Unemployment rate hits 10.2% in October

[punkr6]

Obama's stimulus plan, has only mad things worse----------Discuss.....

[Ed]

so who was actually hoping obama would do a damn thing for this country?

[Greddypacked]

Obama's stimulus plan, has only mad things worse----------Discuss.....
:rant::mad::fightpig::smackass::sicks:

[StreetHazard]

I'm doing fine right now, I have never left too much of my livelihood in the control of others, much less the U.S. government. Obviously I pay taxes and still report to a boss, but I keep my skills honed enough for (if/when) I get sick of this shit I can go somewhere else.

I will always survive and keep a roof over my head....no matter what. If I have to hustle, pimp some nasty ass bitches out at a truck stop...I will not go cold in the winter and get rained on when I sleep. Ill do whatever it takes

I don't blame anything on anybody...If I fail, I blame myself

[S2KJD]

it could get worse after this sunday's voting...

[Vteckidd]

not a surprise, saw this coming for months. I didnt think it would jump .4% in a month though.

I expect it to keep rising, i think we will top out around 10.8-11%, hold there for a few months then gradually start to work our way down.

Unless Obama does something stupid like raise TAXes on small business, or make them provide healthcare IE increase their costs. If that happens i can see us going to as high as 15%.

U6 is prob closer to 20% right now

[Njobe]

I'm doing fine right now, I have never left too much of my livelihood in the control of others, much less the U.S. government. Obviously I pay taxes and still report to a boss, but I keep my skills honed enough for (if/when) I get sick of this shit I can go somewhere else.

I will always survive and keep a roof over my head....no matter what. If I have to hustle, pimp some nasty ass bitches out at a truck stop...I will not go cold in the winter and get rained on when I sleep. Ill do whatever it takes

I don't blame anything on anybody...If I fail, I blame myself
QFT

[MongolPup]

Also remember that after x months of unsuccessful searching, a person is removed from the rate. So there are more people unemployed than the number ever shows.

[Vteckidd]

thats U6.

u6 counts people that are working part time that WANT to work full time, or have stopped looking for work.

The PUBLISHED number i think is U2 or U3, basically if someone gets laid off from there 40 hour a week job, and gets hired at mcdonalds working 10 hours a week, they count that person as "employed".

you really want to look at u6 to really see how bad it is

[Vteckidd]

* U1: Percentage of labor force unemployed 15 weeks or longer.
* U2: Percentage of labor force who lost jobs or completed temporary work.
* U3: Official unemployment rate per ILO definition.
* U4: U3 + "discouraged workers", or those who have stopped looking for work because current economic conditions make them believe that no work is available for them.
* U5: U4 + other "marginally attached workers", or "loosely attached workers", or those who "would like" and are able to work, but have not looked for work recently.
* U6: U5 + Part time workers who want to work full time, but cannot due to economic reasons.

[MongolPup]

Yay for informational post.

[Paul]

honestly i don't see it as that big of a problem... we needed to weed out weak companies and employees. after dot com rise people were hiring 2 people for 1 job. the current situation brings more stability to companies as they trim the fat out of their cost. my wife and i will make more money this year than ever before. my company is in the automotive industry and we are still looking good this year.

[Njobe]

^^ saw your car at wild wings on suawnee but you were no where to be seen :ninja:

[Alan®]

called it 6 months ago.

[Jdm94Coupe]

Didn't vote and probably won't. Me and punkr6 and good friends, but what I'm wondering is do we ALWAYS put the blame on the president, or is this some new trend. Were previous presidents to blame for every situation? ex. bush/clinton etc...... I'm not saying its because he's black but why is it like that? Bush was never to blame for sending us to war or for putting us in this hole in the first place. The hole is getting deeper, but did people really think Obama would get president and fix the economy in less than a year??? It took 8 years and 2 terms to fuck it up, how many to fix it?

Not an Obama fan, nor bush fan, well im not a fan of any of them, lol.... but i just wanna know what ppl think.

[DB4LYFE ™]

http://data.getafreelancer.com/project/352100/Obama-Barack-funny.jpg

~DB4LYFE

[JITB]

i thought the president doesnt take the charge for anything.. that was the consensus on IA when bush was in office...lol....

i dont know what people xpect to see in less than a year's time.

regardless of whos in office, i want to see a better US! But i believe there is more people that want things to go sour in the US.. just to be able to say i told you so. America has a problem with change in anything, and until people are prepared to change how things are run. Nothing will be fixed regardless of whos in office.

[Paul]

^^ saw your car at wild wings on suawnee but you were no where to be seen :ninja:


lol ya cici's for lunch :goodjob:

[csmiths]

i thought the president doesnt take the charge for anything.. that was the consensus on IA when bush was in office...lol....

i dont know what people xpect to see in less than a year's time.

regardless of whos in office, i want to see a better US! But i believe there is more people that want things to go sour in the US.. just to be able to say i told you so. America has a problem with change in anything, and until people are prepared to change how things are run. Nothing will be fixed regardless of whos in office.




But you see, that is far from true. Obama wants to raise taxes so that he can "help" the defacit that the country is in, when in reality it wont do a god damn thing besides hurt small businesses. Change isnt always a good thing, and he is not changing for the better. Companies arent hiring because taxes supposed to be going up the beginning of the year, and they are worried that they wont be able to afford to keep more employees. Hes fucking alot of companies up with the taxes hes trying to enforce.


Why I care is bc i work for a small business. When my boss tells me that he has to pay 10k every month to have 2 employees on a payroll is absolutely ridiculous. And on top of that he pays 45% of his profits towards taxes. So if it gets worse I could be fucked

[JITB]

But you see, that is far from true. Obama wants to raise taxes so that he can "help" the defacit that the country is in, when in reality it wont do a god damn thing besides hurt small businesses. Change isnt always a good thing, and he is not changing for the better. Companies arent hiring because taxes supposed to be going up the beginning of the year, and they are worried that they wont be able to afford to keep more employees. Hes fucking alot of companies up with the taxes hes trying to enforce.


Why I care is bc i work for a small business. When my boss tells me that he has to pay 10k every month to have 2 employees on a payroll is absolutely ridiculous. And on top of that he pays 45% of his profits towards taxes. So if it gets worse I could be fucked

im not referring to change as in obama slogan. im talking about alot of things need to be changed. the little things that america is trying to change takes soo long to get done. its like its never gonna happen. America gets sidetracked so easily by any and everything.

2 months ago it was healthcare crazy.. last month it was the war in Afghan....it seems nothing ever gets completed.

[punkr6]

http://data.getafreelancer.com/project/352100/Obama-Barack-funny.jpg

~DB4LYFE

LOL, reps...

[DB4LYFE ™]

LOL, reps...

:yes::goodjob:

~DB4LYFE

[§treet_§peed]

Now if you would refer to before the fuck stick Obama took office he said within a few months of him becoming president that he would : 1. End the war. 2. Reform health care. 3. Reform the country from it's current economy crisis. And so on and so on as the list continues..... Not saying that it's just because of his skin color but he is a good bullshitter. He pretty much pulled the shit over everyone eyes to see him as such a revolutionary when he himself knew he couldn't do half the shit he promised. So thank you America for buying into the news propaganda to claim to hate so much.

