the "r" word

[guinness]

i want you guys/girls opinion(s) on this ****. :thinking:
have you people heard the bull**** that the guy we call our president has been spitting out again when talking about the u.s. economy?this mother ****** wants to beat around the ****ing topic by telling us that the public in general wants to know about the gas prices and sales and other **** like that!?!?!?then he wants to say that he "knows" we are not in a recession based on these stupid-ass ideals.are you ****ing kidding me?how big of a moron or ignorant do you have to be to say some **** like that?hell yeah we are in a recession.....nationwide.gas is almost $4 a ****ing gallon here in georgia where we are still the lowest prices around!!the housing market has turned bottom up.forclosures are up 120% than they were from last year!!amerca is busying buying outside of here and importing and not doing any exporting or having anyone buy our products which puts a huge strain on our industry,industry growth,and in the end,the job situation.america wants to get the most bang for their buck by making products with labor that doesn't put back into the economy.why?becaus it's cheap for the big man.our american dollar is no longer the most valuable form of currency in the world like it has been forever,so to speak.how can the "leader" of our nation look at these facts and then say with confidence that we are not in a recession?what happened back in the 20's?black friday!!our dollar was worth nothing,our job market was sinking or not there at all,the price of goods went through the roof,buisnesses went under,and i'm sure that even back then the housing market went under too.i ****ing hate bush and all the bull**** that he has caused for our country.we have spent more money and lost more lives on a war that was absolutely stupid.it wasn't about terrorism...it was about ****ing oil and him making for sure that he would be elected to a second term.what country would get rid of their leader in a time of war?then this is what gets me as well.he has this plan with these rebate checks to "stimulate" the economy.these checks are going to be used to feed people's children,fuel their cars,try and get back on track with their house payment so they don't face a forclosure.this isn't going to stimulate the economy.whatever money is spent on tv's or computers or whatever else will be so small in comparison to the state that we are in that it will still have no effect on the economy like they are hoping it will.we need to have a president that can do for our economy what bill clinton did when he was in office.he was great for our economy.**** whatever else he did in the oval office and what he did it with.we were in a great state of stability in the economy and in the job and housing market.

bush says,"i'm not ready to use the r word because i don't feel we are there and are not going to get there" :eek: .bush....go **** yourself like you have been ****ing everyone in america since you stepped into power :2up: .i don't know how we'll get out of this without some serious scars,but whoever and however it is has got to be better than what he did to us.

[The Ninja]

They can impeach a president for lying under oath about sexual affairs, but they can't impeach Bush?

LOL!

[guinness]

they should impeach his ass just based on the fact of his inability to do the job he was elected to do on top of all the other **** he has done as well.

[SouthSide Tay]

Bush is a world class **** up with millions of dollars and billionairs to back his dumbass up.

[Spektrewing386]

There is some deep hidden secrets with that man. I wonder if hes implementing a new version of "Operation Northwoods" or something. His grandpa is suspected to have been in a plot to overthrow FDR and install a fascist dictatorship in the United States after his company was investigated for doing buisness with the Nazis.

[man]

Retards trying to discuss politics/economics crack me up...

[Dr.G35]

:lmfao:

[ShooterMcGavin]

here's my advice to you:

1) learn to spell
2) learn there's no need to cuss every 4th word
3) learn to use grammar correctly
4) learn that there are things called paragraphs, and you too can use them

follow those simple steps and you too can discuss politics and current affairs without looking like a simpleton! :goodjob:

[ironchef]

Also, we're not in a recession, so you're an idiot.

[osiriskidd]

we're not in a recession...


yet. if things keep up, than in a couple of decades...maybe. but with bush leaving, i suspect things will take a turn for the better.

[SouthSide Tay]

we're not in a recession...


yet. if things keep up, than in a couple of decades...maybe. but with bush leaving, i suspect things will take a turn for the better.
+1

[MistaCee]

we're not in a recession...


yet. if things keep up, than in a couple of decades...maybe. but with bush leaving, i suspect things will take a turn for the better.

We cannot avoid a recession, its part of the economic cycle.

[osiriskidd]

We cannot avoid a recession, its part of the economic cycle.
this is also true. but there are steps to lessen the impact/devastation. or something like that. i didn't pay too much attention in econ last semester.

[On_Her_Face]

we're not in a recession...


yet. if things keep up, than in a couple of decades...maybe. but with bush leaving, i suspect things will take a turn for the better.

it does not take a couple of decades to be in a recession, it takes two quarters with negative GDP

[MistaCee]

this is also true. but there are steps to lessen the impact/devastation. or something like that. i didn't pay too much attention in econ last semester.

Lessen impact and pulling us out of it as quick as possible is what should be figured out.

[tony]

Recession aka "R" word is relative, some people define a recession as two consecutive months of reduced economic activity, others can say that if there is any reduced economic activity we are in a recession.

To those here who say we are not in a recession, if we are not going through a recession then that means we must be going through an economic expansion.. how do you justify your stance that the economy is growing at this time?

People are so afraid to admit that we could possibly be in a recession and I do not understand the logic behind that. Recessions are a natural and vital part to the economic cycle, as soon as there is acknowledgement that the economy is not growing we can start the process of recovery and rebuild. Or will some of you just deny a recession till rebuilding happens and claim that there never was one?

[MistaCee]

Recession aka "R" word is relative, some people define a recession as two consecutive months of reduced economic activity, others can say that if there is any reduced economic activity we are in a recession.

To those here who say we are not in a recession, if we are not going through a recession then that means we must be going through an economic expansion.. how do you justify your stance that the economy is growing at this time?

People are so afraid to admit that we could possibly be in a recession and I do not understand the logic behind that. Recessions are a natural and vital part to the economic cycle, as soon as there is acknowledgement that the economy is not growing we can start the process of recovery and rebuild. Or will some of you just deny a recession till rebuilding happens and claim that there never was one?

Yea I seriously believe we are in a recession.. I think the media is just trying to cover it up because of elections.

[tony]

Anxiously awaiting a response

[ClipseGST]

If we aren't in a recession yet, we are surely on our way. I recently read an article that discussed what the American economy is built on. When we moved away from building industrial and manufacturing goods, we become a FIRE Economy. The acronym stands for (Finance, Investing, and Real Estate). This effectively took any material value from the dollar being based on solid goods, and gave it more intrinsic value.

Just like the internet boom of the Late 90's, we had a boom in these sectors. Money was spent in these sectors in exorbitant amounts. Well above the actual value of the markets. That's why we saw the stock market rise so high. If I remember correctly, the real estate, and finance markets were overvalued by at least 12 Trillion dollars.

Now that the market has collapsed, the American economy suddenly lost the "make believe" value of those dollars. So now the economy is looking to make up for that money spent. The author stated that the only way to get out of this financial shortfall and recession is to have another bubble that would be in excess of 12 trillion dollars.

In my honest belief, the next bubble will be the: Alternative Power Race. In the next couple of years, you'll see many companies ramp up the production of commercially feasible ways to create power for natural resources and the sun.

Just me 2cents.... and from excessive reading.

Brian

[tony]

If we aren't in a recession yet, we are surely on our way. I recently read an article that discussed what the American economy is built on. When we moved away from building industrial and manufacturing goods, we become a FIRE Economy. The acronym stands for (Finance, Investing, and Real Estate). This effectively took any material value from the dollar being based on solid goods, and gave it more intrinsic value.

Just like the internet boom of the Late 90's, we had a boom in these sectors. Money was spent in these sectors in exorbitant amounts. Well above the actual value of the markets. That's why we saw the stock market rise so high. If I remember correctly, the real estate, and finance markets were overvalued by at least 12 Trillion dollars.

Now that the market has collapsed, the American economy suddenly lost the "make believe" value of those dollars. So now the economy is looking to make up for that money spent. The author stated that the only way to get out of this financial shortfall and recession is to have another bubble that would be in excess of 12 trillion dollars.

In my honest belief, the next bubble will be the: Alternative Power Race. In the next couple of years, you'll see many companies ramp up the production of commercially feasible ways to create power for natural resources and the sun.

Just me 2cents.... and from excessive reading.

Brian

Very good post but I do think the value of the dollar is heavily backed by oil vs finance which in theory.. could be why the U.S government isn't completely opposed to higher oil prices.

[ironchef]

Very good post but I do think the value of the dollar is heavily backed by oil vs finance which in theory.. could be why the U.S government isn't completely opposed to higher oil prices.Yep, because its lining their pockets with profits while emptying ours.

[BanginJimmy]

we arent in a recession, we are in a stagnant economy. Recession comes from the root word recede which means to fall back or lose ground. 1st quarter shows the GDP was up .6%.

I also think we are on the way to a recession but we arent there yet. Its a natural economic cycle and its also something that happens at just about every election, especially a tightly contested one like this one is. Foreign investors pull some of their capital out of our economy and the average US citizen does the same.

[BanginJimmy]

Yep, because its lining their pockets with profits while emptying ours.

got anything to back this up?

Heres a better question, why dont you explain how oil prices are set. That way we can judge if its worth listening to any more of your banter.

