Palin-tology ???

[4dmin]

so there are tons of youtube vids surfacing of her crazy religious beliefs such as: speaking in tongues, baptizing in lakes, speaking w/ god, preaching the end time message, etc

speakers of her church have also made comments to kerry/bush election that kerry supporters will go to hell.

also speaker apart of jews for jesus made comments about god punishing jews in modernlife talking about isreal; this is due to the fact they have not accepted jesus.

she suggested in a speech that iraq war is gods war.

she seems to be turning out to be quite a :screwy: loon.

discuss.

[sicivic89]

so there are tons of youtube vids surfacing of her crazy religious beliefs such as: speaking in tongues, baptizing in lakes, speaking w/ god, preaching the end time message, etc

speakers of her church have also made comments to kerry/bush election that kerry supporters will go to hell.

also speaker apart of jews for jesus made comments about god punishing jews in modernlife talking about isreal; this is due to the fact they have not accepted jesus.

she suggested in a speech that iraq war is gods war.

she seems to be turning out to be quite a :screwy: loon.

discuss.

I will address some of the points you mentioned. Baptizing in lakes is not out of the ordinary. There are plenty of stories in the Bible of people being baptized in the rivers and such. People can be baptized in pools, the ocean, etc. Also, most Christians will preach about an end time message as the last book in the Bible talks about it in Revelations with the return of Jesus and destruction of the Earth. Again, pretty standard Christian stuff. I wouldn't call them crazy religious beliefs. Thats what CNN is trying to tell you ;)

Its funny the Republicans made a big issue about Obama's lack of experience and his church associations and the Democrats all downplayed them and they are now trying to mention the same issues about Palin with experience and religion. Palin has more experience than Obama and she will never have the extreme religious associations that Obama does.

[4dmin]

I will address some of the points you mentioned. Baptizing in lakes is not out of the ordinary. There are plenty of stories in the Bible of people being baptized in the rivers and such. People can be baptized in pools, the ocean, etc. Also, most Christians will preach about an end time message as the last book in the Bible talks about it in Revelations with the return of Jesus and destruction of the Earth. Again, pretty standard Christian stuff. I wouldn't call them crazy religious beliefs. Thats what CNN is trying to tell you ;)

Its funny the Republicans made a big issue about Obama's lack of experience and his church associations and the Democrats all downplayed them and they are now trying to mention the same issues about Palin with experience and religion. Palin has more experience than Obama and she will never have the extreme religious associations that Obama does.

we'll i'm not religious to begin w/ and last thing we need is another commander n chief thinking he is doing "gods work"... she is pentecostal and their preaching the end time message is a little over the top as well as speaking in tongues. so what you seem to think is normal behavior is far from normal.

associations? i guess you didn't read the comments speakers of her church have preached as in jews are being punished by god and they need to accept jesus, or saying kerry supporters will go to hell. ya she sounds like the person for the job :lmfao:

[Kevykev]

Wonder if the media plans on making her into the next Britney?

[Nerdsrock22]

so there are tons of youtube vids surfacing of her crazy religious beliefs such as: speaking in tongues, baptizing in lakes, speaking w/ god, preaching the end time message, etc

speakers of her church have also made comments to kerry/bush election that kerry supporters will go to hell.

also speaker apart of jews for jesus made comments about god punishing jews in modernlife talking about isreal; this is due to the fact they have not accepted jesus.

she suggested in a speech that iraq war is gods war.

she seems to be turning out to be quite a :screwy: loon.

discuss.

As a practicing Christian for all of my life, I am concerned with anyone who claims a war is God's work. Christ provides no example of a "just war" cause, nor do Paul or any of the disciples. Furthermore, I am leary of any type of escapist theology promoted by a weak understanding of Revelations. We shouldn't pretend to fully understand a book that is heavily laced with 1st century Jewish symbolism.

As far as speaking in tongues, baptizing in lakes, and speaking with God, I see no reason to fault her for personal beliefs and practices (all of which have been in effect for 2000+ yeares) that she shares with millions of Christians. Attack her policies and political understandings, I'm sure you can find some substance there...

[AirMax95]

Too much going on @ IA.com, lol.