[jcs]

this man speaks the truth....

[The Creeper]

Obama is gunnna pay mah Car PAYment.

[punkr6]

Obama is gunnna pay mah Car PAYment.

lmao...:lmfao:

[StreetHazard]

Now if you would refer to before the fuck stick Obama took office he said within a few months of him becoming president that he would : 1. End the war. 2. Reform health care. 3. Reform the country from it's current economy crisis. And so on and so on as the list continues..... Not saying that it's just because of his skin color but he is a good bullshitter. He pretty much pulled the shit over everyone eyes to see him as such a revolutionary when he himself knew he couldn't do half the shit he promised. So thank you America for buying into the news propaganda to claim to hate so much.

Could you remind us of the alternatives again? and shouldn't this be posted in the "politics" section?

[91boostdgsr]

I'm doing fine right now, I have never left too much of my livelihood in the control of others, much less the U.S. government. Obviously I pay taxes and still report to a boss, but I keep my skills honed enough for (if/when) I get sick of this shit I can go somewhere else.

I will always survive and keep a roof over my head....no matter what. If I have to hustle, pimp some nasty ass bitches out at a truck stop...I will not go cold in the winter and get rained on when I sleep. Ill do whatever it takes

I don't blame anything on anybody...If I fail, I blame myself

AGREED!!! x2

[Me86Rob]

I need a job

[Naswal]

If you spend $700 billion you are expected to get some favorable results:boobies:

[Kevykev]

I'm doing fine right now, I have never left too much of my livelihood in the control of others, much less the U.S. government. Obviously I pay taxes and still report to a boss, but I keep my skills honed enough for (if/when) I get sick of this shit I can go somewhere else.

I will always survive and keep a roof over my head....no matter what. If I have to hustle, pimp some nasty ass bitches out at a truck stop...I will not go cold in the winter and get rained on when I sleep. Ill do whatever it takes

I don't blame anything on anybody...If I fail, I blame myself


This probably the most honorable statement you or anyone will post regarding anything regarding government that I will ever read on this site PERIOD!

Honestly didn't expect it from you. :cheers:

[Elbow]

OBAMA FTW. ANYONE WHO DOESN'T LIKE OBAMA WAS HOPELESS IN THE FIRST PLACE.

[Repiks]

im not referring to change as in obama slogan. im talking about alot of things need to be changed. the little things that america is trying to change takes soo long to get done. its like its never gonna happen. America gets sidetracked so easily by any and everything.

2 months ago it was healthcare crazy.. last month it was the war in Afghan....it seems nothing ever gets completed.



The jumping back and forth between issues is because of the media that got this president elected, and is not a proportinal view of what all Americans feel is important.

[Skorcher]

If you didn't vote for Obama and/or don't like any of his ideas or policies, you're obviously just racist. :rolleyes:
/sarcasm

[Bajjani]

Obama 1, America 0 (After sundays vote)

[JITB]

The jumping back and forth between issues is because of the media that got this president elected, and is not a proportinal view of what all Americans feel is important.

true..

[Bajjani]

BTW, they say actual unemployment is closer to 17%.

[punkr6]

BTW, they say actual unemployment is closer to 17%.
True...

[Jdm94Coupe]

not choosing any sides. but how many people in this thread think that unemployment wouldve got better with mccain? think the war wouldve ended? and how many think the U.S. wouldve been in a better position. I'm not choosing a side by any means, but I do feel like this was all going to happen anyway. idk about the healthcare issue because im not up 2 date on the issue at all, just hear ppl at work talking about it (while i work, lol)

[Bajjani]

not choosing any sides. but how many people in this thread think that unemployment wouldve got better with mccain? think the war wouldve ended? and how many think the U.S. wouldve been in a better position. I'm not choosing a side by any means, but I do feel like this was all going to happen anyway. idk about the healthcare issue because im not up 2 date on the issue at all, just hear ppl at work talking about it (while i work, lol)

Yes, I do think the US would be in a better position. A 1.2 trillion dollar socialist bill is not good for our country. Nor is Obama the socialist cunt.

[PSINXS]

so who was actually hoping obama would do a damn thing for this country?

i knew he was a fraud from the beginning.

but those billions should have been given to the unemployed public as funds to start businesses.

[StreetHazard]

Yes, I do think the US would be in a better position. A 1.2 trillion dollar socialist bill is not good for our country. Nor is Obama the socialist cunt.


McCain I can actually agree with as a valid choice, if he lived long enough to complete his term. Sarah Palin fucked it all up for me as a republican choice, sorry but I am sick and tired of republican fundies setting policy in this country, and intellectuals being pushed aside...I would rather have a "socialist" president if those are my options.

The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the Supreme Being as his father, in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter. - - Thomas Jefferson, letter to John Adams, April 11, 1823

but alas...you were out-voted chump, and now you have to sit and stew in it like the democrats did through Bush's term, im independent so I don't hold party loyalty. And all the republican whines and cries just fill me with giggles and glee! The more republicans kick and scream the larger my smile becomes, especially if they are fundamentalist to boot.

tell us how Obama is destroying our county
tell us how he kills unborn children
tell us how he will not support our troops overseas because he has a muslim middle name

I will smile from ear to ear

The republican elephant was slain, put down like the rampaging rabid animal it was, and the intellectuals and free thinkers of this country have been shooting blow-darts at that foul beast for years. And now the entire republican party is in disarray...the ideals that originally held true for the party were systematically dismantled with the bush regime. Now that your huge fatted calf has been slain the party is reaching for something...ANYTHING it can grasp for a handhold to stabilize and reflect this change of events.

And who does this party look too? Glenn Beck? Rush Limbaugh? and FOX news hired Dick Cheney as a pundit?...clowns, entertainers and fundamental christian mouthpieces on syndicated T.V. shows whose sole purpose is to get you riled up to hold your attention so you sit through 2 min. of advertising.

I am glad you are upset...instead of whining go do something about it!




I went door to door in this city with voting registration forms campaining for Obama, I went into upscale neighborhoods..to the shittiest ghettos in this city with those forms going door to door. Some of those neighborhoods I was terrified to go into...4 white people showing up knocking on doors with a bunch of papers looking like fucking collection agents.

But when they found out what we were doing they opened the doors wide and let us into their homes and treated us like family. Some I had ask if they were wanted, but if they already did their time in prison then they are eligible to vote...and it gave them hope they seemed to not have had in a long time. And I stand by my choice, it was the only option we had with the choices we were given.

Will I do it again in 3 years? I don't know...I need to see the options

[tony]

I'm doing fine right now, I have never left too much of my livelihood in the control of others, much less the U.S. government. Obviously I pay taxes and still report to a boss, but I keep my skills honed enough for (if/when) I get sick of this shit I can go somewhere else.

I will always survive and keep a roof over my head....no matter what. If I have to hustle, pimp some nasty ass bitches out at a truck stop...I will not go cold in the winter and get rained on when I sleep. Ill do whatever it takes

I don't blame anything on anybody...If I fail, I blame myself

TRUE conservative sentiment right there moreso than I've seen from anyone who claims to lean to the right on this board. I can't remember the last time I looked at my paycheck (or lack thereof) and blamed the President for my situation.

