MMA @ LA Boxing?

[DrivenMind]

I was out and about earlier today, looking for things to do with my spare time and came across a mixed martial arts training place within a five mile bike ride from my place. There was a really cool place that gave what appeared to be pretty damned good guitar and music lessons in the same complex, but the music lessons are more than twice as much, and half as frequent, and I've done alright teaching myself guitar without them so far I think.

I'm not exactly an aggressive person, nor would I consider myself the fighting type, but since I need to be working out, and getting exercise instead of drinking my face off at the computer with my guitar (see my Anyone Been to AA thread), I'm going to sign up for muay thai, and ju jitsu training classes sometime tomorrow. I was wondering if anyone had done this before, or maybe had a rough idea of what to expect. I've never done any sort of martial arts before, and I have absolutely no idea what I'm getting myself into. But it seems like good healthy fun, and I've always wanted to learn how to properly defend myself in a potentially violent situation. I'm 100% positive I'm going to get tossed around and probably hurt if I have to do any sparring, but I'm assuming it will be a learning process none the less, and I'll be sure to post pics of my first black eye and/or nose bleed for you all to get a good laugh.

[SleepingTalon]

Yes, I've been doing it for awhile now. About 4yrs. Go slow, watch carefully, and check your ego at the door. There's a lot to learn, and it'll seem like a whole lot to take in, but it really is an endless process. Also, the type of shape you get in by lifting weights, running, etc, will NOT prepare you for the type of stamina, and soreness you'll feel. You'll be using muscles that you've probably never used before, so until you get used to it, you'll probably feel pretty beat up. On a final note, don't be discouraged if you get tapped a bunch, and are getting the worse of the stand up exchanges (even if the person is MUCH smaller). Everyone starts off as a beginner, so just take it in stride. Just like anything, if you stick to it, you'll get better. Good luck!

[DrivenMind]

I have no ego when it comes to this, I have zero experience, and am pretty much expecting to get pretty beat up by any and everyone, I have to practice with, although I would appreciate it if they didn't go full bore, and seriously try to hurt me while practicing, especially knowing that I don't have any experience. And I am a little concerned that I might screw up or damage my fretting hand for playing guitar.

[SleepingTalon]

I have no ego when it comes to this, I have zero experience, and am pretty much expecting to get pretty beat up by any and everyone, I have to practice with, although I would appreciate it if they didn't go full bore, and seriously try to hurt me while practicing, especially knowing that I don't have any experience. And I am a little concerned that I might screw up or damage my fretting hand for playing guitar.

No one is gonna go all out on you. It doesn't help them, and it sure as fuck doesn't help you. Your willingness to learn is a good attitude to have in the gym though. At any rate, injury is part of the game. If you don't get hurt, you're probably not training hard enough. I broke my left arm for the 3rd time last month, and had my 2nd surgery in 6 months on it. I'm still recovering from it. I'm not saying that you'll do what I did, but injuries DO happen. If you're really that worried about getting hurt, then you might wanna think twice about it. It's a combat sport, so it kinda goes with the territory.

[DrivenMind]

Getting hurt isn't so much of a big deal, but lasting damage is a bit of a concern. I'm not planning on entering any cage matches, or engging in any serious fights, I'd just like to see what I can learn from it.

[SleepingTalon]

Getting hurt isn't so much of a big deal, but lasting damage is a bit of a concern. I'm not planning on entering any cage matches, or engging in any serious fights, I'd just like to see what I can learn from it.

Yeah, I understand that. That's what the majority of people do. I was actually training for a fight, but again, that's just me, and not everyone is there for that. At any rate, I've broken fingers, toes, and the radial bone in my left arm, with a dislocated wrist, were the most recent injuries. Lasting damage just depends. There's no way to predict this type of stuff. I'm dealing with lots of lasting damage, because of the amount of times I've broken it, repeated nerve damage, etc, but everyone is different. You've gotta roll/spar with people to get better, so anytime that you're dong that, the risk is there. Just know that getting hurt is part of the game.

