Joe Wilson incident, discuss.

[AirMax95]

Ok, here we go. I know this is ImportAtlanta.com, but this is the Politics section. There has not been a thread about Rep. Joe Wilson, R-South Carolina. Since his heckling of the President of our country, there has been surrounding controversy as to his motives, background, and whether or not race played a part in it.

How do you feel about it? Do you interrupt and yell at the President because you disagree with him?

Please keep the nonsense to a minimum (just try please:rolleyes:).


Being that he is an active, supporting member of Sons of Confederate Veterans, do you feel that he is an undercover racist? The Southern Poverty Law Center has been following the organization for sometime now and the intel paints a scary picture.

"This is an organization that, as the SPLC has detailed assiduously, has been taken over in the past decade by radical neo-Confederates who favor secession and defend slavery as a benign institution. Leading the takeover is a radical racist named Kirk Lyons, who's been an important legal figure on the far right for some years. "

[Justin51982]

I don't think race has anything to do with it. He called Obama a liar because Obama IS a liar.

Him being involved in groups that preserves his heiritage have nothing to do with him being a racist.

I made a donation to his campaign.

[LizBiz]

Him being involved in groups that preserves his heritage have nothing to do with him being a racist. THANK YOU!!!! I wish everyone could understand that. Just because we (Black/African-Americans) want to have groups that "preserve our heritage" has nothing to do with us being racist. You said it!!!!! :D

[Justin51982]

THANK YOU!!!! I wish everyone could understand that. Just because we (Black/African-Americans) want to have groups that "preserve our heritage" has nothing to do with us being racist. You said it!!!!! :D

someone had to :) :cheers:

[Total_Blender]

Heckling is just disrespectful and uncivilized.

That being said, if I were Obama, I'd pick a Republican congressman or a pundit from Fox News and challenge them to a duel on the South Lawn. If we're going back to the raucous politics of the early 19th century, we might as well have another Burr-Hamilton style duel.

[Justin51982]

Heckling is just disrespectful and uncivilized.

So is lying to the nation

[zspeed24]

He was out of line, but with that being said i think we can all see that illegals may not be covered in this plan but its undeniable that they are given assisted or free health care already be it by defrauding the medicaid system or by the hospitals being unable to turn away any patient regardless of their citizenship and just writing off what costs are incurred. And we all know this won't change.

[Total_Blender]

You already pay for the indigent care given to illegals at emergency rooms in the added cost to your health insurance. When they "write off the costs" where do you think that money goes?

Having a plan that would standardize the minimum amount of care and who gets stuck with the costs for that care would be a step in the right direction. If we actually had a "guest worker" type of program, we could place a surcharge on those who hire illegal immigrants that could cover their minimum care requirements.

[Total_Blender]

So is lying to the nation

Everyone has their panties in a wad about what Kanye did at the VMA's, but really Joe Wilson is playing on the same level. The man has no class.

[AirMax95]

This guy voted against Veteran healthcare.......

[btstone]

what he did was very disrespectful. yes, he may not agree with obama but he should let him speak.
obama is looking dumb enough as it is. he has become a used car salesman with these healthcare pitches.

there was no need to make himself look dumb by yelling during the mans speach. although barrack obama merrits no respect, the position he holds does. therefore we should repsect it

[David88vert]

what he did was very disrespectful. yes, he may not agree with obama but he should let him speak.
obama is looking dumb enough as it is. he has become a used car salesman with these healthcare pitches.

there was no need to make himself look dumb by yelling during the mans speach. although barrack obama merrits no respect, the position he holds does. therefore we should repsect it

x2

[David88vert]

Being that he is an active, supporting member of Sons of Confederate Veterans, do you feel that he is an undercover racist? The Southern Poverty Law Center has been following the organization for sometime now and the intel paints a scary picture.

"This is an organization that, as the SPLC has detailed assiduously, has been taken over in the past decade by radical neo-Confederates who favor secession and defend slavery as a benign institution. Leading the takeover is a radical racist named Kirk Lyons, who's been an important legal figure on the far right for some years. "


Sons of Confederate Veterans is not a racist organization. I know of a forum member that is a member, and he definitely cannot be considered racist in any fashion. Neither can his father who has been in SCV all his life.

