Encased Rollcage...

[speedminded]

Can't believe it's never occured to me to put sheet metal over the side bars of a rollcage! Could enclose the outside and over the top then have an insert on the inside that matches the interior (or do it all sheetmetal like below) The insert could also me made removeable as an access panel to inspect the cage underneath. Paint the sheet metal then cover it with clear vinyl to protect it from wear...

[BLK JDM]

I know AAP builds roll cages for Supras that are hidden underneath paneling. The car looks like it doesn't have a cage. It takes a lot of time and $$ though.

[speedminded]

I know AAP builds roll cages for Supras that are hidden underneath paneling. The car looks like it doesn't have a cage. It takes a lot of time and $$ though.Give me a metal brake, slicer, and a rivet gun and I'll make it happen! ;)

[BLK JDM]

Give me a metal brake, slicer, and a rivet gun and I'll make it happen! ;)

Who's gonna fab up the A, B pillar plastic or suede interior paneling and the interior inserts to cover everything up and make it look stock? hahaha

[speedminded]

Who's gonna fab up the A, B pillar plastic or suede interior paneling and the interior inserts to cover everything up and make it look stock? hahahaWrapping is easy until you start doing the curves on dashes...it's really not much different than putting upholestry on a dining room chair.

[EJ25RUN]

Is that the 360 from SuperGT GT300 in Japan?

[speedminded]

Is that the 360 from SuperGT GT300 in Japan?Technically the old JGTC i believe.

[EJ25RUN]

Technically the old JGTC i believe.

That's what i thought.

Now help me understand this.

GT300 cars (300HP) and GT500 (500HP)

so how does a Ferrari 360 that out of the factory produces far more power compete in a class limited to 300hp. I read that JGTC machines have superior aerodynamics to even FIA GT1 cars.

Are cars like the 360 still limited to 300hp or do the superior aero on the other cars + weight penalties out way the difference so the car can have more power than 300?


Here is the entry list for the 2007, SuperGT Gt300 season opener.

Privée KENZO Asset Shiden

SHIDEN MC/RT-16 / 1UZ-FE
Kazuho Takahashi
Hiroki Katoh Cars Tokai Dream28 YH
4 EBBRO 350R

VEMAC RD350R / ZV348
Tetsuya Tanaka
Shinsuke Yamazaki EBBRO TEAM NOVA YH
5 KUMHO Proμ MACH-GO 320R

VEMAC 320R / C32B
Tetsuji Tamanaka
Hironori Takeuchi TEAM MACH KH
7 RE AMEMIYA RX-7

MAZDA RX-7 (FD3S) / 20B Rotary
Hiroyuki Iiri
Ryo Orime RE AMEMIYA RACING YH
9 LEYJUN DUNLOP MT900
MOSLER MT900R OOX / LS1
OSAMU
Guts Jyonai A&S RACING DL
11 TOTAL BENEFIT JIM CENTER F360

FERRARI F360 MODENA (GF-F360) / F131B
Masayuki Ueda
Hideshi Matsuda JIM GAINER YH
13 ENDLESS ADVAN SENZAIKAKUMEI Z

NISSAN FAIRLADY Z (Z33) / VQ35DE
Masami Kageyama
Tomonobu Fujii ENDLESS SPORTS YH
19 WedsSport Celica

TOYOTA CELICA (ZZT231) / 3SGTE
Akira Iida
Yuhi Sekiguchi RACING PROJECT BANDOH YH
26 YUNKER-POWER TAISAN PORSCHE

PORSCHE 911GT3RS / M96/77
Shinichi Yamaji
Nobuteru Taniguchi TEAM TAISAN with NISHIZAWA YH
31 apr MR-S

TOYOTA MR-S (ZZW30) / 2GR-FE
Kyosuke Mineo
Yuya Sakamoto apr MI
43 ARTA Garaiya

Garaiya / VQ35DE
Morio Nitta
Shinichi Takagi AUTOBACS RACING TEAM AGURI MI
46 Houzan DUNLOP Z

NISSAN FAIRLADY Z (Z33) / VQ35DE
Kota Sasaki
Naoki Yokomizo MOLA DL
47 Houzan DUNLOP Z

NISSAN FAIRLADY Z (Z33) / VQ35DE
Shigekazu Wakisaka
Shogo Mitsuyama MOLA DL
55 DHG ADVAN FORD GT

FORD GT / DHG/D35806V
Daisuke Ikeda
Taku Bamba DHG Racing YH
62 WILLCOM ADVAN VEMAC408R