Religion is all about how you were raised.......Baptizing in rivers/lakes/ponds still goes on today. Some churches have modernized and do it indoors at a baptizmal tank or the simple "splash" of the face ritual.

Speaking in tongues is something that I have yet to fully understand. I am Methodist. My uncle has a non-denomination church. I have seen the speaking of tongues more than I can count, but due to my faith I will not question its reality. Non-denominational means it doesn't align itself to any one set of Christian beliefs. In other words, whatever is said in the Bible is taken as true and absolute.

To say that the Iraq war is "gods work" is blasphemy. Not even going to comment on that too much, but I will say that religious beliefs cross to far into hatred sometimes. Which is why i stepped away from "church" for a moment to further understand it.

My only assumption is that Palin is trying to appeal to more evangelicals. I feel the seperation of church and state is coming to an end more and more each day. Who ever thought the U.S. would have a holy war?

[Nerdsrock22]

Who ever thought the U.S. would have a holy war?

The fact is, many of our political leaders see America as an extension of medieval Christendom. This idea, unfortunately, is way off of New Testament biblical teachings. Ever since Constantine picked up his sword "for Christ", we have had to deal with it.:(

[metalman]

By comparison, praying to Mary, statues(idols) of 'saints', buying your relatives out of purgatory, paying offerings for the right to sin, eating the wafer god, etc etc all seem far wackier in terms of religious practice....especially since all are condemned in the very christian book the people practicing them propose to follow. By comparison preaching the end time message, baptism, etc are all condoned by that book.

I think Obamaramas religious association is beyond retarded too. Anyone who sits by for years listening to the unAmerican hatred being spouted by his 'mentor' seems un qualified to be the leader of the freeworld IMHO.

There's no question however that the GOP has major problems in terms of being in bed with religious wackjobs (Pat Robertson & others) who actually believe that its their duty to 'do gods work' and bring this country 'back to god' and all manner of other idiotic freedom eroding concepts that should scare any American as well as indicate they have no grasp on the principles of the bible they claim to follow.

I think w're fuked either way in the long run.

[4dmin]

By comparison, praying to Mary, statues(idols) of 'saints', buying your relatives out of purgatory, paying offerings for the right to sin, eating the wafer god, etc etc all seem far wackier in terms of religious practice....especially since all are condemned in the very christian book the people practicing them propose to follow. By comparison preaching the end time message, baptism, etc are all condoned by that book.

I think Obamaramas religious association is beyond retarded too. Anyone who sits by for years listening to the unAmerican hatred being spouted by his 'mentor' seems un qualified to be the leader of the freeworld IMHO.

There's no question however that the GOP has major problems in terms of being in bed with religious wackjobs (Pat Robertson & others) who actually believe that its their duty to 'do gods work' and bring this country 'back to god' and all manner of other idiotic freedom eroding concepts that should scare any American as well as indicate they have no grasp on the principles of the bible they claim to follow.

I think w're fuked either way in the long run.

:cheers: obama's background isn't any different yet it is quite humorous Hillary/GOP supporters have made such a big deal about it now same is surfacing about Palin

[AirMax95]

By comparison, praying to Mary, statues(idols) of 'saints', buying your relatives out of purgatory, paying offerings for the right to sin, eating the wafer god, etc etc all seem far wackier in terms of religious practice....especially since all are condemned in the very christian book the people practicing them propose to follow. By comparison preaching the end time message, baptism, etc are all condoned by that book.

I think Obamaramas religious association is beyond retarded too. Anyone who sits by for years listening to the unAmerican hatred being spouted by his 'mentor' seems un qualified to be the leader of the freeworld IMHO.

There's no question however that the GOP has major problems in terms of being in bed with religious wackjobs (Pat Robertson & others) who actually believe that its their duty to 'do gods work' and bring this country 'back to god' and all manner of other idiotic freedom eroding concepts that should scare any American as well as indicate they have no grasp on the principles of the bible they claim to follow.

I think w're fuked either way in the long run.