[81911SC]

McCain I can actually agree with as a valid choice, if he lived long enough to complete his term. Sarah Palin fucked it all up for me as a republican choice, sorry but I am sick and tired of republican fundies setting policy in this country, and intellectuals being pushed aside...I would rather have a "socialist" president if those are my options.

The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the Supreme Being as his father, in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter. - - Thomas Jefferson, letter to John Adams, April 11, 1823

but alas...you were out-voted chump, and now you have to sit and stew in it like the democrats did through Bush's term, im independent so I don't hold party loyalty. And all the republican whines and cries just fill me with giggles and glee! The more republicans kick and scream the larger my smile becomes, especially if they are fundamentalist to boot.

tell us how Obama is destroying our county
tell us how he kills unborn children
tell us how he will not support our troops overseas because he has a muslim middle name

I will smile from ear to earThis guy couldn't be serious.

[Hektik]

americans only bitch and moan about things.... were are the milllions of people sitting outside of the whitehouse protesting all the things they want to blame on others.... people need to grow a set and do something about it or learn to live with the way things are... but complaining about everything changes nothing.....

[Bajjani]

McCain I can actually agree with as a valid choice, if he lived long enough to complete his term. Sarah Palin fucked it all up for me as a republican choice, sorry but I am sick and tired of republican fundies setting policy in this country, and intellectuals being pushed aside...I would rather have a "socialist" president if those are my options.

The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the Supreme Being as his father, in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter. - - Thomas Jefferson, letter to John Adams, April 11, 1823

but alas...you were out-voted chump, and now you have to sit and stew in it like the democrats did through Bush's term, im independent so I don't hold party loyalty. And all the republican whines and cries just fill me with giggles and glee! The more republicans kick and scream the larger my smile becomes, especially if they are fundamentalist to boot.

tell us how Obama is destroying our county
tell us how he kills unborn children
tell us how he will not support our troops overseas because he has a muslim middle name

I will smile from ear to ear

The republican elephant was slain, put down like the rampaging rabid animal it was, and the intellectuals and free thinkers of this country have been shooting blow-darts at that foul beast for years. And now the entire republican party is in disarray...the ideals that originally held true for the party were systematically dismantled with the bush regime. Now that your huge fatted calf has been slain the party is reaching for something...ANYTHING it can grasp for a handhold to stabilize and reflect this change of events.

And who does this party look too? Glenn Beck? Rush Limbaugh? and FOX news hired Dick Cheney as a pundit?...clowns, and entertainers on syndicated T.V. shows whose sole purpose is to get you riled up to hold your attention so you sit through 2 min. of advertising.

I am glad you are upset...Now it is up to you to do something about it!

I don't consider myself republican or democrat, but I am definately not a socialist moron. They're killing small businesses with the new taxes and taxing the fuck out of everyone. That means costs are going to go up for goods. That means exports go down. That means the dollar gets even weaker. Its a downward trend. Go get an education please.

[StreetHazard]

I don't consider myself republican or democrat, but I am definately not a socialist moron. They're killing small businesses with the new taxes and taxing the fuck out of everyone. That means costs are going to go up for goods. That means exports go down. That means the dollar gets even weaker. Its a downward trend. Go get an education please.


do you think this is ground breaking information? I can pull up FOX news as fast as anyone.

our situation is very vast and extremely complicated, when I see different then most IMO on this is

I DO NOT PRETEND TO KNOW

I am fairly sure you are not a economy professor, nor head up a large multi-national corporation...what makes you think you have all the data and all the information about our current situation to make an informed decision?

it would be like arguing on how to put a colony on mars, you don't work for NASA and I am not an engineer.

and debating politics is like debating religion...we are not going to see eye to eye.

[Bajjani]

do you think this is ground breaking information? I can pull up FOX news as fast as anyone.

our situation is very vast and extremely complicated, when I see different then most IMO on this is

I DO NOT PRETEND TO KNOW

I am fairly sure you are not a economy professor, nor head up a large multi-national corporation...what makes you think you have all the data and all the information about our current situation to make an informed decision?

it would be like arguing on how to put a colony on mars, you don't work for NASA and I am not an engineer.

and debating politics is like debating religion...we are not going to see eye to eye.

LoL..I actually am part owner of a company that does business globally, and we own a business in Poland as well, and Brazil. And also I have inside information from the financial analyst with the REAL #s, not the shit on the news. So yes, I can make a much more informed decision than you. But way to put your foot in your mouth.

[StreetHazard]

This guy couldn't be serious.

re read my original post (it was edited), obviously I am not alone in my views, I helped get him elected...well (of course) Georgia is a red state. but still I tried

[BanginJimmy]

do you think this is ground breaking information? I can pull up FOX news as fast as anyone.

our situation is very vast and extremely complicated, when I see different then most IMO on this is

I DO NOT PRETEND TO KNOW

I am fairly sure you are not a economy professor, nor head up a large multi-national corporation...what makes you think you have all the data and all the information about our current situation to make an informed decision?

it would be like arguing on how to put a colony on mars, you don't work for NASA and I am not an engineer.

and debating politics is like debating religion...we are not going to see eye to eye.

So we should leave these decisions to someone that wasnt smart enough to figure out turbotax?

Since I CAN correctly file my taxes with turbotax, does that make me better qualified than the Sec Tres?

[StreetHazard]

So we should leave these decisions to someone that wasnt smart enough to figure out turbotax?

Since I CAN correctly file my taxes with turbotax, does that make me better qualified than the Sec Tres?


with your logic, why do we have elected officials at all? I have beat this topic to death in other forums..I am not going to bother with it here, I have said all I am going to say. Fortunately I have given a different viewpoint than what was expected.

Now feel free to bash the president and jack each other off

[Bajjani]

with your logic, why do we have elected officials at all?

Well if you are a fan of socialism, you can move out of the us. Take obama with you.

[BanginJimmy]

with your logic, why do we have elected officials at all?

Because there isnt a better option. I do think we need to make some serious changes in the way our elected officials are elected. We can start with term limits and move from there. Get rid of the career politician for good.


I dont see what this has to do with an unelected official though.

[tony]

The term socialism has been so dumbed down now that people who obviously dont comprehend the definition of socialism use it as a tool to validate right wing rhetoric.

[Total_Blender]

tell us how Obama is destroying our county
tell us how he kills unborn children
tell us how he will not support our troops overseas because he has a muslim middle name

I will smile from ear to ear

Reps! :lmfao:

[Total_Blender]

Well if you are a fan of socialism, you can move out of the us. Take obama with you.

If you don't like our government of democratically elected officials, you can move to Somalia. No government there, just sand and pirates. It's a libertarian (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angry_white_male)'s paradise. :goodjob:

[Vteckidd]

TRUE conservative sentiment right there moreso than I've seen from anyone who claims to lean to the right on this board. I can't remember the last time I looked at my paycheck (or lack thereof) and blamed the President for my situation.

