Fuel Pump gets not power: EVO IX GSR

[Apex i ITR]

I'm trying the cheapest/simplest parts first before I start looking at the 12v wire running to the fuel pump directly or worse the main harness. So through some of the threads here I found other people with the same issue and some of the suggestions thrown out......Beyond it being a wiring issue (nightmare), or a crank angle position sensor (2 different motors and the same issue would lead me to believe this isn't the issue) the simplest thing to check is the Fuel relay.

Any other suggestions? I posted this in turbo forum but I think I might get a better response here (esp since I have a more direct description of the issue.

I tried to order from the dealer but its a special order part and will take a while to get here....mitsubishiparts.net shows 4-10 day turnaround ('ll call them to confirm) and I've hit a few part out people up. No responses yet. Hoping someone has one lying around they don't need that they can sell me or just send me. I'd like to get my car running asap.

[Barefoot]

have u tested your current relay yet according to the FSM.

[Apex i ITR]

No....FSm (Full Service Manual?)

[NickW]

Honestly I would try hitting up some EVO forums, if it's a common problem.

Was extensive work being done that could be related to this was this problem just out of the blue?

[Apex i ITR]

It had an HKS FCon and AMS fuel system....thats when the problem started (with the previous owner)...been trying to figure it out ever since

[NickW]

Hmm...Now that sucks. If you know how to read a diagram and use a multi-meter, that woule be where I would start. I'm sure you've checked the fuses already too...

[Apex i ITR]

Owner had it before...I assume he did but I'm checking all the basics first...not the greatest DMM testing (my biggest achilles heel). I have a friend that is willing to help that knows how to use that equipment...I'm thinking about trying to figure out how to use a DMM myself.

[Barefoot]

No....FSm (Full Service Manual?)wtf if u own a car these days u need to atleast have a autozone manual.


ok here are the wiring diagrams and the tests for the relays. do the test if they check out u just save some money. an did throw a part at it with your fingers crossed. just keep moving down the line on the diagrams till u figure out what the issue is. take it line by line component by component.

if u cant read or dont understand whats going on in the diagram PLEASE take it to somebody who can. an dont be surprised if your bill is crazy electrically is pricey.

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[Apex i ITR]

I have the shop manual in PDF....just didn't realize thats what you meant. I have a few people around me that are decent electrically. Thanks for the help.

[Apex i ITR]

thanks for the relay check diagram ( I wasn't sure how to do that).

[Barefoot]

np

[blackonblack]

mine was the crank angle sensor... was broken... have you actually pulled yours out... its 3 bolts... on the side of the the valve cover... kinda sorta... i'd pull it out and check if you haven't done so already thats all i could tell you :-P

[Barefoot]

mine was the crank angle sensor... was broken... have you actually pulled yours out... its 3 bolts... on the side of the the valve cover... kinda sorta... i'd pull it out and check if you haven't done so already thats all i could tell you :-Phis key is that he hd 2 different motors so assuming he used the cas from the new motor it shouldnt be an issue. so the next best would be look at the constants on the car. which is what he is doing. it wouldnt be all that hard to believe there is a bad cas now. just not logical at this point without a cel on for it.

[Apex i ITR]

right...I thought about that cas being the issue but that would be last on the list to check.

[Apex i ITR]

Ok so an update. I pulled both relays off the car (that are on the firewall)....one is all black the other one is black and grey at the borrom (its a little bigger). So since I'm a little green when it comes to using the DMM but i bought the best one I could find and set the DMM to continuity......test both sides of each relay. Not sure what they are supposed to read but I read the instruction manual and it states that if it beeps then that = bad. So the first relay (all black one side reads somewhere around 76-78 this is the side with smaller contacts. The side with the bigger contacts gives no reading and beeps.

The bigger relay gives a 62.7 - 62.8 and beeps and the other side just beeps with no reading. I will try to run 2 wires off the batter to the relays and see what the readings are but does that tell any of you anything.

Just realized based on the FSM I pulled the electric pump relay.....So the one that seemed to fail the continuity test is the fuel pump relay but again I'm not even sure I tested it right.

[NickW]

You should really get some help...Not knowing what you're doing won't really help you and could potentially make things worse.

[Apex i ITR]

You should really get some help...Not knowing what you're doing won't really help you and could potentially make things worse.

Yeah I realize that now. This is just so frustrating...I mean I take servers apart for a living....this shouldn't be that friggen difficult. My next door neighbour is an electrical engineer....might ask him for some help......I have some friends that have a little more experience with the DMM then me that are coming by on Saturday.

I hate not knowing WTF I'm doing. I'm fairly confident I tested the relay right (without the battery) and I got a low reading....just don't know if thats normal or not

[AnthonyF]

EVO IX with these problems? Dealer item? Ever google your vin? A lot of times it will show recalls on models.