Ha, yeah.....he said things that people say all the time. His position makes it hard to swallow the words. Its a black church, the christian faith was bestowed upon african-americans when we were brought over in slavery. Slavery itself goes against the words of the Bible. Anger yes, crazy....hardly. I have read his sermons countless times. People fear people like him (race does not apply) because they voice the TRUTH about this countries DIRT. We toss Christianity and every other religion up in the air and play with it. He used direct quotes for his sermons, making certain things in society known to those who may not know. Anderson Cooper did a good article after he analyzed his speeches. Never did he "damn" America. He simply spoke the truth to the people.

Also, as stated numerous times, just because people say things does not mean you follow/believe them all. I am pretty we all have close family who has said some outlandish things, but you still love/respect them.


Violence begets violence. Hatred begets hatred. And terrorism begets terrorism."

The truth hurts, especially when you know you have been telling a lie.

Also, I don't think we are ****ed, lol. Every election we get 2 candidates who have thier own level of ****tyness. Its nothing new. The biggest fears are mainly 2 things:

1) Obama being able to change the norm for the better

2) McCain being able to do worse than Bush

I say we hope for EITHER of the two candidates to break even and we are well on our way to being the same ole US of A!

[Maniacc]

Did someone say, religion? :ninja:

[metalman]

Ha, yeah.....he said things that people say all the time. His position makes it hard to swallow the words.


Yeah..some blacks spout a veiled hatred all the time...and/or blame whitey or the gubment for problems they cause themselves. In fairness, white a$$holes wearing sheets say much the same redderick and are frankly in the same catagory. I expect much more from a 'man of god'...which that man really isnt IMHO.

Obama's association with him until called out on it says volumes about him. Please save the 'wacky uncle' crap excuse for the stupid. :goodjob: Black people need to stop making excuses for stupidity, bigotry, and other such ignorance within their community, openly condemn it, and rise above it.




Its a black church, the christian faith was bestowed upon african-americans when we were brought over in slavery.

None of which has anything to do with much of anything.
Youre NOT a slave. Neither am I.
We're free to do ANYthing we wish. We SHOULD improve our own situation by being an example of love, kindness, and respect....especially when one calls themself a minister of the bible/chistianity/gospel.

Its very clear this idiot was merely pandering to an undercurrent of 'blame whitey' and blame society for the problems in his community....cloaking this garbage as a 'spiritual message'. Thats not the job of a minister of God, nor is ANY such calling manadated in the christian Bible....on the contrary!! The 'we were slaves once' excuse utterly fails.

[AirMax95]

Yeah..some blacks spout a veiled hatred all the time...and/or blame whitey or the gubment for problems they cause themselves. In fairness, white a$$holes wearing sheets say much the same redderick and are frankly in the same catagory. I expect much more from a 'man of god'...which that man really isnt IMHO.

Obama's association with him until called out on it says volumes about him. Please save the 'wacky uncle' crap excuse for the stupid. :goodjob: Black people need to stop making excuses for stupidity, bigotry, and other such ignorance within their community, openly condemn it, and rise above it.




None of which has anything to do with much of anything.
Youre NOT a slave. Neither am I.
We're free to do ANYthing we wish. We SHOULD improve our own situation by being an example of love, kindness, and respect....especially when one calls themself a minister of the bible/chistianity/gospel.

Its very clear this idiot was merely pandering to an undercurrent of 'blame whitey' and blame society for the problems in his community....cloaking this garbage as a 'spiritual message'. Thats not the job of a minister of God, nor is ANY such calling manadated in the christian Bible....on the contrary!! The 'we were slaves once' excuse utterly fails.


Don't chop my post.

He never blamed "whitey" for anything. I am going to discontinue discussing with you, beacuse you SEEM to be among the people who hear things and quote them, but NEVER want to seek the truth. He revealed all the dirt the the US leaders were doing. What goes around comes around. Keep letting the media dictate and decide everything for you. I know you are not stupid, probably far from it, but you will not sit there and act like you AGREE with everything your mother or father has ever said. Beliefs are one thing, actions are another, and Obama is an intelligent individual who makes his own decisions. He openly admitted that he did not agree with EVERYTHING that the man said, but everyone wants to yell guilty by association. GTFO :screwy:

...and stop making every arguement about black people like you know all (if you are black, well then just WOW!) Yes, some black people still blame whitey, SOME have reason to. There are plenty of whites that act like their predecessors and screw minorites all the time. Yes, black people need to do better, and WE are. The United States as a whole has begun to play the blame game all the time. Our countries leaders do it, from the county level to the executive branch. Some white people blame affirmitive action for them losing jobs to minorities!

