GSR vs. LS vtech < whats the difference?

[DaRussian]

like the title says what is the difference between a gsr and an ls vtech? big difference in the block?

[GaGen2Teg]

ls/vtec = ls bottom or crv bottom with a vtec head...basically best of both worlds torque and top end power

gsr= a gsr is a gsr haha idk

[japan4racing]

the difference is most ppl toss a bunch of crap together to make a ls/vtec then get pissed when it makes less power than a gsr and costs twice as much. if you build a ls/vtec right you can make decent power...but seriously..whynot just get a stock gsr swap and boost it....thats what i did and it ran low 12's in a 4 door dx civic

[blackshine007]

The LS vtec will make more low end tq but won't last as long as the GS-R motor. You come out better going with the GS-r motor if you want longevity

[GaGen2Teg]

what they said just got with a gsr

[xlilvi3tx]

ls/vtec = ls bottom or crv bottom with a vtec head...basically best of both worlds torque and top end power

gsr= a gsr is a gsr haha idk

thats b20vtec

ls vtec - good low end torque with a lil vtec fun to help out at high end but not reliable for sh!t

gsr - motor that is in over half the hondas on here

[GaGen2Teg]

thats b20vtec

ls vtec - good low end torque with a lil vtec fun to help out at high end but not reliable for sh!t

gsr - motor that is in over half the hondas on here

yeah im well aware of that

[xlilvi3tx]

yeah im well aware of that

just making sure u didnt get the 2 twisted up since u stated the a b20 is a lsvtec that is all :goodjob:

[GaGen2Teg]

just making sure u didnt get the 2 twisted up since u stated the a b20 is a lsvtec that is all :goodjob:

word i feel ya i wouldnt i already had my ls/vtec days done and over with that maybe...haha

[khaxnguyen]

LS bottom end and GSR bottom end is different isnt it?

[japan4racing]

LS bottom end and GSR bottom end is different isnt it?

:headslap: :lmao:

[gtikid]

like the title says what is the difference between a gsr and an ls vtech? big difference in the block?

The major difference between the 2 is that with one, you get a phone with it, and with the other, you get vtec :goodjob:

Your choice

[mengus200sx]

If u go with a gsr, then get a jdm Gsr. it will make more power then the usdm gsr. it will last u a very long time, unless u abuse it. ls/vtec suck and wont last long, unless u built it rite. if u got the $$$ for it then go ahead. i think b20vtec is better then ls/vtec.

[TheChosenOne]

Listen...

Ls/vtec aren't for the weak hearted. They DO make more power than a Gsr; stock for stock. But just like previously stated, if you don't built it right, it's more than likely going to last as long as a disposable contact.:goodjob:

Now, they are both l.8 liter motors with identicle Vtec heads (depending on whether you use a gsr head or a b16 head), so obviously the difference is in the block. THe pistons are the same size, but the stock gsr pistons will yeild a higher compression ratio.

The crank in the LS is the key to making power in an Ls/Vtec. It allows for much more responsive low end torque (even more torque with a b20 bottom end) than a Gsr.

Theoreticaly, ls/vtec's are not ment to be reved past 8k rpms, while gsr can go past 8k with no problem.

The question is whether you want power or reliability.;)

[khaxnguyen]

:headslap: :lmao:

what's that suppose to mean? it was kinda rhetorical...

[IggyBcool]

If u go with a gsr, then get a jdm Gsr.

It's all about the JDM :rolleyes:

[japan4racing]

this thread is the win......vtec fo life s0n!

[Z0_o6]

the difference is 37.

[AnthonyF]

:headslap: :lmao:dont pick on him now. he even asked a 350z owner why his rear wheels had a bigger dish than his front wheels...

[japan4racing]

the difference is 37.

el oh el

[Krappy]

If u go with a gsr, then get a jdm Gsr. it will make more power then the usdm gsr. it will last u a very long time, unless u abuse it. ls/vtec suck and wont last long, unless u built it rite. if u got the $$$ for it then go ahead. i think b20vtec is better then ls/vtec.
no such thing as a "jdm gsr" its a SI-R motor... which is equivolent to the USDM GSR....and yes reliability depends on how well its been built and put together....