Most of the time, SCV seems to be focused on discovering and preserving gravesites, and reenacting battles. Slavery was part of the later half of the Civil War, but the Civil War was not started over slavery.

[Total_Blender]

. although barrack obama merrits no respect, the position he holds does. therefore we should repsect it

http://memegenerator.net/Instances/675/Advice-President-COOL-STORY-BRO.jpg

[Total_Blender]

Slavery was part of the later half of the Civil War, but the Civil War was not started over slavery.

I will agree with you that slavery wasn't the main cause of the civil war (it was one among many such as tariff disputes, etc) but to say that it was "part of the latter half" of the civil war is stretching it a bit thin.

As far as the SCV, I would imagine its probably something like the NRA, a lobbying/interest group that also serves as a fellowship. The group itself may not have a nefarious bent, it might just attract some members that do. I would imagine that Rick Perry and the other neo-secessionists are members. :ninja:

[Vteckidd]

what he did was very disrespectful. yes, he may not agree with obama but he should let him speak.
obama is looking dumb enough as it is. he has become a used car salesman with these healthcare pitches.

there was no need to make himself look dumb by yelling during the mans speach. although barrack obama merrits no respect, the position he holds does. therefore we should repsect it

x3

[Vteckidd]

it was wrong, it was disrespectful, but i can tell you this, the Dems used to BOO BUSH all the time during his speeches. Maybe not as bad as "you lie" but its close.

In all honesty he didnt need to yell YOU LIE , most people already know hes wrong. The basis for that comment was that the GOP tried to get wording in the current bills specifically stating that Illegals would NOT be covered, and they wouldnt do it. Why? because they will be covered, it will just be too late to do anything about it.

Like DODD saying he didnt know about the executive compensation for AIG execs, yet was the one that approved it. LIAR.

[BanginJimmy]

what he did was very disrespectful. yes, he may not agree with obama but he should let him speak.
obama is looking dumb enough as it is. he has become a used car salesman with these healthcare pitches.

there was no need to make himself look dumb by yelling during the mans speach. although barrack obama merrits no respect, the position he holds does. therefore we should repsect it

x4.


There is no reasonable excuse for that to happen in congress o matter who is speaking or what they are saying. Anyone that has the right to speak in front of congress should be able to speak without interruption.



As far as the civil war goes, slavery was a piece of it, but not a cause of it. It was a broader issue of states rights, slavery was just the main focus of that argument.


SCV is much like the NRA. Just because it may draw racists to it, does not make it a racist organization. The best example I can think of would be the NAACP. While it is not racist in its intentions, it does draw racists into its ranks.

[BanginJimmy]

Actually it is called the truth, if that incites you to take offense then you are probably one of the guilty ones.

[Justin51982]

Everyone has their panties in a wad about what Kanye did at the VMA's, but really Joe Wilson is playing on the same level. The man has no class.

Maybe if Wilson, ran up as Obama was speaking, grabbed the mic and started giving his own speech.

[Justin51982]

what he did was very disrespectful. yes, he may not agree with obama but he should let him speak.
obama is looking dumb enough as it is. he has become a used car salesman with these healthcare pitches.

there was no need to make himself look dumb by yelling during the mans speach. although barrack obama merrits no respect, the position he holds does. therefore we should repsect it


I agree with what you are saying, and it is country above all else. I do agree with him making himself look like a moron on his own.

[Justin51982]

Figures total blender would be inappropriate as usual. The porn you posted has no place here. It is crude and inappropriate.

[cjhutch]

So is lying to the nation

Really, if that's the case then when every politician speaks there should be someone step up and yell "you lie." They all lie from the moment they start their campaigns to when they are out of office about what their intentions are. Everyone one of the screams about government spending and then when it comes time to talk about the budget they are looking for money for various programs they want to sponsor and other crap that will make them look good in their home state.