My point is this: His sermons were about the US taking into account the wrong that they are doing. The profound speech that got Rev Wright on blast was the post 9/11 speech. What you reap is what you sow. He dug up all the WRONG that the US has done and put it on blast. We make excuses for everything and try to justify it.

I am also glad that you have assessed the stupidity, bigotry, and other such ignorance within our community. As stated NUMEROUS times on this board by COUNTLESS people, you will never understand being black unless you are. Being the minority and having strikes against you before you are born. No I am not a slave, yes I make my own choices, yes I have overcome the stereotypes, but I know how majority of society views me. I know who I am, what I am, and what I stand for......sadly MANY people see only a black man who is doomed to the stereotypes of the land. I, amongst many others are beating the odds so to say. If CNN were to do any other "(insert race) In America", I am pretty sure that some spot light would be shinned on everybody.

Part of the ministry is being an educator. Yes, he is an outspoken individual that tells it like it is. Google Anderson Coopers assessment of Rev. Wright. Cooper has nothing to gain from sitting and studying the mans sermons. Calling someone racist is not "un-christian" behavior. The man wishes the best for all people. He called out some big names, cited the truth and then the media jumps on him and slams him cause he is a minister. Again, not HATRED rather ANGER!!!

Majority of the people bashing him are back-sliding christians on a daily basis who got their tails handed to them by Wright.

Here is one of the articles: http://ac360.blogs.cnn.com/2008/03/21/the-full-story-behind-rev-jeremiah-wrights-911-sermon/

Rely on that media if you believe all the other hype.

[flak_monkey]

The ***** is pro life. That's all I needed to hear.

[.::UNKNOWN::.]

The ***** is pro life. That's all I needed to hear. so someone wanting to cherish life is unacceptable in our country...... but someone who refuses the born alive bill is... i am not a christian by any means.... i am not pro life or pro choice i could careless... that is why i am a libertarian..... but i have read the book written by the ex abortion clinic nurse that watched them perform a partial birth abortion and throw the kid in a storage closet.... i support that bill and it is one of the reason's i do not support obama.... it a kid that is still alive after a partial birth abortion should be given every chance to see if the child will live...

[metalman]

Don't chop my post.

I am going to discontinue discussing with you, beacuse you SEEM to be among the people who hear things and quote them, but NEVER want to seek the truth. .

You obviously know nothing about me then. I likely have spent more time 'seeking truth' then the average person here...and I wouldnt be very surprised if that included you.

And, I'll 'chop' any post anyway I see fit thank you. I dont care to address all the meaningless side nonsense you included in yours, just some key points.

This fool utterly fails as a minister of the gospel....end of story.
If you dont see that or understand it then YOU definitely need to 'seek some truth'. :goodjob:

[metalman]

so someone wanting to cherish life is unacceptable in our country...... ...

I think the problem many people, myself included, have with those in the 'pro-life' arena, is that often those who claim to 'cherish life' have no regard for the God given freedom of others to make their own decision on the same moral issues. BUT, wish to legislate their OWN morality for all.

[Nerdsrock22]

I think the problem many people, myself included, have with those in the 'pro-life' arena, is that often those who claim to 'cherish life' have no regard for the God given freedom of others to make their own decision on the same moral issues. BUT, wish to legislate their OWN morality for all.

Actually, the conclusion that there is viable human life in a fetus does not allow for moral relavancy, in the same sense that the legality of murder or homicide cannot be judged by the individual.

If you disagree that a fetus doesn't not represent human life, then that is one thing; however, if you claim "viable life" and then say that its open for discussion, you have neglected your self-instilled obligations to protect human life.

[metalman]

Part of the ministry is being an educator. Yes, he is an outspoken individual that tells it like it is. Calling someone racist is not "un-christian" behavior. The man wishes the best for all people. He called out some big names, cited the truth and then the media jumps on him and slams him cause he is a minister. Again, not HATRED rather ANGER!!!

.

Perhaps you have bought into the political/racial nonsense put forth in many black churches.