[willum14pb]

Yes, I've been doing it for awhile now. About 4yrs. Go slow, watch carefully, and check your ego at the door. There's a lot to learn, and it'll seem like a whole lot to take in, but it really is an endless process. Also, the type of shape you get in by lifting weights, running, etc, will NOT prepare you for the type of stamina, and soreness you'll feel. You'll be using muscles that you've probably never used before, so until you get used to it, you'll probably feel pretty beat up. On a final note, don't be discouraged if you get tapped a bunch, and are getting the worse of the stand up exchanges (even if the person is MUCH smaller). Everyone starts off as a beginner, so just take it in stride. Just like anything, if you stick to it, you'll get better. Good luck!

couldn't have said it better myself. good luck man. It's a lot of fun, you'll make great friends with great people. If you want to get really serious about training you should come to Alliance in sandy springs. LA Boxing is an extension of Knuckle UP! so.. it's not very good as far as training. However, have fun!

[ironchef]

Are there any places around Alpharetta that are decent like Alliance? I've heard good things about them, but driving down there can be painful than getting hurt lol.

[willum14pb]

Are there any places around Alpharetta that are decent like Alliance? I've heard good things about them, but driving down there can be painful than getting hurt lol.

There is nothing like alliance in this state. Or in the south east for that matter. Manu the muay thai instructor is 4 time world champion. He also professional boxes.. on the side. lol. Jacare, and one of very very very few men who has received their black belt from Rolls Gracie ( the man who invented BJJ.) If you're in alpharetta it's just a few short exits away.. they have morning classes and evening both that start when traffic has ended :). LMK if you wanna come check it out ill put you in contact with the right person :D

[ironchef]

There is nothing like alliance in this state. Or in the south east for that matter. Manu the muay thai instructor is 4 time world champion. He also professional boxes.. on the side. lol. Jacare, and one of very very very few men who has received their black belt from Rolls Gracie ( the man who invented BJJ.) If you're in alpharetta it's just a few short exits away.. they have morning classes and evening both that start when traffic has ended :). LMK if you wanna come check it out ill put you in contact with the right person :DYea I've been interested in checking it out, my schedule just sucks though. I'd like to see when their classes are happening. You mean Royce Gracie btw? And is that the same Jacare who was just in the DREAM middleweight tournament?

[willum14pb]

Yea I've been interested in checking it out, my schedule just sucks though. I'd like to see when their classes are happening. You mean Royce Gracie btw? And is that the same Jacare who was just in the DREAM middleweight tournament?


No, i mean Rolls. Royce is his son. Different Jacare. This is Romero "jacare" Cavalcanti. He's one of the founders of alliance and since it's inseption has won most major tournies, over gracies :). www.alliancebjj.com for class schedules and shit :).

[Friggintitsman]

No, i mean Rolls. Royce is his son. Different Jacare. This is Romero "jacare" Cavalcanti. He's one of the founders of alliance and since it's inseption has won most major tournies, over gracies :). www.alliancebjj.com (http://www.alliancebjj.com) for class schedules and shit :).

I think you mean Helio Gracie, I've heard a lot of good things about alliance, and have trained with several people that came from there. Also Unit 2 is another gym that is great if you are looking at good BJJ training.

Knuckleup is not a part of LA Boxing... the owners of Knuckleup use to be affiliated with LA boxing before breaking off and becoming Velocity kickboxing. Then after they moved and becamse an MMA gym they became Knuckleup. As for you question Ironchef Knuckleup is a good gym despite what anyone tells you. I have been there for 3 years now and have learned a lot from them. In the beggining my focus was BJJ and Muay Thai, but now I've shifted toward Kali. I realized that since I have no interest in competing or even getting a belt really. My training is strictly for health and possible self defense. I guess simple answer is all in your needs for the training. IMO anyone that knows more than I do is a potential teacher. I have learned techniques from several arts all of which are useful in every day fighting.

[ironchef]

I think you mean Helio Gracie, I've heard a lot of good things about alliance, and have trained with several people that came from there. Also Unit 2 is another gym that is great if you are looking at good BJJ training.