VEMAC 408R / MF458S
Shinsuke Shibahara
Haruki Kurosawa WILLCOM R&D SPORT YH
66 triple a GALLARDO RG3

Lamborghini Gallardo R-G3 / 07L1
Naohiro Furuya
Muneyuki Kurihara JLOC YH
67 triple a GALLARDO RG3

Lamborghini Gallardo R-G3 / 07L1
Tsubasa Kurosawa
Hisashi Wada JLOC YH
70 Gaishano Gaikokuya ADVAN PORSCHE

PORSCHE 996GT3RS / M96/97
Hiroshi Koizumi
Kazuyoshi Takamizawa TEAM GAIKOKUYA YH
77 CUSCO DUNLOP SUBARU IMPREZA

SUBARU IMPREZA (GD) / EJ20
Tetsuya Yamano
Takayuki Aoki CUSCO RACING DL
83 YOKOYAMA ADVAN UEMATSU RD320R

VEMAC RD320R / C32B
Tadao Uematsu
Ryohei Sakaguchi YOKOYAMA RACING YH
87 MARUHON MURCIE RG-1

Murcielago R-G1 (GH-BC10E) / L535
Yasutaka Hinoi
Atsushi Yogo JLOC YH
88 AKTIO MURCIE RG-1

Murcielago R-G1 (GH-BC10E) / L535
Marco Apicella[I]
Koji Yamanishi JLOC YH
101 TOY STORY apr MR-S

TOYOTA MR-S (ZZW30) / 2GR-FE
Kazuya Oshima
Hiroaki Ishiura apr MI
110 GREEN-TEC BOXSTER GT

PORSCHE BOXSTER / M96/77
Takuya Kurosawa
Hidetoshi Mitsusada ARKTECH MOTORSPORTS YH
118 FINA GLAD SpecialOlympics GT3R

PORSCHE 911GT3RS / M96/77
Takashi Miyamoto
Shozo Tagahara TOMEI SPORTS YH
333 Mario ADVAN ISHIMATSU PORSCHE

PORSCHE 911GT3RSR / M96/73
Katsuo Kobayashi
Takashi Inoue MARIO RACING WITH ISHIMATSU YH
666 Rakuten BOMEX 320R

VEMAC 320R / C32B
Shogo Suho
Junichiro Yama****a AVANZZA × BOMEX YH

[EJ25RUN]

I know these cars have to make more than 300hp but in GT300....Do they?

http://www.imca-slotracing.com/images/GT300-111.jpghttp://www.imca-slotracing.com/images/GT300-88.jpg
http://www.3tmotorsport.com/web2003/images/JGFerrari360.jpg
http://www.rdsport.net/2007/vemac/img/vemac_01.jpg
http://www.d3-tatsunami.net/gt/55-2.JPG

[speedminded]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_GT

[EJ25RUN]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_GT

Speedminded.... that was not one of your better post.

I feel ashamed that you would think i haven't checked wiki and many other sources before hand.

But anyways, with this article....and the success ballast system.... im assuming (like i have all along) the GT300 designation means nothing. Is this the case?

""""GT300

Few works teams participate in GT300, so the field tends to be much more varied in terms of types of cars entered; although here, as in many European and North American events, Porsche tends to dominate with its 911 GT3 model making up the bulk of the field. The big Japanese car makers also participate in this class, as well as more exotic cars from the likes of Vemac and ASL. Since 2006, European-style GT cars have chosen to concentrate in this series, with Lamborghini leading the move from the higher division with some success, including a class win in the opening round of the 2006 season at Suzuka. Along with the standard GT cars, Shiden, a Riley Daytona Prototype car also exist in GT300 class since 2006, getting outstanding results (losing the title to RX-7 with tied points but less wins in 2006, and won the title in 2007). Until early 2000s when FWD cars were being permitted to be converted to RWD configuration, many of these such as Mitsubishi FTO and Toyota Corolla Levin AE101 competed in its original configuration.

GT300 cars are much more regulated than their GT500 counterparts, and much more closely resemble road-going versions. Chassis clips and realignments are not allowed (except the latter in the case of front-wheel drive cars), which results in a much more affordable racing experience for privateers. While engine outputs and modifications are at a lower level than the GT500 cars, the GT300 cars still post competitive times and races are very competitive.""""

[speedminded]

Speedminded.... that was not one of your better post.

I feel ashamed that you would think i haven't checked wiki and many other sources before hand.

But anyways, with this article....and the success ballast system.... im assuming (like i have all along) the GT300 designation means nothing. Is this the case?