[Justin51982]

Really, if that's the case then when every politician speaks there should be someone step up and yell "you lie." They all lie from the moment they start their campaigns to when they are out of office about what their intentions are. Everyone one of the screams about government spending and then when it comes time to talk about the budget they are looking for money for various programs they want to sponsor and other crap that will make them look good in their home state.

I agree do agree with you on this. It is a truthful and unbiased statement.

[David88vert]

I will agree with you that slavery wasn't the main cause of the civil war (it was one among many such as tariff disputes, etc) but to say that it was "part of the latter half" of the civil war is stretching it a bit thin.

As far as the SCV, I would imagine its probably something like the NRA, a lobbying/interest group that also serves as a fellowship. The group itself may not have a nefarious bent, it might just attract some members that do. I would imagine that Rick Perry and the other neo-secessionists are members. :ninja:

Stretching thin? Please explain your comment. The American Civil War stated in 1861. Lincoln did not end slavery with the Emancipation Proclaimation (1863) - it only applied to ten succession states - leaving it active in all other states/territories, including the Kansas territory, and I believe Texas as well.
The Thirteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution was passed abolishing slavery in December, 1865.



You are correct on the SCV. Similar to the NRA, ACLU, etc., and yes, there are some nutcases in any organization.

[Justin51982]

Stretching thin? Please explain your comment. The American Civil War stated in 1861. Lincoln did not end slavery with the Emancipation Proclaimation (1863) - it only applied to ten succession states - leaving it active in all other states/territories, including the Kansas territory, and I believe Texas as well.
The Thirteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution was passed abolishing slavery in December, 1865.



You are correct on the SCV. Similar to the NRA, ACLU, etc., and yes, there are some nutcases in any organization.

The best thing about Total Blenders "mistruths", is that it appears he got himself banned and we don't have to see them until/if they unban him.

[Justin51982]

Stretching thin? Please explain your comment. The American Civil War stated in 1861. Lincoln did not end slavery with the Emancipation Proclaimation (1863) - it only applied to ten succession states - leaving it active in all other states/territories, including the Kansas territory, and I believe Texas as well.
The Thirteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution was passed abolishing slavery in December, 1865.

Very true

[/QUOTE]You are correct on the SCV. Similar to the NRA, ACLU, etc., and yes, there are some nutcases in any organization.[/QUOTE]

x2, there are extremes in every organization, in every cause, and in every walk of life.

[David88vert]

The best thing about Total Blenders "mistruths", is that it appears he got himself banned and we don't have to see them until/if they unban him.

Oh, didn't know he was banned.

[NovaScotia]

Um as far as the civil war goes. Secession began once Lincoln was elected out of a belief that he was Anti-Slavery (see "Northern Interests") and that the "North" as a populace had become more unified in Abolition. Seven states we're out by the end of Lincoln's incumbency.
Also states rights is thrown around a lot. For the South it was the idea that a state could act and govern with some level of independence (i.e. IGNORE certain federal policies that would abolish slavery). And the North would carry on progressively and adapt, relying on industry in comparison to the South's agricultural bias. And since 1793 the use of slave labor for cotton production specifically had exploded, becoming the cornerstone of Southern agriculture. Without free labor, profits would dive. Sure they could change, but these are OG Conservatives we're talking about here. Picture telling GM's brass when profits were at an all time high that they had to compensate or terminate any and all automated equipment that helped create their automobiles.

"Why would you pay something that has no emotions, and can't think. It's not like they're real people."

[Justin51982]

Oh, didn't know he was banned.


It says he is underneath his name, and all his Rep power is gone, so that is what I assumed.

[BanginJimmy]

As predicted more than a year ago, every liberal with access to a microphone is calling anyone that doesn't fall completely in line with the Mesiah a racist.

It seems that this is all we should expect from liberals is attacks unless you agree with them.

[David88vert]

As predicted more than a year ago, every liberal with access to a microphone is calling anyone that doesn't fall completely in line with the Mesiah a racist.

