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4dmin
03-23-2005, 03:12 PM
Do you think Doctors should be able to discreminate between patients???

example: You are raped and you want a day after pill to terminate pregnancy, but the pharmacist won't fill for you...

what do you think about this???

quickdodgeŽ
03-23-2005, 03:26 PM
Hmmmm. Good question. That kind of falls under the "WTF do I do" thing. Code of Ethics, it would seem would prevent the pharmacist from helping you out. If, in fact, a pharmacist has to take that oath.

It reminds me of the doctors who administer the syrum in death sentences. They are having to have private, unkown to the public who it is, doctors do this now. When a docotr gets his degree, he takes the Code of Ethics which basically states that you will do everything in your power to save a life NOT help take it. If you see what I am saying. Later, QD.

uncle_el
03-23-2005, 04:52 PM
Hmmmm. Good question. That kind of falls under the "WTF do I do" thing. Code of Ethics, it would seem would prevent the pharmacist from helping you out. If, in fact, a pharmacist has to take that oath.

It reminds me of the doctors who administer the syrum in death sentences. They are having to have private, unkown to the public who it is, doctors do this now. When a docotr gets his degree, he takes the Code of Ethics which basically states that you will do everything in your power to save a life NOT help take it. If you see what I am saying. Later, QD.

hippocratic oath, not code of ethics... and i'll be taking it in may... kinda sorta, since i don't agree with the language of it (as it says to the pagan gods of my ancestors before me... which i am opposed to). but for sake of argument, here's the hippocratic oath:



I SWEAR by Apollo the physician and AEsculapius, and Health, and All-heal, and all the gods and goddesses, that, according to my ability and judgment, I will keep this Oath and this stipulation -- to reckon him who taught me this Art equally dear to me as my parents, to share my substance with him, and relieve his necessities if required; to look upon his offspring in the same footing as my own brothers, and to teach them this art, if they shall wish to learn it, without fee or stipulation; and that by precept, lecture, and every other mode of instruction, I will impart a knowledge of the Art to my own sons, and those of my teachers, and to disciples bound by a stipulation and oath according to the law of medicine, but to none others. I will follow that system of regimen which, according to my ability and judgement, I consider for the benefit of my patients, and abstain from whatever is deleterious and mischievous. I will give no deadly medicine to any one if asked, nor suggest any such counsel; and in like manner I will not give to a woman a pessary to produce abortion. With purity and with holiness I will pass my life and practice my Art. I will not cut persons labouring under the stone, but will leave this to be done by men who are practitioners of this work. Into whatever houses I enter, I will go into them for the benefit of the sick, and will abstain from every voluntary act of mischief and corruption; and, further, from the seduction of females or males, of freemen and slaves. Whatever, in connection with my professional service, or not in connection with it, I see or hear, in the life of men, which ought not to be spoken of abroad, I will not divulge, as reckoning that all such should be kept secret. While I continue to keep this Oath unviolated, may it be granted to me to enjoy life and the practice of the art, respected by all men, in all times. But should I trespass and violate this Oath, may the reverse be my lot.


and of course there are amended versions as well...

a pharmacist does not go to medical school and does not take the hippocratic oath, though a pharmacist is a doctor. :shrug:








doctors used to discriminate between patients, and today you still can, depending on the situation.

an emergency room doctor has to take care of any patient who comes through his/her doors... to a certain point. with the current law structure, the patient has to be stabilized. at that point, the patient can be admitted, discharged, or transferred to another hospital.

a surgeon, who has a patient referred to him/her, is under no obligation to perform the surgery on that patient if they don't have the expertise or don't feel comfortable. they are obligated, however, to refer that patient to another colleague who is likely to perform the surgery (depending on circumstances of course, since a patient could ask for a surgery that is not indicated or is unnecessary).



as far as the example asked... what to do if a pharmacist won't fill a prescription?

first solution would be to ask for another pharmacist. some stores have more than one pharmacist in the store at the same time.
2nd would be to talk to the pharmacist, ask him/her to call the doctor who wrote the prescription.
3rd would be to go to another pharmacy.








again, doctors can and do discriminate patients, depending on the situation.

4dmin
03-23-2005, 05:32 PM
a pharmacist does not go to medical school and does not take the hippocratic oath, though a pharmacist is a doctor. :shrug:
they don't go to med school they go to pharmacy school obviously, and they do take an oath... whats the shurg for? a pharmacist knows more about drugs than a medical dr does, and med dr. are the ones prescribing pretty messed up. some pharmacist can prescribe meds though.



as far as the example asked... what to do if a pharmacist won't fill a prescription?

first solution would be to ask for another pharmacist. some stores have more than one pharmacist in the store at the same time.
2nd would be to talk to the pharmacist, ask him/her to call the doctor who wrote the prescription.
3rd would be to go to another pharmacy. i wasn't giving the an example for an answer i already know the answer, i wanted to see what people thought... pharmacist can deny anyone they sit fit, its the law.