Knuckleup is not a part of LA Boxing... the owners of Knuckleup use to be affiliated with LA boxing before breaking off and becoming Velocity kickboxing. Then after they moved and becamse an MMA gym they became Knuckleup. As for you question Ironchef Knuckleup is a good gym despite what anyone tells you. I have been there for 3 years now and have learned a lot from them. In the beggining my focus was BJJ and Muay Thai, but now I've shifted toward Kali. I realized that since I have no interest in competing or even getting a belt really. My training is strictly for health and possible self defense. I guess simple answer is all in your needs for the training. IMO anyone that knows more than I do is a potential teacher. I have learned techniques from several arts all of which are useful in every day fighting.Yea I'd be really interested in doing something Muay Thai related, for getting into better shape, conditioning, and knowing good self defense techniques. I think it would be cool to compete in the future once I maybe learn enough, maybe even get to the UFC. Though I don't expect to be the next GSP haha.

[DrivenMind]

Conditioning, and cardio are a big reason of why I want to get into it.

Plus lots of fights end up on the ground, in the event that such a thing were to happen, ju jitsu could come in quite handy.

[SleepingTalon]

I think you mean Helio Gracie, I've heard a lot of good things about alliance, and have trained with several people that came from there. Also Unit 2 is another gym that is great if you are looking at good BJJ training.

Knuckleup is not a part of LA Boxing... the owners of Knuckleup use to be affiliated with LA boxing before breaking off and becoming Velocity kickboxing. Then after they moved and becamse an MMA gym they became Knuckleup. As for you question Ironchef Knuckleup is a good gym despite what anyone tells you. I have been there for 3 years now and have learned a lot from them. In the beggining my focus was BJJ and Muay Thai, but now I've shifted toward Kali. I realized that since I have no interest in competing or even getting a belt really. My training is strictly for health and possible self defense. I guess simple answer is all in your needs for the training. IMO anyone that knows more than I do is a potential teacher. I have learned techniques from several arts all of which are useful in every day fighting.

Yes, this is true. I've trained at KU before with Steve Headden, and he's a very good coach. Also, just so there isn't some misinformation in this thread, there are A LOT of good BJJ black belts in this state. Roberto Traven won the Mundials and is a world champion, Paul Creighton is a black belt under Renzo Gracie, and has fought in the UFC (he actually fought BJ Penn). IMO, the BEST BJJ coach in the state is my current coach, Ricardo Murgel. He moved here last summer and just got promoted to 8th degree BJJ black belt under Flavio Behring a few weeks ago. This promotion now puts Master Murgel at a VERY ELITE level, and at the same level as Rickson Gracie, who if you know your lineage, you'll know he's the BEST in the Gracie family, and that's not even up for debate...it's fact. He is also founder of the Union Fight Team in Brazil, and is the person who gave Nate Marquardt his BJJ black belt. He's on his way back to Brazil in a few weeks for his promotion ceremony. Among those attending are the Nogueira brothers, Anderson Silva, both of who he has trained. Google his name and you'll see why I will say he's top of the food chain in this state.

[SleepingTalon]

Yea I've been interested in checking it out, my schedule just sucks though. I'd like to see when their classes are happening. You mean Royce Gracie btw? And is that the same Jacare who was just in the DREAM middleweight tournament?

If you wanna go train with the Jacare you're referring to, just jump on a plane and head to San Diego! He trains out there with Diego Sanchez and Saulo Riberio. If you want a solid ground game, it's not a bad place to be! LOL.

[Friggintitsman]

Yea I'd be really interested in doing something Muay Thai related, for getting into better shape, conditioning, and knowing good self defense techniques. I think it would be cool to compete in the future once I maybe learn enough, maybe even get to the UFC. Though I don't expect to be the next GSP haha.

Well if you want to train in Muay Thai and stay in Alpharetta I would suggest Knuckleup by all means. Frank Milsap is one of two trainers there. He is a really good teacher and all out cool guy too.

[Friggintitsman]

Personally I'm a dirty fighter...thus why I like my Kali instructor. I sometimes use illegal moves when training BJJ because it's things I was taught in Kali. Ooops! lol

[willum14pb]

I think you mean Helio Gracie, I've heard a lot of good things about alliance, and have trained with several people that came from there. Also Unit 2 is another gym that is great if you are looking at good BJJ training.

