Lets Talk Carburetor's

[FasTech]

I've been doing some reading up on the ES1 and ES2 motors for the Honda Accord. I have an ES2 in my '85 and I'm in need of another carb and I'm trying to see what would be the best deal for alittle more power.

*The ES2, came with a standard 3 barrel carb for a total of 86hp and 99tq.

*The ES1 came with the dual side draft carb's for a total of 100hp and 104tq.

*I found a Weber 32/36DGEV carb but I can't find any hp & tq ratings with that carb.

*I also find some stuff on 3geez's.com about using another kind of Weber carb. I believe it was something like a 38?! I believe. It has the manual choke unlike the 32/36 that has the electric choke.

I'm not trying to build a race car, I'm just trying to find something that will be alittle more responsive. As in throttle and top end. I also wouldn't mind maybe it being alittle better on gas. Which would the better deal? I'm not going to go with the stock 3 barrel, just posted it up comparing. I figured even if I have to spend a few extra $$$ on one or the other, it'll be worth it in the long run.


My Questions:
#1. Which would I need to go with?
#2. Do you know of any other carb's for my engine?
#3. If so to #2, what would I need to mount it?
#4. Which would be better, a manual or electric choke?


Once again, thanks IA old school'ers. :goodjob:

[quickdodge®]

I'm putting the Weber 32/36 for the Accord on my Civic. Better gas mileage and a bit more performance for under $300. I believe most people will tell you Weber. Later, QD.

[Sammich]

I'M NOT SAVVY ON CARB'S...OR TOO MUCH FUEL MANAGEMENT PERIOD, BUT I'VE SEEN ALOT OF SATISFIED PEOPLE ON THE YOTASCENE FORUMS THAT HAVE USED THE WEBER ON THEIR 22R/20R CARB'D MOTORS.

I BELIEVE THE 32/36 IS BETTER ON GAS THAN THE 38 IF I REMEMBER CORRECTLY THOUGH

[FasTech]

I'm putting the Weber 32/36 for the Accord on my Civic. Better gas mileage and a bit more performance for under $300. I believe most people will tell you Weber. Later, QD.


Were did you find one for under $300? Everywhere I found was atleast $350 or higher. Also, do you know anything of this Weber 38? Alot of people pver there were talking pretty good about.

[FasTech]

I BELIEVE THE 32/36 IS BETTER ON GAS THAN THE 38 IF I REMEMBER CORRECTLY THOUGH



Which would be better for power. Even if I have to lose alittle gas mileage for alittle extra hp, I wouldn't mind.

[Sammich]

I THINK THE 38 GIVES MORE HP...BUT FROM WHAT I REMEMBER (MY MEMORY IS FUBBERED) IT DOES USE MORE GAS, HOW MUCH MORE, I'M NOT SURE. BUT IF UR NOT TOO WORRIED ABOUT GAS MILEAGE DO THE 38

[FasTech]

I THINK THE 38 GIVES MORE HP...BUT FROM WHAT I REMEMBER (MY MEMORY IS FUBBERED) IT DOES USE MORE GAS, HOW MUCH MORE, I'M NOT SURE. BUT IF UR NOT TOO WORRIED ABOUT GAS MILEAGE DO THE 38



Yeah.. I want to do alittle more reading up on everything before I make a solid decision. But if I can get alittle more hp out of the 38, I'll more than likely go with that one.

[Sammich]

I WOULD LIKE TO LEARN ABOUT CARB'S EVEN THOUGH I PROBABLY WONT GO BACK TO ONE UNLESS I OWN ANOTHER 84-88 TOYOTA P/U OR C10 CHEVY. POST UP ANY FIRM INFO U FIND IF U DONT MIND.

[Total_Blender]

As far as Webers go... you can get rebuildable clones from pull-a-part for like $12. By clones I mean the Holley 5200 and Carter-Motorcraft versions built under license for domestics.

I snagged a Carter-Motorcraft carb from an Escort for the 2v conversion on my Falcon. Pretty much the same thing as a DGV, and you can see where it says "license from Weber, Italy" on the front of the fuel bowl.