[0p7!mu5]

i think we're gettin there fast and its just going to happen anyway. Like what was stated in earlier posts we keep jumping from bubble to bubble. Unfortunately for oil companies it's not a renewable source (at least in several lifetimes anyway) so yeah it would make sense to jump to alternative resources which could be good for us period. We just got a really bad start at the moment in my opinion. yes bush was a total waste imo but we did elect him so lets not **** this up this year. The housing market was doomed to begin with if housing prices were rising faster than peoples wages it was doomed to bomb. Its a domino effect Im even feeling it at work (im in a warehouse). We've had less orders to fill within the past two months and it makes sense because we cant afford to ship as much which is also why we're switching couriers. I dont think this mess is over by a longshot.

[ironchef]

got anything to back this up?

Heres a better question, why dont you explain how oil prices are set. That way we can judge if its worth listening to any more of your banter.Got anything to prove it wrong?

Oil prices are set by commodity traders, who are in turn influenced by current events, such as the declining value of the dollar.

LOL @ the banter comment btw. Come back when you have something real to try and insult me on.

[TheDarkRacer]

OPEC, don't they set the base for the prices of oil by the Barrel? But doesn't the U.S. have a reserve of oil to last us 5(i think its that many) years?

Anyways, I'm gonna throw in my 2Cents...
I dislike Bush, A lot. Simply said. I feel he has been the puppet for many greedy people in politics. He isn't a very bright man. He can't do a lot of things that the United States president should be able to do, on his own. I think he should have been out of office by now. I don't know how he got reelected. I think he has a big part in economic crisis we're in right now. But at the same time, a large part of the economic crisis also has to do with the Real Estate being played out(simply said). I recently went to a business meeting and they laid it out like this:
The Baby Boomers are the single target age range for the majority of products right now. Why? Because this one 13year(i think) age range is 1/6th of the worlds/U.S.(cant remember) population. If you advertise your product for this one age range(what ever it is depending on the year) then you are advertising for 1/6 of the population. Remember G.I. Joe? When was the most popular? Now think of all those millions of people, they all grew up and wanted to purchase their own home. Around the time when they are old enough(with a steady job) they purchased a house. When 1/6th of the population buys a house, there is more supply then demand, therefor, more money to be spent on houses, building land, ect. and the Real Estate market exploded. Now The Majority of those Baby Boomers own/ed a house and look what is happening to the Real Estate market. Need more be said?

Its just part of the way the world works. But it sill can be influenced to have a lesser impact on the economy.
/Rant
~TDR

[BanginJimmy]

Got anything to prove it wrong?

Oil prices are set by commodity traders, who are in turn influenced by current events, such as the declining value of the dollar.

LOL @ the banter comment btw. Come back when you have something real to try and insult me on.

I'm not the one making the accusations, I have nothing to back up.


You forgot one part of the equation. OPEC controls the supply, they could increase supply by something as small as .5mil barrells a day and the increased supply would drop the oil price somewhere in the area of $6.00 a barrell. That in turn would drop gas prices about $0.30 a gallon.

[ironchef]

I'm not the one making the accusations, I have nothing to back up.
http://www.roguegovernment.com/news.php?id=8694

^ Food for thought.

[BanginJimmy]

http://www.roguegovernment.com/news.php?id=8694

^ Food for thought.


Nothing I didnt already know.

also this quote at the end
"When our boys and girls are wounded the government bills them to return their reenlistment bonus. They have to return any pay they received while they were hospitalized. They have to pay for their helmets and uniforms that are destroyed in the hell of war. But they keep on fighting for these politicians’ right to keep their war profits."

That just made me laugh. It also completely destroyed ANY respectability that site has.
1. If you are wounded and are medically retired you keep any bonuses you have been paid. You do not receive any unpaid portions after you seperate.
2. Any pay while hospitalized is still active duty. You are paid exactly as you do if you are at your home command, including any entitlements such as BAH.
3. Actually any gear damaged or missing during a combat deployment is written off and replaced free of charge, its just a simple form thats filled out so your supply can replace it. The only exception to this MIGHT be cami's, but in most cases those are also replaced free of charge.

[Spektrewing386]

dont forget that rising prices are also due to oil companies bringing in massive profits for themselves. I have the Exxon Mobil documents to prove it.

[TheDarkRacer]

^^ can we see them :)
~TDR

[BanginJimmy]

dont forget that rising prices are also due to oil companies bringing in massive profits for themselves. I have the Exxon Mobil documents to prove it.

profits from when? And has the profit margin changed excessivly since 2001?

[Spektrewing386]

^^ can we see them :)
~TDR

http://www.envisionreports.com/XOM/2008/11fe08025m/index.html


This was in the annual report:
http://img167.imageshack.us/img167/4374/29593874xw3.jpg



This was on p.56 of the proxy report dealing with Executive Compensation (brought up by the shareholders for a topic in the meeting):

http://img373.imageshack.us/img373/8531/92172004qm7.jpg


and of course there is lots of other stuff too.