Knuckleup is not a part of LA Boxing... the owners of Knuckleup use to be affiliated with LA boxing before breaking off and becoming Velocity kickboxing. Then after they moved and becamse an MMA gym they became Knuckleup. As for you question Ironchef Knuckleup is a good gym despite what anyone tells you. I have been there for 3 years now and have learned a lot from them. In the beggining my focus was BJJ and Muay Thai, but now I've shifted toward Kali. I realized that since I have no interest in competing or even getting a belt really. My training is strictly for health and possible self defense. I guess simple answer is all in your needs for the training. IMO anyone that knows more than I do is a potential teacher. I have learned techniques from several arts all of which are useful in every day fighting.

Jacare (Portuguese for 'Alligator') grew up on the mean streets of Rio and holds the last of only five Black Belts awarded by the legendary Rolls Gracie. <-- LA Boxing spiraled to Velocity, which spiraled to Knuckle Up. it's all the same. If you plan on going to knuckle up to get in shape, that's fine, great place to go. However, if you plan on competing, it's not the place to be. I've attended classes at knuckle up and alliance, and i stuck with the obvious choice for competition. Depends what your goals are.

[willum14pb]

Yes, this is true. I've trained at KU before with Steve Headden, and he's a very good coach. Also, just so there isn't some misinformation in this thread, there are A LOT of good BJJ black belts in this state. Roberto Traven won the Mundials and is a world champion, Paul Creighton is a black belt under Renzo Gracie, and has fought in the UFC (he actually fought BJ Penn). IMO, the BEST BJJ coach in the state is my current coach, Ricardo Murgel. He moved here last summer and just got promoted to 8th degree BJJ black belt under Flavio Behring a few weeks ago. This promotion now puts Master Murgel at a VERY ELITE level, and at the same level as Rickson Gracie, who if you know your lineage, you'll know he's the BEST in the Gracie family, and that's not even up for debate...it's fact. He is also founder of the Union Fight Team in Brazil, and is the person who gave Nate Marquardt his BJJ black belt. He's on his way back to Brazil in a few weeks for his promotion ceremony. Among those attending are the Nogueira brothers, Anderson Silva, both of who he has trained. Google his name and you'll see why I will say he's top of the food chain in this state.


fyi, roberto traven recieved his black belt from alliance, under jacare. The best teacher, hands down, statistically, is jacare. His students/organization win more events than anyone.

[willum14pb]

Muay Thai.. Manu.. period.. He's world champion for a reason.. and one of the only people ever to beat the thai's in lumpinee stadium.. However, if money is tight, and you dont plan on competing, then yes, again, knuckle up is for you.

[Friggintitsman]

Jacare (Portuguese for 'Alligator') grew up on the mean streets of Rio and holds the last of only five Black Belts awarded by the legendary Rolls Gracie. <-- LA Boxing spiraled to Velocity, which spiraled to Knuckle Up. it's all the same. If you plan on going to knuckle up to get in shape, that's fine, great place to go. However, if you plan on competing, it's not the place to be. I've attended classes at knuckle up and alliance, and i stuck with the obvious choice for competition. Depends what your goals are.

I only said that because you claimed Rolls invented BJJ, but he trained under Helio (his uncle).

I haven't trained at alliance, but I've heard good things.

[willum14pb]

I only said that because you claimed Rolls invented BJJ, but he trained under Helio (his uncle).

I haven't trained at alliance, but I've heard good things.

ah. yea i knew that. but rolls is really the guy who spiraled it and invented the majority of moves. Helio took it from it's ancestral form and made it a little brazillian.. rolls completed the transformation :P. Jacare is considered his only equal on the mat.

[One_Bad_SHO]

Conditioning, and cardio are a big reason of why I want to get into it.

Plus lots of fights end up on the ground, in the event that such a thing were to happen, ju jitsu could come in quite handy.

I was training for Knuckleup over in Midtown. Like the guy said a few posts up, don't get discouraged! Conditioning/cardio is ROUGH. It makes you really admire mma on tv when these guys gotta go for five 5 minute rounds. After your first "roll" session, you'll see what I mean.

Oh, and a bit of advice. Wash your gui! You don't want to be that guy in class that nobody wants to fight because his gui smells like ball sack. Yes, is gonna fade... but who cares. Keep it clean. :goodjob:

[willum14pb]

I was training for Knuckleup over in Midtown. Like the guy said a few posts up, don't get discouraged! Conditioning/cardio is ROUGH. It makes you really admire mma on tv when these guys gotta go for five 5 minute rounds. After your first "roll" session, you'll see what I mean.

