AND interest right? So stadium=Paid for out of these new taxes?


That's just the amount that they have agreed to pay out. That does not mean that it covers the stadium out of the new taxes. Everything that I have seen so far says that it does not cover it completely, but not all of the details have been flushed out yet.




5.5 Millionx 30 years = 165 million in revenue Doesnt include the Hotel/Car rental taxes.

Now, is this 5.5 Million in addition to the Business and Tourism taxes mentioned above? Or is this INCLUDED in those taxes?

Total expected off both taxes is just over $8M/yr, so $240M over 30 years.

Included, based on what has been published to date.




Developed land is worth more than undeveloped land. the correct question is what is Atlanta selling Turner Field to developers for................or what if the braves sign another 30 year lease.


Developed land is worth more when the developments and their infrastructure is reusable/saleable. No one will buy Turner Field as is for use as a stadium, and the reason that the Braves are moving is because the City of Atlanta has not kept up the infrastructure.

How much did Atlanta-Fulton County stadium sell for and what was the stadium and infrastructure worth? Oh right, it's a parking lot.

Turner Field will be bulldozed. Mark my words.




Legitimate concern, agreed. However, you and i know, thats business. Vitos will adapt of go under. You cant legislate companies to survive when environments change.

But you can create legislation to put them out of business. Just take some public funds, raise taxes, and give another private entity the ability to open a bunch of restaurants across the street.





Should be put to a vote

Agreed 10000% see what i said below this. I do feel it should be all on the table and residents should approve it. Anytime taxes are levied , residents should have an informed debate on whether to have new stadium or not.

And that is the whole point.



HMMMMM ill just leave this here


Sounded like you were ready to approve it earlier without question, and definitely without knowing the whole deal. Didn't Pelosi say we had to pass Obamacare before we read the ACA legislation? Same thing, just local county government spending big bucks this time around.



I in no way saaid they sholdnt have a voice or vote on this. You misunderstood me. Blank? is that you? :P

So we agree that the residents should have all of the information on the new stadium and vote on it. That's been my point from the beginning. I think we are in agreement.

[David88vert]

The way it seems this thing is being put up for vote without much input from residents seems rushed, usually there's a reason for that. Every news story I hear about how the process is moving forward makes it sound a little less on the up and up than it originally sounded.


And the reports of people buying up the land just before the announcement doesn't sound fishy either.

Details emerge about Braves' secretive stadium deal, developer land grab in surrounding area | Atlanta News & Opinion Blog | Fresh Loaf | Creative Loafing Atlanta (http://clatl.com/freshloaf/archives/2013/11/18/details-emerge-about-braves-secretive-stadium-deal-developer-land-grab-in-surrounding-area)

[David88vert]

I agree, things have drastically changed in about a weeks time. Would like to know more specifics and details


Wouldn't we all.....

[Vteckidd]

Wouldn't we all.....


So we agree that the residents should have all of the information on the new stadium and vote on it. That's been my point from the beginning. I think we are in agreement.


10000% in agreement.

[-EnVus-]

It makes me kind of suck watching all the cockiness from the deep pocket majority white people in Cobb county. The people around there have full hard on erections over the idea the Braves relocating there. It will have plenty of draw backs also but they could careless all they see is this will put Cobb county on the map big time. I hate the whole moving of the team and the sorry excuses given to why they must move. Also what makes Cobb county a permanent home maybe the Braves will want to move again in the future.

[AFSil80]

Mayor Reed said that with the Braves leaving Turner Field, that he will focus on putting something there that the neighborhoods deserve.

Which is funny, b/c I thought the state penitentiary was already just a few miles away?