[Z0_o6]

el oh el


at least somebody got it...

[allmotoronly]

LS bottom end and GSR bottom end is different isnt it?

The main differences between the two bottom ends are:
The GSR has a 87.2mm stroke, the LS block has a 89mm stroke.
GSR has higher compression pistons
GSR has oil squirters
GSR has a higher volume oil pump
GSR already has oil passages to accept a VTEC head, LS does not
GSR has different size bearings
GSR has stronger rods
GSR is 1797cc, LS is 1834cc

[allmotoronly]

Listen...

Ls/vtec aren't for the weak hearted. They DO make more power than a Gsr; stock for stock. But just like previously stated, if you don't built it right, it's more than likely going to last as long as a disposable contact.:goodjob:

Now, they are both l.8 liter motors with identicle Vtec heads (depending on whether you use a gsr head or a b16 head), so obviously the difference is in the block. THe pistons are the same size, but the stock gsr pistons will yeild a higher compression ratio.

The crank in the LS is the key to making power in an Ls/Vtec. It allows for much more responsive low end torque (even more torque with a b20 bottom end) than a Gsr.

Theoreticaly, ls/vtec's are not ment to be reved past 8k rpms, while gsr can go past 8k with no problem.

The question is whether you want power or reliability.;)

you can make just as much power with a GSR as you can with a LS/VTEC... The reason the LS/VTEC makes more low end torque is because of the slightly longer stroke (heavier crank=more rotating mass=more torque), which is also what makes the LS/VTEC not capable of the higher RPM's that the GSR can handle. Stock for stock, a LS/VTEC will make about the same hp as a GSR. The reason most LS/VTEC's make more is because a lot of times people will go ahead and get a set of pr3 pistons or p73 pistons to raise the C/R. Also, chances are that most people are going to run a chipped ecu and have the car professionally tuned (if they are serious about how their setup runs). A good tune is what makes the difference between a stock GSR engine and a LS/VTEC.

Bottom line: LS/VTEC's make good low end power, but are not as reliable as the GSR, and (unless built) can not handle the higher rpm's necessary to make the most power with the VTEC head.

In the end, a GSR engine is more reliable, and as soon as you start building, both are just as capable as each other.

[KevinT707]

Bottom line: LS/VTEC's make good low end power, but are not as reliable as the GSR, and (unless built) can not handle the higher rpm's necessary to make the most power with the VTEC head.

In the end, a GSR engine is more reliable, and as soon as you start building, both are just as capable as each other.
Good point :goodjob:

[AnclyT]

the similarity of a GSR and an ls/vtec is that they will get pwn'd by the h22

:idb:

[allmotoronly]

the similarity of a GSR and an ls/vtec is that they will get pwn'd by the h22

:idb:

not necessarily. I've owned and built both. The only advantage the h22a has is the larger displacement.

[japan4racing]

ive always said if the ls/vtec was such a good idea honda would have made it....and they did....b18c1/5 ect and they even made it rev really high......ok ok ok...it dont make the torque the ls bottom end makes.....it dont make the power either though. i have had a few freinds go the ls/vtec route..and they always regret it. i went the gsr route...years later i still have the same motor. it was boosted twice, had a nitrous set-up once, been down the track numerous times, seen 9500rpms and 17 spi all on a stock gsr motor with a 57 trim and 60 trim turbo. when i pulled it apart to build it, it looked great inside. my ls/vtec buddies didnt last more than 15k miles...my **** had over 20k from me and 120k total. so imho...gsr>lsvtec...i will never have one and never want one. i undertand the concept and im not disputing the fact hat make more torque....but if i want more torque i will turn a knob on my boost controller and make more than that ls/vtec ever thought about making. you want a reliable set-up that makes all around power and torque go with a gsr and a turbo set-up....the end

[southside]

ive always said if the ls/vtec was such a good idea honda would have made it....and they did....b18c1/5 ect and they even made it rev really high......ok ok ok...it dont make the torque the ls bottom end makes.....it dont make the power either though. i have had a few freinds go the ls/vtec route..and they always regret it. i went the gsr route...years later i still have the same motor. it was boosted twice, had a nitrous set-up once, been down the track numerous times, seen 9500rpms and 17 spi all on a stock gsr motor with a 57 trim and 60 trim turbo. when i pulled it apart to build it, it looked great inside. my ls/vtec buddies didnt last more than 15k miles...my **** had over 20k from me and 120k total. so imho...gsr>lsvtec...i will never have one and never want one. i undertand the concept and im not disputing the fact hat make more torque....but if i want more torque i will turn a knob on my boost controller and make more than that ls/vtec ever thought about making. you want a reliable set-up that makes all around power and torque go with a gsr and a turbo set-up....the end:thinking: Are you comparing your boosted gsr to all motor ls/vtec:???: .Because seems to me your knob makes you feel good when u turn it upto like 20psi and make more power than ls/vtec.If you got the money to do a ls/vtec right and not throw bs together like your friends proble did.Then it will be more reliable and strong, but when you just slap a vtec head on a ls:no: bad idea.

[v8killacivic]

e
the similarity of a GSR and an ls/vtec is that they will get pwn'd by the h22

:idb:

well said...:goodjob:

[japan4racing]

:thinking: Are you comparing your boosted gsr to all motor ls/vtec:???: .Because seems to me your knob makes you feel good when u turn it upto like 20psi and make more power than ls/vtec.If you got the money to do a ls/vtec right and not throw bs together like your friends proble did.Then it will be more reliable and strong, but when you just slap a vtec head on a ls:no: bad idea.

no, im saying that if you want more torque just boost your stock gsr and still be reliable. motor for motor the gsr is a better motor in my opinion. yea, it makes less torque but thats where the turbo set-up comes in. you want torque, dont rely on experimental motors....go turbo and make all you want. i never said you cant make an ls/vtec reliable..i just said my experiences with them are not good ones. i think you read too deep into what i typed and you formed my opinion for me. and the ls/vtec motors i was referring to that my freinds had were not slapped together stock ****....sleeved, rods, pistons, ect ect and assembled by a good builder.

[allmotoronly]

even the best built ls/vtec will never be as reliable as a B18C1/5. Honda designed these engines around the fact that they need to rev high to make the most power. Thats why the B18C1/5 has a shorter stroke than the B18A/B. Shorter stroke=lower piston speed, which equals higher rpm capabilities.

[Vteckidd]

so much bad information in this thread.

[Benefit]

b18c5 > everything

[TheChosenOne]

so much bad information in this thread.
Filter it out for us, so some kid doesn't come along and base his build off of this "mal-informatory" thread. ;)

One thing is for certain that the Ls/Vtec has a long stroke than a stock GSR.

Another fact is that the stock Ls/Vtec (stock ls bottom end with stick GSR head) will make more hp than a stock gsr.

Now, of course, the main variable will be the build quality, so we could say that more often than not, a gsr will be more reliable than a Ls/Vtec, especially in the high RPMs which honda's have been known to make substantial power.

So, with the original question answered above, the nexxt question is undoubtably somewhere along the lines of this:

"Which setup will make the most power, the cheapest way, while maintaining reliability?" :no:

...exhibit "A":yes:

Fast + Realiable = Expensive
Fast + Cheap = Not Reliable
Cheap + Reliable = Slow... eerrr something like that. :screwy: ... don't quote me.

The moral of the story, kiddies, is this:

With the right amount of money, you can make power with almost anything.
The reason that the LS/Vtec was created wasn't because some honda owner sat down 13 years ago and worked out the schematics of an LS motor and concluded that they would have an increased displacement over a GSR by 1.97% by using a GSR head on a B18B block...:thinking:

It was more along the lines of this...:

"Damnn Dude, I'm broke as helll, but I wanna faster motor. Sheit... I got this GSR head laying around, and I head that if you throw in on my ls it'll be quick."

