K series build

[JRDman]

I have gotten lucky enough to score a good bit of RSX stuff and a roller. Now its the drive train time. I know there is a ton of very smart people when it comes to honda stuff here so I have a few questions.

the setup is a 2002 RSX type s for car and then engine will be the same K series that comes in it with manual trans.

I am trying to find out if 1) the stuff I have heard is correct and 2) anything else to add to the list because I am trying to find the most bang for the buck.

things Ive heard-

go with TSX rods because they are stronger
tsx exhaust cam is better cam for the motor
RBC intake manifold
run K pro for tuning
do some tuning with the VTC mechanism
TL throttle body is better than stock
s2000 oil pump / TSX oil pump can work and work better than stock.

stuff im looking into finding out-
how much do these motors respond to mild porting, which header is the best bang for the buck because 1200+ for a head is kinda expensive right now, and what other "tricks" work for picking up power.


thanks guys for any light you can shed on the topic!

CJ

[JDM onlyy]

I know the K-Pro is the ****...the RBC flows better than the Type S mani. And I think they TL throttle body is bigger, but if you go too big and you're car can't support the flow...you're just gonna make less power. Thats all I know bout that...Haven't gotten into the new K-Series or anything...although I should

[JRDman]

well I appreciate what you posted just because If i hear the same info from alot of people then it must be decent tricks.

CJ

[Boostedek]

go to k20a.org to find your info...

[b17a1db2]

the tsx rods, don't make sense, it's in a 2.4L which has a much larger stroke.. so i highy doubt those rods would work in a k20.

[JRDman]

thats what i thought... just what i heard

[KPowerEP3]

You're not going to have problems with rod strength as long as it's an A2, it's the A3's with weak bottom ends. As for the oil pump, stock is fine as well there, you think honda would put it in a motor revving to 8k if it were junk?
K-pro = Win, was the best money I ever spent on my EP. As far as headers, it's generally the BCRH that people see the best gains with, although a Jackson racing RH isn't too far off the mark. There may be others, as well but those seem to be the two most popular. You have to be really careful when porting a K series head, as the intake and exhaust runners have weird designs to them, I'd invest that money in a good set of cams, myself.

[Tech5]

??? but your civic was still slow, there matt, when we gonna run the EH-2 vs the Talon vs Miata?

[Tech5]

lol

[lxpaulxl]

I use to have a full bolt on kproed rsx. It was pretty damn good for what it was. If you want to start touching internals. Usually the 06+ TSX cams are more aggressive than the JDM ITR cams. The RBC manifold is a must. DC sports race header is good for its price but if you want power, Buddy Club Race Header or SSR header is the way to go. Go on clubrsx, you'll learn alot there.

[JRDman]

after doing several hours of research like this im learning alot of what your telling me. I really appreciate it especially for the links to the sites.

what about for an intake? is everyone getting different results or is there an intake thats performed to be very good.

CJ

[Slomaro Z28]

Not sure what you're looking to spend but I love the AEM V2, deep sound and decent power.

[WhiteAccord]

Im guessing this is for an all motor application? Be more specific...

Power Goals? Daily?

TSX rods wont fit.

P&P will increase head flow, but match the Intake manifold and Throttle body to specs so they'll "work" together.

The only tricks to making the car a little quicker, Maintenance.

[Vteckidd]

stock type s head can make 270whp. no need to port it . get cams and youll be fine. tsx rods belong in a tsx motor. go with a ssr header

[rsxtype-svi]

i agree...maintenance

[JRDman]

it for a road race car. I'd love around 225 whp but anything over 205 is good.

main thing is I really need to keep it OEM parts for rules sake. I will be using K pro.

CJ

also I now have a k20a3 motor thats just kinda here. I do need a motor for the roller but i need something that would be identical to the a2 in how it opperates and power.

I know the ivtec sec with the different # of lobes is obviously different but can I just swap the ivtec stuff or would swapping the head then rebuilding the block be smarter?

thanks for all the help guys!