BUSH? werent youi guys the same people jumping up and down about how Bush didnt care about the middle class and stole money from them to give to his rich buddies?

Guys blamed bush for EVERYTHING, now that Obama is getting some blame its "oh i wouldnt ever blame my problems on the president"

LOL

Pick a side and stick to it please.

It may not effect you yet, but talk to your buddies and friends that are in the Unemployment line or will be there shortly. Jobless claims over half a million, GDP shrunk last quarter by over 2%

No amount of spending is going to save this sorry folks. He lied in FEB with Stim 1, hes lying now.

HEALTHCARE will KILL more jobs, wait and see. we will be at 12-13% by June i can almost guarantee that. They are going to trade healthcare for your job, its coming. Taxes on the middle class, its coming.

This country is being stolen from us and theres not a damn thing you can do about it

[StreetHazard]

This country is being stolen from us and theres not a damn thing you can do about it


RAGE MORE! :lmfao::lmfao::lmfao::lmfao::lmfao:

[tony]

BUSH? werent youi guys the same people jumping up and down about how Bush didnt care about the middle class and stole money from them to give to his rich buddies?

Guys blamed bush for EVERYTHING, now that Obama is getting some blame its "oh i wouldnt ever blame my problems on the president"

LOL

Pick a side and stick to it please.

It may not effect you yet, but talk to your buddies and friends that are in the Unemployment line or will be there shortly. Jobless claims over half a million, GDP shrunk last quarter by over 2%

No amount of spending is going to save this sorry folks. He lied in FEB with Stim 1, hes lying now.

HEALTHCARE will KILL more jobs, wait and see. we will be at 12-13% by June i can almost guarantee that. They are going to trade healthcare for your job, its coming. Taxes on the middle class, its coming.

This country is being stolen from us and theres not a damn thing you can do about it

I've consistently said that I criticize Bush for his lack of leadership, with Bush I never blamed him or the government for my predicament. When my payment was sent to pay taxes I never complained.. to me it is the price we pay to play.

When the economy improves under healthcare I'm sure according to his critics it was nothing to do with Obama and somehow had something to do with Republicans. Nobody has mentioned that although unemployment is up so is GDP, a figure that many of you quoted as it pertained to Bush. But of course you only focus on one thing because pointing out a positive with Obama's name on it is a big no no.

I've said it before I'll say it again, the countries that are emerging in the 21st century cover their citizens, that is no coincidence.

[StreetHazard]

Conservatives/libertarian's are pissed off because they hate health-care reform, family planning, abortions, ending any war at all, organic gardening at the White House, and basically just government in general.

But obviously government isn't going anywhere. But you can go here :D


If you don't like our government of democratically elected officials, you can move to Somalia. No government there, just sand and pirates. It's a libertarian (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angry_white_male)'s paradise. :goodjob:

Fundamentalist Christians are upset they are watching their relevancy in american politics dwindle by every passing day that ol' Ronald Reagan helped them achieve through the 80's. that and Obama erased Bush's decision to restrict federal funding for stem-cell research, and also the fact Hussian (america's invented arch enemy) is his middle name...

and the fact he's 1/2 black

I am sure these 'ol southern georgia boys love that...ohhh I bet they do, after they have discarded their white hoods for a decent job in "trailer park management"

When they have watched their little blond haired, blue eyed Aryan love child grow up listening to Puff Daddy, Akon and Ludicris....that jungle music! And prom, and...and during prom she didn't bring home someone like herself...she brought home ONE OF THEM!...one of those....ni...ni....*** (come on say it you ignorant waste of flesh) a ni.....

Yea! that's what I thought

RAGE HARD you assholes, rage hard

[Bajjani]

*sigh* arguing with this kid is like talking to a wall. Typical Obama supporter to exaggerate every comment made. Let me guess because I didn't vote for him I'm racist also? Off to work I'll reply later if the threads still up

[StreetHazard]

why am I the only on openly admitting I support him when he won the election? and his approval rating is still over 50%?

Could it possibly have something to do with demographics? the fact that this is a southern board firmly in the bible belt and always a red state?

just an observation

[Greddypacked]

God bless the hard working soldiers and the people that defend our nation... but to the part of the government that is tearing our economy up this is for them http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DXXXVd8nK_I NWS due to language.

[csmiths]

why am I the only on openly admitting I support him when he won the election? and his approval rating is still over 50%?

Could it possibly have something to do with demographics? the fact that this is a southern board firmly in the bible belt and always a red state?

just an observation



probably because your one of the only ones who actually voted for him

[StreetHazard]

I guess so

[tony]

StreetHazard, you'll find your beating a dead horse. Those of us who voted for or support Obama get tired of having the same conversation every two weeks with the same people who come with arguments that lack substance. Its not that we are not here, we're just tired of beating the horse.

I do find it interesting that when Bush was in office if you opposed the government it was "well go move to another country," and you were labeled unpatriotic but now with Obama in office the sentiment is "we need to stand up against our government." Just an observation..

[StreetHazard]

StreetHazard, you'll find your beating a dead horse. Those of us who voted for or support Obama get tired of having the same conversation every two weeks with the same people who come with arguments that lack substance. Its not that we are not here, we're just tired of beating the horse.

I do find it interesting that when Bush was in office if you opposed the government it was "well go move to another country," and you were labeled unpatriotic but now with Obama in office the sentiment is "we need to stand up against our government." Just an observation..


I know....I said before I was going to let it go. but here I am typing clicking reply

[Vteckidd]

why am I the only on openly admitting I support him when he won the election? and his approval rating is still over 50%?

Could it possibly have something to do with demographics? the fact that this is a southern board firmly in the bible belt and always a red state?

just an observation

Prob why the same people hated bush and had no idea why.

The American population as a whole is ignorant and easy to confuse.

All they see is "free XXXXXXXX" they don't understand the consequences. I don't support Obama because I disagree with his policies. Don't give a shit if he is black white purple green or yellow

[Vteckidd]

Streethazard you seriously have no clue. Funny how only obama lovers pull the race card.

[StreetHazard]

im just saying...look at these results

it looks like the atlanta city limits is just a speck of blue in just a sea of republicans, there is a swath of blue in the middle of the state, which honestly for me is surprising

yet the results were still very close, almost 50/50 which was surprising to me as well, on election day I figured it would be closer to 60/40 for McCain.

This is the reality for a so-called liberal living in the south. and all the attacks and arguments it causes, its very tiring.

there are some things I am conservative about and some things I am liberal about...but I don't think there is a place for me as a "conservative-liberal"

[tony]

I know that exit poll shows votes by race as well.

[StreetHazard]

Streethazard you seriously have no clue. Funny how only obama lovers pull the race card.

just in case you haven't noticed in alot of instances its true, its an un-spoken reality in this country. I honestly hope it doesn't apply to anyone on this site. but in the south...in many cases, it does

im not pulling a "card" on anything, I am stating something very obvious. Go ask some other non-white people on this board about their experiences and see how clueless I am

the racism is tangible...if you do not think it influences the way someone would vote one way or the other in some way (but not the only reason) of course their are other factors involved.


but I wouldn't want to live somewhere that didn't allow these kinds of ideas to be exchanged, for good, for bad for worse...If any of this makes someone want to bash me in the face. then good! its an amazing place to be able to discuss these things.

[Vteckidd]

Obama only won by 53%. What does that mean? This country is DEEPLY divided. Its not like he won by 10% points.

All last election proved was the following:
1) The media can control the outcome
2) A lot of people who voted for Obama were voting ANTI-REPUBLICAN. It was a referendum on no more George Bush.
3) African Americans came out in more numbers than ever before and voted Obama. Whether it was purely based on race or they actually liked his policies, who really knows. All we know is they came out in historic numbers for him for some reason.
4) THe republicans have no viable candidate and are at best a fractured party.


Tony says beating the same dead horse, but its only because too many dont answer the questions posed. YOu can sit there and say only the strong emerging nations cover their citizens, but who is that?

China? England? Germany? Cuba? Canada? LOL


* 2.1 Americas
o 2.1.1 Brazil
o 2.1.2 Canada
o 2.1.3 Colombia
o 2.1.4 Mexico
o 2.1.5 Peru
o 2.1.6 Trinidad and Tobago
o 2.1.7 United States
* 2.2 Asia
o 2.2.1 Bhutan
o 2.2.2 People's Republic of China
+ 2.2.2.1 Hong Kong SAR
o 2.2.3 India
o 2.2.4 Israel
o 2.2.5 Singapore
o 2.2.6 Taiwan (Republic of China)
o 2.2.7 Thailand
* 2.3 Europe
o 2.3.1 Austria
o 2.3.2 Finland
o 2.3.3 Germany
o 2.3.4 Ireland
o 2.3.5 Netherlands
o 2.3.6 United Kingdom
+ 2.3.6.1 England
+ 2.3.6.2 Northern Ireland
+ 2.3.6.3 Scotland
+ 2.3.6.4 Wales
* 2.4 Oceania
o 2.4.1 Australia
o 2.4.2 New Zealand



I wouldnt trade AMerica for ANY of those countries. Free healthcare or not. The fact that you would even use that as a point makes me laugh, no offense.

I dont know where you guys get these GDP Numbers from it shrunk last quarter if you take out Cash For Clunkers. How can GDP Grow when we are LOSING JOBS at a rate of 500,000+ every month? Unemployment jumped almost .5% in 1 MONTH and people think this is over?

Get a clue

[Vteckidd]

The other thing is this, our deficit is approaching 2 trillion THIS YEAR ALONE, projected to be 11-13 Trillion over the next 10 years.

China knows this, the world knows we are in trouble. China is buying up all kinds of commodities to hedge their bets against a hyperinflation of the US dollar. Think about it, we hit 20% and start to pay them back with overinflated dollars. They turn around and say "hey your oil is now $1000/barrel" .

THAT IS GOING ON RIGHT NOW. CHina is buying up every Oil producer they can get their hands on. The Saudis just switched from the standard of measuring oil to get off or start to move away from the $. The $ took a huge hit yesterday as stocks rallied.

All this ties into this healthcare crap, cap n trade, etc. You are going to pass legislation that you cannot lie about , its going to raise taxes on small business which is going to KILL JOBS.

Its going to RAISE the deficit which sends a message to the rest of the world "we dont give a shit if you hold out debt, watch us spend into oblivion"

To me that is far more detrimental than Bush foreign policy

[Vteckidd]

But all you guys see is "HEY FREE HEALTHCARE! SWEET!"

MARK MY WORDS you can quote me, if they pass healthcare that requires employers to provide it or be taxed, you can trade your JOB for HEALTHCARE.

Think about how awesome it is to go to the docs office for free when you are waiting in the unemployment line.

Just sayin

[StreetHazard]

Obama only won by 53%. What does that mean? This country is DEEPLY divided. Its not like he won by 10% points.

All last election proved was the following:
1) The media can control the outcome
2) A lot of people who voted for Obama were voting ANTI-REPUBLICAN. It was a referendum on no more George Bush.
3) African Americans came out in more numbers than ever before and voted Obama. Whether it was purely based on race or they actually liked his policies, who really knows. All we know is they came out in historic numbers for him for some reason.
4) THe republicans have no viable candidate and are at best a fractured party.




I completely agree with all of this, everything else, and the numbers...I am not nostradamus and everything has yet to play out and we will see.

maybe in 3 years there will be a good leader that will come up as a libertarian/conservative/independant something or another, that many people can get behind.

until then, bitch away

[bigdare23]

Like Tony said, this is beating a dead horse. (Some) Americans will rather see the USA crash and burn before succeed under Obama just to be able to say "told ya so". It's funny how many people became "politicians" and "economist" since Obama became a presidential candidate. It's funny how many people became "informed" this election. I wonder why?!? Then when someone uses race as the reason people get all offended and say the "race card" is being used (but that's off the topic). Everyone wants to be a critic, but no one has a better solution. I have the mentality "put up or shut up." If you can't come up with a solution, what gives you the right to be a critic? And if you have a solution, I better see your name on some ballet in the near future.

If you research history, some of the most criticized people became the most influential people to walk this earth, and plenty of nations grew exponentially after they reached their lowest points. But that's because they unified and worked together for a common cause unlike what we Americans are doing. Too many people are too selfish and are only concerned about themselves. Like Tony said before, the term "socialist" is used so loosely now that people have forgotten the true definition. Anyways I'm done with my rant. I believe whoever was elected (Obama, McCain, Jesus,...) would have to deal with the current economic situation. The economy stated to decline well before Obama became elected, and no one man could could prevent it or steer it into the right direction in this limited amount of time. So to give the blame to Obama is not fair (even though I doubt you are worry about what's fair or not since you are blaming him in the first place). I look at it like this, you judge a president based on what he DID during his WHOLE term, not what's going on during the time when he's first elected.

[Vteckidd]

No one is rooting for him to fail. I want him to succeed but im also not stupid.

Thats what so funny to me, people were condemning Bush before he even made a decision. Now under Obama if anyone even thinks about arguing a point its "you want the president to fail" or "youre unpatriotic".

Facts are facts and numbers are numbers. Name me one time Keynesian Economics has EVER WORKED. Name me one nation that is BETTER than US in terms of its citizens, quality of life, cost of goods, WEALTH etc that has FREE UNIVERSAL HEALTHCARE.

Like always im waiting.

You can post fuzzy feel good stories all you want, or talk about how i love Glenn Beck and Faux news and do whatever else it is you liberals like to make fun of people that dont like Obama.

In the end it will all be the same

[Vteckidd]

The economy stated to decline well before Obama became elected, and no one man could could prevent it or steer it into the right direction in this limited amount of time. So to give the blame to Obama is not fair

Ok ill bite. Economy was on a downturn mainly spurred by the housing decline which was caused by..............ding ding ding Barney Frank and the DEMS who passed the Community Reinvestment Act back in Carters time.

Sure Bush kept interest rates artifically low and there is some blame for that. But the BULK of it was Barney Frank and friends.

No one expects Obama to get us out in 6 months, im not naive. But passing what hes passing and SPENDING US into oblivion doesnt help thats for damn sure.