""""GT300

Few works teams participate in GT300, so the field tends to be much more varied in terms of types of cars entered; although here, as in many European and North American events, Porsche tends to dominate with its 911 GT3 model making up the bulk of the field. The big Japanese car makers also participate in this class, as well as more exotic cars from the likes of Vemac and ASL. Since 2006, European-style GT cars have chosen to concentrate in this series, with Lamborghini leading the move from the higher division with some success, including a class win in the opening round of the 2006 season at Suzuka. Along with the standard GT cars, Shiden, a Riley Daytona Prototype car also exist in GT300 class since 2006, getting outstanding results (losing the title to RX-7 with tied points but less wins in 2006, and won the title in 2007). Until early 2000s when FWD cars were being permitted to be converted to RWD configuration, many of these such as Mitsubishi FTO and Toyota Corolla Levin AE101 competed in its original configuration.

GT300 cars are much more regulated than their GT500 counterparts, and much more closely resemble road-going versions. Chassis clips and realignments are not allowed (except the latter in the case of front-wheel drive cars), which results in a much more affordable racing experience for privateers. While engine outputs and modifications are at a lower level than the GT500 cars, the GT300 cars still post competitive times and races are very competitive.""""Too busy editing pics and posting before lunch to get further into it :tongue:

[EJ25RUN]

Too busy editing pics and posting before lunch to get further into it :tongue:

Awaiting better response!

[santacruz77]

how have you never though.seen that befor haha

[speedminded]

how have you never though.seen that befor hahaYeah you know...there's tons of JGTC cars at Road Atlanta, Sebring, Moroso, Homestead, Daytona, VIR, Charlotte, Talladega, Barber and whatever other tracks i've been to :tongue:

[Elbow]

Tons of American road race cars have that

[speedminded]

Tons of American road race cars have thatPost pics, i need more ideas!

[EJ25RUN]

Yeah you know...there's tons of JGTC cars at Road Atlanta, Sebring, Moroso, Homestead, Daytona, VIR, Charlotte, Talladega, Barber and whatever other tracks i've been to :tongue:

I haven't seen them.... like the GT3 Porsche and Ferraris or others?

[speedminded]

I haven't seen them.... like the GT3 Porsche and Ferraris or others?Doesn't matter what the car is, i've spent literally hundreds of hours at various tracks and have not seen it before. :dunno:

[matthewAPM]

Doesn't matter what the car is, i've spent literally hundreds of hours at various tracks and have not seen it before. :dunno:

well then you my friend FAIL!

i see it all the time. anywhere from regional SCCA cars all the way up to pro series.

how many hours have you spent ON the track? lol

[EJ25RUN]

well then you my friend FAIL!

i see it all the time. anywhere from regional SCCA cars all the way up to pro series.

how many hours have you spent ON the track? lol

im confused.... are you taking about actual cars that raced in jgtc then brought over?

or

cars that are like those in jgtc and other series like the fia gt championship and alms?

[speedminded]

well then you my friend FAIL!

i see it all the time. anywhere from regional SCCA cars all the way up to pro series.

how many hours have you spent ON the track? lolHow can you see the inside of other cars from the driver's seat?

I've probably taken 10,000 times more photos ON the track and IN the hot pits and in the paddock than anyone else on this forum plus crewed for 3 differant race teams working on a total of nearly 40 cars between them and still haven't seen it.

Enclosing the sides reminds me of how it is to be in an original GT40 so I would notice it if I've seen it.

[matthewAPM]

How can you see the inside of other cars from the driver's seat?

I've probably taken 10,000 times more photos ON the track and IN the hot pits and in the paddock than anyone else on this forum plus crewed for 3 differant race teams working on a total of nearly 40 cars between them and still haven't seen it.

Enclosing the sides reminds me of how it is to be in an original GT40 so I would notice it if I've seen it.

check out a few of the really competitive IT cars and the GT cars. they got it. I will bring my camera to the national in march and post the pics up....i will probly forgot

BTW, nice picture of the stalker

[speedminded]

check out a few of the really competitive IT cars and the GT cars. they got it. I will bring my camera to the national in march and post the pics up....i will probly forgotWouldn't you think there would already be pics of all these cars on the internet already? How many nationals do you think I had media access and/or crewed for?

[matthewAPM]

Wouldn't you think there would already be pics of all these cars on the internet already? How many nationals do you think I had media access and/or crewed for?

Of the interiors? and actually, there really isnt that many pictures from the SCCA regional/ national events at RA.