It seems that this is all we should expect from liberals is attacks unless you agree with them.


Now we have an ignorant statement from Jimmy Carter stating, "I think it's based on racism. There is an inherent feeling among many in this country that an African-American should not be president." He specificially targeted Wilson's "You lie!" statement in the interview with AP.
My opinion - Carter is a has-been that should have been a never-was. He has repeatedly shown over the years disregard for truth, and has shown racist tendencies himself in his anti-Semitic views.

[tony]

So easy to dismiss racial issues as the race card now, its that thing of taking the easy path rather than the less traveled path of understanding.. but then again that goes back to that discussion of education.

[Vteckidd]

So easy to dismiss racial issues as the race card now, its that thing of taking the easy path rather than the less traveled path of understanding.. but then again that goes back to that discussion of education.

You cant honestly sit there and say that Wilsons outburst, OR the people angry with the way the country is going (healthcare, bailouts, etc) are all only angry because of a black man being president?

Are there some WHITE racists that dont like Obama cause he is black, YES
Are there some black RACISTS who only like Obama cause he is black, YES

But grouping EVERYONE into on of those categories, well thats just plain stupid.

Where were you when Van Jones was spewing his anti-white propaghanda?

Thats the only problem i have with this shit. Say something to a black man, its RACISM. Say it to a white man, its "getting even for years of slavery and injustice".

[Vteckidd]

Oh and Carter is a moron, his legacy is horrible so he has to get the spotlight anyway he can

[tony]

You cant honestly sit there and say that Wilsons outburst, OR the people angry with the way the country is going (healthcare, bailouts, etc) are all only angry because of a black man being president?

Are there some WHITE racists that dont like Obama cause he is black, YES
Are there some black RACISTS who only like Obama cause he is black, YES

But grouping EVERYONE into on of those categories, well thats just plain stupid.

Where were you when Van Jones was spewing his anti-white propaghanda?

Thats the only problem i have with this shit. Say something to a black man, its RACISM. Say it to a white man, its "getting even for years of slavery and injustice".

Mitt Romney put a Universal Healthcare system in Massachussets, what kind of treatment has he been getting? His plan actually went further than Obama's but not one bit of criticism. This is not the first time Universal Healthcare has been put on the table but suddenly this time the level of disrespect goes above and beyond any other time? Not coincidence, sorry. But honestly you wouldn't see that anyway, that is no fault to you.. i just understand why you don't.

[BanginJimmy]

Tony, you are simply proving the point. You disagree with Obama, you are a racist.

Fuck Obama. Fuck his policies. Fuck every one of the our elected "representatives" in Washington.

Oh and Mass Care or whatever they are calling it now is broke and running massive deficits. There is also no govt option. It is a clearinghouse for subsidized insurance for those that make less than 300% of poverty.

It also raises taxes on businesses and individuals.

Romney's plan wasnt nearly as far reaching as the plan they have either. He veto'd 8 major sections of the bill but his veto was overridden by the legislature.

[preferredduck]

I don't think race has anything to do with it. He called Obama a liar because Obama IS a liar.

Him being involved in groups that preserves his heiritage have nothing to do with him being a racist.

I made a donation to his campaign.

:goodjob:

[preferredduck]

You cant honestly sit there and say that Wilsons outburst, OR the people angry with the way the country is going (healthcare, bailouts, etc) are all only angry because of a black man being president?

Are there some WHITE racists that dont like Obama cause he is black, YES
Are there some black RACISTS who only like Obama cause he is black, YES

But grouping EVERYONE into on of those categories, well thats just plain stupid.

Where were you when Van Jones was spewing his anti-white propaghanda?

Thats the only problem i have with this shit. Say something to a black man, its RACISM. Say it to a white man, its "getting even for years of slavery and injustice".


or a hate crime!!!

[Justin51982]

I agree with BOTH Vteckidd and PreferredDuck.

One thing that people forget is Obama is half white too, so we must be being racist toward them. Or here is another example, take Kanye at the VMA's, he wasn't being racist, just a "jackass". However, if it was Taylor Swift doing that to a black artist, it would have been racism.