I mean are you dumb? you know that if you cut a main artery you cant stop the bleeding with a normal bandaid. Thats common knowlede, but are you going to try it anyway and "hope for the best and see it through" maybe this time it will be different?

[StreetHazard]

I like the term "armchair economist" better

[Vteckidd]

I like the term "armchair economist" better

I think i qualify more than most people considering i own my own small business and ive prob read more books on the subject than i can care to list.

I was also a business major in college.

I deal direct with overseas companies that manufacture my goods so i know how the economy is effecting them as well.

I mean im not harvard educated. But to try and sit there and not even be able to argue with me and say I DONT know what im talking about is laughable.

[StreetHazard]

I think i qualify more than most people considering i own my own small business and ive prob read more books on the subject than i can care to list.

I was also a business major in college.

I deal direct with overseas companies that manufacture my goods so i know how the economy is effecting them as well.

I mean im not harvard educated. But to try and sit there and not even be able to argue with me and say I DONT know what im talking about is laughable.


then what is the solution? you have my attention

[Vteckidd]

im not going to sit here and say im right, but ill tell you what:

IN a recession i would

1) Cut Taxes on small business, or offer some incentive for them to hire new workers. Somehow find a way to LOWER their overhead, not increase it.

2) First time homebuyers credit was a great idea, i agree with that.

3) Cash 4 Clunkers would be a great idea if we didnt own 80% of GM and depended upon them making a profit to get our money back. Cash 4 Clunkers for only AMERICAN cars would have been the better bet, but that prob would have pissed off most of the foreign car makers. Oh well.

4) STOP SPENDING. Healthcare needs reform, but BABY STEPS, not a whole new system that they cant possibly run correctly. Cap and Trade, dont do it. DRILL for oil offshore. Becoming independent on oil consumption alone would spur us out of this recession. Invest in stuff that CREATES jobs and stimulates the private sector. Not pass bullshit stimulus packages that create short term work YEARS from now.

5) LET BUSINESSES FAIL. I would have let GM go under, and had someone else buy them out. When businesses run their companies into the ground, let them go, someone will step in and pick them up and make them more efficient. We would have suffered a lot more pain but for a much shorter amount of time IMO.

6) LEGALIZE MARIJUANA. That industry spurred billions in revenue/profit for california. I dont smoke personally, but im on the bandwagon of its no worse than alcohol. legalizing it would spur new companies, new jobs, and a huge amount of tax revenue for the fed govt.

7) Drop capital gains tax rate for 5 years. Encourage foreign companies to build factories over here. We are long past the point of producing out own goods anymore, so we need other companies to come HERE and do it, and not go to China.

8) Pay down the national debt, i dont care how, but someway.


thats it for now

[StreetHazard]

you win...VtecKidd for pres! :D I would vote for you off this alone

6) LEGALIZE MARIJUANA. That industry spurred billions in revenue/profit for california. I dont smoke personally, but im on the bandwagon of its no worse than alcohol. legalizing it would spur new companies, new jobs, and a huge amount of tax revenue for the fed govt.

[Greddypacked]

To much money went to Bailouts. All that money they used on bailouts they should of gave to American people to distribute effeciently and everyone equally puts out money back in the economy.

[GirlieZ]

To much money went to Bailouts. All that money they used on bailouts they should of gave to American people to distribute effeciently and everyone equally puts out money back in the economy.

Or instead pay off the country's debt?

If the American ppl wanted to keep money in their pockets they would have voted Republican

[StreetHazard]

To much money went to Bailouts. All that money they used on bailouts they should of gave to American people to distribute effeciently and everyone equally puts out money back in the economy.


never ever, ever would that happen....it makes too much sense

that would be like the landowner giving his starving farmers some of the potatoes he harvested.

never ever would that happen, that farmer would starve to death before that happened.

[BobbyFresco]

Or instead pay off the country's debt?

If the American ppl wanted to keep money in corporation's pockets they would have voted Republican


Fixed.

[Greddypacked]

never ever, ever would that happen....it makes too much sense

that would be like the landowner giving his starving farmers some of the potatoes he harvested.

never ever would that happen, that farmer would starve to death before that happened.

Well if Revolutionary, and constitution parties start forming out of control they may do that lol. To many people are dealing w/ poverty over the governments bad decision making.

[GirlieZ]

Fixed.

I take it your for lowering our country's healthcare standards as well? socalist! :p

[Vteckidd]

Fixed.

Under Bush, i would agree.

Trickle down may not be the best, but i dont really know any other system that would be better.

The numbers over history speak for itself, the more the "rich" make the lower our unemployment.

you cant demonize wall street and business when you need them to hire people in the first place.

Thats like talking shit about your doctor before he operates on you

[tony]

Thats what so funny to me, people were condemning Bush before he even made a decision. Now under Obama if anyone even thinks about arguing a point its "you want the president to fail" or "youre unpatriotic".



The difference is people didn't start harshly criticizing bush till well into his 2nd term, not the 10th month. Critics of Bush gave him a chance, I did because I voted for him twice and he was a dissapointment plain and simple.

[tony]

Ok ill bite. Economy was on a downturn mainly spurred by the housing decline which was caused by..............ding ding ding Barney Frank and the DEMS who passed the Community Reinvestment Act back in Carters time.

Sure Bush kept interest rates artifically low and there is some blame for that. But the BULK of it was Barney Frank and friends.

No one expects Obama to get us out in 6 months, im not naive. But passing what hes passing and SPENDING US into oblivion doesnt help thats for damn sure.

I mean are you dumb? you know that if you cut a main artery you cant stop the bleeding with a normal bandaid. Thats common knowlede, but are you going to try it anyway and "hope for the best and see it through" maybe this time it will be different?


Are you kidding? The housing boom was the fault of Dems? See this is what I'm talking about with bipartisanship being a waste of time, its delusional statements like that one. A child could put A + B together, the administation KNEW these balloon mortgages were going to come to a head and it was the result of deregulation. Its amazing when this stuff comes from a certain few of you on this board the Republicans never had anything to do with the downturn but everything to do with positive news couldn't be done without repubs.

Armchair economist, Streethazard.. i couldn't have said it better.

[tony]

To much money went to Bailouts. All that money they used on bailouts they should of gave to American people to distribute effeciently and everyone equally puts out money back in the economy.

1 word.. inflation. Investing in infrastructure would be smarter, (i.e, alternative energy)

[StreetHazard]

I take it your for lowering our country's healthcare standards as well? socalist! :p

its kind of like if you have a really sick parent with terminal cancer, and all the other treatments haven't worked...someone shows up and offers you something new. If you do nothing and say no your parent will die. Would you not stop and listen to what this person has too offer? or possibly let them try it?

the heathcare in this country is a disaster...no one even hardly attempted to raise it as a very serious issue until our current president actually stood up and did something...ANYTHING about it.

I am going to let him try it

[tony]

Hillary Clinton tried, she was shot down. Obama is the first one to take it this far.

[Vteckidd]

Do I really need to go pull all the vids of Barney frank and his cronies saying fannie and Freddie were fine?