Oh, and a bit of advice. Wash your gui! You don't want to be that guy in class that nobody wants to fight because his gui smells like ball sack. Yes, is gonna fade... but who cares. Keep it clean. :goodjob:

if you buy a high quality gi.. you should only need to wash it about once a week, if that, as long as you hang it to dry out.

[SleepingTalon]

Jacare (Portuguese for 'Alligator') grew up on the mean streets of Rio and holds the last of only five Black Belts awarded by the legendary Rolls Gracie. <-- LA Boxing spiraled to Velocity, which spiraled to Knuckle Up. it's all the same. If you plan on going to knuckle up to get in shape, that's fine, great place to go. However, if you plan on competing, it's not the place to be. I've attended classes at knuckle up and alliance, and i stuck with the obvious choice for competition. Depends what your goals are.

This is simply NOT true, and a lot of pro fighters would take exception to that statement, so I would be careful to not offend people. What do you base this on, because MANY of their head instructors, including Diego Saraiva, Rafael Assuncao, and Junior Assuncao, all came from the KU camp, and made it to the big show, the UFC/WEC. Bernard Rutherford was signed with the IFL before they shut their doors a few months ago, and Steve Headden was invited and training regularly with Quinton Jackson, Michael Bisping, and Chieck Kongo for all their biggest fights, including Rampage's fight with Dan Henderson. All of the above were head coaches at KU, and very solid, so saying that it's not a place to go to if you wanna compete is simply not true.

[willum14pb]

This is simply NOT true, and a lot of pro fighters would take exception to that statement, so I would be careful to not offend people. What do you base this on, because MANY of their head instructors, including Diego Saraiva, Rafael Assuncao, and Junior Assuncao, all came from the KU camp, and made it to the big show, the UFC/WEC. Bernard Rutherford was signed with the IFL before they shut their doors a few months ago, and Steve Headden was invited and training regularly with Quinton Jackson, Michael Bisping, and Chieck Kongo for all their biggest fights, including Rampage's fight with Dan Henderson. All of the above were head coaches at KU, and very solid, so saying that it's not a place to go to if you wanna compete is simply not true.


If you ask junior who used to train him he'll tell you.. Manu.. ;) People don't go to knuckle up to LEARN how to fight. The people you mentioned already fought, and had tons of previous training from others. They came to knuckle up for money, i know this for fact. If you ask them, they will tell you. Unless they're being dishonest.

[Friggintitsman]

This is simply NOT true, and a lot of pro fighters would take exception to that statement, so I would be careful to not offend people. What do you base this on, because MANY of their head instructors, including Diego Saraiva, Rafael Assuncao, and Junior Assuncao, all came from the KU camp, and made it to the big show, the UFC/WEC. Bernard Rutherford was signed with the IFL before they shut their doors a few months ago, and Steve Headden was invited and training regularly with Quinton Jackson, Michael Bisping, and Chieck Kongo for all their biggest fights, including Rampage's fight with Dan Henderson. All of the above were head coaches at KU, and very solid, so saying that it's not a place to go to if you wanna compete is simply not true.

Although I agree somewhat with will about Jacre and Manu, Knuckleup does have some good trainers. I think their problem when it comes to competing is that they put people out there that have no business fighting because they are undertrained.

[Friggintitsman]

lol I hear the same rap from most of the alliance guys.

[willum14pb]

JUst let me set this straight, im not dissing the gym. They just don't put out top class fighters. They have some good fighters who train/teach there, however, none of them world class status. Every instructor at the Alliance gym IS WORLD class, and PROVEN to produce champion after champion. On a side note, soul, after rolls death jacare did train with helio.

[SleepingTalon]

If you ask junior who used to train him he'll tell you.. Manu.. ;) People don't go to knuckle up to LEARN how to fight. The people you mentioned already fought, and had tons of previous training from others. They came to knuckle up for money, i know this for fact. If you ask them, they will tell you. Unless they're being dishonest.