What part of GA are you located in?

-Ant.

[Apex i ITR]

In L'Ville but an aftermarket fuel system was added and caused this issue, Its not warranty for sure.

Update:
Ok so after checking relays (2 under dash one big one in the engine bay on the firewall next to the electric pump relay......It appears that the fuel pump relay isn't giving constant power. And he confirmed for me that the relay socket for the fuel pump isn't recieving power either. I'll be ordering one from mitsubishi tonight if I can't find one to test locally.

[Barefoot]

find another 1 on the car that looks like it swap it for a test.

[BoosTKing187]

hope you get it back up and running man! evo's are sick nasty

[Apex i ITR]

Swapped with a local. Still doesn't start. Going to try tapping power on the harness that connects to the fuel pump socket and run power straight to the pump.

Also the original owner thought that the ECU was fried so he tried another ECU...copied his stock rom over and used his original immobilizer on the new ECU....I don't think that will work so I will go back to the original ECU.

If the immobilizer code is wrong will it cut power to the fuel pump or would it just allow the car to start and then stop?

[Batlground]

In L'Ville but an aftermarket fuel system was added and caused this issue, Its not warranty for sure.

Update:
Ok so after checking relays (2 under dash one big one in the engine bay on the firewall next to the electric pump relay......It appears that the fuel pump relay isn't giving constant power. And he confirmed for me that the relay socket for the fuel pump isn't recieving power either. I'll be ordering one from mitsubishi tonight if I can't find one to test locally.

It had to be that fcon that did it. Get an AEM EMS :)

Seriously, if you are going to mod it in the future then just run a new wire and a new relay from the battery. Trigger it on when you turn the key on. It will flow more fuel that way. If you are not planning on modding it then keep digging.

[Apex i ITR]

Updates: Ran power directly to fuel pump and it turns on......Car still doesn't start and there is no green light denoting immobilizer isn't the issue. Power does come thru the white wire on the fuel pump harness when the car is turning over. Fuel pump is only giving 10 Volts when the car is turning over but gives no current when key is in on position. I also checked the fuel relays under the dash by running power directly to them and they clicked....check for continuity and it was getting some current, also did the same thing with relay 3 and it clicked and showed continuity (around 62-64). Fuel pump is working (There is pressure in the line before the fuel rail).

Side note......the car has no MAF currently....seller was trying to get one and hasn't gotten one yet. I'm looking for one right now. This is a stock motor that came out of a EVO MR SE (spoke to the owner and there was nothing wrong with it before he pulled it out).

[WANTED]

Hold the phone, you're trying to run a stock ecu with no MAF? If so, that's one of your problems. What else was done to this car previously, and what has changed since you got it?

First reason I ask this is based on the notation on the lack of maf. To not have one leads me to believe that either the previous owner was trying to run speed density with the fcon or he severely mucked it up.
Next, earlier you mentioned two different motors. Was there a different engine in this car, and if so how recently was it swapped out?
ECU's, are you sure both are for a 9, and are you sure you are running the right immobilizer settings? Are either or both of these ecu's running stock maps or modified ones?
etc, etc, etc.

[Black R]

wait, is this Hurrell?

[Apex i ITR]

Yeah its me Ken....whats up. Hell of a way to get back into this hunh...LOL

[Apex i ITR]

Hold the phone, you're trying to run a stock ecu with no MAF? If so, that's one of your problems. What else was done to this car previously, and what has changed since you got it?

First reason I ask this is based on the notation on the lack of maf. To not have one leads me to believe that either the previous owner was trying to run speed density with the fcon or he severely mucked it up.
Next, earlier you mentioned two different motors. Was there a different engine in this car, and if so how recently was it swapped out?
ECU's, are you sure both are for a 9, and are you sure you are running the right immobilizer settings? Are either or both of these ecu's running stock maps or modified ones?
etc, etc, etc.

I'm not sure why the MAF was missing...originally he thought he'd have the car together and the fuel issue sorted out. I did text him to ask my the original maf was missing. It was a fully built monster....the motor was traded for a stock EVo IX motor...I actually ran into the motors owner last week and we chatted for a bit...he assured me that motor was fine when he pulled it. Basically he had an AMS storker, HKS FCon and AMS fuel system. Car didn't run, he decided ot cut his losses and go back to stock to sell it. I bought the car and he said he would get it running. He put the new motor in and took another ECu from off of an EVO IX and put the immobilizer code in for MY car not the car that it came out of...Not getting any codes for improper immobilzer code. He swapped ECU's because he thought the FCon fried his original ECU.