CJ

[WhiteAccord]

225 WHP is an easy goal. I/H/E/ with K-Pro Tuned will get you there... No need for anything else.

[Vteckidd]

200whp is doable not 225. not on oem parts. run itr cams itr pistons amd an upgraded oil pump if its a RR car

[josh green]

I made 202whp on a BONE stock k20a2 with a Hasport cheap swap header and about 45 mins worth of street fuel tuning, car also had a 3" exhaust.

[Vteckidd]

swapped chassis seem to make 10-15% more power. most i\h\e rsx cars with kpro make 180~190 . with cams they make 205~215whp

[Vteckidd]

dont buy into the k hype either that youll see on the boards

[josh green]

dont buy into the k hype either that youll see on the boards
I depends, if your going all motor K series is just simply the setup to have. Yes, you can make the same power with a B series but its hard, and its not as nice of a torque band. If you are track racing it the K is going to be the best thing for you if your class requires the use of OEM power/drivetrain setups.

But I will agree that some people are just ignorant and full of misinformation. If it in your budget to do a K, then do it.

[JRDman]

well I HAVE to run the k20a2 setup in my car because thats what the car would technically come stock with so thats what we have to run.

this is what I was thinking for as goodies so tell me if you think this is smart or not.

kpro,Intake, Full race header with pretty much a straight pipe for racing, do the VTM modifications, possibly an RBC intake mated to the Euro Accord type are TB so that you dont have to do an adapter plate ( big deal for me), '06 TSX cams( seem to be more aggressive than ITR), rebuild everything new gaskets, bearings, and ARP bolts, modfied oil pump/pan,and the car will be tuned for race gas all the time.


would this net my 225whp goal? more? less?


and the question I had earlier about I have a k20a3 already if im planning to rebuild a motor anyway would it still be smart to rebuild the a2 instead? I know the Ivtec stuff is different but if I either swap the heads out or swap the valvetrain/ ivtec stuff what would be the best



thanks guys!!!!
CJ

[josh green]

The k20a3 is an economy engine, build the A2.

[JDM onlyy]

well I HAVE to run the k20a2 setup in my car because thats what the car would technically come stock with so thats what we have to run.

this is what I was thinking for as goodies so tell me if you think this is smart or not.

kpro,Intake, Full race header with pretty much a straight pipe for racing, do the VTM modifications, possibly an RBC intake mated to the Euro Accord type are TB so that you dont have to do an adapter plate ( big deal for me), '06 TSX cams( seem to be more aggressive than ITR), rebuild everything new gaskets, bearings, and ARP bolts, modfied oil pump/pan,and the car will be tuned for race gas all the time.


would this net my 225whp goal? more? less?


and the question I had earlier about I have a k20a3 already if im planning to rebuild a motor anyway would it still be smart to rebuild the a2 instead? I know the Ivtec stuff is different but if I either swap the heads out or swap the valvetrain/ ivtec stuff what would be the best



thanks guys!!!!
CJ


I say keep the k20a3 on the side and rebuild that and swap the heads on it. Since it doesn't have that real vtec or whatever. Really though, if you could get your hands on a k24 block with a rsx-s head then you're in business! :goodjob:

[josh green]

I say keep the k20a3 on the side and rebuild that and swap the heads on it. Since it doesn't have that real vtec or whatever. Really though, if you could get your hands on a k24 block with a rsx-s head then you're in business! :goodjob:
Swapping the blocks would be against the rules of his class. The bottom end of the k20a3 is what is garbage. The crank journals are smaller and not rev friendly.

[Vteckidd]

well I HAVE to run the k20a2 setup in my car because thats what the car would technically come stock with so thats what we have to run.

this is what I was thinking for as goodies so tell me if you think this is smart or not.

kpro,Intake, Full race header with pretty much a straight pipe for racing, do the VTM modifications, possibly an RBC intake mated to the Euro Accord type are TB so that you dont have to do an adapter plate ( big deal for me), '06 TSX cams( seem to be more aggressive than ITR), rebuild everything new gaskets, bearings, and ARP bolts, modfied oil pump/pan,and the car will be tuned for race gas all the time.


would this net my 225whp goal? more? less?


and the question I had earlier about I have a k20a3 already if im planning to rebuild a motor anyway would it still be smart to rebuild the a2 instead? I know the Ivtec stuff is different but if I either swap the heads out or swap the valvetrain/ ivtec stuff what would be the best



thanks guys!!!!
CJ

If you are running a STOCK class, you need to let us know the RULES.