There are a lot of black people that are racist towards white people. Whereas I believe a lot of white people are becoming less racist and realizing the B.S. associated with it.

Like I said before, Obama got the black vote, but he also got the majority of the white vote. Obama is HALF Black AND HALF white. He was raised in Hawaii by his WHITE grandmother. So, he is not from the "streets" like people would like to believe. He is white in almost everyway except the color of his skin.

Get over the race thing, and as far as the race card goes, give it up Tony, it has nothing to do with taking the easier path, it is the race card, it has been being played in this country for years, it is time to let it go.

The younger generation, for the most part, is very tolerant and very understanding of diversity and of others cultures. It appears, that by me being a white male, over the age of 18, that my heiritage and my culture and my views have to be subdued because otherwise we might offend someone.

Well frankly, I'm over it.

Adding one more thing, I voted for McCain, I am voting for John Oxendine for governor, is it because they are white? No, it is because I feel they would do the best job in the position they are trying to be elected into. It seems to me that we are so close to calling anyone who didn't vote for Obama a "racist".

Pastor Manning, (Who is black) said it best when he said "you keep pushing the white folk like you do, they are gonna rise up . . . and I agree with them, I hope they let me join them."

Link to his video:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLkokNuIojw

As long as I'm on my soap box, let me just explain one more thing. Clearly, I am a republican. I am proud to be one. Here is one of the biggest differences between Republicans and Democrats.

For 8 years we watched the media and the liberal propaganda, demean and disrespect President Bush. We sat back and took it. I agreed with a lot of what Bush did as president, but I also DISAGREED with some things. Regardless, I wanted him to succeed. I wanted this NOT to make the GOP look good, but so that the U.S.A. would succeed. If the president does well, then the country does well, then we do well.

As far as Obama goes, I do not like him, I do not like what he stands for, but even so, as president, I want him to succeed in fixing the problems and keep America a great country. Even though I didn't vote for him, I wanted him to do well, because then in turn, I will do well. The sad part is, that everyday he shows that he was not a good choice. But regardless, for his term, I didn't want him to fail.

The liberals, want the republicans to fail, the media would report anything Bush said and did, we have networks refusing to air anti-healthcare ads because it might offend the mesiah (which goes to show how yellow journalism really is). The democrats wanted Bush to fail. It's that simple.

OK, I'm done.

[tony]

Romney's plan wasnt nearly as far reaching as the plan they have either. He veto'd 8 major sections of the bill but his veto was overridden by the legislature.

Romney's plan had subsidized healthcare for those who had an income under $29,000.. one has to wonder who else has proposed something similar lately and has come under harsh scrutiny. Where Romney's plan went even further was that EVERY citizen had to have coverage, if you didn't you were fined and many did end up getting a fine. But you only prove my point, you defend Romney on a plan that is not only similar but more far reaching than Obama's then turn around and say fuck Obama.

Point proven, I will say no more.

[BanginJimmy]

Romney's plan had subsidized healthcare for those who had an income under $29,000.. one has to wonder who else has proposed something similar lately and has come under harsh scrutiny. Where Romney's plan went even further was that EVERY citizen had to have coverage, if you didn't you were fined and many did end up getting a fine. But you only prove my point, you defend Romney on a plan that is not only similar but more far reaching than Obama's then turn around and say fuck Obama.

Point proven, I will say no more.


Again, Romney's plan wasnt as far reaching as he veto'd many of those parts that you mentioned.

I guess this means I am a racist in your eyes then huh. Then again, I am willing to bet you see a racist every time you see a white person.

As a matter of fact, ANYONE that proposes such a plan would come under the same amount of criticism from me.

[mm2654]

So I guess we were all racist when we opposed Hillary Care back in the 90s too. I will agree that there is a small minority of people oppose everything that Obama does based on their racist views but, the vast majority of his critics disagree with him on a purely idealogical level.

[jorgen]

I didn't read most of this thread... here we go.