Jesus Christ, the EXAMPLE for ALL ministers of the gospel said this..."My Kingdom is NOT of this world" Not once did He EVER get involved in political issues of this world....not once. His closest friends didnt even understand this at first and urged him to do so. Afterall, they were slaves of the Roman empire and wanted that to change. BUT, Christ ignored all of that. ALL. Christ could have freed the jews from Roman occupation...but didnt. He could have preached firey sermons about the political issues of the day...but didnt. He could have incited political revolution and freed all earthly slaves but didnt. That was never His example to his followers nor instruction to ministers of that same gospel.
Why?????? Well thats where you need to study....and seek truth.
I already have a pretty good idea of the answer. I have already given you a hint. Have fun!

[Nerdsrock22]

Perhaps you have bought into the political/racial nonsense put forth in many black churches.

Jesus Christ, the EXAMPLE for ALL ministers of the gospel said this..."My Kingdom is NOT of this world" Not once did He EVER get involved in political issues of this world....not once. His closest friends didnt even understand this at first and urged him to do so. Afterall, they were slaves of the Roman empire and wanted that to change. BUT, Christ ignored all of that. ALL. Christ could have freed the jews from Roman occupation...but didnt. He could have preached firey sermons about the political issues of the day...but didnt. He could have incited political revolution and freed all earthly slaves but didnt. That was never His example to his followers nor instruction to ministers of that same gospel.
Why?????? Well thats where you need to study....and seek truth.
I already have a pretty good idea of the answer. I have already given you a hint. Have fun!

Have you read Gregory Boyd's Myth of a Christian Nation?

I think you'd enjoy it. :goodjob:

[metalman]

Actually, the conclusion that there is viable human life in a fetus does not allow for moral relavancy, in the same sense that the legality of murder or homicide cannot be judged by the individual.

If you disagree that a fetus doesn't not represent human life, then that is one thing; however, if you claim "viable life" and then say that its open for discussion, you have neglected your self-instilled obligations to protect human life.

Actually there is human life within sperm. So, following your 'moral point' to its conclusion I would presume that it should be immoral to kill it, 'waste' it, or flush it down the toilet in a tissue.

The point is, there is no absolute black and white with regard to making moral decisions for others. Society should maintain some civil order and law, but as loosely as possble, allowing for INDIVIDUAL FREEDOM OF CONCIENCE...which by the way is a principle of our constitution and one given by God.

[mocha latte cupcake]

pro life - abortion as a form of oops i got knocked up cause i'm a skank and this baby doesn't fit into my life plan right now... hail no, you're a sorry person for not using all forms of birth control in the first place! put it up for adoption, there are plenty of people out there who would love to have a child and can't... abortion is so wrong in my eyes.

[Nerdsrock22]

Actually there is human life within sperm. So, following your 'moral point' to its conclusion I would presume that it should be immoral to kill it, 'waste' it, or flush it down the toilet in a tissue.

The point is, there is no absolute black and white with regard to making moral decisions for others. Society should maintain some civil order and law, but as loosely as possble, allowing for INDIVIDUAL FREEDOM OF CONCIENCE...which by the way is a principle of our constitution and one given by God.

I'm all down for the second paragraph.

But sperm does not represent viable human life. Therefore, I am not morally obligated, in my mind, to protect it. My understanding of freedom and justice tells me that each viable human life is due right to life and right to property. I believe abortion contradicts that element of my concept of liberty.

[AirMax95]

You obviously know nothing about me then. I likely have spent more time 'seeking truth' then the average person here...and I wouldnt be very surprised if that included you.

And, I'll 'chop' any post anyway I see fit thank you. I dont care to address all the meaningless side nonsense you included in yours, just some key points.

This fool utterly fails as a minister of the gospel....end of story.
If you dont see that or understand it then YOU definitely need to 'seek some truth'. :goodjob:

Gotcha buddy :goodjob:

Never said I knew anything about you, only going off your post. I am glad that you are a truth seeker and don't fall for the meaningless jargon the media may spew out.

You can call what I posted nonsense, but it is reality. My point is that he was put on blast for speaking the truth. I posted some fact, and there is plenty more out there. I don't agree with several of his sermons, esp. the use of the N word, but in regards to why he is in the media, people pulled bull**** not fact.