uncle_el
03-23-2005, 08:59 PM
they don't go to med school they go to pharmacy school obviously, and they do take an oath... whats the shurg for? a pharmacist knows more about drugs than a medical dr does, and med dr. are the ones prescribing pretty messed up. some pharmacist can prescribe meds though.


the oath taken upon graduation of pharmacy school (oath of maimonides) is different from the oath taken upon graduation of medical school (oath of hippocrates). that also assumes that the school asks students to take the oath, which not all schools do.

the shrug wasn't intended for any controversy, but rather a question of the question. a doctor can be a physician, pharmacist, dentist, someone with a ph.d. ... but the question seemed to aim towards medical doctors, though it was not explicitly said.

i don't disagree that generally, pharmacists know more about medications than physicians. which is why i always ask pharmacists on my teams tons of questions, and if i don't have one on my team, i call one of two i have a personal relationship with.



i wasn't giving the an example for an answer i already know the answer, i wanted to see what people thought... pharmacist can deny anyone they sit fit, its the law.

depending on the situation, a pharmacist can deny any patient. depending on the state or store, the pharmacist may or may not have to refer the patient to another pharmacy that can fill the prescription.

accordsti
03-23-2005, 09:11 PM
they should be able to discriminate, with the cost of malpractice insurance why not??

accordsti
03-23-2005, 09:13 PM
well if u really are true at heart and really want to better mankind you wont discriminate though

Jaimecbr900
03-23-2005, 11:02 PM
I'm a little confused. Why wouldn't the pharmacist dispense? Personal beliefs?

uncle_el
03-24-2005, 06:43 AM
I'm a little confused. Why wouldn't the pharmacist dispense? Personal beliefs?

yes, a pharmacist has a right to refuse to fill a prescription. though it can be challenged ethically, it is legal in most cases.

also, some stores may not carry a particular medication. for instance, wal-mart does not carry plan b. thus, if a woman were to go there, it wouldn't matter if the pharmacist thought it was ok to fill the prescription, as it is not in stock there, and never will be.

another option i forgot earlier is to have the doctor write an order for birth control pills... there are different formulations of birth control pills, but there are charts that equate the number of birth control pills that will give the effect of plan b.

microzimmer
03-24-2005, 08:00 AM
i think its crazy if someone were to do that...what if you needed the pill to relief you of pain but someone was like to bad...its just like what i saw on the news a guy wrecked his bike they called and the officer said too bad..they had to call back 2 more times for someone to get someone to comeout there to help them and the girl that was on the news said its seemed like it took them 30 mins... thats pretty bad when you rely on someone to be kind hearted and they treat you like that...what has happened to people these days.....

4dmin
03-24-2005, 08:01 AM
I'm a little confused. Why wouldn't the pharmacist dispense? Personal beliefs?

yes personal beliefs is why i asked the question...


another option i forgot earlier is to have the doctor write an order for birth control pills... there are different formulations of birth control pills, but there are charts that equate the number of birth control pills that will give the effect of plan b.my wife explained it is the = of taking a bunch of her birth control to get the same effect

uncle_el what school are you at?

Jaimecbr900
03-24-2005, 10:37 AM
That's kinda sticky right there. If someone doesn't agree ethically or morally, is that superceded by their profession?

Good question Paul.

I'd have to stew on that one a minute. :thinking:

uncle_el
03-24-2005, 05:26 PM
yes personal beliefs is why i asked the question...

my wife explained it is the = of taking a bunch of her birth control to get the same effect

correct.




uncle_el what school are you at?

i'm at emory university school of medicine... last day of school is tomorrow :D



That's kinda sticky right there. If someone doesn't agree ethically or morally, is that superceded by their profession?

Good question Paul.

I'd have to stew on that one a minute. :thinking:

again, depends on the situation. say you're a doctor, and you're morally and ethically opposed to illicit drug use. you're in the emergency room, and someone who has sustained a gunshot wound to the abdomen is brought in by an ambulance. in obtaining the history, you find that the person is a drug dealer, and some crack fiend shot him.

though you're morally and ethically opposed to illicit drug use, it would be stupid not to treat the guy... not to menition illegal!

now, say you have the same feelings about drugs, and you're in an outpatient clinic. the same drug dealer, now doing fine, comes to you for follow up. you'd have a right not to see him, but you'd be required to send him to someone who could treat him. in other words, you can't leave him in the wind.

i'm not sure if that helps or not.

the pharmacist who is morally and ethically opposed to abortion, and works at a pharmacy that stocks plan b, is under no obligation to fill that prescription. and he/she does not have to refer you to a pharmacy or pharmacist that will fulfill the prescription. in other words, the pharmacist's ethical and moral obligations are allowed to supercede the profession.




i think its crazy if someone were to do that...what if you needed the pill to relief you of pain but someone was like to bad...its just like what i saw on the news a guy wrecked his bike they called and the officer said too bad..they had to call back 2 more times for someone to get someone to comeout there to help them and the girl that was on the news said its seemed like it took them 30 mins... thats pretty bad when you rely on someone to be kind hearted and they treat you like that...what has happened to people these days.....

most pharmacists will fill pain prescriptions. but i suppose a pharmacist retains the right of refusal. usually, the hang up in pain prescriptions is not pharmacists, but physicians who are afraid/fearful of filling prescriptions for drug abusers.