Or the cspan vids of the republicans in 2001 and earlier arguing that the books were cooked and we were in trouble but Barney said nope we are fine

are you that delusional?

No republicans got sweetheart deals from Fannie and Freddie or countrywide wonder why.....

The republicans fault was trusting the fed and lowering interest rates artificially to keepis out of a recession after 9/11. But sorry the majority of the housing crisis lies at the dems doorstep. They created this home for everyone and bullied banks to lend or face going out of business

ask jamiecbr about it

[tony]

So Fannie May and Freddie Mac controlled ALL of those mortgage companies? Countrywide? Indymac, AIG, Homebanc.. and the list goes on. 2 entities did not cause an entire economic meltdown, bad fiscal policy did and the Bush administration can shoulder much of that blame. C'mon Mike, you said you've read books on economics if that is the case you should know Freddie Mac and Fannie May represented only a fraction of what happened to the economy.. it takes something so much more than them two alone to have such a drastic outcome.

[StreetHazard]

:D

[BABY J]

I'm laughing at all of you dorks who haven't figured out SHIT yet about the Presidency, the nation, simple economics, national/global economics. The shit that's posted in this thread I can get a 1st year college student to come in here and make you look dumb.

I'll help you all out. What has politics FIXED (totally eradicated) since you all have been alive. Put a list together please.

[StreetHazard]

in ^ ^ ^

created legal equality for race, gender and sexual orientation (not in my life time but say in the last 50 years or so) politics move slowly

[Bajjani]

Vtec, 1 suggestion that was offered to help inspire jobs was cut taxes on new employees for 2 years, then in 2 years when the economy is predicted to turn around, they'd go back to paying. This would inspire new jobs, more people would have money to spend and money would go back to being circulated.

[StreetHazard]

Vtec, 1 suggestion that was offered to help inspire jobs was cut taxes on new employees for 2 years, then in 2 years when the economy is predicted to turn around, they'd go back to paying. This would inspire new jobs, more people would have money to spend and money would go back to being circulated.


this is like wishing a unicorn would show up to take me home from work.

new employee's not paying taxes.....pffffft your dreaming

ANYONE not paying taxes will get the large boot of uncle sam right up the ass

[Bajjani]

this is like wishing a unicorn would show up to take me home from work.

new employee's not paying taxes.....pffffft your dreaming

ANYONE not paying taxes will get the large boot of uncle sam right up the ass

Wow, fuckstick. I'm talking about the COMPANYS paying taxes on the employee. Do you know how payroll taxes work, I'm just curious?

Btw, I did the math on how much the insurance bill is going to change the insurance cost of my company. 1.5million a year.

[StreetHazard]

Employers who do not pay withheld payroll taxes to the U.S. government for employees are assessed a Trust Fund Recovery Penalty by the IRS. The Trust Fund Recovery Penalty is assessed to individuals determined to be responsible by a 4180 Interview for the missing taxes and can be those who willfully do not collect, account for, or pay the taxes. These individuals can be business owners, officers, or employees. The penalty is for 100% of taxes owed plus interest.

[StreetHazard]

Wow, fuckstick. I'm talking about the COMPANYS paying taxes on the employee. Do you know how payroll taxes work, I'm just curious?

Btw, I did the math on how much the insurance bill is going to change the insurance cost of my company. 1.5million a year.


and why are you so angry fella? did someone get sand in your pussy?

[Bajjani]

Employers who do not pay withheld payroll taxes to the U.S. government for employees are assessed a Trust Fund Recovery Penalty by the IRS. The Trust Fund Recovery Penalty is assessed to individuals determined to be responsible by a 4180 Interview for the missing taxes and can be those who willfully do not collect, account for, or pay the taxes. These individuals can be business owners, officers, or employees. The penalty is for 100% of taxes owed plus interest.

I don't think you are understanding what I'm saying, let me try again.

One idea on how to try to help cut the unemployment problem is give companys a tax break on new employees for payroll taxes for two years. Not have companys just stop paying taxes, god damn the fact you couldn't gather that much information out of what I said is amazing, stop talking please.

The last post I replied to you kept saying asshole this shit talk that, so I called you a fuckstick. Fuckstick.

[StreetHazard]

did I hurt your feelings? :cry:

[Bajjani]

did I hurt your feelings? :cry:

No, you're just annoying and ignorant.

[StreetHazard]

awwww I did...I did hurt your feelings because now your calling me names

you are adorable

[Bajjani]

awwww I did...I did your your feelings because now your calling me names

you are adorable

Umm, logic /fail

[tony]

Yall do realize that tax cuts are a form of government spending right? Ever wonder why the deficeit surged under Reagan and although he stated "no new taxes" George H.W Bush was forced to raise taxes? Because its passing the buck, eventually those taxes will have to be paid in one way or another. An economy that's grows under a tax cut is no different than the housing boom, lifes good till that mortgage defaults.

[Bajjani]

Yall do realize that tax cuts are a form of government spending right? Ever wonder why the deficeit surged under Reagan and although he stated "no new taxes" George H.W Bush was forced to raise taxes? Because its passing the buck, eventually those taxes will have to be paid in one way or another. An economy that's grows under a tax cut is no different than the housing boom, lifes good till that mortgage defaults.

Okay well, figure this. Since you call it a tax CUT.

Do me a favor, lets make this REALLLLY simple. If 20% of the people are unemployed, they generate no form of payroll tax, they spend less money because they have no money, so sales tax is gone, and less money gets circulated, right?

Well if they cut payroll tax for on company side for 2 years, they earn 50% of the payroll taxes, they stimulate growth, and they make more money. As opposed to a constant downward trend.

Soooo
Make sense?

[tony]

Okay well, figure this. Since you call it a tax CUT.

Do me a favor, lets make this REALLLLY simple. If 20% of the people are unemployed, they generate no form of payroll tax, they spend less money because they have no money, so sales tax is gone, and less money gets circulated, right?

Well if they cut payroll tax for on company side for 2 years, they earn 50% of the payroll taxes, they stimulate growth, and they make more money. As opposed to a constant downward trend.

Soooo
Make sense?

What is to keep the company with a tax cut from pocketing that cut instead of hiring? Even corporations that received TARP are giving bonuses to execs but how many job listings are they posting?

Ill make it simple for you, me cutting your business taxes does not make an immediate impact like investing that money in infrastructure. Roads don't get built without workers, and everyone knows we need to invest in energy source that lessen our dependency and provide jobs that cannot be outsourced. That is the kind of investment that provides a return. I'm on my blackberry but investment in healthcare is just as important.

[Bajjani]

What is to keep the company with a tax cut from pocketing that cut instead of hiring? Even corporations that received TARP are giving bonuses to execs but how many job listings are they posting?

Ill make it simple for you, me cutting your business taxes does not make an immediate impact like investing that money in infrastructure. Roads don't get built without workers, and everyone knows we need to invest in energy source that lessen our dependency and provide jobs that cannot be outsourced. That is the kind of investment that provides a return. I'm on my blackberry but investment in healthcare is just as important.

Healthcare needs changes, I'll agree. What it doesn't need is to be designed as if we lived in a socialist economy, we don't, I don't want to pay for someone's healthcare who sits on their fucking ass all day not doing shit.