Carry on.

BTW, chopping post takes away from the complete meaning of what I typed. Jeremiah Wright's sermons were chopped to make his points sound like they came out of left field. Cooper fixed that though.

[metalman]

I'm all down for the second paragraph.

But sperm does not represent viable human life. Therefore, I am not morally obligated, in my mind, to protect it. My understanding of freedom and justice tells me that each viable human life is due right to life and right to property. I believe abortion contradicts that element of my concept of liberty.


Well, having looked at sperm thru a microscope it looks pretty 'alive' to me.

If abortion contradicts what you believe then you should never practice it. Follow your own concience. :goodjob:

The real issue is that humans really have no right to make these moral decisions for other humans. Those that think they do have caused nearly all the bloodshed in history.
The concept of a forced morality by standards of the majority brought about the very country in which we live, and the constitution we enjoy. That should be a sobering thought to the American who now feels it okay to force others by majority consensus or by their own concience.

Palins position with regard to her personal life and practice isnt the issue...its what she feels is okay to force upon others that I would be concerned with. Also, the notion that the current war is 'Gods work'....now that is way wacky!!!!

[Total_Blender]

Christ could have freed the jews from Roman occupation...but didnt. He could have preached firey sermons about the political issues of the day...but didnt. He could have incited political revolution and freed all earthly slaves but didnt.!

You do realize that most of what makes up the Bible was complied and translated by Greeks and Romans, right? And that most accepted Christian practices originated within the Roman Empire after it became Christian? And also that religion was used by slave owners as a tool to keep the slaves subservient, much the same way that you just posted?

What a lot of White people don't understand is that the Black church is not JUST a church. It is also kind of an unofficial community/political organization. Back in the reconstruction the Black churches organized much of the resistance to White oppression. The churches were an already established organization then and were one of the few places where Blacks could conduct political affairs within their own communities without much interference from Whites. It worked then, and the model has survived/adapted to the present day.

As a leader in the Black community, Obama probably attended Rev, Wright's church just to show that he was present and listening to the concerns in the Black church community. He didn't necessarily have to agree with Rev. Wright on every issue because the church and the community around it were bigger than Rev. Wright. :2cents:

[AirMax95]

Well, having looked at sperm thru a microscope it looks pretty 'alive' to me.

If abortion contradicts what you believe then you should never practice it. Follow your own concience. :goodjob:

The real issue is that humans really have no right to make these moral decisions for other humans. Those that think they do have caused nearly all the bloodshed in history.
The concept of a forced morality by standards of the majority brought about the very country in which we live, and the constitution we enjoy. That should be a sobering thought to the American who now feels it okay to force others by majority consensus or by their own concience.

Palins position with regard to her personal life and practice isnt the issue...its what she feels is okay to force upon others that I would be concerned with. Also, the notion that the current war is 'Gods work'....now that is way wacky!!!!

I could not agree more.

[metalman]

You do realize that most of what makes up the Bible was complied and translated by Greeks and Romans, right? And that most accepted Christian practices originated within the Roman Empire after it became Christian? And also that religion was used by slave owners as a tool to keep the slaves subservient, much the same way that you just posted?

What a lot of White people don't understand is that the Black church is not JUST a church. It is also kind of an unofficial community/political organization.

It would appear that you may have bought into a 'black notion' of Christian history, a catholic notion, or similar...and the subsequent 'excuses' to ignore the Christian God.

I find it ironic that professed Christians feel they should follow their God in every way EXCEPT the way He indicates. I also find it ironic that professed believers profess to serve an "Almighty" immortal God yet really think He is incapable of preserving His own truth/word from mortal humans. They contradict themselves! No wonder atheists laugh at them.

As for slave owners 'using' religion....of course, slave owners MISUSED anything they could to preseve their immoral way of life....including the Bible and religion. But, even an elementary understanding of the Christian Bible would show that slavery of any human is imorral..and that engaging in such is not Christian by any means.

I fully understand the 'black church' is (has become) a political organization. And as such it UTTERY FAILS as a Christian church....much like the slave traders 'churchy' notions and methods. And of course, to rationalize this one must 'tarnish' the 'gods word' as 'poluted by men' to fit this course of action.