Stock maps, New motor, No MAF (Borrowing one tomorrow), test fuel pump and it does work with direct power...also shows 10 volts when turning the car over so the white wire that supplies power to the fuel pump harness is giving power....check all relays and they appear good.....CAS is fine. Only thing left is to hook a MAF up and hope it starts.

Its never started in its current configuration so I hope thats why its not starting with out the MAF...I was told it would start and run but be really rough on idle....It would start and then shut off...or it wouldn't start at all.

[Batlground]

Updates: Ran power directly to fuel pump and it turns on......Car still doesn't start and there is no green light denoting immobilizer isn't the issue. Power does come thru the white wire on the fuel pump harness when the car is turning over. Fuel pump is only giving 10 Volts when the car is turning over but gives no current when key is in on position. I also checked the fuel relays under the dash by running power directly to them and they clicked....check for continuity and it was getting some current, also did the same thing with relay 3 and it clicked and showed continuity (around 62-64). Fuel pump is working (There is pressure in the line before the fuel rail).

Side note......the car has no MAF currently....seller was trying to get one and hasn't gotten one yet. I'm looking for one right now. This is a stock motor that came out of a EVO MR SE (spoke to the owner and there was nothing wrong with it before he pulled it out).

Did you check it for spark yet? If not, pull a spark plug wire out, put a plug in it and ground the end of the plug. Use a jumper cable to ground it if you cant lay it on bare metal in your engine bay (like your intake manifold). Try and start the car and look for a spark at the spark plug.

Then check for fuel. Take the spark plugs out of the car. Turn it over. You may see fuel vapor coming out of the spark plug holes. Also look in the holes with a flashlight and see if there is moisture in the cylinders. Smell them to make sure that fuel is getting in there.

If you have no spark and fuel then check your ecu for power. If your ecu is good then check your cam and crank sensor.

It is much easier if you have a logging program to log the parameters from your obd2 port. Then you can see if the cam and crank is working, the ecu, coils, etc, etc, etc.

If you tried to start it without the maf you might have fouled the plugs.

If you cant figure it out, feel free to give us a call.

I have a maf at the shop if you want it. email me at [email protected] for a price or send me an offer.

[Apex i ITR]

Did you check it for spark yet? If not, pull a spark plug wire out, put a plug in it and ground the end of the plug. Use a jumper cable to ground it if you cant lay it on bare metal in your engine bay (like your intake manifold). Try and start the car and look for a spark at the spark plug.

Then check for fuel. Take the spark plugs out of the car. Turn it over. You may see fuel vapor coming out of the spark plug holes. Also look in the holes with a flashlight and see if there is moisture in the cylinders. Smell them to make sure that fuel is getting in there.

If you have no spark and fuel then check your ecu for power. If your ecu is good then check your cam and crank sensor.

It is much easier if you have a logging program to log the parameters from your obd2 port. Then you can see if the cam and crank is working, the ecu, coils, etc, etc, etc.

If you tried to start it without the maf you might have fouled the plugs.

If you cant figure it out, feel free to give us a call.

I have a maf at the shop if you want it. email me at [email protected] for a price or send me an offer.

If you have a MAF I'm coming by there right now....LOL. I'd be coming from Lawrenceville. Is it the housing and the sensor (I need both....at least the sensor.

I had a funeral to attend today...I just got home so I will be trying those things (Hopefully after I come get the MAF from you).

I'll be checking fuel and spark today.

[Apex i ITR]

Also I have access to a tactrix cable so I will be trying to log

[Apex i ITR]

No spark....any ideas

[WANTED]

A couple.

Crank Angle Sensor comes to mind. Make sure the plate is present, as it is easily forgotten during a rebuild. Not having it plugged in or not having the plate would cause a no spark issue.

Make sure everything is plugged in and that all you other fuses and relays are in order.

Lastly, start troubleshooting your ignition system.

I would be doing this in that order on mine.

[Apex i ITR]

CAS is fine, checked all fuses with test light.....checked continuity on all relays.....everything checks out. Troubleshooting ignition? How would I do that.....I'm kinda learning as I go.

[Apex i ITR]

Woke up this morning to try and disable immobilizer and now ECU flash won't work. I tried the latest version......I tried removing app and re-installing.....diffrent USB ports.......keeps giving me a generic error saying it con't connect to the ECU.

WTF

[Apex i ITR]

Ground was loose on battery terminal.......motherfucking immobilizer.....enabled periphery bits in ecuflash.....vaguely remembered it was bit 3.....set it to zero.....car fired right up. Dammit

[WANTED]

It's usually something stupid. Don't feel too bad. Glad you're up and running.

[Apex i ITR]

Yeah thanks for all the help guys I appreciate it. All I need now is a MAF. I PM'd batlground but I might just show up over there to get it....That way I can drive my car to work....(half day).