And no, the tax cut would be for new hires, as in, they have to prove they are a legitimate new hire.

[tony]

Healthcare needs changes, I'll agree. What it doesn't need is to be designed as if we lived in a socialist economy, we don't, I don't want to pay for someone's healthcare who sits on their fucking ass all day not doing shit.

And no, the tax cut would be for new hires, as in, they have to prove they are a legitimate new hire.

Whats a socialist economy? Please do enlighten me.

[zspeed24]

1 word.. inflation. Investing in infrastructure would be smarter, (i.e, alternative energy)

Doesn't work they tried this in Japan.

[zspeed24]

its kind of like if you have a really sick parent with terminal cancer, and all the other treatments haven't worked...someone shows up and offers you something new. If you do nothing and say no your parent will die. Would you not stop and listen to what this person has too offer? or possibly let them try it?

the heathcare in this country is a disaster...no one even hardly attempted to raise it as a very serious issue until our current president actually stood up and did something...ANYTHING about it.

I am going to let him try it

What exactly is wrong with it? Besides the fact its not FREE.

[tony]

Doesn't work they tried this in Japan.

We've done it here, look into the Federal Aid Highway act or how the Alaskan Pipeline has affected the loca economy. The resources and the amount of land we have differs greatly from that of Japan.

[Vteckidd]

What is to keep the company with a tax cut from pocketing that cut instead of hiring? Even corporations that received TARP are giving bonuses to execs but how many job listings are they posting?

Ill make it simple for you, me cutting your business taxes does not make an immediate impact like investing that money in infrastructure. Roads don't get built without workers, and everyone knows we need to invest in energy source that lessen our dependency and provide jobs that cannot be outsourced. That is the kind of investment that provides a return. I'm on my blackberry but investment in healthcare is just as important.



There we go again you can't legislate how people spend their own money. What's to stop them? Generally speaking people that make money continue to want to make money by expanding , investing on equipment, hiring new people , etc

infrastructure is fine nothing wrong with that but at best those jobs last 5 years. Then what? You can't have a workforce of construction workers. Seriously that's your answer? Fix and build roads?

I agree we need to lessen dependence on oil

[StreetHazard]

1 word.. inflation. Investing in infrastructure would be smarter, (i.e, alternative energy)

:goodjob:




I agree we need to lessen dependence on oil

[Vteckidd]

Oh and infrastructure jobs usually pertain to govt funded jobs. I'd rather not have a workforce dependant upon how much money the govt spends to employ them

private sector is better

[zspeed24]

We've done it here, look into the Federal Aid Highway act or how the Alaskan Pipeline has affected the loca economy. The resources and the amount of land we have differs greatly from that of Japan.



infrastructure is fine nothing wrong with that but at best those jobs last 5 years. Then what? You can't have a workforce of construction workers. Seriously that's your answer? Fix and build roads?

Vteckidd answered before i had the chance.

[tony]

Vteckidd answered before i had the chance.

Both of you really think it would take 5 years to be at least 70% energy independent? Furthermore you don't feel those jobs would be self sustaining, it isn't a 5 year deal and then the energy creates itself, that is an ongoing process.

Problem is gas prices are under $3 so there isn't a sense of urgency for alternative fuels.

[BABY J]

Oh and infrastructure jobs usually pertain to govt funded jobs. I'd rather not have a workforce dependant upon how much money the govt spends to employ them

private sector is better

This is the same thing these days. A private (publicly traded) company bids on a job, they win. Yet it's funded by the Gov.

Enter Northrop, Lockheed, SAIC, Mitre, etc.

[tony]

Oh and infrastructure jobs usually pertain to govt funded jobs. I'd rather not have a workforce dependant upon how much money the govt spends to employ them

private sector is better

Much like Blackwater in Iraq right? How is that going? Military is government funded, you don't see civilians manning F15's do you? This idea the government is the base of all evil is dumbfounded, government can work it is leadership that fails.

[tony]

This is the same thing these days. A private (publicly traded) company bids on a job, they win. Yet it's funded by the Gov.

Enter Northrop, Lockheed, SAIC, Mitre, etc.

exactly right

[Vteckidd]

You can't compare defense military contractors with construction workers lol.

Tony I said building roads I didn't say 5 years to be without dependence on foreign oil. Sure let's do renewable energy. Pick one. Hydrogen , ethanol, solar, wind. Nobody knows what's the best

oil is here and we can get some at the cost of a few carribous.

[BABY J]

You can't compare defense military contractors with construction workers lol.

Tony I said building roads I didn't say 5 years to be without dependence on foreign oil. Sure let's do renewable energy. Pick one. Hydrogen , ethanol, solar, wind. Nobody knows what's the best

oil is here and we can get some at the cost of a few carribous.

If it's a Fed program to build anything they will use the lowest bidder process that they already do. RED HORSE would not be building this infra. It would be a private sector company bidding on a gov funded program.

[1SICKLEX]

There needs to be a fundamental change in the way Americans work and I mean work together instead of trying to fuck over and over and over
-their loved ones
-their neighbors
-their employees
-their employers
-their friends
-their church

Greed is GOOD it drives innovation. Greed can get BAD when you manipulate the system for your personal benefit. This is bigger than taxes, America is a country that just wants to SPEND SPEND SPEND and we have completely lost touch of our manufacturing base. We believe we are entitled to cheap energy but we don't want to build refineries, drill or have alternative methods. Everyone wants to work in a cubicle and make 100 grand a year. People think they "deserve" things and are "owed" things instead of working hard for them.

We are so busy bitching about the other guy and the other side, we are not taking responsibility for our actions and our sides actions.

What the financial sector did was incomprehensible. The smart guys stopped being doctors and lawyers and went to Wall Street. They figured out how to make the computer make you money no matter what. EVERYONE was involved...

-homes didn't become homes. They became something to 'flip"
-the FED lowered rates to have more loans
-banks loaned more and more on bullshit computer models
-people overpaid and bought things they could NOT afford
-local governments wanting more tax revenue appraised homes at high values that made no sense
-financial sector bet on all these loans and debt swaps
-there was NO REGULATION and if someone did say "hey this balloon is going to blow" they were told STFU or fired.


As for taxes, look I am no fan of Reaganomics, the national debt increased under him greatly. BUT I MUCH RATHER PAY LESS TAX AND HAVE THE NATIONAL DEBT INCREASE THAN PAY MORE TAX AND HAVE THE NATIONAL DEBT INCREASE.

The bottom line is Bush AND Obama should have told all those companies to GO TO FUCKING HELL instead of bailing them out. Let Capitalism take its course. The banks and people doing the right thing should have benefited. Instead they got nothing while companies that got bailed out, won again.

Over and over again, gains are privatized, losses are socialized.

The FED is a corrupt system along with the banking system. If you read how it started and what they have done throughout history you would puke.


As for the unemployment rate that shit is closer to 20%. It doesn't factor in those that work PT and gave up looking for full time. It doesn't factor in those that no longer qualify for unemployment benefits. It doesn't factor those that are not looking or stopped looking for work.

Don't fret though, this is also a great time for opportunity!