1 - You cannot make me buy healthcare. Fuck you.
2 - Obama is a liar. 'There is not pork in this stimulus'
3 - Was it racially modivated? Maybe. But he did make over a million on that comment.
4 - Pelosi is a bitch, why hasn't someone shot her yet? I will fucking dance in the streets if it happens.

Unrelated, CA lost 40,000 farming jobs because of the smelt fish. Someone wanna tell me that turning that water back on is going to put fishermen out of business?

[tony]

So I guess we were all racist when we opposed Hillary Care back in the 90s too. I will agree that there is a small minority of people oppose everything that Obama does based on their racist views but, the vast majority of his critics disagree with him on a purely idealogical level.

And I completely agree here, I just tend to think the ones who are more disrespectful about it are not just motivated by politics alone.

[zspeed24]

Read an opinion article that i have also seen similar news reports showing how President Obama may have a back door to cover illegal immigrants...

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2009/09/the-presidents-promise-not-to-insure-illegal-immigrants-isnt-as-simple-as-it-sounds.html

[BanginJimmy]

Read an opinion article that i have also seen similar news reports showing how President Obama may have a back door to cover illegal immigrants...

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2009/09/the-presidents-promise-not-to-insure-illegal-immigrants-isnt-as-simple-as-it-sounds.html


If this is about amnesty, its old news. He said he was going to do it and call it reform back during the election.

[zspeed24]

I knew it was just wanted to remind some people thats all....

[Total_Blender]

4 - Pelosi is a bitch, why hasn't someone shot her yet? I will fucking dance in the streets if it happens.
?

You teabaggers all want to be taken seriously, and then you go and shit from your mouth like that. Glenn Beck also acted out poisoning Pelosi on his show. Its hilarious to watch the Right go off the deep end, now that Glenn Beck and Rush Limbaugh run the party.

[Justin51982]

You teabaggers all want to be taken seriously, and then you go and shit from your mouth like that.

Wow, that's like the pot calling the kettle black

[vinayak]

4 - Pelosi is a bitch, why hasn't someone shot her yet? I will fucking dance in the streets if it happens.


Give the Dems more reason to come take my guns.

[Justin51982]

Give the Dems more reason to come take my guns.

Amen to that.

[preferredduck]

If this is about amnesty, its old news. He said he was going to do it and call it reform back during the election.

amnesty= wrong. maybe if they can make $$ off of them.

[BanginJimmy]

amnesty= wrong. maybe if they can make $$ off of them.

Not only is it wrong, it doesnt work. Reagan tried it back in '86. It led to the number of illegals crossing the border to more than double on a yearly basis.

[mm2654]

I just tend to think the ones who are more disrespectful about it are not just motivated by politics alone.

It is an undeniable fact that there are who hate the Pres. based on the color of his skin, and that some of those people are using the current political controversies to voice their disapproval of a black Pres. under the disguise of political ideologies. But, I truly believe that those people make a up a small percentage of the people protesting.

As far as the disrespect you speak of, I am assuming you are referring to the people with the posters of Obama with the Hitler mustache, their actions are no more disrespectful than that of the liberal protesters of GWB who were protesting the war. Further more, both examples are probably just people who are more extreme in their political views and like to go for the shock value of doing more outrageous acts. Either way, those people really don't do their argument justice as those kind of extreme views tend to scare the masses away.

If there are other, more disrespectful acts taking place that I don't know about i'm sorry, I haven't had much time to watch the news lately as I have been really busy with school this semester.

[David88vert]

As far as the disrespect you speak of, I am assuming you are referring to the people with the posters of Obama with the Hitler mustache, their actions are no more disrespectful than that of the liberal protesters of GWB who were protesting the war.


The liberals complain of one reference comparing Obama to Hitler, but forget all of the Photoshops that the left did about Bush/Hitler. A reminder:
http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&source=hp&q=bush+hitler&gbv=2&aq=f&oq=&aqi=g-m1

[BanginJimmy]

Liberals have always held themmselves to a double, much lower, standard. This is not news.