I guess the god these people serve is incapable! Hows he going to save them then?

[AirMax95]

You do realize that most of what makes up the Bible was complied and translated by Greeks and Romans, right? And that most accepted Christian practices originated within the Roman Empire after it became Christian? And also that religion was used by slave owners as a tool to keep the slaves subservient, much the same way that you just posted?

What a lot of White people don't understand is that the Black church is not JUST a church. It is also kind of an unofficial community/political organization. Back in the reconstruction the Black churches organized much of the resistance to White oppression. The churches were an already established organization then and were one of the few places where Blacks could conduct political affairs within their own communities without much interference from Whites. It worked then, and the model has survived/adapted to the present day.

As a leader in the Black community, Obama probably attended Rev, Wright's church just to show that he was present and listening to the concerns in the Black church community. He didn't necessarily have to agree with Rev. Wright on every issue because the church and the community around it were bigger than Rev. Wright. :2cents:

Thank you.



Perhaps you have bought into the political/racial nonsense put forth in many black churches.

Jesus Christ, the EXAMPLE for ALL ministers of the gospel said this..."My Kingdom is NOT of this world" Not once did He EVER get involved in political issues of this world....not once. His closest friends didnt even understand this at first and urged him to do so. Afterall, they were slaves of the Roman empire and wanted that to change. BUT, Christ ignored all of that. ALL. Christ could have freed the jews from Roman occupation...but didnt. He could have preached firey sermons about the political issues of the day...but didnt. He could have incited political revolution and freed all earthly slaves but didnt. That was never His example to his followers nor instruction to ministers of that same gospel.
Why?????? Well thats where you need to study....and seek truth.
I already have a pretty good idea of the answer. I have already given you a hint. Have fun!

Please see above.

I know the Bible sir, still learning and interpreting more about it everday. If you only knew the 2 churches that I were raised in. There were never any talks of Politics by the pastors, not hatred preached in regards to race, but I get your point. Skim the good book, it highlights how you should treat people. Skim it again, we are all children of god. Skim it again, ....you get my point.

Before I go any further with a rebutle: What is your faith base sir, may I ask?

[Total_Blender]

I

I guess the god these people serve is incapable! Hows he going to save them then?

They are trying to save themselves. Its is foolish to just wait for God to save you if you have the means and resources to save yourself. If I am hungry should I ask God to make me a sandwich, or should I get up and do it myself and thank God that I have the resources and ability to feed myself?

I'm not a religious person myself, but I do see the role the church plays as a social/political network. :goodjob:

[metalman]

Before I go any further with a rebutle: What is your faith base sir, may I ask?

I do not 'belong' to any earthly church denomination nor am I member of one.

I do know a bit about the principles & teachings of the Christian Bible and I can tell you without hesitation that most people & organizations that claim christianity in word deny it in action and practice. Furthermore most church goers have not even an elementary understanding of Biblical principles nor much desire to personally seek them out but prefer instead to allow their 'preachers/priests/bishops/teachers/pastors' to tell them how/what to think and believe merely continue within their tired old non Biblical 'traditions'...using all manner of excuses...including race & political concerns.
This is true for blacks and whites and all the rest of the 'colors'.

[metalman]

They are trying to save themselves. Its is foolish to just wait for God to save you if you have the means and resources to save yourself.

The problem for these 'believers' though is that such a 'self save' concept is starkly contrary and in direct opposition to the Bible those people profess to believe. Their own Bible teaches clearly that no mortal man can save himself...period. And that presuming to be able to do so is the very spirit of 'anti christ'....which simply means 'in place of Christ'.

But...we're drifting far from the subject of this thread here.... :D

It is true that the church has played a political role....the problem is, its NOT supposed to...at least according to the Christ/God/Bible the christian church says they believe and have faith in...AND the constitution. Even the catholic JFK acknowleged this....much to the dismay of the popish church.

[Nerdsrock22]

The problem for these 'believers' though is that such a 'self save' concept is starkly contrary and in direct opposition to the Bible those people profess to believe. Their own Bible teaches clearly that no mortal man can save himself...period. And that presuming to be able to do so is the very spirit of 'anti christ'....which simply means 'in place of Christ'.