^^read what i edited

[Elbow]

Yeah I have seen anything from a ITS RX-7 up to a ALMS Porsche

[DinanM3atl]

Man this is an angry post over some hidden roll cages :)

Who cares. If you got the cash you waste your time on hiding the roll cage. If it built up like that Ferrari on the inside and is racing there is probably a cage under it ;)

[speedminded]

Man this is an angry post over some hidden roll cages :)

Who cares. If you got the cash you waste your time on hiding the roll cage. If it built up like that Ferrari on the inside and is racing there is probably a cage under it ;)It's just for a cleaner look vs. climbing inside a jungle gym. Plus could run wiring to the back in it, put switches on it, or even a vent in it to allow more air flow then what's provided on the dash.

Won't know how practical it is until the cage is done but cost is 100% irrelevant when you have a pneumatic riveter and access to a metal brake and slicer. What is it, about $100 for a 4' x 10' sheet of aluminum sheet metal? It's not like I have to pay someone $100+ p/hr to make something I can fabricate myself.

[matthewAPM]

i got a HUGE sheet of metal at my house.

and about running wire, you could do that with just tubing. here is a picture of it done in CF
http://images.superstreetonline.com/featuredvehicles/130_0405_06_z+skunk2_honda_sir+driver_side_interio r_view.jpg

[speedminded]

i got a HUGE sheet of metal at my house.

and about running wire, you could do that with just tubing. here is a picture of it done in CF
http://images.superstreetonline.com/featuredvehicles/130_0405_06_z+skunk2_honda_sir+driver_side_interio r_view.jpgI'd do anything to have the interior door skins like that but rolls of carbon fiber are pretty high $$$ right now. Still contemplating black suede on everything!

[slow_hatch]

/\ That looks sick :eek:

[matthewAPM]

I'd do anything to have the interior door skins like that but rolls of carbon fiber are pretty high $$$ right now. Still contemplating black suede on everything!

whos BMW?

PM me about the CF

[speedminded]

whos BMW?

PM me about the CFPasi from Carfreaks.com... http://carfreaks.net/garage/?car=6 or http://carfreaks.net/photos/garage/m3pasi/

[Elbow]

i got a HUGE sheet of metal at my house.

and about running wire, you could do that with just tubing. here is a picture of it done in CF
http://images.superstreetonline.com/featuredvehicles/130_0405_06_z+skunk2_honda_sir+driver_side_interio r_view.jpg

Passenger seat ftw

[DinanM3atl]

If you build it right why do you have to climb over a "jungle gym"? What will covering the bars do for you? It is only going to the same height as the bars or higher if you space it over the bars.

I just don't see the point in the time spent whether you are paying someone or doing it yourself. I guess if you want to impress people looking at it then it would be worthwhile. I would rather spend my hours that I would spend doing it doing something else.

[StraightSix]

Perhaps, something more important that no one has considered are the implications for the car passing tech at the event you want to drive.

For example, I'm about 90% certain that if a car showed up to a NASA-SE event with a cage like in the Ferrari, we would not allow it to pass tech. Why?

There wouldn't be any SFI padding protecting the driver's or instructor's melons in the event of an off course excursion into a tire wall, or, God forbid, a roll over.

Maybe you have checked the rules for the sanctioning body where you want to drive the car, but the posts in this thread seem to indicate otherwise.

[Elbow]

The drivers helmet cant even touch it though probably, and that is weird there is no padding anyway.

[StraightSix]

You might be surprised how much a driver, or passenger, will really move in a track incident...even when properly harnessed into the car.

[Elbow]

True

[speedminded]

Perhaps, something more important that no one has considered are the implications for the car passing tech at the event you want to drive.

For example, I'm about 90% certain that if a car showed up to a NASA-SE event with a cage like in the Ferrari, we would not allow it to pass tech. Why?

There wouldn't be any SFI padding protecting the driver's or instructor's melons in the event of an off course excursion into a tire wall, or, God forbid, a roll over.

Maybe you have checked the rules for the sanctioning body where you want to drive the car, but the posts in this thread seem to indicate otherwise.That's the point I was trying to make with everyone saying they see it all the time...i'm pretty sure it's not legal where they say they've seen it BUT who says they can't use SFI padding on the face of it just like the interior of a formula Mazda/Atlantic/Ford, etc.

http://www.pegasusautoracing.com/productselection.asp?Product=2396

I've already mentioned [at least once] about making the interior panel removable for cage inspection...could easily do the same for the exterior panel too allowing a full 360° view around all the welds on the cross bars. It's really not rocket science.