Ehron
03-24-2005, 08:42 PM
Should people who use the word discriminate spell it correctly?

4dmin
03-24-2005, 09:14 PM
i'm at emory university school of medicine... last day of school is tomorrow

thats cool, my wife is at mercer. what kind of doc you going to be?


Should people who use the word discriminate spell it correctly? bahhhh NOT FUNNY!!! :rolleyes:

uncle_el
03-25-2005, 06:47 AM
thats cool, my wife is at mercer. what kind of doc you going to be?

internal medicine... headed to los angeles at the end of may.

ironchef
03-26-2005, 12:57 PM
So what was your schooling like? Im heading towards the medical field after high school/college. Did you get a 4 year degree then go to emory or something else. And is it always necessary to get a science based degree like biology before going to med school?

uncle_el
03-26-2005, 04:35 PM
So what was your schooling like? Im heading towards the medical field after high school/college. Did you get a 4 year degree then go to emory or something else. And is it always necessary to get a science based degree like biology before going to med school?


4 years of undergraduate education
4 years of medical school
3-7 years of residency (depending on the field you go into)

you cannot get into medical school without a college degree.


get a degree in whatever field you want, just take the necessary pre-requisitie courses for medical school (general chemistry + lab, organic chemistry + lab, general biology + lab, physics + lab). a resource you should check out, if you haven't already, is www.studentdoctor.net

FrnkPwrs
03-28-2005, 09:30 PM
Quick quest el, where in Grady are you working? You wouldnt happen to know a girl in the ER named Olivia Echols would you?

uncle_el
03-29-2005, 10:42 AM
Quick quest el, where in Grady are you working? You wouldnt happen to know a girl in the ER named Olivia Echols would you?

i'm done with med school, so i'm not at any of the hospitals anymore.

i don't remember anyone named olivia... but maybe if you give me a description, i'd be able to remember, lol. last time i was in the er at grady was 2 weeks ago. the last time i was there consistently was november.

ironchef
03-29-2005, 08:37 PM
So now are you going into a residency program since youre done with med school.

kgmoore
03-29-2005, 08:49 PM
Do you think Doctors should be able to discreminate between patients???

example: You are raped and you want a day after pill to terminate pregnancy, but the pharmacist won't fill for you...

what do you think about this???


hell no. doctors and medical professionalists don't get paid to discriminate. they get paid to treat and heal. if your morals and ethics get in the way of you doing your job...then you should't be in the medical profession. i guess i am a little passionate about it because there is this big debate surrounding women's rights to control (or do whatever they want to do) their own bodies.

if i was in that situation...i did not ask to get raped and i did not ask to get pregnant. i'm paying for the pharmicist to tell me no? then why is he/she there to begin with? my medical needs have nothing to do with his/her beliefs or morals. and i am not in any state of mind to hear about it. i was just violated and i need medical attention.

i would hit the celing then i would proceed to make sure that that person never works in the medical field ever again. besides most employee manuals for pharmacists speciflcally states that they are not to discriminate or refuse treatment or filling perscriptions based on their own personal beliefs or morals or they will lose their job. ...that's what i would do.

besides...i got my tubes 'burned'. not getting pregnant. don't want to. my life, my body, my decision.

uncle_el
03-30-2005, 05:57 AM
So now are you going into a residency program since youre done with med school.
yep, headed to la for internal medicine.

FrnkPwrs
03-30-2005, 06:54 AM
3rd person, going left to right

4dmin
03-30-2005, 07:52 AM
^ 2 chicks on the right look good

FrnkPwrs
03-30-2005, 08:00 AM
Hehe, those be the freaks too!

4dmin
03-30-2005, 06:35 PM
^ you know those girls... you know we always looking for new talent on IA... the 2nd to the right looks like eva lagoria(sp?)

FrnkPwrs
03-30-2005, 08:51 PM
YeA, I know em. Ill get contact info for you

uncle_el
03-31-2005, 08:04 AM
frnk, i don't know her, but she looks familiar. i'm sure i've run into her in the er... but the grady er is a busy place!


^ you know those girls... you know we always looking for new talent on IA... the 2nd to the right looks like eva lagoria(sp?)

hell, i'm looking for new talent too! lol. btw, it's eva longoria.

damn, we've gotten way off topic here, lol.

Jaimecbr900
03-31-2005, 09:28 AM
frnk, i don't know her, but she looks familiar. i'm sure i've run into her in the er... but the grady er is a busy place!



hell, i'm looking for new talent too! lol. btw, it's eva longoria.

damn, we've gotten way off topic here, lol.

Yeah, but that girl on the right is F-I-N-E....... ;)

uncle_el
03-31-2005, 01:57 PM
Yeah, but that girl on the right is F-I-N-E....... ;)

shoot, i'd take eva longoria, or the chick on the right in the black... or even the chick in the aqua!