This is not what you were arguing. You were arguing about the level of instruction, and with many pro fighters who made it to the UFC/WEC, the level of instruction has definitely been on par with many places. Many fighters in this state train with one another. I've trained with Jeff Bedard, who brought Sean Sherk down with him, and Paul Creighton, who brought Matt Serra in. That's what fighters do, it's not uncommon. It's not like the people I mentioned owe their entire BJJ and MT games to Alliance. Alliance is a top notch place, but what you're suggesting is simply not true.

[Friggintitsman]

I think you both should fight it out. This would please me.

[willum14pb]

This is not what you were arguing. You were arguing about the level of instruction, and with many pro fighters who made it to the UFC/WEC, the level of instruction has definitely been on par with many places. Many fighters in this state train with one another. I've trained with Jeff Bedard, who brought Sean Sherk down with him, and Paul Creighton, who brought Matt Serra in. That's what fighters do, it's not uncommon. It's not like the people I mentioned owe their entire BJJ and MT games to Alliance. Alliance is a top notch place, but what you're suggesting is simply not true.


I'm simply suggesting that KU does not produce champions, in anything. Again, i will state, the "top notch" fighters you claim at KU were all part of a previous training camp that converted to KU for MONEY.

[SleepingTalon]

Although I agree somewhat with will about Jacre and Manu, Knuckleup does have some good trainers. I think their problem when it comes to competing is that they put people out there that have no business fighting because they are undertrained.

Every gym has that. Greg Jackson's gym, Greg Nelson's gym, AKA in San Jose, etc. You can't tell people that they can't fight if they want to. I'm helping a friend get ready for a fight in December and he's been training for 6 months, so it's very well possible that he could lose, but that's his choice. Atlanta is a newer hub for elite MMA. Roan Carneiro just moved here too and started an Atlanta branch of American Top Team, so it's starting to come around, but it'll take awhile. I've been doing this since 2004, and it was a lot smaller back then. It's getting pretty crazy now.

[willum14pb]

Every gym has that. Greg Jackson's gym, Greg Nelson's gym, AKA in San Jose, etc. You can't tell people that they can't fight if they want to. I'm helping a friend get ready for a fight in December and he's been training for 6 months, so it's very well possible that he could lose, but that's his choice. Atlanta is a newer hub for elite MMA. Roan Carneiro just moved here too and started an Atlanta branch of American Top Team, so it's starting to come around, but it'll take awhile. I've been doing this since 2004, and it was a lot smaller back then. It's getting pretty crazy now.

yea, too many wannabe's now.. frankly it's annoying. i hate the guys that come in, and when you ask if they have experience they make up some bullshit artist background about having trained in this and that fora little. who cares, just say no, i dont, and start fresh. Everyone wants to come in and act tough, it's really annoying.

[Friggintitsman]

I'm simply suggesting that KU does not produce champions, in anything. Again, i will state, the "top notch" fighters you claim at KU were all part of a previous training camp that converted to KU for MONEY.

I know some people that would be plenty pissed if they heard you say that.

[SleepingTalon]

I'm simply suggesting that KU does not produce champions, in anything. Again, i will state, the "top notch" fighters you claim at KU were all part of a previous training camp that converted to KU for MONEY.

KU hasn't been around long enough to produce their own champions in MMA, which is what their focal point really is. No, KU didn't groom those fighters, but you were trying to deter someone from going there because you said that it's not good if you wanna compete, but if solid guys are instructing there, then that would make your statement invalid.

[willum14pb]

KU hasn't been around long enough to produce their own champions in MMA, which is what their focal point really is. No, KU didn't groom those fighters, but you were trying to deter someone from going there because you said that it's not good if you wanna compete, but if solid guys are instructing there, then that would make your statement invalid.

solid fighter does not mean solid instructor. again, not dogging anyone, maybe they are great trainers, but like i said, if you want for sure proven training then there's really only one place for that in atlanta.

[Friggintitsman]

I'm content not ever wanting to compete. I've wanted to train since I was a young lad, but was too broke growing up to do so. After getting out of the military I decided to join in 2006. I have a few injuries from the army that although I probably could compete I would rather be able to walk for the rest of my life.

[SleepingTalon]

solid fighter does not mean solid instructor. again, not dogging anyone, maybe they are great trainers, but like i said, if you want for sure proven training then there's really only one place for that in atlanta.

That's not true, especially not in BJJ/MMA. As far as MT, this may be true, but not in BJJ/MMA.