1) if its showroom stock, you arent allowed ANY mods. Then my answer is NO you cant hit 225whp with a stock motor and stock header.

2)If your running in a modified class an can use any OEM parts, and any aftermarket I/H/E combo then yes you can hit 225whp

if your answer is 2, then I would run:

ITR pistons
ITR cams
RBC Intake
SSR header/BC Race Header
Skunk2 Mega Power "R" Exhaust
KPRO

that shuold get you in the 215-220whp range if the motor is built right.

Porting on the head isnt really needed IMO. Waste of money

[JRDman]

it would be option 2 . its a modified class.

rules are pretty much oem parts, no stroker type setups but the blocks can be bored .040 over, gasket matching type port work, anything intake , exhaust , etc. and Kpro.

CJ

[josh green]

it would be option 2 . its a modified class.

rules are pretty much oem parts, no stroker type setups but the blocks can be bored .040 over, gasket matching type port work, anything intake , exhaust , etc. and Kpro.

CJ
You should get working the head OUT of your head. The stock head has made 300whp NA, There are only a handful of shops around that I know how to improve them and have numbers to prove it.

[JRDman]

well see heres the thing. i know that in this application it might not be needed. but when I have quite a bit of experience seeing older B series engines picking up 10-15ish whp by doing the tricks that we do to our heads in a 'stock' sense I am simply saying that is the allowable modifications we can legally perform.

because even if stuff only produces small amounts of gains we do it because every little bit counts. this aint street racing where anything goes.

CJ

[Vteckidd]

i understand, but you wont see the gains as you would on a B series head.

put it this way, THE TRICKEST B SERIES you can BUY flows 300- 315CFMs.

a Stock K series head flows 300CFMs with ease. Call RLZ and ask to speak to Brad, he will tell you some stuff or search for it on HT

You still have a 2.0L, it can only breath so well for its Disp. VE can only be so much.

[JRDman]

thats good info. thanks man!!

but I have heard but havent seen first hand the '06 TSX cams are more aggressive than ITR cams. any insight on that??

CJ

[Vteckidd]

they arent more aggressive they are ALMOST the same profile.

[§treet_§peed]

i wanna throw a k20a in a crx lol

[josh green]

You can send your head off to have it worked but you will spend $1200-1800 for headwork and givin that you are having to stay "stock" I doubt you will see any gains. I would just make your own type R, maybe a thinner head gasket to get a little more compression. Honestly if you want to make the most of it, you are going to need a SPOON setup. They race classes where ONLY stock engines are required, all their parts are extremely precise. I know it sounds stupid to say, "BUY spoon ****" but thats what they are known for.

[JRDman]

well I just want to say thanks for everyones input and advice.

I do all my own work at my shop so I wont be spending 1200 on port work and such.

that is interesting though about the spoon stuff. I believe Opak races an RSX actually and am pretty sure they are the dealer for Spoon stuff here in the US so ill try and get in touch with them.

John from Hytech has been a huge help especially with his K series experience as well.


take care guys!!
CJ

[JDM onlyy]

Swapping the blocks would be against the rules of his class. The bottom end of the k20a3 is what is garbage. The crank journals are smaller and not rev friendly.

I thought the head is garbage? So does that mean the whole damn motor is garbage? Lol...

[Vteckidd]

the block CASTING is the only thing thats really any good.

other than that, its junk

[WhiteAccord]

EVERYBODY JUST GET A ****ING ACCORD.

[jbhondatech]

The K20A3 is not the greatest motor however I have built one useing type s pistons, oil pump and a type r head. with the kpro it made 219hp at the wheels. The realy crappy part of an A3 is the oil pump (civic si ) may be different for the RSX

[JDM onlyy]

the block CASTING is the only thing thats really any good.

other than that, its junk

Lol, really? I knew those EP3's were junk but damn...I didn't all that. I think I'm gonna go talk to my friend and rag on his ride...LOL

[§treet_§peed]

k20a is where its at lol

[JRDman]

interesting