But...we're drifting far from the subject of this thread here.... :D

It is true that the church has played a political role....the problem is, its NOT supposed to...at least according to the Christ/God/Bible the christian church says they believe and have faith in...AND the constitution. Even the catholic JFK acknowleged this....much to the dismay of the popish church.

Solid points. I like the way you're thinkin. I've got a whole library I think you'd love!

[4dmin]

Actually there is human life within sperm. So, following your 'moral point' to its conclusion I would presume that it should be immoral to kill it, 'waste' it, or flush it down the toilet in a tissue.



:cheers: lol this has always been a big point for me... i don't understand pro life people that debate what is or isn't alive... how can anyone practice sex and be pro life? sh!t everytime your old lady swallows a load or lets it run down her backside millions of children die :goodjob:

[Nerdsrock22]

:cheers: lol this has always been a big point for me... i don't understand pro life people that debate what is or isn't alive... how can anyone practice sex and be pro life? sh!t everytime your old lady swallows a load or lets it run down her backside millions of children die :goodjob:

Sperm, by itself, cannot become a viable human life.

C'mon guys.

[4dmin]

Sperm, by itself, cannot become a viable human life.

C'mon guys.

sperm already has LIFE what you consider "human" is what is questionable... i don't consider a fetus human just as i don't consider dogs human. it doesn't think like a human, feel like a human, it isn't human.

[metalman]

:cheers: lol this has always been a big point for me... i don't understand pro life people that debate what is or isn't alive... how can anyone practice sex and be pro life? sh!t everytime your old lady swallows a load or lets it run down her backside millions of children die :goodjob:

The behind the scenes drive of pro-life comes from catholicism...(yet another reason freedom loving Americans should be very wary of it) which does teach that 'waste' of sperm is a sin and a violation of the 'laws of god and nature'...thats one reason why that popish church has continuously opposed birth control etc. They even have programs on EWTN dedicated to this nonsensical made up doctrine.

Your old lady swallows? Can you please have her talk to my old lady about doing so!! :lmfao:

[4dmin]

The behind the scenes drive of pro-life comes from catholicism...(yet another reason freedom loving Americans should be very wary of it) which does teach that 'waste' of sperm is a sin and a violation of the 'laws of god and nature'...thats one reason why that popish church has continuously opposed birth control etc. They even have programs on EWTN dedicated to this nonsensical made up doctrine.

Your old lady swallows? Can you please have her talk to my old lady about doing so!! :lmfao:

:lmfao:yes sir - now you know why i proposed.

[JConner]

so there are tons of youtube vids surfacing of her crazy religious beliefs such as: speaking in tongues, baptizing in lakes, speaking w/ god, preaching the end time message, etc

speakers of her church have also made comments to kerry/bush election that kerry supporters will go to hell.

also speaker apart of jews for jesus made comments about god punishing jews in modernlife talking about isreal; this is due to the fact they have not accepted jesus.

she suggested in a speech that iraq war is gods war.

she seems to be turning out to be quite a :screwy: loon.

discuss.


hahaha a loon?????? before you say anything about Palin's religious beliefs check out the black liberation theology that was preached to Obama for the past 20 years.

[Maniacc]

Sperm, by itself, cannot become a viable human life.

C'mon guys.I don't understand what's so hard to get. Just because sperm doesn't have an actual sign of life doesn't necessarily mean it's just a brain-less zombie. In fact, what do you think drives it to reach the ovum? Dog feces has no life, sperm does. If you classify life as; being able to show thought process and having psychical interactions with other life forms, then I highly recommend you first read up on what the definition of 'life' really is.

[Nerdsrock22]

I don't understand what's so hard to get. Just because sperm doesn't have an actual sign of life doesn't necessarily mean it's just a brain-less zombie. In fact, what do you think drives it to reach the ovum? Dog feces has no life, sperm does. If you classify life as; being able to show thought process and having psychical interactions with other life forms, then I highly recommend you first read up on what the definition of 'life' really is.

so at what point does a fetus become human enough to have civil rights? I mean you can't argue that a 6 inch tunnel is the only thing that separates a human from a fetus.