...and VUWALA! The poor-man's-GSR was born.:D

So, if yoru like me, and you don't have deep pockets, and you wanna your civc or integra to keep up... Go for the ls/vtec. But beware... budget builds aren't garunteed for anything...

just my :2cents:

[Lucky.]

like the title says what is the difference between a gsr and an ls vtech? big difference in the block?

the GSR b18c is an engine and the VTECH is a phone...

[jwrape]

Ok, I am new to the Honda scene but not knew to cars or mechanics, matter of fact I just swapped a 1.6L Vtec into my brothers Civic last week, but anyway, I am being a good board member and doing a search and found this thread.

History: Just bought a 95' Integra GS-R. The previous owner said he bought it as a GS-R but the previous owner said he had swapped a LS motor into it(dunno why). The car runs good and in fact is a GS-R per Title but is the only way to confirm that it has been swapped is to check for the B18C on the block or is there some other way?

Also, if it is a LS motor in a GS-R car, will the ECU or anything else affect this motor to not run as well?
Thanks
Jason:goodjob:

[Z0_o6]

... jesus at bring up the old thread.


the motor was proabably swapped out to be sold, or it blew up. if the block says B18A or B18B it is an LS, if it says B18C it is a GSR, if it says B18A/B but DOHC VTEC ont eh valve cover, it is an LS/VTEC. if it has the vtec computer on an LS it will have CEL's for all kinds of good stuff like vtec solenoid and knock sensor. it will not be as fast as a GSR if it is in fact an LS due to it being from the lower trim model anyways.

[Captain-Obvious™]

Fast + Realiable = Expensive
Fast + Cheap = Not Reliable
Cheap + Reliable = Slow... eerrr something like that. :screwy: ... don't quote me.

come on jordan it's:

Fast + Reliable = Not Cheap
Fast + Cheap = Not Reliable
Cheap + Reliable = Not Fast

[jwrape]

... jesus at bring up the old thread.


the motor was proabably swapped out to be sold, or it blew up. if the block says B18A or B18B it is an LS, if it says B18C it is a GSR, if it says B18A/B but DOHC VTEC ont eh valve cover, it is an LS/VTEC. if it has the vtec computer on an LS it will have CEL's for all kinds of good stuff like vtec solenoid and knock sensor. it will not be as fast as a GSR if it is in fact an LS due to it being from the lower trim model anyways.

Ok, I looked yesterday and found it's a B18B1 block. It's aVTEC Head. It all seems to work fine but it does idle funny when it's cold. The RPMS jump for a few minutes unti lit warms up. The car runs good but I don't think it acts like a GSR should being that it's a LS.

[Z0_o6]

...you need to know that gsr's aren't exactly fast to begin with.

[jwrape]

...you need to know that gsr's aren't exactly fast to begin with.

So what is the big hype about GSR's anyways. I know I bought one but it was just by chance that it's a GSR and I bought it. I didn't set out looking for one, just wanted a clean Integra. Actually I started out looking for a CRX.
Anyways, whats so special about them. I don't see a huge difference between the LS and GSR anyways. Maybe I am missing it.
Teach me.. :D

I understand from reading this thread that the LS has more low end torque and even more compression I believe. To me, I would think that would make the LS motor better for DD unless it was boosted. Maybe if gas goes back down i will boost my Integra cause my love is Turbo'd cars but for now, the more mileage I can get the better. :yes:

[Z0_o6]

no, the LS has lower compression (mid 9-s vs. high 10-s for the gsr) and no vtec aka no high revs.

the LS is a fantastic engine for a turbo car due to the lower compression and easier tuning, with a little more torque.

the GSR is even better as a boosted engine due to the oil squirters keeping the pistons slightly coolerm the better breathing of a vtec head, higher compression means less boost per hp.

ls vtec isn't bad my buddy made 391 whp @15-16 psi on pump gas with a mildly built ls/vtec. you just might as well go forged internals and some other beefy good stuff while you're building it.

[jwrape]

no, the LS has lower compression (mid 9-s vs. high 10-s for the gsr) and no vtec aka no high revs.

the LS is a fantastic engine for a turbo car due to the lower compression and easier tuning, with a little more torque.

the GSR is even better as a boosted engine due to the oil squirters keeping the pistons slightly coolerm the better breathing of a vtec head, higher compression means less boost per hp.

ls vtec isn't bad my buddy made 391 whp @15-16 psi on pump gas with a mildly built ls/vtec. you just might as well go forged internals and some other beefy good stuff while you're building it.

Yea, that is how I built my Conquest Tsi motor. Weisco Forged 8:1 pistons, Race Prep rods, hopefully it will be a strong bottom end. No top end work other than all new parts but eventually I might up the boost.

[SandM]

Ok, I looked yesterday and found it's a B18B1 block. It's aVTEC Head. It all seems to work fine but it does idle funny when it's cold. The RPMS jump for a few minutes unti lit warms up. The car runs good but I don't think it acts like a GSR should being that it's a LS.

ok, that means you have an LS/VTEC. Very common swap. What's the head stamp say?

[Z0_o6]

ooh ooh i know! P72 cause they spun a rod bearing due to oil starvation on the GSR bottom end!!!!



lol i guess anyways.

[SandM]

thats what i was thinking, but it could have been a theft recover with no motor, or he wanted a poor mans arrrr and sold the gsr

[dsm3g]

Filter it out for us, so some kid doesn't come along and base his build off of this "mal-informatory" thread. ;)

One thing is for certain that the Ls/Vtec has a long stroke than a stock GSR.

Another fact is that the stock Ls/Vtec (stock ls bottom end with stick GSR head) will make more hp than a stock gsr.

Now, of course, the main variable will be the build quality, so we could say that more often than not, a gsr will be more reliable than a Ls/Vtec, especially in the high RPMs which honda's have been known to make substantial power.

So, with the original question answered above, the nexxt question is undoubtably somewhere along the lines of this:

"Which setup will make the most power, the cheapest way, while maintaining reliability?" :no:

...exhibit "A":yes:

Fast + Realiable = Expensive
Fast + Cheap = Not Reliable
Cheap + Reliable = Slow... eerrr something like that. :screwy: ... don't quote me.

The moral of the story, kiddies, is this:

With the right amount of money, you can make power with almost anything.
The reason that the LS/Vtec was created wasn't because some honda owner sat down 13 years ago and worked out the schematics of an LS motor and concluded that they would have an increased displacement over a GSR by 1.97% by using a GSR head on a B18B block...:thinking:

It was more along the lines of this...:

"Damnn Dude, I'm broke as helll, but I wanna faster motor. Sheit... I got this GSR head laying around, and I head that if you throw in on my ls it'll be quick."

...and VUWALA! The poor-man's-GSR was born.:D

So, if yoru like me, and you don't have deep pockets, and you wanna your civc or integra to keep up... Go for the ls/vtec. But beware... budget builds aren't garunteed for anything...

just my :2cents:


^best bit of information i found in this thread, great point man.

[jwrape]

ok, that means you have an LS/VTEC. Very common swap. What's the head stamp say?

Where's that badge located? Don't ever remember seeing that one.

[jwrape]

^best bit of information i found in this thread, great point man.

So assuming I have a LS head on my LS B18B1 block now, I could potentially swap the LS head with the GSR head and get some decent power for my DD?
That would be sweet. I don't like to reve in the higher RPMs anyways. So doing the swap should be pretty reliable as long as I don't peg it at 9krpms, right?

[jwrape]

ok, that means you have an LS/VTEC. Very common swap. What's the head stamp say?

Head Stamp says PR4-2.. What is that? Is it the LS Head? Isn't the GSR head P72?