The lil project car I'm building probably won't be legal in ANY competitive sanctioning body, lolol...it's just a fun 2,100-2,200lbs play car with nearly 400hp on low boost. Will make a great time attack car though, should I post the specifications of the cage they require for you? ;)

[speedminded]

If you build it right why do you have to climb over a "jungle gym"? What will covering the bars do for you? It is only going to the same height as the bars or higher if you space it over the bars.

I just don't see the point in the time spent whether you are paying someone or doing it yourself. I guess if you want to impress people looking at it then it would be worthwhile. I would rather spend my hours that I would spend doing it doing something else.It's really not that hard to imagine, visually a flat smooth surface is going to be more appealing then a bunch of cross bars. Sure it's going to enclose the "cockpit" more, it may even make it feel smaller inside but the goal is to make the interior clean and simple. Who knows, it may not look the way i want it too...that's why i want to see more pics of it to get ideas!!

[DinanM3atl]

I completely understand what you are doing. The enclosed cages seems more of a "oh wow damn that is SICK" kind of response on a web forum.

When I was at Fall-Line Motorsports in Chicago building Grand Am Cup M3s(now Koni Challenge) there was no time to worry about bull **** like that. There was chassis setup and engine tuning and the list goes on and on. The point of a race car is to win and most of the time function comes over form if it helps win.

I will say again, I don't see the point in wasting my own time or paying someone to do this. It certainly may look cool and get some responses on a web forum but what is the point?

Time Attack have bull**** rules for safety. I think you can run a bolt in 4 point... maybe requires a 6 point. Why don't you build the car to a class?

[speedminded]

I completely understand what you are doing. The enclosed cages seems more of a "oh wow damn that is SICK" kind of response on a web forum.

When I was at Fall-Line Motorsports in Chicago building Grand Am Cup M3s(now Koni Challenge) there was no time to worry about bull **** like that. There was chassis setup and engine tuning and the list goes on and on. The point of a race car is to win and most of the time function comes over form if it helps win.

I will say again, I don't see the point in wasting my own time or paying someone to do this. It certainly may look cool and get some responses on a web forum but what is the point?

Time Attack have bull**** rules for safety. I think you can run a bolt in 4 point... maybe requires a 6 point. Why don't you build the car to a class?I'm not doing it for anyone else silly, I could give a **** what anyone else thinks about a car I build when it's for me!

~looking for the race car~ **crickets**

...nope, still not a race car. I sure as hell won't let anyone drive next to my car like that let alone a couple dozen. That's what a stock body, legal brakes, non-turbo, etc. car is for. I don't have a schedule, I don't have a calender of events I have to drive in, I don't have a race team relying to feed their families with the car...nothing. It's just a safe and relatively quick play car that will occasionally see time on the track. I will have a track car but it won't be this one.

As for Time Attack, I don't care if they allow PVC pipe for a rollcage...i'm building it to the specs I feel safe in, whether its SCCA or DTM or a combination of all the best and safest things I find.

[StraightSix]

I suppose my take on the whole idea is similar to DinanM3Atl's. I don't really see the point to putting all the work into something that will ultimately only add weight and make the tech inspection process at track events, however many you attend, more cumbersome.

I agree that the other people who have posted previously claiming to have seen something similar to the Ferrari in your original post at local SCCA events "all the time" are flat wrong. I go to a lot of track events and I haven't seen anything like that...ever.

To me the notion of an enclosed roll cage is something that's just bling. The overwhelming point that i really wanted to make was that before spending the time to enclose your roll structure make sure it will be allowed by whatever track event sanctioning body where you might want to enjoy your creation.

[dazn]

I suppose my take on the whole idea is similar to DinanM3Atl's. I don't really see the point to putting all the work into something that will ultimately only add weight and make the tech inspection process at track events, however many you attend, more cumbersome.

I agree that the other people who have posted previously claiming to have seen something similar to the Ferrari in your original post at local SCCA events "all the time" are flat wrong. I go to a lot of track events and I haven't seen anything like that...ever.

To me the notion of an enclosed roll cage is something that's just bling. The overwhelming point that i really wanted to make was that before spending the time to enclose your roll structure make sure it is will be allowed by whatever track event sanctioning body where you might want to enjoy your creation.



I am at almost every SE NASA and SCCA event and have never seen an "enclosed" cage. There may be some in a BP car or some production series but even the top IT cars dont have any.

if you do plan on racing the car in any sanctioned events, just make sure you get your cage drilled, teched and stamped before covering everything up. you might even leave the area where it stamped clear so it can be seen easily.