It ran well on it, the electric choke was great and I liked the shut-off solenoid. But the threads on the jets were screwed up (they had been staked for some reason :crazy:) so I ended up scrapping it and going back to 1v.

http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l314/erose999/webercarb003.jpg?t=1254502764

I think this one was 32/34, but there were some other cars (Pinto; Vega?) that came with the 32/36.

I'm going to be trying one of these again soon :goodjob:

[HypnoToad]

i think u need a holly 750 and tunnel ram

[AltimaCharlie]

i think the 32/36 has secondaries, where the 38 is wide open all the time. so worse gas milage, and no real gain, cuz you can floor the 32/36 and open the secondaries. so basically worse milage even when your cruising. i'd go with the 32/36.

[FasTech]

I WOULD LIKE TO LEARN ABOUT CARB'S EVEN THOUGH I PROBABLY WONT GO BACK TO ONE UNLESS I OWN ANOTHER 84-88 TOYOTA P/U OR C10 CHEVY. POST UP ANY FIRM INFO U FIND IF U DONT MIND.



Will do, homie.


Charlie: Thanks for the helping info. :goodjob:

[FasTech]

Well I have another question... could I just take a carb off the ES1 motor, and just build it?

[Total_Blender]

i think the 32/36 has secondaries, where the 38 is wide open all the time. so worse gas milage, and no real gain, cuz you can floor the 32/36 and open the secondaries. so basically worse milage even when your cruising. i'd go with the 32/36.


All of the Webers have secondaries, its the progressives that you are thinking about where you can floor it and open it up. Progressives are the ones where the primary venturi is smaller than the secondary (as in 32/36). As far as sustained highway cruising I would think economy would be the same as the throttle will be wide open on both of them. Its the city driving where you go in and out of throttle and you do a lot of idling where you'd see a difference.

As far as a CVCC engine is concerned, a Weber is a tradeoff for fuel economy and efficiency anyway because you don't have the 3rd venturi to work the CVCC chamber. Someone on the 1g Honda board said that Oscar Jackson himself would still do a performance jetting on the CVCC carbs for a price, but this was a few years ago. Not sure if there was a Canadian non-CVCC head to fit the later EK/ES series engines, but that might be worth looking into...

[BABY J]

http://www.mallenalley.com/

Go by the shop - don't just call and yap on the phone. You will be a LIFETIME customer if you do.

/thread

[FasTech]

Someone on the 1g Honda board said that Oscar Jackson himself would still do a performance jetting on the CVCC carbs for a price, but this was a few years ago. Not sure if there was a Canadian non-CVCC head to fit the later EK/ES series engines, but that might be worth looking into...



Do you have any more info on this??

[BABY J]

^^ You're trying WAYY too hard man. There is a local resource already --- I have pointed you in the right direction. Stop by Adam's shop.

[oldcorolla]

Another Idea would be to find a set of motorcycle carbs and jet them accordingly , should give you better throttle response and maybe a few horsepower also if you can get them jetted right.

[Total_Blender]

Do you have any more info on this??

I remember seeing posts about it on the 1st gen Honda forums back in 1999 or so. One of the OG's on that forum like Adrian, Richard, or Don would probably be able to tell you more.

If you know what you're doing, you can also do performance jetting yourself, by drilling out the jets in small increments. I am pretty sure thats what Jackson does/did. The brass used for jets is really soft, you can drill it just working a bit back and forth between your fingers. I wouldn't mess with it myself unless I had tuning equipment to measure a/f ratios and such so you can tell where you're rich/lean.

Carb jet drill/reamer set:
http://ezbore.net/0066.pdf

I am not sure if you can get just the jets from Honda or not. I would think you could just go to pull-a-part and yank a bunch of jets from CVCC carbs and drill them however you need them. Or you might luck out and find that the CVCC carb jets are the same as something common like a VW beetle.

[FasTech]

^^ You're trying WAYY too hard man. There is a local resource already --- I have pointed you in the right direction. Stop by Adam's shop.



Well, when I'm up that way, I will stop by. But I live in Macon so its a drive for me, not exactly local. lolol.



And I apperciate all the others responses. :goodjob: